Legalization a think tank discussion

[pussum]

In my travels, I have seen that for as much as we all think we are different from one another we really are the same. A mother and father in Sri Lanka love their children just as much as a mother and father in Canada. A child afraid of the dark calls for their loved ones just the same whether they are in Alaska or Atlanta.

One world would be something to work for wouldn't it? That would be a very beautiful thing indeed.

Start world peace right now. Pack a bowl and pass it to your neighbor. Let them hit the greens and give peace a chance!

 

[POTUS]

In my travels, I have seen that for as much as we all think we are different from one another we really are the same. A mother and father in Sri Lanka love their children just as much as a mother and father in Canada. A child afraid of the dark calls for their loved ones just the same whether they are in Alaska or Atlanta.

You've hit the proverbial nail directly on the head.

The working class of the world have no real differences in respect to what they desire. The differences are in how they are taught by the leaders to gain what they desire.

At face value, Communism sounds like a wonderful thing. Everyone equal, everyone sharing resources, everyone living at the same level that is gained by the combined work of the many.

In reality, that nasty little human factor of GREED sets in and destroys any good that Communism would provide.

In fact, under Communism, NO ONE is equal, NO ONE shares resources, and NO ONE lives at the same level because GREED rules the acts and results of the efforts of the masses.

I'm sorry to say that GREED isn't restricted to only Communism. It's a common trait in every type of society on our planet Earth.

There really is only one cure for Global Greed. That's a Global uprising that encompasses the populations of every country on our planet Earth.

Eventually, this will happen. When the people of Earth finally have had enough of the greed of their so-called representatives that make the rules, they'll overthrow them in a widespread, global tidal wave of relief.

The types of changes that are needed, can't happen gradually, because the people who make the rules won't let that happen. Each time the people make an inch of progress, the people who make the rules pull the floor out from under us by a mile.

China's recent abomination of power that showed their massive abuse and fear of the people and allowed them to actually beat and murder PRIESTS AND MONKS, show a wide-spread lack of approval throughout the people of China as well as the entire world of working class people.

The efforts of the false ideology of Islam in recent years shows the same results. The working class suffers the greed of the rulers.

Many examples of this World Class Greed are evident in the world today and have come to such an obvious level that the working class has a front row seat in the drama that has held them back for countless years.

Partially as a result of mass communication and high speed Internet information, the worlds working class are slowly coming together in the realization of their plight in the Global sense.

As I've said in a previous post, I think a pandemic is coming. This isn't a knee-jerk response to media hype, but an educated evaluation of recent happenings in the status of world health and how it's being handled.

When this pandemic happens, the global scale of misery and death will so overwhelm the ability to handle it, that I think a massive tidal wave of rebellion will take place on a scale never seen before.

At that time, the efforts of the working class will save the world from bottoming out and will start a turn towards the global stabilization of efforts to bring the population of the world together in one overpowering move towards unification of strength.

The power of the world will be with the people, not the few greedy leaders who govern the world as we know it now.

I wish that this pandemic wouldn't happen, but it's name is "Bird Flu" and it's alive and well right this moment. It's altering it's own genetics and becoming something that will be the equivilant of nothing seen by mankind yet.

I believe that the tenth of the world that survives it will initiate the new form of Global Government that has been the desire of the people since the beginning of time.

The nine tenths of people who will die aren't equal geographically. The hardest hit will wipe out entire countries like Africa, India, Pakistan, China and others where the masses of the populace are under-fed, lack in proper health care ability and are kept directly under the thumbs of an oppressive leadership to keep them "In their place".

We now live in a time that is loaded with massive global tension. The load that is now in place on the working class has bent it's back to the point of breaking.

No wonder the young people are so dissatisfied with the world right now. It's reached a place of no return and the path it's taken is not peaceful.

We have a group of people here that are the exception to the rule.

We of Marijuana Passion have a common denominator that keeps us sane. We all De-Stress with our favorite mind relaxing plant of choice. Each of us has times each day that we throw out the tensions of the world and truly relax our minds and dream of the world to be.

We will be the leaders of the new world.

We will decide what is best for us.

We will no longer let the greedy, self serving, power hungry few tell us what is good for us despite evidence of the contrary.

We are many.

They are few.

We will have our time.

***

I love you all and wish the best of luck to every one of my brothers and sisters here on MP.

Peace has to happen.

Peace will happen.

We will make it happen.

 

[Runbyhemp]

Eventually, this will happen. When the people of Earth finally have had enough of the greed of their so-called representatives that make the rules, they'll over-throw them in a wide-spread, global tidal wave of relief.

I'm not too sure about that one. Hundreds of years ago if people had grievences with the government, they could gather together with their pitchforks and have a "bloody revolution"

Pitchforks would be no use to us today. In this day and age any rising would be considered as "terrorism".

We are many. They are few.

I think that our numbers will not make any difference. In the past, the method of dealing with numbers has been genocide.

I really do hope I'm wrong.

 

[POTUS]

I'm not too sure about that one. Hundreds of years ago if people had grievances with the government, they could gather together with their pitchforks and have a "bloody revolution"

Pitchforks would be no use to us. In this day and age any rising would be considered as "terrorism".

I should have made myself more clear. Today, the communication between the masses is so much more evident that the coordination of effort will be equally improved. Coordination of effort is what revolutions are all about. This has been proven with many successful revolutions in the last hundred years. "Go left" and "Watch your flank" are commands that can save a revolution. In the past, many revolutions that were attempted, failed as a result of the lack of this type of maneuvering information and logistical coordination.

When the time comes, the counter efforts of the Establishment won't matter much. Sure, they'll win some battles, but the war will be won by the people, not the few greedy leaders that exist today.

The "Pitch-Fork" will be more effective to the hundred-fold, and there will be millions more "Pitch-Forks".

The revolutionary leader in "Bumblesquat" Nevada will be on the phone to the revolutionary leader in "SquatnBumble" China.

They will learn. They will evolve thier efforts. They will adjust in minutes to what took years before.

In the end, we will win.

 

[Dadgumit]

Amen Potus...

I've read numerous posts of yours and you speak from a position of knowledge about world history and current events and expressed love for your fellow brothers/sisters (which resonates with me to my core) and I thank you from the botton of my heart for being one of the kind, enlightened souls that encourage us to believe that we can stand up straight and tall with our faces to the sun, after a lifetime of oppression that has caused us to question whether we can stand at all.

I, too, have observed the shift in global consciousness since the advent of the internet. No one is isolated anymore - we are able to communicate and learn from each other rather than have our perceptions molded solely by the deliberate misinformation and political spin of our government's covert agendas. We the general public can now formulate and voice our own opinions with each other; opinions which, as this site so adequately represents, are fundamentally different from what the current powers that be have contrived for us to believe.

There is definitely a wave of change underway that is driven by the desire for all of us to understand and accept our unique individualities while embracing and nurturing our innate commonalities. We now know that the desire to "form a more perfect union" is not a national or cultural phenomena, but a world-wide movement.

Avian influenza (bird-flu) has been predicted by many of the world's leading scientists to be the next great global pandemic. The Centers for Disease Control and the World Health Organization websites state that bird-flu is rated as a 3 on the levels 1-6 "Phase of Alert" scale that they use to assess the degree of probability of a world health crisis. Although I am hesitant to cite WHO reports because of their history of political bias in world health issues, I would agree with them on this. Over the past twelve years there have been hundreds of reported (and probably thousands of unreported) cases of interspecies infection between humans and infected birds - and although you can look at the numbers and say that the infection of a few hundred peolpe over the course of over a decade isn't anything close to alarming - the fact that these viruses have had a recently direct and significant impact on global food supplies and can/have spread to other uninfected geographic areas via migratory birds cannot be ignored. World economic conditions are already being affected as Europe and Asia's burgeoning beef inclusive diet is a substantive byproduct of the spread of the bird-flu viruses. There is litlle understanding of how interspecies infection occurs and there is no known vaccine or cure.

I do believe that it would take a world-wide populous uprising against the current power structures to create a new and more humane world government, but I also think that a catastrophic event of near mass-extinction capabilities will probably occur; thus creating the de facto economic, environmental and social conditions that will obliterate present political paradigms and birth a brand new world.

 

[pussum]

I think it is sad that in the constitution we have the right to raise up and over throw the government if we feel they aren't doing what they are supposed to do, yet we have allowed the government to weave so many laws into the constitution that if we were to actually raise up we would be held as terrorists and be put to death.

very sad what we have allowed to happen in the U.S.A..

 

[POTUS]

I think it is sad that in the constitution we have the right to raise up and over throw the government if we feel they aren't doing what they are supposed to do, yet we have allowed the government to weave so many laws into the constitution that if we were to actually raise up we would be held as terrorists and be put to death.

very sad what we have allowed to happen in the U.S.A..

If one were to "raise up" with weapons and try to take over the White house, then yes, you'd not survive the attempt. You'd be mowed down like a ripe wheat field.

However, if one follows the laws relating to protest and filing petitions, rallies and demonstrations, you can protest almost anything.

An example of this is how the despised KKK can file the appropriate paperwork and have a march through the center of any city, dressed to the hilt in their coned hats and white robes, shouting sociological obscenities.

The police actually PROTECT them as they march.

If you organize a march through downtown Washington D.C. with 5 thousand marijuana law protesters, you could carry signs, puff on huge fake joints, shout anti-prohibition slogans and scream at the top of your lungs about the unfair laws governing Marijuana.

Everything would be done in accordance with the existing laws of our society and would also BE UNDER THE PROTECTION OF THE POLICE.

What a laugh that would be.

We could have our own million person march.

Start setting it up for 2010. By then, you could have all the "i's" dotted and the "t's" crossed for a successful march.

I can guarantee you that it would be on CNN and every other media coverage that exists.

THAT, my friend is how to protest in a peaceful society.

You beat them at their own game.

You use their own laws against them.

You gain public attention by putting it IN THEIR FACE, legally.

 

[clanchattan]

im in

 

[clanchattan]

im about an hour from the district. idk about all 5000, but with enough tents i can sleep a couple hundred. i got acreage.

 

[pussum]

Come on now, don't get me wrong. I wasn't saying lets all grab our oozies and go in guns blazing. hahah, that would be insane. There is a peaceful way to do anything in this world, but still. One step out of line if they don't like what you have to say and you could be persecuted. . . just because.

 

[clanchattan]

this country was founded by seditionists with guns........
is freedom worth your life?
or because we have freedom, are we complacent enough to have it leached away abit at a time while we rationilize the fact its being sucked away?

 

[clanchattan]

google "the declaration of arbroath" written around 1310. the first appearance of constitutionilizm in history. over throwing a king if he subverts indivdual rights of the people. the king is responsible to, not for his subjects.
powerful piece of history.

 

[POTUS]

One step out of line if they don't like what you have to say and you could be persecuted. . . just because.

I believe that you're wrong in saying this. If it were so, then every single one of those disgusting KKK types would be arrested the moment they started shouting their crap.

There is a huge difference between shouting "I'll kill anyone who disagrees with me" and "Change the law to be fair to those who smoke Marijuana".

If one were to shout the first, then yes, they would and should be arrested for threatening to murder someone.

In the case of the second example, no violence was threatened. Only an opinion was shouted. That is perfectly legal and no cop in their right mind would arrest anyone who did so with the proper licencing in hand.

"One step out of line" would be anything that is NOT legal. That's easy to step around by simply NOT shouting or doing anything illegal. Both can be accomplished at the same time.

Just because they don't like your message, they can't arrest you. Besides, a smart protest contains many, many lawyers among the protesters.

Cameras, microphones, witnesses. This is what wins in a courtroom.

Peaceful protest is one of the most legal actions permitted in the USA.

The first "F" you to a cop and on go the cuffs. You have to keep it within the law.

The late Martin Luther King Jr. proved it beyond doubt. He helped bring protest to a fine art.

Peace

 

[POTUS]

MARIJUANA DOESN'T KILL, YOU SOULD TRY IT, I SURE WILL!

MARIJUANA, TRY THAT SMOKE, PEACE WILL GRAB YOU WITH JUST A TOKE!

LEGAL WEED WILL FILL OUR NEED!



-Gimme some more-

 

[snuggles]

You guys are coming up with some great stuff. I'm happy to see so many of you contributing...for now I watch I do not have the wisdom or know how that some of you have. I would love to see the day when things change but I have a feeling it will be quite a while...maybe just maybe though.

Also Potus I do agree with you...that bird flu is some scarey stuff and I fear the day that it mutates and runs rampant. I also think with all these enviornmental issues that someone somewhere will give in and make the right choice, we need to get back to basics IMO. It's OK to have technology but we seem to forget about the greatest force in all our lives...our planet but we need to wake up soon before it is too late.

 

[Dadgumit]

I can guarantee you that it would be on CNN and every other media coverage that exists.

That would be fantastic - I know that I could contribute a bit to the headcount for that day! When contemplating your idea I wondered what kind of "spin" the media would put on a rally such as this. I mean, the US government doesn't have a high profile, multi-billion dollar, publicly postured position admonishing the EVILS of becoming a racist piece of crap - like they have against us.

They have spun their web of lies concerning marijuana users well enough by making these overreaching, blanket statements about drugs in general that they just swept marijuana up with the generalized presentation that "drugs are bad, and if you do drugs you are bad too." It isn't even the marketing that we are "bad", per se - its the assertion that we are morally wrong deviants and should be shunned by "respectable" society that is not just patently inappropriate, it's just plain wrong. We are perceptually colonized like modern-day lepers.

Hmmm...

If we could get everyone who participated in this march to dress professionally (as if going on a job interview) and conduct themselves accordingly, we would visually debunk the myth that marijuana smokers are either: burnt out, haven't-bathed-in-a-week, long-haired freaky people or gang-banging, thug-life living, threats to society as we have been stereotyped. We need to conduct it more like a political convention rather than a "get together with fellow users" because that's what they think we do with all of our free time anyway!

 

[POTUS]

The end of a march is always the time for speeches. That's the time to have a well spoken, media friendly, professional speaker make the points about Marijuana. That person, while on camera and microphones, could use an educated explanation of the legal tricks used by the anti-marijuana establishment to ban weed.

Crap like the tax stamp. Title it "Why the lie? This is how it started!"

The speaker would have the floor, so-to-speak, so have that person say what is on all of our minds.

It wouldn't be a debate. It would be our time and our time only.

If done in twenty cities at once, carefully planned and attended by at least 5,000 people at each location, it would cause a media splash that would be heard around the world.

Follow it up with well organized information rallies that are media attended as well.

That my friends is how it's done.

To paraphrase Patrick Swayze in "Road House", "Put the march in their face, but be polite. Have a excellent speech given, but be polite. Have lots of rallies, but be polite".

Show the world that we aren't the villains that the establishment makes us out to be.

One note; If one person comes out and says "I love to get good and high on weed and then take a drive", you've just lost the entire thing. The establishment is just waiting for some idiot to say something ignorant like that.

"I love to be high at work" "You've never lived until you fly high"

I've heard all three of those statements made by people who don't understand how stupid they're being and how they're hurting our cause.

If we don't want the Real Police to watch everything we do, then we have to police ourselves. When you hear a friend say he's wasted and going for a drive, take his keys away. Being stoned while guiding 3 tons of car down the road between other people is plain flat stupid.

One "Aw Crap" takes away 10 "Attaboys".

We can't afford to back up.

We need to watch out for each other.

 

[snuggles]

Follow it up with well organized information rallies that are media attended as well.

I think there is a lot of information that the general public needs to know. I believe most people think it is a small issue but if you convince them otherwise I think it would be a good start. MJ/Hemp is a very important matter IMO, most people just think drug and/or Drag War. There are many people interested in politics all over the world and for different reasons, some of them may be social problems, the enviornment, healthcare, medicine, enviornmental, energy, crime, agriculture, war, human rights, religion, the economy, The Drug War etc. etc. blah blah blah

I am one of those people that believes MJ/Hemp touches all these issues. If we could convince people that all of the above could be greatly affected by legalization and in a good way. Convince them that it is a blanket issue covering all sorts of areas. Convince them that really is just a plant but not just any plant...a dangerous plant to the powers that be. Perhaps the one of the most important plants that was put here for us. Explain what the War on MJ/Hemp is really about and the consequences, how these lead to social woes and a cycle of crime, broken lives, broken families, etc. and the people that gain from all of this. Explain the enviornmental consequences of no Hemp, and what benefits it would bring if legalized. Explain that it could be an excellent way for farmers to really earn what they deserve. Explain to people that we would no longer be dependent on others for things like oil, leading to less "conflict". There are so many ways to approach the whole thing it truly is an amazing plant. explain to people that it can be used for medicine, we are finding out more about it everyday but not fast enough IMO. Basically I guess what I am trying to say is make it a blanket issue, make the informational rallies a well rounded affair, having something for everyone. Explain who the people are in charge of the wanton destruction and unneeded punishment, who gains and why it's really bad. It's not that hard to demonize these so called crusader of justice once the people see what they really have to gain. Let the general public know why we also don't like drug dealers and thuggish violent criminals, and how some profit from this crazy cycle. Explain to people that it is not a voodoo medicine but a very real and affordable option for their loved ones, and explain why pharma is needed but why they are wrong and how they treat us and our loved ones like meat. There is so much to learn and I think that is also a huge part of my obsession with it, hey I like to get high, I am into gardening and the earth. Also people need to realize we are being forced into a chemical society, nature is being made to be a joke, why synthsize everything under the sun when we have all we need already. Tell them why we are living like this and why we are being forced into it, who's behind it and why. Explain to them how it is actually influencing the way some researchers are approaching medicine. i.e. how we have discovered cannabinoids, the endocannabinoid system, etc. and how they interact with one another, how this could be used to actually have different approaches to treating sick people. Explain to them that we indeed do have a relationship and are supposed to have a relationship with MJ/Hemp, just like we do with all the veggies. I mean it's astounding what the cannbinoid thing is teaching us about ourselves, the endocannabinoid system actually monitors how our body "does" certain things. How it is infinitely safer than our medicine cabinets, if people are so concerned about their children then why don't they make medicine cabinets with locks on them? I'm not very good at this kind of thing, and even worse at getting it out of my head and on screen the way I intended but I tried LOL. It is such a huge all encompassing issue...HUGE think big REAL BIG. One day it would be great to see people open up their eyes and see the truth, they just need that nudge sometimes

 

[Dadgumit]

I for one want to find out more on NORML (I haven't informed myself near enough about them) because I am really moved by this issue. I don't know, maybe it's because I'm getting old(er) that I've become quite passionate about our government and the political games that they play that affect the overall health and welfare of everyone (I'm over being shocked by anything that they do.) Now, I am just literally disgusted by how far this country has strayed from the path that so many of us believe she should/could be on.

The very foundation of our being is built on the right that there are certain freedoms on decisions of personal choice that cannot be taken away. There is great passion about this because no personal decision should be subjected to the will or "approval" of another because that violates the primary truth of all existence that "all men are created equal." Thomas Paine (1731-1809) wrote in "The Rights of Man" (1791) that "It is a perversion of terms to say that a charter gives rights. It operates by a contrary effect - by taking rights away. Rights are inherently in all the inhabitants, but charters, by annulling those rights, in the majority, leave the right by exclusion, in the hands of a few... They...consequently, are instruments of injustice."

Snuggles, POTUS - you know I'm on board with you 100%. We DESPERATELY need to get EDUCATED AND MOTIVATED about what the truth is and how we can help spread it for there is work to be done! But lets not forget to include information/education about the reality of our "rights" in this "What's The Truth?" movement... The one remaining right that we have that truly bears any weight in the political world is the right to vote and thus change the direction of our government by majority rule.

 

[pussum]

I believe that you're wrong in saying this. If it were so, then every single one of those disgusting KKK types would be arrested the moment they started shouting their crap.

There is a huge difference between shouting "I'll kill anyone who disagrees with me" and "Change the law to be fair to those who smoke Marijuana".

If one were to shout the first, then yes, they would and should be arrested for threatening to murder someone.

In the case of the second example, no violence was threatened. Only an opinion was shouted. That is perfectly legal and no cop in their right mind would arrest anyone who did so with the proper licencing in hand.

"One step out of line" would be anything that is NOT legal. That's easy to step around by simply NOT shouting or doing anything illegal. Both can be accomplished at the same time.

Just because they don't like your message, they can't arrest you. Besides, a smart protest contains many, many lawyers among the protesters.

Cameras, microphones, witnesses. This is what wins in a courtroom.

Peaceful protest is one of the most legal actions permitted in the USA.

The first "F" you to a cop and on go the cuffs. You have to keep it within the law.

The late Martin Luther King Jr. proved it beyond doubt. He helped bring protest to a fine art.

Peace

[FONT=&quot]
Are you seriously going to sit there and tell me that people who rise up and get vocal are not considered threats or targets and aren't persecuted for rising up against the power? You spoke of Martin Luther King Jr. who was immensely persecuted throughout his entire life and in the end was assassinated for what he was standing up for. No matter how many legal hoops everyone jumped and jumps through to ensure they are within the legal bounds of protest, the government (or someone else) will find ways to shut you up if what you say doesn't go with their plans. At that point, once you are in the spotlight they can't jump at you directly, but you better believe they will jump at you from every other side imaginable until they can find some sort of weakness in your defense and get you taken out of the picture. If you think that to be an inconceivable possibility I say you don't have your eyes open to reality.

One step out of line doesn't have to be anything illegal. We like to believe we do, but ultimately we do not make "the line". The government does. Because of that they can change the line, move the line, erase the line, and completely rewrite the line if they want to without anyone in the general population finding out. Before the birth of the internet and widespread communications how many laws do you think passed that were snuck into other bills that were only put there to further a politicians agenda? Granted now we have ways of finding these little hidden laws that are attached to bills and rallying against them, but the point remains the same. All the legal making and breaking and rewriting is done in congress, and for the most part, we as a population are still not quite aware of what goes on behind those doors. There is no law that says our representatives have to go door to door and tell us what they are doing down in Washington. Since everything they do down there is public domain anyway they crutch on that and say "it was made public why didn't you say something when the bill was on the table?" when we complain about the laws.

If someone were to gain enough power that the majority was starting to follow him and not what the government wanted how easy would it be to find a way to call them a terrorist as defined by the ever broadening definition set forth by the patriot act and have them put away? They may have gone about doing everything legally, but if acts outside their power start occurring that fringe or actually transcend into illegal activities, and are done in their name, the courts can and possibly will hold him as the figure head. They can spin the opinions of who ever they want and next thing you know this figure head who never once broke the law in his protest is all of a sudden being held as a terrorist threat and being sentenced to death or life or being put behind bars or being punished in some shape or another.

I feel as though I am getting off onto a tangent so I will just reiterate my point. They may not be able to get someone at face value for protesting or rising up and doing everything legally, but with a little digging, and a little creative interpretation of the laws, they could put just about anyone away if they wanted to. No matter if what they did was legal or not. It is the same thing they do in jails. They may not get a suspect on murder, but "oops we found something completely non-related that will get him put out of the picture anyway so win/win for us".[/FONT]

EDIT:

I am not sure why my text came out so strange, but as long as it is still read-able. Anyway, I am greatly anticipating your response. So far out of the people I have spoken with both in the real world and on the internet you are the only one who has posed a solid argument that didn't resort to childish name calling. I'm hoping for one hell of a counterpoint on your end so don't let me down POTUS!