I need help identifying the problem here!
- Thread starter 7thG
- Start date
FYI 7thG, I am too having this issue. I suspect its a ph issue, I have damn near tried everything else, as this is has happened to my last 6 plants now.
I think my ph meter is faulty....I am returning it monday. It keeps saying my tap water is the same ph as the distilled water I am using, which I know is not true, I pulled up my local water info online and found the ph is around 6.0 in the tap.
It also keep telling me my soil ph is 6.3-6.5, no matter how I nute, or what I water with, and no matter how many times I calibrate it...i think its just off.
Hopefully the new one will work better, and hopefully this might pinpoint an answer for us both.
EDIT: I suspect with a proper working ph meter I will find my soil way off either way, which would explain the deficiencies from nute lock out.
I think my ph meter is faulty....I am returning it monday. It keeps saying my tap water is the same ph as the distilled water I am using, which I know is not true, I pulled up my local water info online and found the ph is around 6.0 in the tap.
It also keep telling me my soil ph is 6.3-6.5, no matter how I nute, or what I water with, and no matter how many times I calibrate it...i think its just off.
Hopefully the new one will work better, and hopefully this might pinpoint an answer for us both.
EDIT: I suspect with a proper working ph meter I will find my soil way off either way, which would explain the deficiencies from nute lock out.
Hushpuppy
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Make sure when you get a new pH meter that you get the calibrating fluids and always store the meter in 4.0 fluid so that the bulb doesn't dry out or get out of calibration as quickly. I use to keep a measuring glass with water and 4.0 fluid, and just kept my meter sitting in that rather than putting it back in the cap every time. I only had to recalibrate about once every 5-6weeks, and that is while using it 5-10x a week.
Hushpuppy
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Its very difficult to check accurately the pH of soil because you are having to check the runoff which is affected by the soil in multiple ways. As the water runs through the soil, it releases chemicals that are held in solution going in. Then the water picks up other elements from the soil such as nutrient salts or other dissolved minerals. The actual pH of the soil could be very different from the final pH of the water that runs off due to this chemical exchange.
If you are in regular soil then you just need to make sure that the solution or water going in every time is at ~6.5 but if you are in soilless medium then you need to keep the solutions closer to 6.0. Some say that it should be even lower in soilless, but I am willing to bet that it depends greatly on the type of soilless medium that you are using.
If you are in regular soil then you just need to make sure that the solution or water going in every time is at ~6.5 but if you are in soilless medium then you need to keep the solutions closer to 6.0. Some say that it should be even lower in soilless, but I am willing to bet that it depends greatly on the type of soilless medium that you are using.
Hushpuppy
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With organics you want to keep any water/nutes/teas around 6.5-6.8 but once in the soil, don't worry about the pH unless there is a problem.
Robertr; if you are using compost in your medium then you are also running with organic setup. The whole key to organics from beginning to end is Microbes, beneficial microbes to be exact. If you don't keep enough microbes in your medium or fail to keep them healthy, then you will lose the pH balance. In organics the microbes tend the pH balance. All you have to do is make sure the water going in is kept within a reasonable range which is below 7.0 and above 6.0 to keep the microbes healthy. But you also have to feed the microbes while the plants are small as they are unable to feed the microbes themselves.
See the microbes break down the material/nutes into units that the plants can absorb, and the plants trade the available(chelated) nutrients for sugars that the microbes use for energy. When you first set up your grow medium, you have to make sure you have an abundance of microbes in the medium by either adding stuff that has them or adding the actual microbes themselves. But then you have to feed them periodically (most people use molasses for feeding the microbes by mixing it into the water during the first couple weeks)
I would recommend that the both of you should get some Mychorizae and Tricoderma from the hydro store and add to your medium on the next go if you are going to try to stay with organics. Also read as much of the organics stuff in that section so that you have a solid understanding of the best methods for using organics as it is far more involved than many people think. I have only done it some myself as it is quite challenging. You have to change the way you think about caring for your plants. You no longer feed your plants, you feed the soil and microbes, and they feed your plants and take care of the pH balance. I hope this helps both of you
Robertr; if you are using compost in your medium then you are also running with organic setup. The whole key to organics from beginning to end is Microbes, beneficial microbes to be exact. If you don't keep enough microbes in your medium or fail to keep them healthy, then you will lose the pH balance. In organics the microbes tend the pH balance. All you have to do is make sure the water going in is kept within a reasonable range which is below 7.0 and above 6.0 to keep the microbes healthy. But you also have to feed the microbes while the plants are small as they are unable to feed the microbes themselves.
See the microbes break down the material/nutes into units that the plants can absorb, and the plants trade the available(chelated) nutrients for sugars that the microbes use for energy. When you first set up your grow medium, you have to make sure you have an abundance of microbes in the medium by either adding stuff that has them or adding the actual microbes themselves. But then you have to feed them periodically (most people use molasses for feeding the microbes by mixing it into the water during the first couple weeks)
I would recommend that the both of you should get some Mychorizae and Tricoderma from the hydro store and add to your medium on the next go if you are going to try to stay with organics. Also read as much of the organics stuff in that section so that you have a solid understanding of the best methods for using organics as it is far more involved than many people think. I have only done it some myself as it is quite challenging. You have to change the way you think about caring for your plants. You no longer feed your plants, you feed the soil and microbes, and they feed your plants and take care of the pH balance. I hope this helps both of you
Thanks Hushpuppy, no I am not doing organics, I grow in soil but that is all the local store had and I did not realize this till later. I have been doing the same as I did with the soil not knowing any better. I am using GH Flora Nova series nutes but am switching to Jungle Juice as soon as it arrives. My plants look good but after reading this thread I thought I would ask about the ph. 7thG sorry for jumping in on your thread.
Hushpuppy
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I think you will be fine growing in soil with hydro nutes. You should have been able to do fine with the GH Flora but the JJ is very good nutes. The key to running both organic style soil and synthetic nutes is to talk to the guys who do it, like Hamster Lewis and 4U2Smoke. I think they usually start out with the soil and add about 1/4th amount of pearlite. The vermiculite is different than pearlite which is important for keeping the soil from compacting and trapping moisture.
They let the plants veg in the soil which they amend a little, then when the nutrients in the soil are close to depleted, they begin feeding the plants with synthetic nutes. I think that compost may be a bit tricky for using in soilless without going fully organic. If you want to go fully synthetic, and use the JJ, I would suggest a coco based soil medium. However, with the JJ, regardless of the soil medium, you will have to get the pH adjuster fluids to set the pH levels as JJ3part has no buffers in it.
If you want help with the JJ when you get ready to start, just let me know and we can go over how to best use it
They let the plants veg in the soil which they amend a little, then when the nutrients in the soil are close to depleted, they begin feeding the plants with synthetic nutes. I think that compost may be a bit tricky for using in soilless without going fully organic. If you want to go fully synthetic, and use the JJ, I would suggest a coco based soil medium. However, with the JJ, regardless of the soil medium, you will have to get the pH adjuster fluids to set the pH levels as JJ3part has no buffers in it.
If you want help with the JJ when you get ready to start, just let me know and we can go over how to best use it
Thanks Hushpuppy , I have the ph stuff and I have been using gh for many years without problems and just thought I would try something different. JJ seemed like a good choice and the price was good. I know you are using it and will keep you in mind if I have problems.
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