One more of my folk apps!

[zem]

Hello my friends. I am frustrated and I need some advice. I got my hands on some concentrated sulfuric acid a while back and just now i did the stupid thing of adding water to it and it had such an exothermic reaction that i am afraid that it melts the plastic container. It comes in a food grade type of industrial plastic containers if you have seen them, they are often blue and come in different sizes and are used to store chemicals. The good thing is that i added some water slowly but when i noticed fumes i soon stopped and touched the container and it is damn hot. Then did a quick search to find that you should add the acid to the water not the other way round in some stainless steel or glass container. I have seen quite a bit in my life and i never imagined that water can have such a reaction with sulfuric acid. Had I opened the water tap to the maximum output, it would have boiled violently sending it flying in the air. I was outdoor had glasses and gloves on but it burns skin. Jeez I am not happy. I am waiting for it to cool down and hoping that the container holds on. and now my question is the following: Do you think that the heat melted some plastic into the sulfuric acid? It is food grade plastic anyway. So i don't think it would be a problem to use the acid for ph-. What are your thoughts? thanks

 

[pute]

Wow, doesn't sound good.

 

[WeedHopper]

Found this



YES! Sulfuric acid's reaction with plastic can be treacherous. HDPE #2 will keep it contained for a long time (more than a few months by experience, probably years) but any HDPE #1 and any plastic mixed with HDPE #1 will be destroyed. It becomes dangerous when you leave a bottle thinking it looks stable only to find out a week later that it has dissolved and the acid has eaten all around it. In doubt, avoid putting sulfuric acid in any plastic of unknown type. From experience, this acid seems to destroy plastics more quickly than metals! It is also more reactive when diluted so beware again as you may expect your diluted acid to behave as "gently" as your fully concentrated one



This is what happens when you mix concentrated sulfuric acid and water in a plastic container.

 

[zem]

The container is its original container from the factory, thick blue plastic so I think it is the right type for it. So I should not worry about plastic particles dissolved in the acid you think?

 

[oldfogey8]

The container is its original container from the factory, thick blue plastic so I think it is the right type for it. So I should not worry about plastic particles dissolved in the acid you think?

Probably a question for Tattered Gray Wolf. He is a chemical genius…

 

[WeedHopper]

The container is its original container from the factory, thick blue plastic so I think it is the right type for it. So I should not worry about plastic particles dissolved in the acid you think?

That is above my head brother.

 

[SubmarineGirl]

Whoa that’s scary. I’m glad you are ok.

 

[zem]

Probably a question for Tattered Gray Wolf. He is a chemical genius…

That would be helpful. Let us see if he chimes in soon.
I checked on it and it is cooling down thank God. I noticed that the upper part of the fluid has heated the most. I touched the lower end of the side it is cold.

 

[LabRat]

Damn lucky you didn't toss in a lot of water or you wouldn't have been able to start this thread. You'd be in the hospital at the least and probably blind to boot if not just dead. Horrible way to go.

I have a diploma in environmental chem and worked at a hazardous waste disposal facility many years back so have a buttload of safety training under my belt. I have used 96% H2SO4 as my pH down for many years and add it dropwise to DWC tubs when needed.

I scored the glass bottle of it from my old job along with some conc. nitric acid I made some silver nitrate with a while back.

Do not add water to things like caustic sodas either. Always add any strong chemical to the water preferably lots of water. And wear appropriate PPE!

As that plastic container may have been compromised by the heat you should find a strong glass container to decant it into. Make sure it's very dry inside before pouring in the acid. Barring that at least keep the container inside a good, clean 5gal pail or something similar in case the plastic springs a leak.

Stay safe out there!

 

[SubmarineGirl]

Thanks for your comment and welcome to the passion labrat

 

[pute]

So, can ya grow marijuana?

 

[Hippie420]

I always used phosphoric acid myself. Cheap and easy to find at your local TSC.

 

[WeedHopper]

I like Paper Acid myself. Made me melt into the floor.

 

[zem]

Damn lucky you didn't toss in a lot of water or you wouldn't have been able to start this thread. You'd be in the hospital at the least and probably blind to boot if not just dead. Horrible way to go.

I have a diploma in environmental chem and worked at a hazardous waste disposal facility many years back so have a buttload of safety training under my belt. I have used 96% H2SO4 as my pH down for many years and add it dropwise to DWC tubs when needed.

I scored the glass bottle of it from my old job along with some conc. nitric acid I made some silver nitrate with a while back.

Do not add water to things like caustic sodas either. Always add any strong chemical to the water preferably lots of water. And wear appropriate PPE!

As that plastic container may have been compromised by the heat you should find a strong glass container to decant it into. Make sure it's very dry inside before pouring in the acid. Barring that at least keep the container inside a good, clean 5gal pail or something similar in case the plastic springs a leak.

Stay safe out there!

Thank you so much for your input. I ended up diluting a little amount in a glass bottle of 1 liter 1/3 of which is acid and put the plastic container aside for a later time. Yeah I read about how strong the reaction with water can be and I agree I was lucky, but I did take precautions just in case. I did not research it ahead which is stupid but i thought hey you never know so i had a long hose 20 feet away outdoor and i opened the tap slowly then i saw some fumes i went hmmmm why would this be fuming i waited a bit then shut the water. only then did i approach the container and just when i was heading back to reopen the tap still not knowing why it is fuming, i thought of touching the container and damn was it hot! Anyway my aim was to dilute the entire amount as much as i can because it is very dangerous as it is so i cannot find big enough glass containers plus glass has the nasty habit of breaking.
I have an identical plastic container that was used to store phosphoric acid and has never been compromised with heat.. I was thinking maybe i fill that one half way with water then add the concentrated sulfuric acid slowly to it. This amount of acid should suffice me for 2 lifetimes so I don't know if it expires or if it breaks down the original container eventually. The container is the blue type that is widely used to store all kinds of chemicals. What do you think? Many thanks LabRat!

 

[zem]

I always used phosphoric acid myself. Cheap and easy to find at your local TSC.

phosphoric acid for soil might work to get the ph from arounf 7.8 which is my source water to say 6.5 for soil but in hydro, it will exceed the needed phosphorus to get me to the desired 5.6-5,8. And then when i need to add ph'd water to my res periodically so i would be raising the phosphorus so much. There is a lot of p in phosphoric acid go figure I still use it alongside the sulfuric acid and factor it in my feeding NPK ratio. I cant get my hands on nitric acid yet.

 

[LabRat]

Thank you so much for your input. I ended up diluting a little amount in a glass bottle of 1 liter 1/3 of which is acid and put the plastic container aside for a later time. Yeah I read about how strong the reaction with water can be and I agree I was lucky, but I did take precautions just in case. I did not research it ahead which is stupid but i thought hey you never know so i had a long hose 20 feet away outdoor and i opened the tap slowly then i saw some fumes i went hmmmm why would this be fuming i waited a bit then shut the water. only then did i approach the container and just when i was heading back to reopen the tap still not knowing why it is fuming, i thought of touching the container and damn was it hot! Anyway my aim was to dilute the entire amount as much as i can because it is very dangerous as it is so i cannot find big enough glass containers plus glass has the nasty habit of breaking.
I have an identical plastic container that was used to store phosphoric acid and has never been compromised with heat.. I was thinking maybe i fill that one half way with water then add the concentrated sulfuric acid slowly to it. This amount of acid should suffice me for 2 lifetimes so I don't know if it expires or if it breaks down the original container eventually. The container is the blue type that is widely used to store all kinds of chemicals. What do you think? Many thanks LabRat!

Not a good plan to dilute the acid in another plastic container or it could melt down as well. I would use something like a Pyrex measuring cup or two. Even half strength that stuff is still wicked strong so if you want to use it for pH Down a 10x dilution would be a lot safer but still pretty strong. If you have a 2 cup measuring cup put 9oz of water in that. Then use a clean 1 cup measure or even a coffee mug but something with a pour spout is better and pour in an oz or more of the acid. Then just add that slowly to the water until it hits the 10oz mark. That's almost 300ml of dilute acid and should be fine in most plastic containers like even a pop bottle. Label it well. You can just pour any left-over acid back into the original jug or add baking soda to it until it stops fizzing then dump it down the drain.

Check out the crystals forming on the top of my little bottle of nitric acid. Perfectly harmless but I have it sitting in a pyrex bowl to catch any that drop off. Bottle of conc. sulphuric acid beside it and my colloidal silver rig beside that.

Blinded by science! No joke so wear good eye protection when messing with any dangerous stuff. Burns will heal on your body but not so much if it gets in your eyes.

 

[zem]

oh wow. my concern is that i don't want to store highly concentrated sulfuric acid anywhere i will have to make a plan for that and give it the required time and equipment. i have about 15 liters if i want to dilute to x10 that gives me 150 liters which is not easy for me to store. Can I store them in empty plastic water bottles for 10 years?

 

[LabRat]

oh wow. my concern is that i don't want to store highly concentrated sulfuric acid anywhere i will have to make a plan for that and give it the required time and equipment. i have about 15 liters if i want to dilute to x10 that gives me 150 liters which is not easy for me to store. Can I store them in empty plastic water bottles for 10 years?

Is it all in the one plastic container? If it will fit in a 5gal pail set the whole container in there and leave the lid on loose. Then if it leaks it won't be a big problem.

This stuff isn't battery acid is it? Does it say what strength it is? Just make teh 10oz batch I mentioned and store the rest in a pail or a Rubbermaid tub if it won't fit in a pail. A 5USG pail holds 19.1L so big enough to hold it all if it leaks.

I worked for a chemical supply many years ago. We would get train tankers full of stuff like conc. H2SO4 and all sorts of other nasty stuff and have to unload it into 45gal drums and various size carboys. Had a 5gal carboy spring a leak in the back of the 5-ton in front of a dry cleaners at a mall where I was pumping some perchlorethylene, (dry cleaning fluid), into their holding tank. Got done that then walked around the back of the truck to get some other supplies for them and saw this dark purple liquid dripping out the left corner and fizzing when it hit the ground. Rolled up the door and the back was full of fumes. I had a lot of bags of pool shock type dry chlorine and if it got into that there would have been a big problem. Long story short the fire dept. came along and we got it cleaned up.

Writing up the incident report took more time than the cleanup. lol