# Potassium



## gottaloveplasma (Jul 25, 2015)

What would be the best nitrogen free preferably stand alone potassium source that would be available to the plant for 2 weeks?  Or any sources to include when I initially set up my soil.  Any thing I can source say in a tea?  Last 2 weeks or should I add it in some other way, maybe at mixing of initial soil?


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## zem (Jul 25, 2015)

you can use hardwood ash, or organic potassium sulfate


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 25, 2015)

Hey Zem, how about putting a banana and peel in a compost tea?


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 25, 2015)

Would I make tea with the ash?  Fungul tea perhaps.


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## zem (Jul 25, 2015)

i'm no soil grower or tea brewer for that matter, so i cannot help with that, but  i guess that the ash must be sprinkled or dissolved because i imagine it leaching out of the tea in minutes, but i am not sure


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## Rosebud (Jul 25, 2015)

Why do you need potassium?  And no a banana peel in water will not work.


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 25, 2015)

How about a banana in a tea and let it mold up perhaps first?  Am I talking now or still left field?


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## Rosebud (Jul 25, 2015)

You are talking like a person who is learning about fungi and soil... keep learning, you will be great.


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## next (Jul 25, 2015)

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=66568


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 26, 2015)

I just read that book t/w microbes good read.


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## Droopy Dog (Jul 26, 2015)

gottaloveplasma said:


> How about a banana in a tea and let it mold up perhaps first?  Am I talking now or still left field?



Left field!? You aren't even in the parking lot.  :rofl:  :holysheep:

First, decide if you actually want to go organic, OR, are just enamored with the *idea* of organics? Bottled 'organics' are much like a flex fuel Hummer, if you get my drift. You can convince yourself it's really something good, but the reality is quite different.

Organics is a lot of work making the initial soil mix. After that, it's pretty much just watering and the occasional top dress every month or so.

Really gets boring compared to say hydo, or, chem grows in general, where you are constantly tweaking/putting out fires and adjusting balances.

BTW, the best thing for K is kelp meal. Meal, not liquid or concentrate, but dry meal. You can make your own liquid from the meal if you wish and it works great.

The only bottle I have is ProTekt, which is also a good K source, but I only use it for the silica and perhaps 3x during a grow.

Wet


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 26, 2015)

I am learning about organics.  I use organic bottles.  I think theme nutrient I use are great, just expensive.  Would be nice to not use bottles.  I like the idea of using teas and such and homemade nutrients sounds fun and will let me feel like I'm actually doing ****.


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## next (Jul 26, 2015)

I chose to go organic over a year ago, I started using earth juice liquid nutes.. but I wanted to further my organic journey so I tried to switch over into the real organic world using castings, compost, and amendments like bone and blood meal. I learned the hard way that they are two different monsters. 

The liquid organics are.. still bordering the line of synthetics if you ask me.. You are not relying so much on an active microbe / fungi population, instead you are relying mixing different organic nutes from different bottles to try and feed your plant what it needs for the given part of its life cycle. You can easily give too much of one thing or not enough of another, and it is somewhat still up to you to provide that for your plant.

From what I gather now, with real organic nutes, you mix what the plant needs into the soil, then the microbes / fungi break it down and make it available as food for your plants. they do it in a much more natural way, allowing the plant to pick and choose what it takes. 

Be cautious confusing the liquid organics, with the dry organics. (That is my warning, I made the mistake myself) From what I read, the chelates that are used in the liquid organics, are actually bad for an organic grow and can do more harm than good, especially to your microbe / fungi's.


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 27, 2015)

Hey Next,  I like what you are saying.  Can you be any more specific?  I think my bottles are different.  They are at least way different than earth juice.  I know the stuff I have are broken down not with chemicals.  And my nutrient line I all about the microbes.  For instance,  when the ppm in soil gets to high we do a flush without much run off if that makes sense with liquid bonemeal and sugars.  The bonemeal bonds to the salts in the soil and becomes microbe food and is then made available by the microbes.  The nitrogen is protein nitrogen and it claims to be what the plant wants easiest and softest form of nitrogen on plant.  Also they pretty much suggest feed feed then a microbe tea feed feed then the binding feed with the bonemeal and sugars.


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## next (Jul 27, 2015)

"Earth Juice

While these products are usually all natural, they are also normally full of organic acids for chelation, and will really dive your pH and piss off a lot of your microlife, especially the Myco fungi. "

I know just a little bit about chelation, but not much.. I do know that in order for them to be able to bottle the microbes they have to make them go dormant.  Otherwise the bottle would blow up.. Earth juice stuff has a PH of like 3.7, I think that has to do with the "organic" acids used to stabilize the nutes.

Your nutes sound a lil fishy to me... there shouldn't be any salts in your soil. Unless your adding them.. which must be the case. Then the question is why is there excess salts in your nutes? And thats assuming the excess ppm's are salt. I dunno.. I personally question organic bottled nutes.

As for the feed, feed, microbe tea... kinda sounds like the feed, feed, part is doing some harm to the microbes which then you need to add more microbes.. kinda sounds like an un-natural vicious circle. Don't get me wrong, i'm sure it works.. its just it seems like it still within the lines of "where you are constantly tweaking/putting out fires and adjusting balances."


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 27, 2015)

It's a no salt line.  It has very little of the acid in bottles your talkin bout.  The ph up is actually a partially broken down lime so as microbes eat and make acids it further chelates and its also food source releasing more goodies and ph up.  So fat seems to be the most organic of all lines.


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 27, 2015)

My nutrient line is made for tlo soil.  Nothing will harm the microbes.  Just had a big fb discussion with some people who ran this for last 3-5 years.


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## Rosebud (Jul 27, 2015)

In true organics you don't care about ph and you don't flush.


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## Droopy Dog (Jul 27, 2015)

next said:


> I chose to go organic over a year ago, I started using earth juice liquid nutes.. but I wanted to further my organic journey so I tried to switch over into the real organic world using castings, compost, and amendments like bone and blood meal. I learned the hard way that they are two different monsters.
> 
> The liquid organics are.. still bordering the line of synthetics if you ask me.. You are not relying so much on an active microbe / fungi population, instead you are relying mixing different organic nutes from different bottles to try and feed your plant what it needs for the given part of its life cycle. You can easily give too much of one thing or not enough of another, and it is somewhat still up to you to provide that for your plant.
> 
> ...



:yeahthat::goodposting::aok:

VERY well put!

Spot on with the chelates and whatever method or substance that is used as a preservative. True, some are better than others, but even the *best* isn't all that when compared to a well constructed mix using dry amendments. This is more than obvious the first time you grow in a well crafted mix. Simple experience trumps the best ad copy, lavish art work on the label's, cutesie names and jaw dropping sticker prices. See for yourself and make up your own mind.

For me, bottled organic nutes are pretty much 'feel good' chemical nutes.  The reason is simple. With organics, adding water is what gets everything started, mainly getting the microbes out of dormancy and going to work decomposing stuff.  So, you add water to get it in a bottle then have to stop the microbe activity or have the bottle blow up.  :shocked:

Next is way more than correct with the observation of liquid organics and dry organics being two different monsters. The mindset for dry organics is way harder to master than the learning curve.

But, in any event, if you are serious about organics, think about starting a worm bin. Start now and you could have fresh castings for next spring.

Wet


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## gottaloveplasma (Jul 27, 2015)

There are no flushes with this line actually.  Just got new bottles of crab shrimp meal....  Almost puked when I opened it.


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## next (Jul 27, 2015)

I'm sure the nutes work.. its just that they don't work the same way. For instance, there is NO adjusting the ph of an organic grow. The microbe's don't like it when their ph gets messed up, maybe they like a ph of 8, maybe more a ph of 5. The point is, the rhizosphere's ph is what the microbe's want it to be, not what we want it to be, or even what the plant wants it to be. I don't think the world has quite unlocked all the secrets of the organic world, just unlocked enough to call it organic and grow a plant.


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## pcduck (Jul 28, 2015)

Feed the soil not the plant.
Bottled organic nutes feeds the plant.
IMO true organics feeds the soil.

Should have no need to flush unless a grower error occurs.

If you need to flush otherwise, it is because your bottled nutes suck.imo


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## pcduck (Jul 28, 2015)

If you want to fool around with bottled nutes. Take your dry soil amendments stick it in a bottle along with some AEM and water, let sit for awhile. Then strain it if you want.


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## Rosebud (Jul 28, 2015)

Duck is correct.  You never did tell me how or why you need to add K?

Organics is slow and wonderful.


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## Droopy Dog (Jul 28, 2015)

Rosebud said:


> Duck is correct.  You never did tell me how or why you need to add K?
> 
> Organics is slow and wonderful.



Much like old(er), gardeners. :farm::heart:

Wet


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