# 'One Gram per Watt Club'



## Pot Belly

I have seen several references to a "one gram per watt" harvest. I have not achieved that yet - if there is a "yet" for me in the future.

Curiously, has anyone acheived a harvest like this? Can it be done without CO2? How about soil? What is the single most important item when trying to do this? Strain?

Also, I have found a problem with trying to compare wattage to harvest ratios: The higher the HPS wattage, the more efficient lumen output is per watt.

200 watt HPS = 22,000 lumens, or 110 lumens per watt.
400 watt HPS = 50,000 lumens, or 125 lumens per watt.

So when you are on the lower end of the grow scale, say 70 watts (HPS), you are at 90 lumens per watt.

Would a more accurate way to verifiy output be "grams per lumen", or "lumens per gram" (because it is a whole number)? Or is the ratio based on a 'standard', such as a 1,000 watt light?


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## the widowmaker

Pot Belly said:
			
		

> I have seen several references to a "one gram per watt" harvest. I have not achieved that yet - if there is a "yet" for me in the future.
> 
> Curiously, has anyone acheived a harvest like this? Can it be done without CO2? How about soil? What is the single most important item when trying to do this? Strain?
> 
> Also, I have found a problem with trying to compare wattage to harvest ratios: The higher the HPS wattage, the more efficient lumen output is per watt.
> 
> 200 watt HPS = 22,000 lumens, or 110 lumens per watt.
> 400 watt HPS = 50,000 lumens, or 125 lumens per watt.
> 
> So when you are on the lower end of the grow scale, say 70 watts (HPS), you are at 90 lumens per watt.
> 
> Would a more accurate way to verifiy output be "grams per lumen", or "lumens per gram" (because it is a whole number)? Or is the ratio based on a 'standard', such as a 1,000 watt light?



I think its just a stand benchmark across all lights, some will do better than others, the most efficient lamp is the 600w hps i use 4 of these with a hydroponic setup plus co2 and to be honest i'm breaking 1gpw.

This hole scale really is just a simple method to guage how you did seeing as just going on weight wouldn't be a good platform to base it on.


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## HippyInEngland

1 gm per watt is past the realms of most growers, we do good if we get 1gm  per 5 watts, its a simple bravado brag statement to say one gets 1 gm per watt, to get 1 gm per watt everything and i mean EVERYTHING has to be optimum, perfect nutes, perfect lighting, perfect air flow, perfect C02 etc etc etc, hey, we grow MJ and what we end up is happiness, dont try to touch the stars, they are out of reach.


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## Mutt

Don't forget about the mythical 2grams per watt.
1 gram per watt isn't that elusive. Just most "personal" growers can't have the enviro to do it. Also strain has a great deal to do with this as well. CO2 isn't necessary for 1 gram per watt. but Hippy is right better have everything chimed in.
I can give you quite a few grow journals (unfortunately not many on here) that some members are over 1 gram per watt....climbing towards 1.5 grams per watt...but these dudes are freakin amazing growers and just live eat and breathe weed.


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## the widowmaker

my setup is 4 x 600w hps which = 2400watts

this is a plant that is quite standard for my method of growing its only at 18 or so days of flowering and has another 50 to go

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=49271&d=1203807910

these plants are weighing in at a dry weigh
t of around 4 ounces, i'm using co2 a hydroponic setup with temps at around 93 deg f

I'm currently growing 45 plants under the lights i have

I did say that i expect to achieve 4 ounces a plant but to make it more reasonable I will drop this to an average of 3 ounces per plant which as you can see from the pic above is not unreasonable.

45 plants x 3 ounces = 135 ounces
135 ounces x 28 = 3780 g

3780grams / 2400 watts = 1.57.

I know you might find this unbelievable as the figures are  crazy but this is real and this is what i get no lies.


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## Mutt

:yeahthat: :holysheep:


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## Puffin Afatty

I am aiming at 1 gram per watt as a standard.  I think I can achieve it with SnowWhite.  I got 0.7gm/w so far, and I think maybe this gro I can get to 1.0


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## Pot Belly

Widowmaker - you are a gardener alright!   Wow!  I believe your numbers too.  I don't doubt that it could happen with the right conditions, and strain.

I was originally trying to relate to a small 70 watt bulb for a single plant grow.  That would be 70 grams off a bulb at 90 lumens per watt.  That's 2.5 oz.  Pretty hard to grasp getting that much off a 70 watt'er.  Unless you are real good, and have a real good productive pheno.  Nothing wrong with always trying to improve performance.

I consume an oz a month, so I only need to harvest 2 oz every 8 weeks.  And that would be off one plant.

I've got a plant in flower under a 150 watt HPS, and she's doing superb, but I am sure I'm not going to get 150 g (over 5 oz) off her.  That would blow my mind if I went over 2.5 oz.


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## the widowmaker

Pot Belly said:
			
		

> Widowmaker - you are a gardener alright!   Wow!  I believe your numbers too.  I don't doubt that it could happen with the right conditions, and strain.
> 
> I was originally trying to relate to a small 70 watt bulb for a single plant grow.  That would be 70 grams off a bulb at 90 lumens per watt.  That's 2.5 oz.  Pretty hard to grasp getting that much off a 70 watt'er.  Unless you are real good, and have a real good productive pheno.  Nothing wrong with always trying to improve performance.
> 
> I consume an oz a month, so I only need to harvest 2 oz every 8 weeks.  And that would be off one plant.
> 
> I've got a plant in flower under a 150 watt HPS, and she's doing superb, but I am sure I'm not going to get 150 g (over 5 oz) off her.  That would blow my mind if I went over 2.5 oz.



what about if you grew the plant sideways?

say you get a rockwool cube and you plant your seedling in it,  flip the cube on its side and then the plant should auto correct itself and start growin upwards, go through the whole of veg like this until you come to flower and then flip back up all the branches should point upwards and grow to the light and give you a better yield.


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## headband

there was a pic in BPOTM where someone flowerd sideways, I got 224Gs off a 400, 2 plants. So are you saiying i would have to get 400'g off one plant under a 400, to reach 1 gram per watt? or as many plants as you can fit under a 400. I think it should be only the one plant. this effects quality, and i think its all about growing quality bud, not quantity.


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## the widowmaker

headband said:
			
		

> there was a pic in BPOTM where someone flowerd sideways, I got 224Gs off a 400, 2 plants. So are you saiying i would have to get 400'g off one plant under a 400, to reach 1 gram per watt? or as many plants as you can fit under a 400. I think it should be only the one plant. this effects quality, and i think its all about growing quality bud, not quantity.



It was me that grew the plant sideways.

The cola is without a doubt the best piece of weed on the plant so the best way to get your 1 gram per watt and get the quality is to grow from clone flower early and just grow budsicles.  Cram them in right and you could easily break that 1 gram.  Its always possible its just figuring out how to work it.


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## headband

i think the only way to be in a the gram per watt club is only using one plant. Thats the only way quality doesn't suffer, the plant uses all it can, instead of all the plants using as much as they can get.  I rather have quality than weight any day or the year.


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## the widowmaker

headband said:
			
		

> i think the only way to be in a the gram per watt club is only using one plant. Thats the only way quality doesn't suffer, the plant uses all it can, instead of all the plants using as much as they can get. I rather have quality than weight any day or the year.


 
I'm a bit lost bro, could you clear your last comment up for me a little, i'm confused.


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## thestandard

1g/25 watt club here i come


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## Puffin Afatty

HippyInEngland said:
			
		

> 1 gm per watt is past the realms of most growers, we do good if we get 1gm per 5 watts, its a simple bravado brag statement to say one gets 1 gm per watt, to get 1 gm per watt everything and i mean EVERYTHING has to be optimum, perfect nutes, perfect lighting, perfect air flow, perfect C02 etc etc etc, hey, we grow MJ and what we end up is happiness, dont try to touch the stars, they are out of reach.


 
I can assure you Hippy 1 gm/watt is no problem.

for example:  imagine my last sog grow, 16 ICE plants in a 4x4 grid pattern, 10 inches apart.  every plant is within the effective range of the 430w SonAgro HPS.  each will be trimmed to allow only the top colas to grow.  each plant will produce a 18-20 inch cola yielding between 75 and 125 grams dry.  Do the math and you get 1600 gm on average.  Well over the 1 gram per watt standard.  almost any indica can be done in an efficient sog style.  Perhaps I'll do a blue misty sog style after SnowWhite??


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## headband

i think quality suffers if your trying to get 1 g per watt, using more than one plant under a single light. I think the only way to know you can get it, is to use   
a single plant, where nothing else can alter the plant. No competition for light, different breeds yield different amounts. Theres just to many variables the can effect yeild. As what puffin said, single cola plants in sog would be the best for quality and quantity per space.


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## the widowmaker

headband said:
			
		

> i think quality suffers if your trying to get 1 g per watt, using more than one plant under a single light. I think the only way to know you can get it, is to use
> a single plant, where nothing else can alter the plant. No competition for light, different breeds yield different amounts. Theres just to many variables the can effect yeild. As what puffin said, single cola plants in sog would be the best for quality and quantity per space.



I'm growing approx 45 under 4 lights and my plants are not competing for light, in actual fact bro your going to have lower quality bud by growing just one plant than many, because if you grew just one you wouldn't be cutting branches off that are not going to do as well as others because you need the yield from the one plant.  With my grow i let the tops that will rise up enough and produce quality bud carry on to grow and the lower ones that are not worth it get trimmed.

My method is like between sog and just letting them grow, although the cola is undisputed king of the bud geting 4 or 6 side buds that come up to a decent height will  give a nice yield boost without loss of quality and without reducing the number of plants you put in.

The best weed will only come from flowering sexually mature rooted clones and just growing a budsicle style cola, i doubt however you could reach anywhere near 1g a watt withonly one plant per light unless you gave it some serious veg time and did an awesome scrog like this one.


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## headband

the widowmaker said:
			
		

> The best weed will only come from flowering sexually mature rooted clones and just growing a budsicle style cola





			
				Headband said:
			
		

> single cola plants in sog would be the best for quality and quantity


thats what im saying, i just think the true meaning of 1gm/per watt, should obtain to a single plant and a single light. I definitely know what your going at, i just think the more light the better, not saying you dont trim the weeny branchs or do some serious lst and long veg time, just check out Puffin Afattys regenertaion 5. I think what you got going is sick, I just think anyone can accomplish 1g/per watt even with cfl depending on how big your going. :shocked:


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## headband

the widowmaker said:
			
		

> in actual fact your going to have lower quality bud by growing just one plant than many, because if you grew just one you wouldn't be cutting branches off that are not going to do as well as others because you need the yield from the one plant.


im pretty sure its impossible to recreate the sun, and thats what MJ loves the most, so i say, the more light the better
i dont know, use a small hps, your yield doesn't have to be so big and lollypop her so shes bomb. i just think the quality would be better under one light. just me, not fact.


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## gangalama

When I used rockwool on my 4x4 and 4x8 tables a gram per watt was expected (I`ve gotten more). But that is DEFINATELY because of the strain I have ( I have got less with other strains). I never used C02 on any rockwool grow. Same nutes as I`m using on my current grow (minus the vitamax and koolbloom) 1000 watt bulbs, no covers. And to be honest a lot of conditions couldve been better.  Maryjane is a Crazylady!!!!!!!!!
Peace

P.S. I`m confident I`ll be putting out over a gram per watt with my waterfarm. Just got2 get used to her!!


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## the widowmaker

headband said:
			
		

> i just think the true meaning of 1gm/per watt, should obtain to a single plant and a single light.



This is just the part your losing me at.


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## headband

the widowmaker said:
			
		

> This is just the part your losing me at.


i lost my self anyone can get a gram per what, with enough plants, try getting a gram per watt using one plant.


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## the widowmaker

headband said:
			
		

> i lost my self anyone can get a gram per what, with enough plants, try getting a gram per watt using one plant.



maybe but not everyone wants to wait a few months for one plant to find out


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## headband

yes, but i dont think everyone could accomplish 1 gram per watt that way, but its possible. Thats the real test.


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## the widowmaker

headband said:
			
		

> yes, but i dont think everyone could accomplish 1 gram per watt that way, but its possible. Thats the real test.



It would be near impossible and would put practically everyone out apart from one test grow


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## Pot Belly

the widowmaker said:
			
		

> what about if you grew the plant sideways?
> 
> say you get a rockwool cube and you plant your seedling in it, flip the cube on its side and then the plant should auto correct itself and start growin upwards, go through the whole of veg like this until you come to flower and then flip back up all the branches should point upwards and grow to the light and give you a better yield.


 
Hey WM - That's what I'm trying to achieve by topping _and_ LST. Except that my grow is not like what you described by the big fat single colas in a sea of green. My plant is spread out and evenly distributed to get the most out of the single 150 watt bulb mounted horizontally.

Here she is at this thread. http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showpost.php?p=195107&postcount=2 

She's in week six of flower and will let her go for 3 more. She may surprise me - but I dunno.


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## King Bud

Shouldn't the time the lights are on account for something? :confused2:
first grow: ~90g / 432 watts = .2g per watt  



> we do good if we get 1gm per 5 watts



Right on :farm:


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## kasgrow

As I understand it from reading around. It is supposed to be grams per watt per month. 1 gram per watt over 2 months is pretty easy to do. If you are flowering for 2 months you need 2 grams per watt to equal 1 gram per watt.
Maybe I am wrong. 
Now I will have to reread the thread I had read on another forum.


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## trillions of atoms

yes 1gpw is doable but you have to have time in the equation. think about it.


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## Runbyhemp

I don't think time has got anything to do with it. A gram per watt is a gram per watt no matter how long the grow takes.

Best I've done is .65 grams per watt.


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## thc is good for me

kasgrow said:
			
		

> As I understand it from reading around. It is supposed to be grams per watt per month. 1 gram per watt over 2 months is pretty easy to do. If you are flowering for 2 months you need 2 grams per watt to equal 1 gram per watt.
> Maybe I am wrong.
> Now I will have to reread the thread I had read on another forum.


 
Its 1 gram per watt no matter how long you flower for, you cant flower in a month anyways. 

I would be so happy to get 1 gram per watt


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## Mary_GreenThumb_Jane

i got a room with 3,000 watts, and a/c which keeps it 75 degrees all day..i grow 6 plants but i split my room into 2. 1 side has the 3,000 watts, one side completely dark. i veg about 6 weeks with the 3,000 until they are about 2 feet tall bush's. i dont top all i do is stretch the branch's down and power crop which is squeezing the stem until it pops to make thicker stronger bushier plants. after 6 weeks veg i then put them in flower by switching the rooms every 12 hours. so now i got one side room with 3 plant and the other with 3. so each [plant gets 1,000 watts of light during flower. its just a pain in the *** to switch all plant twice a day. anyways i yeild about 20 O's a plant and i always only flower for 6 weeks.. yes its a little early but when plants have good weight then you gotta do what ya gotta do.. so whole cycle from 8 inch clone to harvest is 12 weeks.. so i average 100 O's per 12 weeks on 3,000 watts..


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## TURKEYNECK

I think Im gettin a little less than a half gram per watt.. 1per would be super cool.


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## Newbud

I smoke it too fast to weigh it but there's a _*LOT*_


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer

last grow was .94 grams per watt.  I bet I could get it up over 1.  SOG in hydro is the only way I can get close.  And no I do not use CO2.  

And yes, the 600 watt light is the most efficient HPS light you can buy because it produces the most lumens to watt of any sized HPS light.

Widowmaker that video has been removed from YouTube.

I am in the process of trying to grow plants upside down so that I can take advantage of the space around the cool tubes where lights is being lost.  Red Diesel SCROG upside down journal in the journal section....didn't think about trying it sideways though.


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## Newbud

Theres been fair bit of debate on here about the whole upside down thing.
I'm undecided, did have a stoned idea about doing a grow with rockwool on the walls as well as a grow on the floor but i dont think i'll be trying it lol


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer

I am completely convinced it can be done.  I was doing a journal with two seed plants but they both showed male.  I was able to keep them growing upside down for over a week though before they showed male. There are some major hurdles to overcome in the process and you are never going to produce something as nice as what you can do naturally with the plant below the light, but I am convinced it cane be done and in a limited space grow anything you can produce besides what you grow on the ground is bonus weed.
http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42027

I really like the vertical grow designs such as the coliseum that take advantage of the light emitting from the bulb in all directions, but in this system you are always only lighting one side of your crop.


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## PencilHead

Mary_GreenThumb_Jane said:
			
		

> i got a room with 3,000 watts, and a/c which keeps it 75 degrees all day..i grow 6 plants but i split my room into 2. 1 side has the 3,000 watts, one side completely dark. i veg about 6 weeks with the 3,000 until they are about 2 feet tall bush's. i dont top all i do is stretch the branch's down and power crop which is squeezing the stem until it pops to make thicker stronger bushier plants. after 6 weeks veg i then put them in flower by switching the rooms every 12 hours. so now i got one side room with 3 plant and the other with 3. so each [plant gets 1,000 watts of light during flower. its just a pain in the *** to switch all plant twice a day. anyways i yeild about 20 O's a plant and i always only flower for 6 weeks.. yes its a little early but when plants have good weight then you gotta do what ya gotta do.. so whole cycle from 8 inch clone to harvest is 12 weeks.. so i average 100 O's per 12 weeks on 3,000 watts..


 
        HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE


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## leafminer

1 gram per watt is very doable. I regard that as normal in fact. I'd like to do better than that but I don't think I will.


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## Mary_GreenThumb_Jane

PencilHead said:
			
		

> HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE


 i dont see what you find funny.. but hey for everything that people do theres got be haters.. lmfao


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## purplephazes

Mary_GreenThumb_Jane said:
			
		

> i got a room with 3,000 watts, and a/c which keeps it 75 degrees all day..i grow 6 plants but i split my room into 2. 1 side has the 3,000 watts, one side completely dark. i veg about 6 weeks with the 3,000 until they are about 2 feet tall bush's. i dont top all i do is stretch the branch's down and power crop which is squeezing the stem until it pops to make thicker stronger bushier plants. after 6 weeks veg i then put them in flower by switching the rooms every 12 hours. so now i got one side room with 3 plant and the other with 3. so each [plant gets 1,000 watts of light during flower. its just a pain in the *** to switch all plant twice a day. anyways i yeild about 20 O's a plant and i always only flower for 6 weeks.. yes its a little early but when plants have good weight then you gotta do what ya gotta do.. so whole cycle from 8 inch clone to harvest is 12 weeks.. so i average 100 O's per 12 weeks on 3,000 watts..


pics please at week 6 of flower thankyou ! i also don't think pencil is shooting at being a hater toward your post i would like to think he may wish to see 6 plants produce 100 ounces in (12 WEEKS) ...but so would i like to see the evidence ! peace and take care !oohh and post the pics when you are ready ! hell i'll still be here in 12 weeks so you could even start a grow journal now to show us exactly what you are saying !


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## The Effen Gee

I am sorry, but you don't get 20 oz per plant off 3000 watts and six plants.

Unless I am reading something incorrectly.


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## Hick

Mary_GreenThumb_Jane said:
			
		

> i dont see what you find funny.. but hey for everything that people do theres got be haters.. lmfao


hee hee... not 'hating' IMO, just calling your bluff.
  You won't get anyone here to believe that "system" reaps those kinds of yeilds, without documented evidence.
  At 6 weeks flowering, NO plants/strains are either mature or fully developed. Meaning, you're not getting the potential yeild, or potential potency.   
20 O p/plant...we don't count roots and pots as part of the yield..:rofl:. j/k now 
but seriously, at 'best' that is wet weight at harvest, and not the actual dried, cured yeild of the smokeable/useable product. :hubba:


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## 4u2sm0ke

Mary_GreenThumb_Jane said:
			
		

> i got a room with 3,000 watts, and a/c which keeps it 75 degrees all day..i grow 6 plants but i split my room into 2. 1 side has the 3,000 watts, one side completely dark. i veg about 6 weeks with the 3,000 until they are about 2 feet tall bush's. i dont top all i do is stretch the branch's down and power crop which is squeezing the stem until it pops to make thicker stronger bushier plants. after 6 weeks veg i then put them in flower by switching the rooms every 12 hours. so now i got one side room with 3 plant and the other with 3. so each [plant gets 1,000 watts of light during flower. its just a pain in the *** to switch all plant twice a day. anyways i yeild about 20 O's a plant and i always only flower for 6 weeks.. yes its a little early but when plants have good weight then you gotta do what ya gotta do.. so whole cycle from 8 inch clone to harvest is 12 weeks.. so i average 100 O's per 12 weeks on 3,000 watts..


 


I call B u l l s h i t ...and yes I know I broke a rule...


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## Hick

4...4U'...


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## PencilHead

This first grow I just finished came in at 750 gees off 7 plants under 1200 watts. That's only .625 per and I worked my butt off getting that much.  The 1 gee per watt is a lofty goal to shoot for though.  Oh, and yeah, I posted pics of the whole happy affair.


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## Mary_GreenThumb_Jane

yea for sure i will put pics when i am at 6 weeks.. i am 2 weeks in flower right now..i completely understand why some wouldnt believe.. but yes i get 20 o DRY smoke on MOST plants.. sum 17 or 18 but usually 20.. thats why i say 20 average..for 1 ive been growing for 8 years with the same strains. for 2 its actually more than a 3,000 watt room.. i make 2 rooms out of it so really its like 6,000.. for those who dont understand i leave 3,000 watts on 24 hours a day..3 go in for first 12 then second set of three the last 12 i have a dark room that stays dark 24 hours a day.. each plant gets 1,000 watts the whole flower cycle .. not 6 under 3,000.. its 3 under 3,000..no its not the most chronic weed you will find but its nice dense collas.. my first nut plant was under a 1,000 watts and was like 7 weeks. i use to grow like 3-5 under a 1,000 and after experimenting found 1 plant to yield the same or even better.


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## Mary_GreenThumb_Jane

oh and if i were to brake it down i get around 50 os a room with 3,000 watts..100 os with my double room a explained
you add that up but i think its some where around .5 gram per watt..


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## massproducer

so you are saying that you move what would have to be 6-7 foot monsters in full flower without doing any damage and on an exact schedule, twice a day?  How exactly do you do this?


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## JBonez

Pot Belly said:
			
		

> I have seen several references to a "one gram per watt" harvest. I have not achieved that yet - if there is a "yet" for me in the future.
> 
> Curiously, has anyone acheived a harvest like this? Can it be done without CO2? How about soil? What is the single most important item when trying to do this? Strain?
> 
> Also, I have found a problem with trying to compare wattage to harvest ratios: The higher the HPS wattage, the more efficient lumen output is per watt.
> 
> 200 watt HPS = 22,000 lumens, or 110 lumens per watt.
> 400 watt HPS = 50,000 lumens, or 125 lumens per watt.
> 
> So when you are on the lower end of the grow scale, say 70 watts (HPS), you are at 90 lumens per watt.
> 
> Would a more accurate way to verifiy output be "grams per lumen", or "lumens per gram" (because it is a whole number)? Or is the ratio based on a 'standard', such as a 1,000 watt light?



you are absolutely correct. Grams per lumen does make beautiful sense. Light intensity makes weight, not wattage. A gram a watt is just a "goal" one trys to achieve. and with those lights, its possibe to get a gram a watt depending on growing style.

two 1000w lights can have completely different output ranges, i like my lumatek 1kw, its ba and is more efficient than my magnetic ballast, piece o junk.


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## Mary_GreenThumb_Jane

massproducer said:
			
		

> so you are saying that you move what would have to be 6-7 foot monsters in full flower without doing any damage and on an exact schedule, twice a day?  How exactly do you do this?



no there not at all 6-7 foot monsters.. i put them into flower when they are about 2 feet tall and 3 to 3 1/2 feet wide..at 6 weeks in flower they are about 3 1/2 feet tall and 4 to 4 1/2 wide. very, very bushy. the collas on the very sides yes sometimes get damaged, but not that bad.. i split my master bedroom into 2 parts by building kinda a frame and panda paper.. panda paper is doubled and it has a door i made using velcro. so when i switch them almost half this wall rolls up.. yes i do it twice a day. every day for usually 2 harvests then i take a couple month break so i dont have to worry about being home exact time every day the year..


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## Mary_GreenThumb_Jane

main reason for doing this is because i didnt want to buy 3 more 1,000 watt setups, but wanted more watts.. so i figured i would make 2 rooms out of the 3 i had.


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## JBonez

saying a 600w light has the best lumen/watt ratio is like saying at least a honda gets 37 mpg to a corvette guy.

My 1000w owns any 600, more power is more power, it will fall of grad. the higher the wattage, but lumens are lumens boys and girls.


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## JBonez

how about 12 lbs from 3 1000s, thats about 2 grams a watt.

hxxttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBDgWYKGUjo


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer

JBonez said:
			
		

> saying a 600w light has the best lumen/watt ratio is like saying at least a honda gets 37 mpg to a corvette guy.
> 
> My 1000w owns any 600, more power is more power, it will fall of grad. the higher the wattage, but lumens are lumens boys and girls.


 

Hi j,
The 600 watt DOES have the best lumen to watt ratio....of any HPS light, math proves it.  I will always use multiple 600's.  If I had a grow space I wanted to fill with 1,000,000 lumens, it would be done with 600 watt HPS lights.
400HPS=50,000 lumens= 125 lumens per watt
600HPS=95,000 lumens= 158.3 lmens per watt
1,000HPS=145,000 lumens = 145 lumens per watt

So if I wanted 1,000,000 lumens, I could do it with 6.89 1,000 watt HPS lights or 10.53 600 watt lights.  The difference being the 600's are only pulling 6,318 watts, but the 1000's are pulling 6,890......more watts for the same lumens.
HOWEVER, the light PENETRATION of the 1,000 can not be compared to the 600......gess it is just a matter of choice.  If yo can remove the heat and want the light penetration, 1,000's would be better.  If you want the most lumens per watt, 600's would be better.

Love your posts by the way J, if you feel like coming over and helping me design my flower room I wold take it in a heartbeat


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## JBonez

that very light penetration is what im after, and yeah, cooling lights is my forte, along with growroom temps. My environment has to be as close to perfect as possible, as i dont need those factors inhibiting my learning.

Ive seen the math before on the comparison of the two lights, sure 1kw uses more power, but i guess that would be someones concern worrying about power usage, which im not.

600w lights should be used in larger grows where multiple lights can be hung, but in a smaller grow, a 600 simply doesnt compare to lumen output.

Which ballast for the amount of power consuption produces the most light? A 600 of course.

Which light produces the most lumens?? 1000w all day!

thanks for the kind words friend!


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## dirtysox

This guy I know, he gets 2000 grams on the scale dry, with 1 cfl from home depot and there are monkeys flying out my ......
:yay:


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## massproducer

So you are saying then that you get 20 oz's off of a 3 1/2 - 4 foot plant?  What are you growing because these are feats that are actually incredible  .  i have honestly not really heard anyone ever say what you are saying.  

I can only speak for myself but I for 1 will never believe your story without seeing pics.  You said that you are 2 weeks into flowering so, so just take some pics now to prove me wrong, because until that time, this whole story makes no sense to me at all.

I have been growing for quite a few years and have grown, in soil, hydro, outdoor and now in coco coir.  I right now have 6 foot montsers growing in my coco buckets, that I will post pics of, but I could not imagine moving them even once, besides an occasicional quater turn, and I would be estaticed if one of them yeilded 20 oz's.  I am grounded more in reality and would be happy with 130 g's dry per plant or somewhere around 5 oz's each, from my monsters.  And I grow with 1000w enchanced spectrum HPS lamps.    



			
				Mary_GreenThumb_Jane said:
			
		

> no there not at all 6-7 foot monsters.. i put them into flower when they are about 2 feet tall and 3 to 3 1/2 feet wide..at 6 weeks in flower they are about 3 1/2 feet tall and 4 to 4 1/2 wide. very, very bushy. the collas on the very sides yes sometimes get damaged, but not that bad.. i split my master bedroom into 2 parts by building kinda a frame and panda paper.. panda paper is doubled and it has a door i made using velcro. so when i switch them almost half this wall rolls up.. yes i do it twice a day. every day for usually 2 harvests then i take a couple month break so i dont have to worry about being home exact time every day the year..


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## massproducer

What is the strain you are growing?


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## massproducer

That is what a relay switch is for?


			
				Mary_GreenThumb_Jane said:
			
		

> main reason for doing this is because i didnt want to buy 3 more 1,000 watt setups, but wanted more watts.. so i figured i would make 2 rooms out of the 3 i had.


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## The Effen Gee

a 600 does have as many lumens as a thousand, but less penetration.

Your canopy will be 12 to 16 inches, when under a 1000 its around 18 to 21 inches. Strain specific.


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## JBonez

what do you mean?

600 is 90,000 lumens

1000 is 140,000 lumens

why do you say they are the same?


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## ross

yea i dont really understand that either, do you mean a 600W at 12 inches gives you the same lumens as a 1000W at 20 inches?


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## LassChance

the widowmaker said:
			
		

> my setup is 4 x 600w hps which = 2400watts
> 
> this is a plant that is quite standard for my method of growing its only at 18 or so days of flowering and has another 50 to go
> 
> http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=49271&d=1203807910
> 
> these plants are weighing in at a dry weigh
> t of around 4 ounces, i'm using co2 a hydroponic setup with temps at around 93 deg f
> 
> I'm currently growing 45 plants under the lights i have
> 
> I did say that i expect to achieve 4 ounces a plant but to make it more reasonable I will drop this to an average of 3 ounces per plant which as you can see from the pic above is not unreasonable.
> 
> 45 plants x 3 ounces = 135 ounces
> 135 ounces x 28 = 3780 g
> 
> 3780grams / 2400 watts = 1.57.
> 
> I know you might find this unbelievable as the figures are  crazy but this is real and this is what i get no lies.



WIDOWMAKER--Im dying to see that pic...but I kept getting the "invalid attachment" thing. Can you re-post it?

Thanks, and man...you ARE the Man. Jeeez.

Id prolly wet my britches if I got half your yeild.

Lass


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## LassChance

the widowmaker said:
			
		

> It was me that grew the plant sideways.
> 
> The cola is without a doubt the best piece of weed on the plant so the best way to get your 1 gram per watt and get the quality is to grow from clone flower early and just grow budsicles.  Cram them in right and you could easily break that 1 gram.  Its always possible its just figuring out how to work it.



Oh BABY!  Now THAT's what Im talking about! YOU grew the sideways? Feaking brilliant. But...you also trimmed em up, lollipop style?  So...you had sideways lollipop plants....Then when you go into 12/12, you put them back to upright, except when they're upright, they're really horizontal?  Is that right?

Didnt happen to be White Widow, was it? Man... So...at finish how tall (or "long", as the case may be)are the plants?

Lass


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## LassChance

Puffin Afatty said:
			
		

> I can assure you Hippy 1 gm/watt is no problem.
> 
> for example:  imagine my last sog grow, 16 ICE plants in a 4x4 grid pattern, 10 inches apart.  every plant is within the effective range of the 430w SonAgro HPS.  each will be trimmed to allow only the top colas to grow.  each plant will produce a 18-20 inch cola yielding between 75 and 125 grams dry.  Do the math and you get 1600 gm on average.  Well over the 1 gram per watt standard.  almost any indica can be done in an efficient sog style.  Perhaps I'll do a blue misty sog style after SnowWhite??



PUFFIN--why only Indica? Sativa doesnt work in a SOG?  Why?

Lass


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## dirtysox

lass
I heard that some sativa's do very well in sog, if kept to the stalk, look at neville berry, sativa dominant, and grows softball bats, when kept single cola, the indies are known to do better in sog, because the plant stays shorter (saving room, if space restricted) and the light penetrates the sog better (tops and base arent as far apart) allowing for the packing on of fatter material.  Sog growers are typically trying to maximize their space, so a shorter plant that doesnt flower as long as most sativas do, is also beneficial. notice below, this is 13 weeks of flower, and will hit the ceiling, why not go with a 7 week flower, short indie, by the time this plant is done, a sog grower is allready beginning to flower the second batch, with the first batch allready dried and cured.  All though if you got time and space, the below sounds wicked.

Seedism NevilleBerry feminized


This is an unparalleled THC bomb with massive buds, producing yields comparable to most heavy Indica strains available.

You will notice its extreme growing vigor as soon as they start their vegetative cycle and you should not let them grow too long when you do not want to end up with your plants touching the ceiling.

The breeder of this strain is an experienced breeder and has produced multiple (cup winning) Haze strains, the NevilleBerry is a project he worked on for a while to see if it is possible to improve the already fantastic Neville's Haze, by adding the right Blueberry male he added something special to this strain. You will not have to search for female plants because the NevilleBerry seeds are 100% female.

NevilleBerry has the growth of a Sativa with the bud structure from a Blueberry; the buds grow all along the stems and need support as soon as the flowers start developing. The flowering cycle takes between 11-13 weeks depending on the environment created.

There are only a limited amount of these seeds available.

Genetics - Neville's Haze x Blueberry 
Flowering Time - 11 - 13 weeks 
Yield - High


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## LassChance

headband said:
			
		

> thats what im saying, i just think the true meaning of 1gm/per watt, should obtain to a single plant and a single light. I definitely know what your going at, i just think the more light the better, not saying you dont trim the weeny branchs or do some serious lst and long veg time, just check out Puffin Afattys regenertaion 5. I think what you got going is sick, I just think anyone can accomplish 1g/per watt even with cfl depending on how big your going. :shocked:



HEADBAND--well...have you broken the 1gm/watt barrier?

Let alone beat it?

Lass


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## LassChance

dirtysox said:
			
		

> lass
> I heard that some sativa's do very well in sog, if kept to the stalk, look at neville berry, sativa dominant, and grows softball bats, when kept single cola, the indies are known to do better in sog, because the plant stays shorter (saving room, if space restricted) and the light penetrates the sog better (tops and base arent as far apart) allowing for the packing on of fatter material.  Sog growers are typically trying to maximize their space, so a shorter plant that doesnt flower as long as most sativas do, is also beneficial. notice below, this is 13 weeks of flower, and will hit the ceiling, why not go with a 7 week flower, short indie, by the time this plant is done, a sog grower is allready beginning to flower the second batch, with the first batch allready dried and cured.  All though if you got time and space, the below sounds wicked.
> 
> Seedism NevilleBerry feminized
> 
> 
> This is an unparalleled THC bomb with massive buds, producing yields comparable to most heavy Indica strains available.
> 
> You will notice its extreme growing vigor as soon as they start their vegetative cycle and you should not let them grow too long when you do not want to end up with your plants touching the ceiling.
> 
> The breeder of this strain is an experienced breeder and has produced multiple (cup winning) Haze strains, the NevilleBerry is a project he worked on for a while to see if it is possible to improve the already fantastic Neville's Haze, by adding the right Blueberry male he added something special to this strain. You will not have to search for female plants because the NevilleBerry seeds are 100% female.
> 
> NevilleBerry has the growth of a Sativa with the bud structure from a Blueberry; the buds grow all along the stems and need support as soon as the flowers start developing. The flowering cycle takes between 11-13 weeks depending on the environment created.
> 
> There are only a limited amount of these seeds available.
> 
> Genetics - Neville's Haze x Blueberry
> Flowering Time - 11 - 13 weeks
> Yield - High



DIRTYSOX--O Lawdy! The NevilleBerry looks kind of like a wet dream...but Im confused.  You said to go for a short plant with a 7 week flower...but the NevilleBerry is bigish and has a LONG-*** flower time...? Looking at it, Id say it's worth the wait. Can you tell me where to order the NevilleBerry? Would it be suitable for a single-cola SOG?  Ive never bought feminized seeds and several posts in here have reccomended not  to.  What is your thinking on that?

Im currently in my 2nd week of flower with six White Widows, which I believe are Sativa dominant...?  They are kind of...sparse in their growing habit, with not much in the way of side branching...so I thought they would be fine for trimming up for single cola next time, in a SOG. I say "next time", because all six were topped when only about three weeks old and they all have double colas.  Well...five do. Plus, they're all in 2 gal pots, so only six will fit under my 600 w HPS. Next grow, Id like to try a different strain (and the NevilleBerry sounds like IT!), but more plants in smaller containers. (Im experimenting with using 2 liter soda bottles Hempy style. The plants in the soda bottle hempys are only a month old, and are fine, so far, but it's too early to say whether they will work over the long haul.

BLESS you! That NB is prettier than a speckled blue-eyed  pup.

Lass


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## dirtysox

That info came right off of attitude's web site, search attitude bank in google, and then once you have the page, look at seedism (the farm who produces the strain), or you can search for seedism seeds and see if they give you a better deal.  One week after placing an order on something else with attitude, these showed as feminised, until just recently I believe (not 100%) the attitude sold them as unsexed! Get them now, before they go back!

As far as feminized: cant speak for anyone else, but I have had 100% success with 30 seeds being female, but I also heard they are prone to turning hermaphodite,  with that being said, if the nevilleberry would have been advertised as fem 2 weeks ago, (again, could be wrong) or if I would have seen it, I would have gotten it.

To make it simple, if you want to wait for some super taste tester type stuff that takes longer to cook, go for it.  My point was that sativa can go sog, but it kinda defeats the purpose of the sog, which is: alot of buds quickly.  With neville you still get alot buds but it takes an additional 35 days later to harvest.  In 35 days, with a "quick indy",  I could have dried and cured batch 1 and be 1 week into flowering batch 2.  Because you would have taken your cuttings and vegged for 4 weeks allready (estimate) on the second batch, while the first batch was begginning to flower, and the process repeats again and again.

Research on how to trim for a sog, and look at net trellis or stakes to hold those softball bats up, yes, it is good for sog, if you have good lighting> because of how tall they get.   Remember the fast indie will allow one to actually smoke cured product up to 6 weeks earlier before the neville, however, when the neville is done, well.... haze x blueberry???  you tell me


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## LassChance

dirtysox said:
			
		

> That info came right off of attitude's web site, search attitude bank in google, and then once you have the page, look at seedism (the farm who produces the strain), or you can search for seedism seeds and see if they give you a better deal.  One week after placing an order on something else with attitude, these showed as feminised, until just recently I believe (not 100%) the attitude sold them as unsexed! Get them now, before they go back!
> 
> As far as feminized: cant speak for anyone else, but I have had 100% success with 30 seeds being female, but I also heard they are prone to turning hermaphodite,  with that being said, if the nevilleberry would have been advertised as fem 2 weeks ago, (again, could be wrong) or if I would have seen it, I would have gotten it.
> 
> To make it simple, if you want to wait for some super taste tester type stuff that takes longer to cook, go for it.  My point was that sativa can go sog, but it kinda defeats the purpose of the sog, which is: alot of buds quickly.  With neville you still get alot buds but it takes an additional 35 days later to harvest.  In 35 days, with a "quick indy",  I could have dried and cured batch 1 and be 1 week into flowering batch 2.  Because you would have taken your cuttings and vegged for 4 weeks allready (estimate) on the second batch, while the first batch was begginning to flower, and the process repeats again and again.
> 
> Research on how to trim for a sog, and look at net trellis or stakes to hold those softball bats up, yes, it is good for sog, if you have good lighting> because of how tall they get.   Remember the fast indie will allow one to actually smoke cured product up to 6 weeks earlier before the neville, however, when the neville is done, well.... haze x blueberry???  you tell me



I get it. The one thing you can count on is, Time WILL pass, if you aint dead, LOL. Nothing wrong with having a few NB's flowering along while a few shorter-flowering plants are already ready to harvest...Variety being the old Spice of Life, as they say. Thanks again--Im having a psychic flash...I see some NevilleBerry in my future...

You rock.

Lass


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## dirtysox

yep thats a good idea, mybe have a low canopy with one light and then your softball bats on another.. you you very smart
for the record.... _  a friend found nevilles:bong2:  berries_


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## simnimbus

the widowmaker said:
			
		

> my setup is 4 x 600w hps which = 2400watts
> 
> this is a plant that is quite standard for my method of growing its only at 18 or so days of flowering and has another 50 to go
> 
> http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=49271&d=1203807910
> 
> these plants are weighing in at a dry weigh
> t of around 4 ounces, i'm using co2 a hydroponic setup with temps at around 93 deg f
> 
> I'm currently growing 45 plants under the lights i have
> 
> I did say that i expect to achieve 4 ounces a plant but to make it more reasonable I will drop this to an average of 3 ounces per plant which as you can see from the pic above is not unreasonable.
> 
> 45 plants x 3 ounces = 135 ounces
> 135 ounces x 28 = 3780 g
> 
> 3780grams / 2400 watts = 1.57.
> 
> I know you might find this unbelievable as the figures are  crazy but this is real and this is what i get no lies.




What really is going on here is that you are really spending .635 watts on one gram.

So 2 grams cost you 1.27 watts.

My rule is 100w per plant past 500-600w

I would think that 45 plants would need 4000w at least.


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## greenmentat

Nice.. what he's really doing is giving less watts and getting more grams... He was trying to trick me??  haha

I find it funny that the picture of this "legendary setup" is an invalid link... Kind of reminds me of the G-13 pick with mini bic that was going around with the guy claiming that you could double your yield with the strain.


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## Ruffy

big *** fish stories if i dont see pics!!! 4 pages of talk and invalid pics.ostpicsworthless:


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## Locked

The broken link is most likely a result of the crash and all those posts we lost....I know I lost over 4000 posts myself so let's not break out the conspiracy theories yet...lol

How many lumens you need is dictated by grow space *not * the number of plants....jmo


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## Joe McQuay

I don't think time has obtained something to hold out with it. A gram every watt is severely a gram every watt no issue how lengthy the develop takes.
Best I've finished is .65 grams every watt.


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## stuball

SOG DWC. Bubba Kush=3.2gm/watt Chem Dawg 2.8gm/watt Cough 1.8 gm/watt. All depends on the strain.1gm/watt is easy, though. Keep your eyes peeled for "grow cups"...I'll show you how!
§


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## JustAnotherAntMarching

3.2gpw from bubba kush....  LMAO  C'mon meow.....


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## 7greeneyes

Dear stuball

Please send me your magic grow wand....lol...

I hit 2 grams/watt on the jack but I have to let it get big. I mean a month long veg after rooting in a 5 gallon bucket then flipped to flower.


----------



## Locked

stuball said:


> SOG DWC. Bubba Kush=3.2gm/watt Chem Dawg 2.8gm/watt Cough 1.8 gm/watt. All depends on the strain.1gm/watt is easy, though. Keep your eyes peeled for "grow cups"...I'll show you how!
> §



I remember getting 12 grams a watt and then the alarm went off and it was time to stop dreaming and get up for work.    Man ya gotta love the Internet.


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## 7greeneyes

Hamster Lewis said:


> I remember getting 12 grams a watt and then the alarm went off and it was time to stop dreaming and get up for work.    Man ya gotta love the Internet.



:yeahthat:

:rofl:


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## DrFever

stuball said:


> SOG DWC. Bubba Kush=3.2gm/watt Chem Dawg 2.8gm/watt Cough 1.8 gm/watt. All depends on the strain.1gm/watt is easy, though. Keep your eyes peeled for "grow cups"...I'll show you how!
> §


 IMO i think this guy is being  funny  specially   talking about  a strain that produces extremely small yields like bubba kush  now some  strains  i believe you can achieve  crazy  yields but  again quality  of the product  is probably not so good  best i ever got  as per gram per watt  is  4720  which dried  was 1180 grams   it was  brand new 1000 watt  bulb  in 5x5 area  SCROG 
 And to think if your going to cram a place with solo cups and think your going to achieve  gram per  watt  sorry to rain on your parade  but its not  going to happen  i  have place  72 clones  in a very tight space  and flipped to flower   no veg time   and was shocked at the  achieving  5 0z   from 1000 watt lol  ..02 gram - if i was lucky .5 gram per plant  this is not efficient period  so   Stuball  if you think  your going to get anything out of some solo cup and achieve  gram per watt  think again     i had stumps like these  to achieve  over 2.5 pounds  in a 5x 5 area      and 4 plants  and buds  like these to get it ther 

View attachment picture294lk.jpg


View attachment picture293b.jpg


View attachment Picture 472.jpg


----------

