Elephant Man's Grow Journal, 1st attempt

[THE BROTHER'S GRUNT]

LOL, I took a peek today, but saw a big trunk .

ROFLMAO Eman. May i say your ladies are looking very healthy. Nothing like a big bush i say. Whatever your doing keep doing it because your ladies are beautiful. :aok:

 

[Elephant Man]

ROFLMAO Eman. May i say your ladies are looking very healthy. Nothing like a big bush i say. Whatever your doing keep doing it because your ladies are beautiful. :aok:

Thanks TBG! That really means alot to me, I am constantly inspired by your incredible talent at growing and photography.

I don't exactly know what I am doing right, I thought I might learn a little about nutrient balancing from this first batch, but they don't really seem to care what I do . They just grow. I have barely any discoloration or spots or anything. Certainly not enough to change anything.

I'm sure all that will change once I start the hydro.

I do wish I had started shaping them much sooner, the big bagseed is just that, BIG. Once I'm sure I can clone, I might have to flower her.

Since she is just a guinea pig, Is there any way I can gradually trim her down without LST or stressing her to herm? Too late to try and bonsai?

 

[THE BROTHER'S GRUNT]

Thanks TBG! That really means alot to me, I am constantly inspired by your incredible talent at growing and photography.

I don't exactly know what I am doing right, I thought I might learn a little about nutrient balancing from this first batch, but they don't really seem to care what I do . They just grow. I have barely any discoloration or spots or anything. Certainly not enough to change anything.

I'm sure all that will change once I start the hydro.

I do wish I had started shaping them much sooner, the big bagseed is just that, BIG. Once I'm sure I can clone, I might have to flower her.

Since she is just a guinea pig, Is there any way I can gradually trim her down without LST or stressing her to herm? Too late to try and bonsai?

Sure just trim as if you were taking clones from her and just toss them away. Be sure that you don't trim more than 30% at a time just like clones. We do it all the time to keep the our plants small.

 

[Elephant Man]

Sure just trim as if you were taking clones from her and just toss them away. Be sure that you don't trim more than 30% at a time just like clones. We do it all the time to keep the our plants small.

Thanks TBG will do . What about the stem? Can I hack 30% off of the top?

A small update on the 1kw MH. After several days of messin' with it, I finally got temps were I want them. I have been steadily dropping it on the girls too, and now I am at 12 inches away with no burn:yay: . I am not sure if this is because of my 400+ cfm fan, or the light track but I like it!

I have the hood open acting as my intake, and I have a thermostat on the fan for those cold temps that will surely get here one day .

 

[Zarnon]

From what I'm reading the mag content is 100mg to 2.5 mg for potassium. That is a really different ratio to conventional nutes where you'll have 8% K to 1% max Magnesium. Manganese is also extreemly high ratio as it is a trace mineral in ferts (running about .001 percent).

So I would not say these are high in salts, I would say these are extreemly high in salts. I have seen too much mag really mess up a grow from people who were trying to correct a deficiency.

This link you posted http://www.anarac.com/fertilizersewage_sludge.htm
was not a promoter of this method but warns of the dangers of using sewage sludge as a fertilizer because of heavy metal contaminants (although not clear if this is because it includes industrial waste or not).

Other than that, it looks like the NPK would work, although there is going to be variation in amount and concentration given what you've eaten (the kidney excretes salts to keep balance in our blood, esp sodium and potassium). Personally I need to know exactly what ratio of a nute is going into my mix including minerals in case I develop problems.

I think your idea of a controlled study is wise. Mainly because most of these links are anectdotal in nature ("I tried it and it works").

Prost!

 

[Elephant Man]

From what I'm reading the mag content is 100mg to 2.5 mg for potassium. That is a really different ratio to conventional nutes where you'll have 8% K to 1% max Magnesium. Manganese is also extreemly high ratio as it is a trace mineral in ferts (running about .001 percent).

So I would not say these are high in salts, I would say these are extreemly high in salts. I have seen too much mag really mess up a grow from people who were trying to correct a deficiency.

This link you posted http://www.anarac.com/fertilizersewage_sludge.htm
was not a promoter of this method but warns of the dangers of using sewage sludge because of heavy metal contaminants (although not clear if this is because it includes industrial waste or not).

Other than that, it looks like the NPK would work, although there is going to be variation in amount and concentration give what you've eaten (the kidney excretes salts to keep balance in our blood, esp sodium and potassium). Personally I need to know exactly what's going in there in case I develop a problem.

I think your idea of a controlled study is wise. Mainly because most of these links are anectdotal in nature ("I tried it and it works").

Prost!

Thanks Zarnon, an excellent open minded opinion:clap: ! I have not actually made it through all of the links in that info I posted. I am merely considering this right now, and your response was EXACTLY the type of answer I was looking for. I have always been a very health oriented person, and I actually consume VERY little processed food at all. I have always been aware of the high sodium contents in processed food sources, and never add salt to anything I prepare. I don't even have any salt in the house, just pepper. I would be interested in seeing an analysis of my own urine. I am developing quite a bond with my ladies and the idea of a full circle connection between my health and theirs just really excites me. I understand the related problems with excess salt build up, and actually that is the only thing stopping me from trying this right now.
I am sure there must be a solution, perhaps pre-mixing and 'sifting' off the top would help reduce some salts and excessive trace elements after they settle? Thanks for your opinion of the analysis above, and for stopping by my journal:cool2: , you are welcome anytime!

 

[Elephant Man]

Oops, wanted to add;

In the article I posted, there is mention of possible Phosphate deficiency during flowering, and using bone meal to combat this. I picked up some Schultz Bone Meal (6-12-0) but it seems to me, using this method, you wouldn't be wanting to add much nitrogen that late in flowering, especially when considering the 'time release' effects of urea or ammonium nitrate (can't remember which one ). Is this product high in nitrate? Or is bone meal in general high in nitrate?

I'm still waiting on clones, no way I will try this on the mothers .

Darn, I was so 'into' this discussion I broke my coffee pot.

 

[laylow6988]

Hey on those bagseed plants, you seeing any preflowers yet. I went through the post kinda quick, I hope I am notasking something that is already there. But after, what is it like 35 days from being in the pot? Do you think they are close to being able to be flowered? They are lookin pretty damn good. I am trying to figure out a timeline. I know 35 days seems kinda soon. But taking all things into consideration right now. Thinking X amount of room. Y amount of plants. Z Yield of plants. W time it takes to fully harvest. V how much smoked in that time. Price of pot on the street. Price grown including supplies. After all that I want to adjust my ways a bit. Damn, I am all up in your thread. Sorry about that. I'll get back to you. So how they lookin?

 

[Elephant Man]

Hey on those bagseed plants, you seeing any preflowers yet. I went through the post kinda quick, I hope I am notasking something that is already there. But after, what is it like 35 days from being in the pot? Do you think they are close to being able to be flowered? They are lookin pretty damn good. I am trying to figure out a timeline. I know 35 days seems kinda soon. But taking all things into consideration right now. Thinking X amount of room. Y amount of plants. Z Yield of plants. W time it takes to fully harvest. V how much smoked in that time. Price of pot on the street. Price grown including supplies. After all that I want to adjust my ways a bit. Damn, I am all up in your thread. Sorry about that. I'll get back to you. So how they lookin?

No, problem, ask all the questions you like! This is my first grow and I have filled this thread with all kinds of stuff from growroom setup, to DIY experiments . I tell ya, its fun to look back at all the crazy ideas I came up with along the way.
The bagseed did preflower first, probably at about 3 weeks . Probably somee kind of commercial strain bred to do that.
A couple actually still haven't preflowered, but I've got clones now from all of them, and If I get tired of waiting, I'll flip a clone and see whats up.

As far as the other questions, I am very excited, but not anxious at all, and your timing is perfect, I am trying to figure out what to do with who .
We learn from our mistakes, and I made a few, I should have started with one strain, maybe 2. 5 seeds of each, look for phenos I like, you get the idea. I should have left them under flouros and started training/shaping them long ago. A couple are pretty big. I know I will flip the 2 bagseed as soon as their clones take to transplant, they are just too much to handle, I got distracted when transplanting one of them long ago, and she sits too high in her pot .

As far as yield, well, I'm optomistic, but I would honestly just to be happy to make it that far . Don't plan on selling anything, have no idea what this stuff goes for on the street, I have freinds who grow that have taken care of me lately since my injury. I would love to be able to repay them one day, but like I said, I'm not thinking that far ahead. I love to experiment as much as I love to smoke, but this summer will most likely be too hot to grow, so I'm hoping to be able to put some aside.

Thanks for ridin' along with me, I'm sure there are others, I don't mind if they lurk, as long as they jump in if I start having problems .

 

[Elephant Man]

This is probably good news for alot of you, I decided not to do the urine thing. IMO as great as it sounds, I'm about learning, and using urine, is not going to teach me enough about their specific needs.

I have experienced a few strange occurances along the way, and I think I know why. Once it came time to feed my ladies, I tried to look for signs of deficiencies, and they never showed . To this day, they have recieved very little food at all, yet done nothing but flourish. I think I have a few beneficial microbial beasties in there, from my original soil mix, 50/50 FF ocean forest and light warrior. Light warrior contains Mycorrhizae Fungi, and I believe they may be taking care of the plant for me, to some extent.
Look at the links HGB posted above for more info, with both of these guys help, I am going to give Living Organics a shot .

I also finished the DIY aerocloner, I couldn't get the pump I bought to create enough heat to keep the water where I wanted, so I copped out and bought an aqaurium heater . Sometimes it's tough to stay ahead of the girls . If there is enough interest, I will put up a DIY, once I see some roots .

 

[HGB]

Look at the links HGB posted above for more info, with both of these guys help, I am going to give Living Organics a shot .

glad ya got some use out of those links bro.. and sorry about the first google search

what's that on top of the cloner bro? looks like metal

grow on

 

[Elephant Man]

glad ya got some use out of those links bro.. and sorry about the first google search

what's that on top of the cloner bro? looks like metal

grow on

Just a few peices of galvanized allthread I threw on there late last night to keep the lid down. I was up too late taking clones and when I got up I replaced the allthread with water bottles . I need a new container, this one is a little warped and leaks, but it should make a great base soilmix container .

I won't be able to thank you enough if this reusing, composting, feeding beasties thing works out. Using my food scraps and recycling soil is pretty good waste management (just like the urine thing) so it falls in line with my plan to recycle and minimize replenishing costs:yay: :yay: :yay: .

 

[laylow6988]

Yeah it sounds like it would work out well. I will do my own compost when I get out of the city. I can't wait to get out of the city. Get me some land to do some experimenting of my own. Can't wait to see your other pics from your DIY projects. I don't see them ending anytime soon. Let us know how the recycling goes. I'd like to know what kinds of things you add, how the PH reacts, any kind of foul smells that might occure. Any knowledge is good knowledge. Pass it on.

 

[Zarnon]

Yeah, I think your goal to do something that is ecologically friendly and efficient is laudable. I do not do the composting route but I'm sure there is plenty of info out there to get the mix you need.

 

[learnin to gro]

hey man looks like your pretty handy ill tell you when it comes to wood im handy but building a cloner or some of the other stuff you got. thats sweet man

 

[Sin inc]

Keep Making Things So I Can Try To Make Them To Your Girls Are Looking Good

 

[Elephant Man]

All of you guys, thank you.

Zarnon, Laylow, the compost thing really runs deep, in my particular situation, I can't grow outdoor or have any kind of 'conventional' compost pile.

I gotta say a quick thing about Living Organics that apply here (and to my plan):

In essence, it is not growing a plant at all, it is the growing of beneficial microbeasties (fungi and bacteria) that will protect, control intake (ph and ferts too), and be completely sustained in your compost and plant containers by VERY small amounts of organic matter. That is the best I can do so far, but I am 'exam crashing' this one with some guys help.

That being said, a VERY sterile environment similar to what you would maintain for a plant, must be maintained for your compost.

Blah blah, here's were I get back to the point. A living organics 'compost' container (10 - 30 gallons) works quite unconventionally. By the use of careful promotion, after a very short time, an overwhelming number of beasties will be at your disposal for distribution to keep your plant containers maximized AND decompose organic matter at an accelerated rate.

By now you might see where this could come in very useful for those:

on a budget,

in an apartment or cramped with no real outdoor area,

interested in recycling their plant matter without a 'conventional outdoor compost pile,

interested in growing true organics - after all in living organics - if you EVER introduce something non organic, your beasties will possibly die and take your plants with them. This can be as simple as adding tap water.

Okay, anyway

Sin and LTG,
I got some more DIY to post real soon, but I am in kind of an emergency with the plants/grow area right now. Alot has happened. I will post more and update real soon.

 

[HGB]

In essence, it is not growing a plant at all, it is the growing of beneficial microbeasties (fungi and bacteria) that will protect, control intake (ph and ferts too), and be completely sustained in your compost and plant containers by VERY small amounts of organic matter. That is the best I can do so far, but I am 'exam crashing' this one with some guys help.

Well EM.

sure didnt take ya long to pick up on that train of thought

here's something to chew on... think of grow'n this plant blind but you have the info to do it without need'n to see it

Theres a couple of blind peeps on the site from the early link's i posted that can grow like mad.... with never seen'n the girls

my goal is to be able to do the same as I only have 1 eye now and the other isnt to good now days but i never want to stop growing

keep up the research bro and share the knowledge.... and keep that all thread away from water cloner's or any hydro setup for that matter


grow on

 

[Elephant Man]

HGB

Wow, I can see where growing blind would seem impossible, but I know if anyone can, you can:aok: :farm: . Now I see why all the troubleshooting guides include so much about leaf texture and shape .

I have been really trying to pick up this LO thing really fast. I think I know why some long term growers may have difficulty with it. I can see where after so many have fought so long to try and understand MJ's needs, that it could be difficult to try and forget all that and learn how to grow beasties. I guess, with me being new, I am a little more open to ideas, considering I know nothing 'set in stone' from experience.

Just a little update, aerocloner works great, couple mothers are not happy.
I am trying to apply what I have learned to pull them through, no disrespect to anyone by not asking for help, I am just a stubborn idiot . The troubleshooting guides are out there, and I am doing my best to utilize them. They are looking much better today, I will update as soon as I have a better idea of what happened.

 

[Elephant Man]

More easy DIY so even the 'financially challenged' can try and grow too .

In the first pic with the fan, you can see I took some info from another site and took it one step further. Just so you know, I have 2 oscillating fans, I got lucky by finding them used/cheap. I am sure you guys have seen what a wall mounted goes for ($$$). I chose to mod this method of using a simple box fan (cheap) and placement to try to 'bounce' airflow off of walls to 'even out' circulation. Instead of messin around and finding the best possible spot, I just mounted it and made some empty bottle 'air directors' and messed around with placement of those till I got good even distribution. This will in fact, free up a plant site

.

In the second pic, I have a simple kerosene heater thermostat attached to my light cooling fan, thus requiring no additional heating

. By monitering placement, you can 'dial' in a temp that will correspond with your canopy temps.

Third pic is of the new 'propagation and seedling' lab area

. And some clones to the right getting experimented on

.

Fourth pic is my very first propagated clone

.