Never Seen This Before....

[tcbud]

And I hope to never see it again.

Outdoor, Hot Temps, Plague, Nutes, Molasses, PH, ***?

Has anyone seen anything like this before? The first plant and the second plant are the SAME plant. As you can see it grew out some, but hardly at all up. These plants are grown by someone who knows what they are doing (I guess neglecting the signs of problems maybe the biggest problem with them?). That being said this is the thing.

He did rototill his garden deeper than normal. (Normally these plants should be in the five to six foot range, huge bushes grown here in the past)

He does have pine trees over the garden area, especially toward where the MJ is located. His tomato (4th pic) is also showing signs of the same problem, and you can see his melon near by is unaffected. The corn you can see behind pic 3 is short but not curing leaf (usually this would be twice this height at this time)

He put in some Mushroom Soil, and this year has added a cover on the soil to prevent weeds. I am wondering if something came into the garden from this load of soil myself.

He did put on Molasses during the first few feedings.

He is using some odd plant food with a huge middle number like 15-85-?.

He planted his garden about the first of June. So I am thinking cold temps cant be a factor. It has been in the 90f pretty much since July 1.

These leaves are tortured and curled from the sides up. I have yet to find a PH problem picture anywhere showing PH problems.

This is really WEIRD! I have never seen anything like this. His neglect to try and find out what the hell was going on sooner is a bummer. I would have been freaking way before now, and I guess you can blame my neglect too, I haven't been going fishing near enough. When I fish, I see his garden, so no fishing, no looking in on his progress.

PLEASE Hick, Nv, anyone who grows outdoor near pine needles....HELP!

 

[BackWoodsDrifter]

I grows outside and have mentioned in past never ever grow near pines or were water runn off come from pine areas. Acid in soil way to high! Have yual been able to get a soil ph test kit? I am assumin yual just plant and leave lone to almost harvest? Anyways get soil tested bet its acid killin'em ifin it aint hope some other smarter pilgrem be gettin set straight friend, hope it goes well fur ya.

BWD

 

[tcbud]

Thanks BWD, he is in the process of getting a soil tester right now. They aren't dying, they are being tortured! These are out in a vegetable garden, growing right next to corn, tomato, peppers and squash. He has grown huge monster plants here for the last four years, always buying his mushroom soil from the same place, tilling it in. He is also on flat ground, no run off, soil perks real fast there. Thank you for your thoughts.

 

[BackWoodsDrifter]

Weird it be then! Hope yual get it dialed back in friend.

BWD

 

[4u2sm0ke]

:ciao: friend..I see a Nute overdose..and some heat issues ..I tried that fabric a few years back and it seemed to heat the soil and with the mushroom compost I bet its real hot down there....those plants look somewhat like mine oit back after the grass weed and feed...really sent them for a loop...my best sugestion is to water often and mist mist mist...

 

[Hick]

He put in some Mushroom Soil, and this year has added a cover on the soil to prevent weeds. I am wondering if something came into the garden from this load of soil myself.

I hope it was Mushroom "compost"... hXXp://extension.oregonstate.edu/gardening/mushroom-compost-use-carefully
...... but every company has a different recipe..
My first impression is that it 'is' a soil/nutrient issue, possibly the mush' soil amendment. Evergreens can make the soil over acidic as bwd related, but I'm leaning toward the mushy stuff. More a "hunch" than anything though.
That "crazy P number" could be an influence as well. phos' toxicity effects/inhibits the utilization of some micro nutrients.
4u might be on to something with the black weed barrier too, or maybe a combination of all of the above..:confused2:
good luck tc..

 

[nouvellechef]

I think its all around not happy. Certainly a nutrient overdose. Am sure PH might be an issue unless he ammended heavily with dolomite lime. Since their in the ground, dont think its heat thats the issue. Plants will well balanced nutrients and good ammended medium thrive when they are kept watered even in extreme heat. I think they are just plain not happy. Recovery and big harvest at this point is mostly out the window. Gonna take weeks for them to recover if at all. GL

 

[Dan K. Liberty]

hi tc . . . sorry for the problem . . . they do look pretty pissed about things

if the soil hasn't been pHed before now, thats asking for trouble . . . im betting it may be in the mid/high 5's or maybe 6.0 ("He did rototill his garden deeper than normal").

I've run OD around pines & beaver meadows in acid rain country, and I would hafta lime the hell outta my holes every spring, a month before the girls got there. At 6.0 and below, they would always stunt for lack of phosphorous and cal/mg, sometimes showing problems taking up water also.

if he's feeding with 85 phosphorous and low pH is locking it out, I bet that sucks for the plants . . . be like sitting before a sumptuous banquet and not being able to eat a single bite . . . if he's not locked out, it might be phosphorous burn . . . hope he can get em happy

jm2c :48:

 

[D3]

Pine needles release a mild acid into the soil. ThaT's why in a pine tree forest you never see anyThing growing underneaTh The Trees no grass no weeds noThing. My Mother used to Make us rake all the pine needles of the grass because it will kill the grass. But this looks more like heat stress to me I had the same proBlem with my veggie garden too. I live in the desert hardly no rain and temperatures well over 100 at times this is what I did. I built a big trellis is over my whole garden and on top I put that wooden lattice. It provided part shade for my garden and works very well. My garden is doing a lot better this year because of the trellis

 

[tcbud]

Thank you all.

I will relay this information to the Brother.

NC, I so agree about weeks to make them happy. I bought him four more plants, big clones, and gave him one of mine. I hope he has something to show for the summer. I still have not heard back from him about his soil PH.

4u, Im gonna go look at your journal, hope you took pics of that nute overdose. Im gonna hope I missed that page in your journal.

D3, pine needles are acid, he says he blew them off the soil, so...... And he/we grow in hot area for the last five/six years. I sometimes get some wilt on mine, but both of us have late afternoon shade.

Hick, I got the same "hunch" too. You go to the same guy for soil, year after year, maybe one year something else just happens to get in the soil, maybe he sells it anyway......still waiting on hearing the soil PH test. I bet he is fishing this morning on the river.

Dan, I think he will lime the garden next year. I wonder what else he will change from this year. I would change those freaky crazy nutes. He got that idea along with feeding all that molasses from a grower friend.

The crazy part is for the last few years his plants have been getting smaller and smaller (he always adds that mushroom soil too...hum....). Four years ago, his plants could have rivaled Old Hippies. Three pound plants. Now......I don't think he will pull eight ounces off of them.

Thanks guys. You all gave me something to think about. If they had been my plants doing this............................I would have pulled them and started over four weeks ago..... put some in pots..... changed up the nutes...... called a MJ doctor..... cried.....

 

[4u2sm0ke]

:ciao: tcbuddy

I think its a video I have that shows it best...they have reboundedand will say it took a feew weeks of nothing happinn...heres a few shots of the worst effected...very nice of you to donate to your Bro...I :heart: You

 

[Dan K. Liberty]

here's a link to a page at Plant Physiology Online, tc . . . pretty good pictures, descriptions and discussion of different nutrient deficiencies . . . not specifically related to OUR crop, but to crop plants in general, pretty good info:

hxxp://5e.plantphys.net/article.php?ch=t&id=289

hope every little bit helps . . . we're "rootin" for ya

jm2c :48:

 

[Hushpuppy]

I am no expert but it looks like the soil has been depleted from years of use. I have seen field here where I live where the corn did the same thing because of the farmer growing the same type of plants year after year, and it ends up depleting certain micro elements which gets the soil out of ballance. And even though they were adding fertilizer, they ended up having to let the field "rest" for several seasons to allow the ferts and natural growth replenish the soil. The melons thriving while everything else is floundering would be a result of them either liking a different PH or that they don't need as much of the missing elements. JMO

BTW: Dan; that info is a very good read. I have it bookmarked so I can go back and do some more reading

 

[tcbud]

Thanks guys.

4u, that looks a heck of a lot like it looked after he had just STARTED getting the problem. Him waiting and doing nothing, his look much worse. You are closest, you get the prize. I have dial up, so neglected to look at the vid, I think I will try and download it today. Thank you so much.

The update over at the brothers is, soil test shows NO nitrogen (Hushpuppy hit the nail there) in the soil at all! The PH test shows he has slight alkali PH, I said how slight and got the answer the color was off, so I don't know how slight is slight. Another person on another site said that the high Phospherous number on his nutes could very well cause that alkali problem. I haven't a clue what he has decided to do.

Thanks again guys.

 

[Wetdog]

Thanks BWD, he is in the process of getting a soil tester right now. They aren't dying, they are being tortured! These are out in a vegetable garden, growing right next to corn, tomato, peppers and squash. He has grown huge monster plants here for the last four years, always buying his mushroom soil from the same place, tilling it in. He is also on flat ground, no run off, soil perks real fast there. Thank you for your thoughts.

If he has grown "huge monster plants here for the last four years", then look at what he did different this year.

I'm REALLY looking at that fabric and the heat issues it would cause more than anything.

That wonky super high P fert a distant second.

The pH? Perhaps, IF he hadn't done so well in the past. I'm sure he limed his soil, or did in the past, or he would have had pH problems before now.

If he could remove a section of that fabric, that would answer that in short order.

Wet