# 3X6 ebb and flow sog



## ruufuus (Sep 14, 2011)

hello again MP.  i am still in the process of gathering information for my upcoming ebb and flow grow.  today i am asking you members the following questions

1.how many plants could i fit into a 3x2 (20g) tray without overcrowding and lowering yield potential?

2. will 2x150w hps cooltubes be adequate lighting for such a grow

3.how frequent should i flood the tray using pea gravel as the medium

4.how many  lumens of daylight(5000k) cfl lighting should i use for the vegging?

these are my questions for the day, thank you all in advance for what i know will be very informational posts.

yours truly~ruufuus


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## Lemon Jack (Sep 14, 2011)

I would say 3-4 plants.

If you close your area to just 3 x 2 and let no light escape that lighting could work.

Im not sure about flooding I would say 3-4 times a day while the lights are on.

18,000 lumens in a 3x2 space  You want 3000 for veg and 5000 for flower but those are minimums if you can cool it you cant really have too much light.


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## ruufuus (Sep 14, 2011)

thanks for your post jack!.  the "room" will be precisely 3x2 and lined with reflective material, and on that note...might you have any recommendations on cheap, avaliable reflective material to use?  also my cooltubes will put out about 15k lumens each and i will be able to keep them pretty close to the tray since they will maintain a low heat.  i was hoping to pull off about 6 plants, as i will be growing  at least 3 different strains.  i will veg them to about 12" before flowering.  thanks again, hope to hear from you soon!


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## Iron Emmett (Sep 15, 2011)

Ruuf, you can just paint the inside of the room flat white, it will reflect really well, for cheap.

you could probably fit 6 in the tray, if you keep them small and just stick with cola sog you could be alright.

You can get just as much or more yield from 3 plants that allowed to spread out a bit as you will get from 6 crowded plants.


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## ruufuus (Sep 15, 2011)

Iron Emmett said:
			
		

> Ruuf, you can just paint the inside of the room flat white, it will reflect really well, for cheap.
> 
> you could probably fit 6 in the tray, if you keep them small and just stick with cola sog you could be alright.
> 
> You can get just as much or more yield from 3 plants that allowed to spread out a bit as you will get from 6 crowded plants.


 you really think so?  i just want to get maximum yield for all the supplies i will have.  also, 3 of the 4 walls of the veg and the flower room will be thick black plastic, any ideas for this?  thanks for your post emmet!


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## Iron Emmett (Sep 15, 2011)

If you are growing for yield, you can train 3 plants with Scrog, topping or some type of LST/HST and have a better yield than 6 plants that are crowed together, Canopy plays a huge part in it, as does airflow.

For the plastic walls, im not sure you cant really paint em, try some Panda film maybe, it isnt too expensive, whatever you decide to use, make sure that its flat, crinkles in you material really reduce the reflectiveness.


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## ruufuus (Sep 15, 2011)

i like the idea of lst, but i looked into single cola sog and like that idea just as well =].  but which would theoretically have higher yield.  my first grow will  be a sexing grow because i have beans from different dank sacks, and need to determine my females and clone them before i start my continuous veg/flower schedule. also i plan to use aluminum(as much as i hate to) to line the sides of the plastic, and the 4'th and only actualy wall, is already panted white.  thanks for your your posts emmett! hope to hear from you soon


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## depetreono (Sep 15, 2011)

For reflective material try the reflective insolater sold at lowes or home depots its cheap and won't produce hot spots. I'll try to find the name of the stuff for you. Or check out what your local hydro shop has for reflective material. I would stay away from the foil. I used something similar and had little burn marks every where from the hot spots.


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## depetreono (Sep 15, 2011)

It's called reflectix made bu reflectix inc. Its insolation for hot water heaters and pipes but its like 96% reflective and distributes light pretty evenly.


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## ruufuus (Sep 15, 2011)

ill deffinetely check it out, nearest hydro store is about an hour drive, and i have heard they suck pretty hard. also, why does foil cause hotspots so much?  thanks for the post dep!


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## Deathsmile (Sep 15, 2011)

Im using the *Panda Film* right now. It seems to work well, but its defiantly a two person job putting it up. If you drag it at all it will cause tiny little pin prick holes and therefore defeating the purpose of you putting it up. 

It seems to stay nice and cool, and it does have a very nice white reflective side to face your plants. My 50ft roll was about $60, but at that price, you can put up dry wall.


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## Lemon Jack (Sep 15, 2011)

ruufuus said:
			
		

> i like the idea of lst, but i looked into single cola sog and like that idea just as well =].  but which would theoretically have higher yield.  my first grow will  be a sexing grow because i have beans from different dank sacks, and need to determine my females and clone them before i start my continuous veg/flower schedule. also i plan to use aluminum(as much as i hate to) to line the sides of the plastic, and the 4'th and only actualy wall, is already panted white.  thanks for your your posts emmett! hope to hear from you soon


  I like lst and thats how i would go. However I dont know if i would run a seed run in an ebb and flow your gonna have males in your tray too and that just makes a mess having to dig all the roots out while your others are still in there.

Watch out for hermis with the seeds from dank sacks one got me yesterday from some bagseed lol.  I wouldnt use alluminum foil at all as it causes hot spots and can burn the leaves. Maybe you could use posterboards or something white and reflective.

Good luck to ya tho ma friend


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## depetreono (Sep 15, 2011)

Besides the burns foil would cause from hotspots it rips way easily and makes it hard to clean the reflectix I was talking about is thicker and easier to deal with. I actually had left overs and used it to set my pots on to reflect light back up.


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## ruufuus (Sep 15, 2011)

jack, you have a pretty valid point, how do you think i should go about sexing them?  also, im all about a hermie...as long as i keep tabs, a hermie means i can get some feminized seeds using the pods from the hermie to pollinate some of the lower "popcorn buds" =]

and as for the reflective material, i have to say the reflectix is looking like the way to go, ill just have to take measurements to figure out how much i will need exactly.  thanks for the posts everyone =]


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## Lemon Jack (Sep 15, 2011)

You can veg till you see preflowers or veg them take clones and flower the clones to see what sex they are.

I dont think you will be creating fem seeds from your hermie I think you will have some female seeds and alot of hermie seeds IMO.  not sure if its really worth it but hey its your grow.


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## ruufuus (Sep 15, 2011)

Lemon Jack said:
			
		

> You can veg till you see preflowers or veg them take clones and flower the clones to see what sex they are.
> 
> I dont think you will be creating fem seeds from your hermie I think you will have some female seeds and alot of hermie seeds IMO.  not sure if its really worth it but hey its your grow.


 well i plan to veg/clone/sex them. but what would be a sufficient size pot to keep them in until i clone and determine sex.  and as for the hermies i have read that you will get fem seeds from a hermie pollen sack.


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## Lemon Jack (Sep 15, 2011)

I grow in a hydro system my mothers are set up on a dripper system as well as the rest of my vegging plants.  I keep my mothers in one gallon pots filled with hydroton. Thats plenty of room for mine  however I do plan to trim my roots at some point .


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## ruufuus (Sep 15, 2011)

Ill probably rig some 1g pots to sit in my ebb and flow until I sex them, at which point I will transplant the females into the medium and take it from there.  Thanks everyone who posted on this thread!  I think this thread is about summed up unless anyone has anything else to add


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## Hushpuppy (Sep 15, 2011)

The Reflectix is definitely the way to go. That stuff is really good and acts as an insulator as well...I have read that panda film is good but only has a reflectivity of 76%, while the reflectix is 96%.  

Do not go with allowing bag seed to hermie and think that you will have good fem seeds, because you won't. Allowing bag seed to hermie is like allowing brothers n sisters to marry, you get bad genetics that breed ugly retarded youngins. If you want fem seeds then buy from a solid breeder who does it the right way, with top quality genetics in controlled environments.

If you breed bag fems then you will end up disapointed more often than not when you have a beautiful crop of buds one day and then cure it and find out it is all seeded and sorry smoke. Hermies are the evil twins of quality sensimilla.

I would start out my seeds in smallish(1gal) pots and do some hardcore LST, or supercrop to keep them small until you can take some cuttings. Then switch"em to flower and see how they sex. Then you can go full ebb n flow. I would use my flood table and just use some 1/2-1gal containers with holes in the bottom n sides, then run hoses up to the planters and top feed'em. Good luck with it


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## The Hemp Goddess (Sep 15, 2011)

ruufuus said:
			
		

> ...a hermie means i can get some feminized seeds using the pods from the hermie to pollinate some of the lower "popcorn buds" =]
> ]



You do not want to do that.  That is not how fem seeds are made.  Hermies means that you can get some hermie seeds.  Pollen taken from a hermie plant will create hermie seeds as this is being bred into the new seed as a dominant trait.  ALL seeds that are the result of hermies should be destroyed.


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## Locked (Sep 15, 2011)

ruufuus said:
			
		

> well i plan to veg/clone/sex them. but what would be a sufficient size pot to keep them in until i clone and determine sex.  and as for the hermies i have read that you will get fem seeds from a hermie pollen sack.




Lol....if that were true most everyone wld love hermies.  CS and GA are the two things used most often to make fem beans I believe.


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## depetreono (Sep 15, 2011)

Hush you had me rolling when I read that.


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## ruufuus (Sep 15, 2011)

i guess i was slightly mistaken in the case of fem seeds, thanks for the correction guys.  and as for the reflective material, i think i am going to purchase some flat white paint made for plastic, and just go that route, because the cost for the reflectix is more than i care to pay at this point.  thanks everyone for your helpful posts, i will keep this all and mind, and will probably be posting another few questions in a couple of days.  

yours truly~ruufuus


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## Hushpuppy (Sep 16, 2011)

Hey you will find that you cant paint plastic. the paint just will not stick to it. Even if you use polymer based spraypaint, it will stick some but then flake off as the sheet bends. You would be better off to get a heavy bedsheet and paint it white with several coats so that light can't penetrate it. It will get stiff and form somewhat of a wall. If you are pretty handy, you could do that and hang it so that it forms your walls. 

I think it's easier to just go to lowes and get the silver-backed insulation boards and make a "ghetto setup" with them. They are pretty cheap andfairly reflective, and given the size of your space, you shouldn't need more than 2 sheets.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Sep 16, 2011)

You can paint plastic.  The paint for plastic is great.  I have a tote that was clear that I painted with black Fusion paint at least 4 years ago.  Not one single chip or flake.  I believe that the paint bonds with the plastic on a molecular level.


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