WW trich pics at 69 days

[Amateur Grower]

Well, I'm almost 10 weeks into flower (69 days today) and I just gave my girls 4 days of complete darkness. I just had to check them today to see if they were ready, being as tomorrow they'll be 10 weeks into flowering. I'm not sure if the 4 days of darkness helped with trich formation or not.

I'm seeing almost all cloudy and a little ambering-these seem to be very stubborn about going from cloudy to amber. Please tell me what you think.

AG

 

[HippyInEngland]

Agreed.

Mostly cloudy.

Did you try a sample before putting her into darkness?

I would have let her go another week or so, but it all depends on what kind of high your after.

Too much amber and she could go too much of a body stone.

eace:

 

[StoneyBud]

Hey AG, I think they're beautiful.

If you want to have some amber trichomes, then just be patient. They'll come.

Turning your lights off was IMHO, as well as many other people who have been growing for decades, a total waste of your time and did nothing but extend the time it'll take for your resin to age to amber.

The "lights out" thing IMHO is another myth like the flushing. Unproven, popular stories with no basis in fact.

But that's what makes the world go-round.

If you leave your lights on, your plants will age just like plants have done since the beginning of time. Time = Age. Dark does not equal age.
Age makes trichomes turn amber, not the absence of light.

Good luck! Looks like whatever you do, you'll have some great smoke.

 

[Amateur Grower]

Agreed.

Mostly cloudy.

Did you try a sample before putting her into darkness?

I would have let her go another week or so, but it all depends on what kind of high your after.

Too much amber and she could go too much of a body stone.

eace:

I've been sampling off and on-I took a small bud this morning that I'm quick drying to sample tonight-can't wait!

I'm looking for some more amber I guess, because I'm wanting somewhat of a body high-I guess I'm shooting for a good mix of head AND body!

AG

 

[Amateur Grower]

Hey AG, I think they're beautiful.


Turning your lights off was IMHO, as well as many other people who have been growing for decades, a total waste of your time and did nothing but extend the time it'll take for your resin to age to amber.

The "lights out" thing IMHO is another myth like the flushing. Unproven, popular stories with no basis in fact.

But that's what makes the world go-round.

If you leave your lights on, your plants will age just like plants have done since the beginning of time. Time = Age. Dark does not equal age.
Age makes trichomes turn amber, not the absence of light.

Good luck! Looks like whatever you do, you'll have some great smoke.

Thanks Stoney-I read about the "two weeks in total darkness" thing about White Widow, and wanted to try going totally dark a little more than 24 hours. There was no way I was going two weeks, with this being my first grow. I still don't know exactly what I'm looking for!

I think you're right-I don't think the total darkness thing makes much of a difference. I believe I WILL wait another week or so to begin seeing more amber trichs. So far in my sampling, it's been nice, but really more of a head high and not too much body. How much difference does drying and slow curing make in potentcy?

AG

 

[SherwoodForest]

I'll add my 2 cents and suggest that drying has everything to do with potency. Curing is more of a taste thing, but drying will have a big affect on how stoney the bud is. For years I have been under the impression that if the thc molecule is surrounded by 2 molecules of H2O or more, the potency is lowered. When the thc has zero H2O next to it, it's as potent as it will ever be.

 

[StoneyBud]

So far in my sampling, it's been nice, but really more of a head high and not too much body. How much difference does drying and slow curing make in potency? AG

Hey AG, sure, with clear and cloudy trichomes like you've shown in your pics, the head high is what you'd expect. It's great, but I personally like to have more of a body high than anything. You may be the same.

Curing does a couple of things for you.

It creates an environment that allows some of the less favorable psychoactive components of marijuana to convert into a more psychoactive condition. This will make a more potent smoke.

It also does something that is nothing more than math. As it drys, there is less and less mass to the quantity of weed. There is more psychoactive material and the psychoactive material that was already there now represents more of a percentage of the entire mass.

What was already there is just more evident in the smoke because it represents more of the total mass.

Curing is a very, very important step in creating your own stash. It mellows the smoke, making it less harsh to smoke. It burns better when rolled and makes for a much better "joint" experience without the runs, drips and going out.

I would be more than glad to be one of your testers..... :hubba:

 

[StoneyBud]

Another part of the Fast Dry vs Slow Dry.

When initially drying your weed, all you're doing is rapidly ridding your weed of most of it's water content. That's it.

Then, as it's cured slowly, it drys at a more predictable rate and slow enough to allow the conversion of it's components as I mentioned in my previous post.

This slow cure has been proven to create a better tasting, less harsh smoke.

A simple test of taking some fresh bud from a plant and giving it a rapid dry until its crackly dry and then smoking it will show you how harsh weed can be.

We've all smoked weed that was properly cured and when compared to the rapidly dried weed, their is a wide difference in smokability.

It takes 3 months for my weed to reach a point where I'll use it. I have some that has cured for more than a year. If stored properly, weed will last several years with negligible lessening of it's potency.

 

[dirtyolsouth]

Hey AG, I think they're beautiful.

If you want to have some amber trichomes, then just be patient. They'll come.

Turning your lights off was IMHO, as well as many other people who have been growing for decades, a total waste of your time and did nothing but extend the time it'll take for your resin to age to amber.

The "lights out" thing IMHO is another myth like the flushing. Unproven, popular stories with no basis in fact.

But that's what makes the world go-round.

If you leave your lights on, your plants will age just like plants have done since the beginning of time. Time = Age. Dark does not equal age.
Age makes trichomes turn amber, not the absence of light.

Good luck! Looks like whatever you do, you'll have some great smoke.

Marijuana reacts to stress and this produces increased trichs. You'd think at some point in all the decades you could actually TRY this to see if it works. I have, it does. It's very easy to do a comparison. Dark = Stress. Stress = Goo. Time + Dark = more goo. Time doesn't stop for darkness, time marches on. Put one of your finished plants into a dark closet for a few days before harvesting and compare it to those who didn't receive the darkness. Voila!

I've done side by side comparisons with the same strain grown in the same conditions and also compared buds from properly cured previous grows in the same room. A dark period has always helped imho and it seems to make the most difference when I grow in the winter and can get the temps down in the upper 50's during the dark period. I've had many strains respond well and amber up during darkness over the years and some strains that just put on more trichs. I don't want to wait another three days but I do... it's worth the wait.

You gotta be getting close on the WW... 70 days already...

Peace!

 

[StoneyBud]

Marijuana reacts to stress and this produces increased trichs. You'd think at some point in all the decades you could actually TRY this to see if it works. I have, it does.

Would you post the methods you used in your testing?

Thanks.

 

[StoneyBud]

I should know better than to argue with anyone on this group. Pretty much, anyone can come here and say anything they want, and if you argue with them about it, it turns nasty and everyone gets banned.

I'll say one last thing about your darkness theory. Then, you can claim whatever you wish and I won't say another word.

First, ALL STRESS doesn't create more trichomes. SOME types of stress do. If all stress worked regardless of what you did or how you did it, then you could just fill the room with some sort of inert gas and deprive the plants of oxygen for 3 days too. That won't work either.

To those who don't understand how plants create trichomes, here's a short lessen for you.

It requires light. Light is what makes plants produce plant matter via photosynthesis. No light, no photosynthesis. The plant will continue to produce a LESSENED amount of plant matter by using some stored energy within it's system, but it won't and can't produce as much as it would if it had full light and nutrients.

Now you can argue this FACT as much as you like. You can SAY it isn't so, but what you're doing is contradicting every botanist in the entire world by saying YOUR PLANT does things that are IMPOSSIBLE.

Your testing isn't accurate. I'll tell you why I know this. It can't be. Your saying something that is not possible. Plain and simple.

Before responding to this, I would strongly advise you to talk to a person who actually knows botany. In a beginners course on it, you learn what you're trying to say works is IMPOSSIBLE. It just can't happen.

It's as crazy as saying you can stress your plant by putting it in saltwater for three days and it'll create more trichomes. NO IT WON'T.

You can lower the RH and/or the temperature on some strains and the plant will react by producing more resin. It does this by using the LIGHT that is on it to produce via photosynthesis. If you take away the light, it will produce less and less photosynthesis each hour until the plant dies.

There really is no argument about this. It's already been proven. If you deny the fact that it's proven, then it just becomes a silly argument, because you can find out by simply visiting a botanist at any University and they will explain it to you.

Growing two crops in rooms next to each other and then smoking the weed and thinking its stronger, or looking at some leaf on it and thinking it has more trichomes on it isn't "testing" the theory.

I'm sorry, but plainly put, if you put your plants into darkness for ANY amount of days prior to harvest, it will make LESS RESIN than it would have, had you just left your lights on for the same amount of time.

I'm not continuing this silly argument. It's pointless.

The facts I've presented are as easy to verify as picking up the phone and talking to a professional in the field. It's not the first time this has been thought of. People have been studying plants for centuries. The modern day SCIENTISTS have already figured this out.

Stop trying to reinvent the wheel. It's round. It rolls. It works.

Light makes plants grow substance, not the absence of light.

I'm sure there will be smoke coming from the "Light deprivation" theorists.

They will insist on trying to make a square wheel roll.

If you use the light deprivation method, all you're doing is harming your plants and making them LESS than they could have been.

THAT CAN BE PROVEN by simply speaking to someone who knows what they're talking about. That part of plant studies is NOT rocket science.

I'm now out of this silly argument. Flame all you want. If anyone insists that this method works, then you will have just proven that you know almost nothing about how a plant grows and it would be pointless as hell to argue with you at that point.

Find a Botanist that disagrees with me and give me their name, title and phone number. I'll call them. Quote what they say to you so I can discuss it with them.

That won't happen, because what you're claiming to happen CANNOT happen. Plants don't work that way.

I'm sorry to be so blunt, but this nonsense has to stop. People work hard to grow their weed and I can't sit by and watch while every Tom, **** and Harry comes up with some wild theory to try.

This one will do exactly the opposite of what is claimed. There is no doubt about it. Any one of you can verify that with one conversation with a professional at any AG department at any University in the entire world.

Unless every single one of them is wrong and you're right.

I'm done.

 

[StoneyBud]

Pretty funny.... The "Richard" in Tom-****-and-Harry is a banned word.

 

[BBFan]

Well, I for one haven't found anything to confirm or deny this.

Stoney, I've read many of your posts and you have made many great points.

I have been very impressed with DirtyolSouth and his posts- I've picked up 2 valuable points from his posts recently. And he always very polite.

Interesting to see where this goes.

 

[dirtyolsouth]

I'm really not trying to bait you or anyone. I can only share what I know from personal experience Stoney Bud. My first discovery of the power or stress with growing marijuana was purely by accident. In the late 90's I grew at a remote location with a hydro setup all automated on timers. My partner and I had to go out of town for the holidays and when we got back to the garden we were very disappointed to see that a breaker had tripped and the plants had gone without food or light for almost a week and the temps were in the 50's. The plants were late in week 5 and were dried up beyond the point of no return. But, they were covered in trichs, much more than that strain had ever produced before by that point in their bloom and much much more than was usually produced in a week. Although the buds weren't developed properly the combination of these stress factors piled on the goo and it was pretty decent to smoke. I didn't know how to replicate the situation and keep my plants healthy until harvest so I filed that knowledge away for several years.

Around 2004 I was frequenting some forums that had a lot of BC growers contributing. A few of the more knowlegible growers started posting their experiments with using a combination of a darkness period, thirsty plants, and night temps in the upper 50's during the dark cycle. We gave it a go. We harvested plants at a couple stages for comparison. They were all the same strain. We harvested one plant on the same day we put the other plants into darkness, we also harvested a plant that stayed under a 1K light for the additional 3 days while the others stayed in the dark bloom room for 72 hours. We also had some nicely cured buds of the same strain from our previous run, grown under the same conditions and nutes but without a darkness period before harvest. The plants that had been exposed to the dark period had slightly more trichs, about 20% more ripe amber trichs and more depth of flavor in the cured end product. Over time I've noticed that some strains amber up more than others in darkness. I don't do A/B tests anymore as I accept that it works and I'm sure that even with my limited knowledge of proper botany, stress must have a lot to do with it.


Peace!

 

[Hick]

I'm really not trying to bait you or anyone. I can only share what I know from personal experience Stoney Bud. My first discovery of the power or stress with growing marijuana was purely by accident. In the late 90's I grew at a remote location with a hydro setup all automated on timers. My partner and I had to go out of town for the holidays and when we got back to the garden we were very disappointed to see that a breaker had tripped and the plants had gone without food or light for almost a week and the temps were in the 50's. The plants were late in week 5 and were dried up beyond the point of no return. But, they were covered in trichs, much more than that strain had ever produced before by that point in their bloom and much much more than was usually produced in a week. Although the buds weren't developed properly the combination of these stress factors piled on the goo and it was pretty decent to smoke. I didn't know how to replicate the situation and keep my plants healthy until harvest so I filed that knowledge away for several years.

Around 2004 I was frequenting some forums that had a lot of BC growers contributing. A few of the more knowlegible growers started posting their experiments with using a combination of a darkness period, thirsty plants, and night temps in the upper 50's during the dark cycle. We gave it a go. We harvested plants at a couple stages for comparison. They were all the same strain. We harvested one plant on the same day we put the other plants into darkness, we also harvested a plant that stayed under a 1K light for the additional 3 days while the others stayed in the dark bloom room for 72 hours. We also had some nicely cured buds of the same strain from our previous run, grown under the same conditions and nutes but without a darkness period before harvest. The plants that had been exposed to the dark period had slightly more trichs, about 20% more ripe amber trichs and more depth of flavor in the cured end product. Over time I've noticed that some strains amber up more than others in darkness. I don't do A/B tests anymore as I accept that it works and I'm sure that even with my limited knowledge of proper botany, stress must have a lot to do with it.


Peace!

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showpost.php?p=501022&postcount=16 <-- At least one mj scholar/authority does not agree. The production of thc and cannabinoid biosynthesis is further explained in the source here--> hXXp://www.mellowgold.com/grow/mjbotany-removed/marijuanabotany4.html
In addition, I too have some "first hand" experience with extended dark period. But mine consisted of longer (14-16 hour dark period over the entire flowering period) in an outdoor greenhouse.
What "I" found, was that the overall "appearance" did seem to show more trichomes, but the potency was "noticeably" less than the same product under 12/12 indoors, OR the same product grown outdoors in fall getting 12-14 hours of light.

Posting 'contrary' opinions, experience, findings, does not constitute arguing. Only the "posters" can elevate it to an arguement...

 

[StoneyBud]

Hey dirtyolsouth, I'm not trying to start an argument either. What I am trying to do is make clear the types of things that are capable of happening and those which are not.

The parts of a plant that grow as a result of photosynthesis, can't alter themselves to grow as a result of darkness. Some of the plant energy that is stored within the plant can be used to prolong a brief period of survival, but it won't enable more growth than the photosynthesis was creating.

There is a variation to that possibility however. If a plant were stressed by placing it into darkness long enough to create a "death" response, which could be termed "stress", and *then* the lights are restored to their previous levels, I can see where that stress may indeed cause accelerated growth for a short period. It may also actually alter the plants genetics, (for good or bad). Plants are extremely adaptable to conditions. Marijuana is one of the most adaptable.

As far as testing results go, the entire reason that "Scientific Method" was created and refined to where it is today is to provide the most accurate method of reporting results of testing. Prior to it being created, many tests of all sorts were a mish-mash of procedure, standards and reported variables.

Proper testing of a theory would result in verifiable results that can be repeated exactly as done in every repetition of the testing. This is harder than it sounds with something like we're discussing.

1. Room parameters have to be exactly the same in all ways.

2. Lighting has to be exactly the same.

3. Nutrients and delivery have to be identical.

4. Clones must be measured, weighed and have exactly the same amount of leaves and structure, and of course, be from the same plant and treated identically in preparation.

5. Temperature and all environmental variables have to be maintained at precisely the same levels and conditions.

6. An exact count of Trichomes must be done on a given size and thickness of leaf from exactly the same position on each of the plants.

7. The leaf must be weighed to ascertain it's resin weight.

8. Testing of the resin on the test leaf, for THC content has to be done.

These are only a few of the test points that would create a testing environment acceptable in any report using Scientific Method. Each of the variables above can affect the outcome to any given extent. That's why "Home" testings like what you've done are pretty much meaningless in the scientific sense. They just aren't a reliable method of determining a procedure to use for a guideline.

It is interesting that your weed seemed to be stronger as a result of your power outage. The reasons for the increased strength are debatable only because they aren't confirmed with repeatable results and as such, the determining factor(s) that caused the increase (if there really was one) aren't able to be confirmed via your testing. It's a nasty little circle that creates doubt in substantiating the given results.

I would strongly suggest to growers to NOT place your plants into darkness as their last step. If testing this theory, I would suggest using the 72 hour darkness, *followed* with at least one week of proper growth parameters to recoup the results of the stress caused by the dark period.

I can see where that could affect the end results, perhaps dramatically.

I'm currently only growing one crop, so I'm not risking it with testing. I already know what to do to create a hell of a finished product without the darkness testing, so I think I'll just stick with what I've already proven to myself in many other grows.

Thanks for the discussion and the mature manner in which you've presented your argument.

If you or anyone does any comparative *Light-Dark-Light* testing, I'd be very interested in the outcome.

 

[StoneyBud]

In addition, in regards to what I would do if I were testing the "Darkness Theory", I would try 24, 48 and 72 hour darkness periods and one, two and three week following lighted periods for each.

The outcome would provide a spectrum of results that could show an advantage in one of the combinations of dark/light timings.

 

[stevetosh]

Hey AG, I think they're beautiful.

If you want to have some amber trichomes, then just be patient. They'll come.

Turning your lights off was IMHO, as well as many other people who have been growing for decades, a total waste of your time and did nothing but extend the time it'll take for your resin to age to amber.

The "lights out" thing IMHO is another myth like the flushing. Unproven, popular stories with no basis in fact.

But that's what makes the world go-round.

If you leave your lights on, your plants will age just like plants have done since the beginning of time. Time = Age. Dark does not equal age.
Age makes trichomes turn amber, not the absence of light.

Good luck! Looks like whatever you do, you'll have some great smoke.

I could not of put it better myself, Stonybud rite on the money.

 

[NorCalHal]

I agree with Stoney on this. Light deprivation will not increse Tric production, and in fact, does the opposite.

Resin is produced by a MJ plant as a Defense to light to protect the Calyx, which, in Nature, would contain a seed, thus protecting the young seed from getting "burned".

Usuing this therory, there has been testing done at some of the MMJ facilities in Cali that actualy do the opposite. They intensify the light at the end of harvest and have proven results of greater Trich production.
What they did was make some crazy light mover that brings the light VERY close to the canopy, which makes the lumens more intense. The folks that conducted the test are reputable and I for one believe it., though an application to the average grower would make it a little expensive and a big PITA.

 

[Amateur Grower]

I just typed a LONG post about peace, love, and everyone getting along, then hit POST REPLY, and got, of course, SERVER BUSY and lost it all. Sh*t!!!!!!

I also asked if flushing was an unproven theory as Stoney intimated and why Art Vandolay's sig mentions smoking WW leaves-it this facetiousness?

AG.