# Got Tax Money?



## Cowboy (Feb 5, 2010)

Not sure how I feel about this yet, but I doubt that all growers will comply.

San Francisco -- A California lawmaker is proposing to require all marijuana growers and sellers to be licensed by the state as a way to increase sales tax revenue.Democratic state Sen. Ron Calderon said Wednesday he plans to introduce a bill requiring all legal and illegal marijuana businesses to register with the Board of Equalization, the state agency that collects sales tax. The bill would not legalize marijuana beyond current state law. 

Supporters say the measure is intended mainly to provide a system of regulation for medical marijuana dispensaries. Such dispensaries already are required to pay sales tax like other businesses, but board vice chair Jerome Horton says many don't comply.
"There is a clear indication that many dispensaries are intentionally evading their taxes, distributing illegal products and may be laundering illegally acquired money," Horton said in a statement.
Licensees would have to pay a fee, prepay part of the sales tax and pay an excise tax similar to manufacturers, distributors and retailers of tobacco products in the state.
Calderon spokesman Rocky Rushing said the lawmaker estimates full compliance from legal medical marijuana sellers could generate $168 million in revenue.
The Board of Equalization estimates that $1.3 billion worth of marijuana is sold legally in the state every year but only $8 million in sales tax are collected.
Under the current tax code, medical marijuana dispensaries do not have the option of choosing marijuana sales as their primary business, making precise estimates of sales and taxes paid difficult.
Medical marijuana advocates with the group Americans for Safe Access conducted their own study in 2007 that estimated dispensaries contribute closer to $100 million annually to state coffers.
Americans for Safe Access spokesman Kris Hermes said that estimate was calculated when there were 400 dispensaries in the state, a figure that may have as much as tripled with the explosion in the number of dispensaries in Los Angeles.
Hermes' group has long opposed the imposition of sales tax on medical marijuana, saying the drug should be treated like prescribed medications, which are not taxed.
He said he did not see the need for additional tax laws regarding dispensaries, especially if new regulations required them to pay more than they already do.
"I don't know that a piece of legislation is necessary for dispensaries to pay sales tax since that's already a policy," Hermes said.
The proposed legislation is modeled on a law crafted by Horton in 2003 that imposed tighter tax rules as a way to crack down on illegal cigarette sales. That law also provided the Board of Equalization with additional funding to enforce sales tax compliance.
A 2006 report by the California State Auditor found that the cigarette law helped to stem a decline in cigarette sales tax revenue but said the board's own estimates of increased revenues owing to the law were overstated.
Source: Associated Press (Wire)
Published: February 3,  2010


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## Old_SSSC_Guy (Feb 5, 2010)

about time the state started to get their cut of the millions of dollars in CA smoke money coming through the dispensaries.  from all their woofing about "helping the sick" you'd maybe not notice the sick volume of profit dollars the dispensaries are raking in - in a bankrupt state no less!


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## kasgrow (Feb 5, 2010)

The only problem is they are not going after the dispensaries money they are going after the growers tax money. Not all growers are profiting from selling so why should they pay taxes. When you grow a vegetable garden you don't need to register with the government and pay tax on each pound of vegetables you grow. 
 The government does not need more tax money they just need to stop spending so much. We don't get to raise our pay every time we want to spend more so why should they.


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## diablo_cannabis (Feb 6, 2010)

In CO dispensaries are required to collect sales tax as well as pay gross receipts taxes etc. I am only a grower but I do have a registered not for profit business and a licensed accountant that handles my taxes, payroll taxes, benefit distributions ect. 100% legal in the eyes of the state.


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## OldHippieChick (Feb 6, 2010)

I don't understand - I don't pay taxes on any medicine here. This taxation on MMJ is the only medical prescription I am aware of that is taxable anywhere in the states? This gives me the impression that MJ for medical purposes is just a wink and a nod away from just being a legal drug. Perhaps this is just a way of preparing the state for legalized and controlled sales of MJ... It might speed up the legalization of MJ across the board but isn't this just setting us that grow for personal consumption up for tax evasion or "bootlegging" charges on down the road?


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## FUM (Feb 6, 2010)

Supreme court recognizes MJ and other drugs for religious matters. Thus,no taxing religious MJ. Free green blessings for those who believe in a higher space. Peace out.

There is a $100.00 federal tax on MJ.


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## MindzEye (Feb 6, 2010)

FUM said:
			
		

> Supreme court recognizes MJ and other drugs for religious matters. Thus,no taxing religious MJ. Free green blessings for those who believe in a higher space. Peace out.
> 
> There is a $100.00 federal tax on MJ.




There is no federal tax on marijuana, the federal government wants nothing to do with it right now, its still illegal to the feds.. States are taxing marijuana not the feds... And from what I hear the only place that recognizes MJ for religion is Hawaii..


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## nvthis (Feb 6, 2010)

OldHippieChick said:
			
		

> I don't understand - I don't pay taxes on any medicine here. This taxation on MMJ is the only medical prescription I am aware of that is taxable anywhere in the states? This gives me the impression that MJ for medical purposes is just a wink and a nod away from just being a legal drug. Perhaps this is just a way of preparing the state for legalized and controlled sales of MJ... It might speed up the legalization of MJ across the board but isn't this just setting us that grow for personal consumption up for tax evasion or "bootlegging" charges on down the road?


 
Yup, and that should be a hell of bargaining chip. If we can get our act together and not get pushed around on this issue, we should be able to insist that if they want their money, it needs to be fully legal PERIOD. Otherwise, keep it a medication and kiss the money goodbye.


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## PeterPotatoes (Feb 6, 2010)

Cowboy said:
			
		

> Not sure how I feel about this yet, but I doubt that all growers will comply.
> 
> San Francisco -- A California lawmaker is proposing to require all marijuana growers and sellers to be licensed by the state as a way to increase sales tax revenue.Democratic state Sen. Ron Calderon said Wednesday he plans to introduce a bill requiring all legal *and illegal marijuana businesses* to register with the Board of Equalization, the state agency that collects sales tax. The bill would not legalize marijuana beyond current state law.


 
ha, yeah right  .  

Like nvthis saying, they just need to legalize it if their going for a profit.  

Some of the dispensaries/growers here in Denver are making hand over fist handing out scripts and selling. It looks like they might pass a bill trying to make the dispensaries non profit so they can get the state to pay their salaries and get rid of in-house doctors to stop the ** scripts being handed out.


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## NorCalHal (Feb 7, 2010)

PeterPotatoes said:
			
		

> ha, yeah right  .
> 
> Like nvthis saying, they just need to legalize it if their going for a profit.
> 
> Some of the dispensaries/growers here in Denver are making hand over fist handing out scripts and selling. It looks like they might pass a bill trying to make the dispensaries non profit so they can get the state to pay their salaries and get rid of in-house doctors to stop the ** scripts being handed out.


 

There is no such thing as a "bad" script, as long as it is written by a Doctor...what do you care?

what are you tryin to say? That only folks that are cancer ridden or on thier deathbed should smoke herb and everyone else should have no legal rights?


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## greenfriend (Feb 7, 2010)

agreed, it should be used for ANY condition for which it provides relief, whether that be cancer, depression, or a mild headache


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## PeterPotatoes (Feb 7, 2010)

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> There is no such thing as a "bad" script, as long as it is written by a Doctor...what do you care?
> 
> what are you tryin to say? That only folks that are cancer ridden or on thier deathbed should smoke herb and everyone else should have no legal rights?


 




			
				greenfriend said:
			
		

> agreed, it should be used for ANY condition for which it provides relief, whether that be cancer, depression, or a mild headache


 
Please, If you two are trying to say all scripts are legit then you're just blind. It's going to be hard to make something legal when there is a bunch of corruption surrounding it.


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## surreptitious (Feb 7, 2010)

PeterPotatoes said:
			
		

> Please, If you two are trying to say all scripts are legit then you're just blind. It's going to be hard to make something legal when there is a bunch of corruption surrounding it.



because there was no corruption when we when through the legalization of alcohol, right?


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## nvthis (Feb 7, 2010)

greenfriend said:
			
		

> agreed, it should be used for ANY condition for which it provides relief, whether that be cancer, depression, or a mild headache


 Yes! And further more half of it should be OTC for nongrowing folks and self-administered just like aspirin. 


The other half should be by the cooler section. Right next to the beer and chips. 

 Hey Hal! Wassup man? Haven't seen too much of you lately. Think I read someplace that you were finally getting your master plan in motion? Nice bro. Drop in soon and tell us how it's all comin together for ya  I ain't forgot about you bro. Not even close! Hey, last I heard you were working with a crap load of purp strains...


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## Old_SSSC_Guy (Feb 7, 2010)

my issue is not with the taxation, that's inevitable.  my issue is with a $20 plant generating $5000++ in dispensary profit, and not much (if any) of that profit going for anything but lining the dispensary owner's pockets - under the guise of "helping sick people".  

instead of dispensaries lowering the street price of pot from its silly high levels they are supporting an exorbinant street price structure which has nothing to do with helping the sick - and everything to do with profit.  just because the dispensaries *can* follow the example of the greedy American medical industry does not mean they ought to!

just wait - when the insurance companies are goaded into covering the cost of pot for treatment, artificially stupid-high pot prices will be etched in stone for many years to come.  i'd rather see the legit states pass laws limiting the cost of pot at a maximum $5-$7 per gram level - plus a tax which would go only to health issues and state health insurance funding.  

*SICK PEOPLE SHOULD NOT BE GAUGED BY THEIR PROFIT POTENTIAL!!!*​


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## surreptitious (Feb 7, 2010)

Old_SSSC_Guy said:
			
		

> my issue is not with the taxation, that's inevitable.  my issue is with a $20 plant generating $5000++ in dispensary profit, and not much (if any) of that profit going for anything but lining the dispensary owner's pockets - under the guise of "helping sick people".
> 
> instead of dispensaries lowering the street price of pot from its silly high levels they are supporting an exorbinant street price structure which has nothing to do with helping the sick - and everything to do with profit.  just because the dispensaries *can* follow the example of the greedy American medical industry does not mean they ought to!
> 
> ...



i'm sorry, but that's ridiculous.  i realize that this may help sick people, but if people are paying for the inflated prices then that's their problem.

the Government should not step in an control prices on things like this.  because if they did, then it wouldnt be a price max it would be a price min because the Government would be getting a % of it and would want as much as possible.

we should follow the law of supply and demand.  we need competition in order for prices to be brought to a reasonable level....not government.

we need much less Government in the united states, not more.


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## NorCalHal (Feb 8, 2010)

PeterPotatoes said:
			
		

> Please, If you two are trying to say all scripts are legit then you're just blind. It's going to be hard to make something legal when there is a bunch of corruption surrounding it.


 
Are you a Medical Doctor?  Do you REALLY believe that MMJ is for medicinal use only? The Millions of folks who smoke for recreation should still be treated like criminals?

Looks like you are the one who is blind my friend.

MMJ is a stepping stone for full decriminalazation, I said it 1000 times.
In 10 years, there will be no term "MMJ", as it will be legal both on the State and Federal level.

Don't be fooled by the term "MMJ". It is the ONLY avenue we have to get folks to wake up to the lies spread by Anslinger that still hold true in many peoples eyes today. MMJ plays on the compassion of folks and is helping people realize that MJ is NOT a gsteway drug or can kill you.

I applaud any doctor  that will give any adult a Reccomendation, for any reason. 

I would like to hear your thoughts on what "ailments" MMJ should be "reccomended " for.

Your thoughts about "false" recs are plain wrong. It has HELPED the cause for legalization. The fact that anyone can get a Rec just shows how harmless MJ is.
It has lead to groundbreaking legislature here in Cali to legalize MJ posseseion/cultivation, which is up for Popular Vote in Cali this November.

So, again, don't be fooled in the MMJ propaganda.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 8, 2010)

Cowboy said:
			
		

> Not sure how I feel about this yet, but I doubt that all growers will comply.
> 
> San Francisco -- A California lawmaker is proposing to require all marijuana growers and sellers to be licensed by the state as a way to increase sales tax revenue.Democratic state Sen. Ron Calderon said Wednesday he plans to introduce a bill requiring all legal and illegal marijuana businesses to register with the Board of Equalization, the state agency that collects sales tax. The bill would not legalize marijuana beyond current state law.




They want All MJ growers and sellers to be licensed !!  Now if they want the growers to be licensed thru the state, So wondering how this going to work because the Local Law or Feds or who ever going to check us all out, are they going to have man power to check us all out after we become legal growers for ourself.?  NO WAY.!!

I look at a Vegetable Don't need a licensed to grow, but to sell, well if that your job then pay taxes, But really if I grew 25 tomato's plants and want to sell them to a friend or family and put up a sign that say ( Tomato's here with out that word For sale) I am Not in violation to sale tax, But if that one person comes by and ask if I am license to sell, then I am busted.

When I was trying to sell my doxie pups at Walmart parking lot and put up a sign that say's ( Doxie Pup's for sell ) I started at 11 am and had the city worker come along and asked if I had a seller permit or got permission from walmart or the city.?  I said No and told him I see a lot of people getting rid of there pup's right here,  Will he told me I am in violation and this was around 4 pm when I got chased off.  

If we the growers, grows for our-self then we Shouldn't have to be License because it is NOT our way of Business, 
But the Love to Grow Good Weed to get excited over, to smoke with friends & family is called sharing either it Vegetables or weed.


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## NorCalHal (Feb 8, 2010)

Old_SSSC_Guy said:
			
		

> my issue is not with the taxation, that's inevitable. my issue is with a $20 plant generating $5000++ in dispensary profit, and not much (if any) of that profit going for anything but lining the dispensary owner's pockets - under the guise of "helping sick people".
> 
> instead of dispensaries lowering the street price of pot from its silly high levels they are supporting an exorbinant street price structure which has nothing to do with helping the sick - and everything to do with profit. just because the dispensaries *can* follow the example of the greedy American medical industry does not mean they ought to!
> 
> ...


 
Id' like to see a $20 plant generate over 5000, never happen.

Do you live in a Medical State with operating Dispensaries? Do you understand operating costs and Employee wages/benefits?

This aint like the street dealer daze my friend.

IE. A lb of A++ herb wholesales to a Dispensary for $4000. The Dispensary will break it down and generate $7800, leaving a 3800 profit. Sounds GREAT huh. easy money.....not.
From that 3800, they have to pay wages (average wage for a typical "budtender" ranges from 30-50,000 a year. Plus FULL medical/health benefits.
Lets talk security. Guards and cameras.
What about the lease money they have to pay every month?
Every reputable dispensary also provides FREE services to ANY MEMBER.
These services include chripopratic,accupunture,massage, and multiple support groups.
They also have discounted prices for folks who are TRULY ill, such as legitimate HIV,Cancer patients.
The BIG kicker...Legal costs. What do you think retainers cost on a business like that? Big $$.

Noone is forcing folks to go to a dispensary,everyone has freewill my friend.

With that said, do your homework man.

I will give you a little credit. Not all dispensaries operate correctly. Yes, there are some that str8 gaffle folks. These soon get shut down, or lose customers and are forced to shut down. It is all about how you treat the end user, as with any other business.

You all have to realize, espesially in the Newer MMJ states ,it takes time to get a hold of a business that is in it's infancy.

I do agree that ALOT of dispensaries are out of hand, but let the end customer "police' them by not giving them thier business, not by allowing the local goverments to regulate them for us.


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## legalize_freedom (Feb 8, 2010)

Well said Hal!  Dang bud tenders are makeing more than me as a fabricator!!?...lol...I need to move to Cali, and get a job in the dispencaries!  I have experience!!!...lol


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## cmd420 (Feb 8, 2010)

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> Id' like to see a $20 plant generate over 5000, never happen.
> 
> Do you live in a Medical State with operating Dispensaries? Do you understand operating costs and Employee wages/benefits?
> 
> ...


 
Yeah..really!

to the folks that want the govt to regulate pot prices...*you're kidding right?*

Open _any_ introductory economics textbook and you will find a bunch of rules to explain why that would not work...

besides..you really want the govt to regulate our prices and business...*really*?


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## spiritlovescolorado (Feb 8, 2010)

:hitchair:    R you Friggin kidding me!  Who among us are adults????  I am a Colorado resident,.. and been smokin the gonge for OVER ,...:ignore:  20 years!  I finally got the "courage" to ask my Doc to give me my MM Lic. !  I say "Courage" because It is still afederal offense,.. I am asking my Doctor,.. who is retired millitary gone civillian Angel,....Doctor,.. to put his lic num., down and "back up MY needs!"  openning him up for investigations from the Feds the State or whoever wants to know  "Why"  I CAN NOT take pharmacutical "man Made" drugs!  THEY POISON OUR FOOD AND THE DRUGS!,... Not an antibiotic pain reliever or sleePing pill for me!,.... YET, I ONLY  shop at one dispensary,... and this is why!  They PAY THEIR TAXES without a whine! or Whimper,... We,.. The mature people of the State of Colorado that DO NOT HAVE A DIAGNOSIS of Aides Cancer or anything that they can figure out for that matter,... but ARE DYING RAPPIDLY,...LIKE ME!  Don't so much mind supporting a state that supports MY needs MEDICALLY!  I pay TWICE the price as they do on the street here,... but, It's clean,.. it's well bred,.. They are Mature honest hardworking CARING providers to my healthcare  (my dispensary in Woodland Park!  Go Caregivers!)  They did things the right way when they openned,.. they cared to be AWAY from school traffic,..they didn't put it in the "center of main" although there was some cheap space for rent,.. they applied for and were granted there business lic.  They Do NOT sell to un lic. peeps..... and they CARE! and I am on State and Federal Medicare and Medicaide,.....They don't cover my "perscription"  We all have our cross to bere,... some heavier thn others"  I PAY CASH for my medicational needs! Suppliments,.. Medical Food that keeps me alive!,.. Because the Gov. doesn't cover My Food,....Food stamps don't buy medical food suppliments because I can't absorb what your getting at walmart! to EAT! EVERYDAY!  My Vitamins and Suppliments MUST BE NATURAL They don't cover that!  Nor my Perscription,... I HAVE to take some financial responsibillity for what my body is putting me through,... I am a proud Woman,....I PAY cash outta pocket outta my 490 bucks a month they give me to live on   "because I was disabled to young" they say (in my 30's at the time but worked 45 to 90 hours a week for the previous ten years!)   I DON'T MIND PAYING THE TAXES!    I do mind a little on the markup in price I do KNOW it is typical mark up,.. for retail,... but, I gotta get some financial relief somewhere,... so Again taking responsabillity for my OWN needs,... I bought some plants,.. they aren't to growin fast enough for my wallet or my credit card for that matter (about at max with all the doctor stuff and trying to stay alive while they figure it out and "practice" their medicine,).:ignore: . at LEAST YOUR TAX DOLLARS AREN'T PAYING FOR ME TO SIT IN JAIL FOR SLAPPIN THE SHINOLAH OUTTA A DOC IN THE LAST FEW YEARS,... I say grow your own,... or PAY YOUR FRIGGIN TAXES!  BE RESPONSIBLE AND RELIGIOUS SPIRITUAL,.. OR JUST FOR SH*TS AND GRINS,.......DO NOT  BLOW IT FOR THOSE OF US WHO DO HAVE A DESPERATE NEED!:holysheep:    Clearly,....Crystal

'Whatever you give a woman, she will make it greater. If you give her sperm, she'll give you a baby. If you give her a house, she'll give you a home. If you give her groceries, she'll give you a meal.. If you give her a smile, she'll give you her heart. She multiplies and enlarges what is given to her. So, if you give her any crap, be ready to receive a ton of *#@$.


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## DonJones (Feb 8, 2010)

I can understand people bitching about the cost of MJ because if I gave it away free some one would want me to deliver it for free.  

What I can't understand is smokers calling for the very same government that created the outrageously high street prices by regulating it in the first place -- yes it is regulated only it is not allowed to anyone under the federal regulations and laws, but it is still regulated or we could all have as much as we wanted.  A ban is an extreme regulation of it but never the less a regulation. -- to further regulate it and thereby lower prices.  Get real, show me anything that the the cost went down when the government got involved in setting the prices.

Not only that the prices will not come down and the state regulating it is going to increase the trafficking in "illegitimate" scripts rather than reducing them if the medicinal prices are artificially set below street price.

*If you don't like the dispensaries, then stay away from them!  If you are able, grow your own (that is what these forums are supposedly about  -- self sufficiency) and if you aren't able but have a legitimate need, I know you can find some one to grow with or who will just plain help you out.  But for GOD's sake as well as your own keep the government just as far away from our medical MJ as possible!*

Not only that, why aren't you complaining about the profits the wineries make or the distilleries or the farmers?  If you think it is such a rip off with obscene profits to be made, then get into the "business" and see just how obscene your profits look when you babysit the plants, pay inflated prices for ferts -- either organic or manufactured, pay the high power bills, try to keep some one from stealing your crop and maybe killing you and/or tour family in the process.  And why are there all of these risks? -- because our governments that you want to mess around more and more in the MJ trade saw fit to regulate it to a Zero tolerance in the first place!  Where were the obscene profits, corruption and organized crime connected with MJ in the early 1990s when it was legal?  There wasn't any!

Look at what happened to the corruption and organized crime connected with alcohol when Prohibition was repealed -- it disappeared and then regrew in the states where there was the most "regulation" of alcohol.

If you think I'm hard hearted and unfeeling for my stance, then be my guest because you don't know me or have any idea how many people I help for free and subsidize that help by charging the ones who can pay what ever they are willing to pay.  The great majority of my paying patients are people who buy everything they can find on the street anyway and if they can drive cars that cost more than my family home is worth, wear $100+ jeans, shoes shirt or what ever, then they can afford to pay me street price if they want good quality, unadulterated safe pot without risking a drug deal going bad and loosing their toys and/or their life. 

I apologize for the rant.  It is just so tiring to hear people cry and moan and then ask the very governments that created the problem in the first place to straighten out the mess by more involvement.

I know there is a less expensive source than some of the dispensaries for people with legitimate needs and no way to pay for it.

Great smoking.


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## legalize_freedom (Feb 8, 2010)

Isn't it blatantly obviouse that everything our government touches turns to crap, and costs twice as much???  Come on they already have way too much control over everything else!  I mean they pay $200 for a hammer that I can buy for $20....they need to stay out of this, until they are ready to say...okay we are turning it over to you...marijuana is 100% legal...


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## surreptitious (Feb 8, 2010)

DonJones said:
			
		

> * But for GOD's sake as well as your own keep the government just as far away from our medical MJ as possible!*



TROOF, but not just limited to MJ...but many other aspects.


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## surreptitious (Feb 8, 2010)

legalize_freedom said:
			
		

> Isn't it blatantly obviouse that everything our government touches turns to crap, and costs twice as much???  Come on they already have way too much control over everything else!  I mean they pay $200 for a hammer that I can buy for $20....they need to stay out of this, until they are ready to say...okay we are turning it over to you...marijuana is 100% legal...



LF, our government was not always this way.  originally, it was formed because we were oppressed by Great Britain (no offense brits, i still love the accent...  ).  I think we should go back to our roots and strictly follow the original US Constitution and Bill of Rights.  We have strayed so far away from it that it doesn't seem likely though.

of course now this probably breaks the rules of the forum....because i dont think we are supposed to discuss politics...i'm sorry admins :x


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## Old_SSSC_Guy (Feb 9, 2010)

yeah - screw those people who have a terminal illness and won't pay inflated prices.  so what if they have AIDS or cancer - its their fault, right?

i am in awe of your logic.




			
				surreptitious said:
			
		

> i'm sorry, but that's ridiculous. i realize that this may help sick people, but if people are paying for the inflated prices then that's their problem.


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## surreptitious (Feb 9, 2010)

Old_SSSC_Guy said:
			
		

> yeah - screw those people who have a terminal illness and won't pay inflated prices.  so what if they have AIDS or cancer - its their fault, right?
> 
> i am in awe of your logic.



if you think the inflated prices are ridiculous then open a dispensary with cheaper prices and force competition.

my point is that there are other options then more government.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 9, 2010)

No matter how anyone wants to look at, the Gov is going to step in and get there share anyway.! Taxes taxes   Nov 1

If they make it legal for those over 21 to buy and smoke, what would that do to our jail house.?  ect,ect
Under the Influence of THC

Wouldn't have to worry to much about theif because everybody will be able to grow in a 25x25 square foot box outside.. 

Marijuana should be left as Medical Marijuana.!!!


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 9, 2010)

Old_SSSC_Guy said:
			
		

> yeah - screw those people who have a terminal illness and won't pay inflated prices.  so what if they have AIDS or cancer - its their fault, right?
> 
> i am in awe of your logic.




So you wouldn't do what Ever it take to control pain or help your mom out, if it means being Illegal.?


So are you saying that it there fault that they got Cancer or Aids.? 
If so You Need to go find another site to complain..

We need this Marijuana to stay Medical Marijuana so that way we are protected under a Doctor care...


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## legalize_freedom (Feb 9, 2010)

Huh?


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 9, 2010)

legalize_freedom said:
			
		

> Huh?



Must of been in a hurry to write that, I didn't go back and proof read..:hubba:


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## surreptitious (Feb 10, 2010)

Flyinghigh said:
			
		

> Must of been in a hurry to write that, I didn't go back and proof read..:hubba:



he was being sarcastic.  he's saying that's what i believe.


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## surreptitious (Feb 10, 2010)

Flyinghigh said:
			
		

> Marijuana should be left as Medical Marijuana.!!!



i disagree with that as well.  i believe that i should be able to do whatever i want as long as it does not infringe on someone else's rights.  first off, i dont think there is anything wrong with using marijuana recreationally.  i acknowledge that there are medical benefits to the drug, but i do not need them at the moment.  simply enjoying being high.  it's no different then someone enjoying being drunk...except i've never wanted to hurt or kill someone when high.      

if i want to smoke crack in the privacy of my own home, i should be able to do that.  i'm not out hurting other people.  the moment something i do infringes on another citizen's rights then the Government should step in.  up until that point, leave me alone.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 11, 2010)

surreptitious said:
			
		

> i disagree with that as well.  i believe that i should be able to do whatever i want as long as it does not infringe on someone else's rights.  first off, i dont think there is anything wrong with using marijuana recreationally.  i acknowledge that there are medical benefits to the drug, but i do not need them at the moment.  simply enjoying being high.  it's no different then someone enjoying being drunk...except i've never wanted to hurt or kill someone when high.
> 
> if i want to smoke crack in the privacy of my own home, i should be able to do that.  i'm not out hurting other people.  the moment something i do infringes on another citizen's rights then the Government should step in.  up until that point, leave me alone.




I believe in privacy in the home too and to do what ever I want too do!

But does that mean smoking crack will KEEP You at Home all night, But instead one would be running around outside late at night isn't fringing on some elses right with mowing or racking making Noise.?  Lets leave the Crack out of this.. !!  That has a BAD RAP ANYWAY as many other drugs.!

Legallizing the marijuana for all to use would be Good for Recreational use, But then the medical part will just be thrown out the window and we all would have to get some type of permit to grow and have the Government would tax yea, and make new laws behind it. Naa
Work force would change and those bussines would still want a DRUG FREE Place and might cause problems.

You work.??     Go ask your boss, that when Nov 1 comes around and they pass Marijuana as recreational use and Yea started to smoke it around then instead of drinking, and you fire up a few joints the night before work and fired up a bowl the next morning and he ask yea for a test the next morning and your piss come back dirty, he Can and Will Let yea go if he wants and that his company Yelling DRUG FREE PLACE.. Keeping it medical would protect you at work..

So the Real Question is for You and ALL??  Marijuana Recreational Use.
You don't drink ALCOHOL before going to work right.? I Never Have.! 
Are You Going to follow the law and NOT smoke before work and TREAT Marijuana Like Alcohol..?


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## legalize_freedom (Feb 11, 2010)

I don't smoke at work....that drug free work place is a crock!  If I smoke on the weekend and they make me pee, I'll show dirty for 30 days.  But someone can do lines of coke and be clean in a couple days...urine tests are only to descriminate agains pot smokers, all other substances are out of your system in a few days.......alcohol in hours.  I don't smoke at work, but with the way they do things they can fire me for smoking on my own time ...yet guys get away with comeing in 1/2 drunk from the night before....drug testing in the work place is biased and wrong.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 11, 2010)

legalize_freedom said:
			
		

> I don't smoke at work....that drug free work place is a crock!  If I smoke on the weekend and they make me pee, I'll show dirty for 30 days.  But someone can do lines of coke and be clean in a couple days...urine tests are only to descriminate agains pot smokers, all other substances are out of your system in a few days.......alcohol in hours.  I don't smoke at work, but with the way they do things they can fire me for smoking on my own time ...yet guys get away with comeing in 1/2 drunk from the night before....drug testing in the work place is biased and wrong.




I understand what your saying  L.F.,  and your so Right on the harder drugs and alcohol getting out of your system ALOT Sooner then Marijuana..
Keeping MJ for medical use would protect you, I would think, because we voted it in for Medical use only, and not for recreational.. 
So if your Doctor gave you pain pills that would be ok with your job.?  If so then that why we need to keep MJ as Medical Marijuana..Protection!!  
If it was Recreational then I would think they need to Throw out the Test for Marijuana just to keep a job.. 


 I much rather be protected by a Doctor,  then by any Government Control of Marijuana for Recreational use..!


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## surreptitious (Feb 11, 2010)

Flyinghigh said:
			
		

> I believe in privacy in the home too and to do what ever I want too do!
> 
> But does that mean smoking crack will KEEP You at Home all night, But instead one would be running around outside late at night isn't fringing on some elses right with mowing or racking making Noise.?  Lets leave the Crack out of this.. !!  That has a BAD RAP ANYWAY as many other drugs.!
> 
> ...



if crack makes you leave your house infringing on peoples rights, then yes, the Government should do something about it, but if I smoke crack and mind my own business then so be it.

i do not smoke while i work.  i would not be productive if i did.  and yes, i treat marijuana like alcohol right now.  i see what your point is though.  if it is only treated as a medication, then if you did it at work, you could prove to your employer that it's because it's prescribed...like any other prescribed medication.

i believe that the place were you work has the right to tell you what you can and cannot do.  if you don't like it, then don't work there.  as far as the piss tests go it is an infringement on my rights.  when they tell me to piss in a cup they are assuming that i'm doing drugs until i prove them otherwise....but even still, if you dont like it, then dont work there...but good luck getting a decent job these days without pissing in a cup.


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## NorCalHal (Feb 12, 2010)

Flyinghigh said:
			
		

> Keeping it medical would protect you at work..
> 
> So the Real Question is for You and ALL?? Marijuana Recreational Use.
> You don't drink ALCOHOL before going to work right.? I Never Have.!
> Are You Going to follow the law and NOT smoke before work and TREAT Marijuana Like Alcohol..?


 

MMJ is NOT protected as far as the workplace goes. If a Company has a "no Drug" policy, then it does not matter that you have a MMJ rec. Period. This has been fought in Cali Court a couple of times and was lost both times. I know one case was a worker for AT&T.
Simply...it is still a controled substance federally, so "insurance" wise, that is how they justify not allowing MMJ to be an exception.

The folks that smoke before work now......wil continue to do so. I am sure we all know a few friends that smoke out before work.


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## Hick (Feb 12, 2010)

> i believe that the place were you work has the right to tell you what you can and cannot do.


...:shocked:.. even when you aren't "on the clock"???.. that's ridiculous!  
 "under the influence" and "on the job".. yes. But random, on the job UA's do not reflect honestly if you are under the influence, only if you _have been_ under the influence within the last 30 days or more.


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## surreptitious (Feb 12, 2010)

Hick said:
			
		

> ...:shocked:.. even when you aren't "on the clock"???.. that's ridiculous!
> "under the influence" and "on the job".. yes. But random, on the job UA's do not reflect honestly if you are under the influence, only if you _have been_ under the influence within the last 30 days or more.



my point is, it's your choice to work there.  if you do not like your company's policy then quit or don't apply for a job there.  it's completely voluntary.

i understand that UA's do not reflect if you are under the influence.  it just shows if you have been under the influence in the past.


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## spiritlovescolorado (Feb 12, 2010)

Most Ua requirements on the job,.. aren't gennerally the "cause of the employer" It is their insurance company requiring them to do so,.. so many peeps per so many quarters to assure "a safe workplace" like you said,.. We live in a casino town where half the people comin attcha on the highway have been consuming alcohol most of their visit! Comforting eh?!  I say you only get a UA if you call in frequently or have a stupid boo boo (not a real accident) at work!  Other wise,.. they should mind there business!:holysheep:


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## legalize_freedom (Feb 12, 2010)

I agree Spirit...I go to work everyday, bust my hump for them, and earn a paycheck.  What I do on my time is my business.  I think if they are going to rely on a US they should develope something that shows to the last minute when someone consumed, otherwise it is wrong, and unconstitional.  

As far as finding a job that doesn't US ...lol....right...good luck with that!  Unless you can make a living at McDonalds or Speedy-mart


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## dirtyolsouth (Feb 13, 2010)

Some of us out here in the United States of Paranoia would even welcome some Federal meds cuz that would mean progress toward decriminalization...  Anything would be progress from the current situation anywhere around here.


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## Hick (Feb 13, 2010)

surreptitious said:
			
		

> my point is, it's your choice to work there.  if you do not like your company's policy then quit or don't apply for a job there.  it's completely voluntary.
> 
> i understand that UA's do not reflect if you are under the influence.  it just shows if you have been under the influence in the past.



"_Choice"_??? what _choice_ is that?.. live under a bridge?.. government subsidized food stamps?.. meals at the homeless shelter?..
The workplace itself calls it _"mandatory"_ random testing.... not "voluntary" random testing..
  Suppose they(employer) is paying a portion of your health insurance. Does that then give them the right to tell you that you can't eat red meat, or fast food, or smoke tobacco when you are "off" of the clock?..   
    If I am a good employee, and dedicate my all to a company for 8 hours, when I punch that clock at 5;00 pm, it starts "MY" time... if I'm sacrificing cats, worshipping the devil, or smoking pot.. it is NONE of their business. As long as I show up safe and sober at 8:00 am.


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## nvthis (Feb 13, 2010)

Man, great thread.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 13, 2010)

surreptitious said:
			
		

> if crack makes you leave your house infringing on peoples rights, then yes, the Government should do something about it, but if I smoke crack and mind my own business then so be it.
> 
> ...but good luck getting a decent job these days without pissing in a cup.



There was a time back about 20 yrs or so ago, my first bust for being under the influence of Crank while walking back to my house from around the corner and the cop thought I was someone else and detained me with hand cuffs went to jail and I told the Cops and the Judge that I was minding my own business  and wasn't hurting anybody else but hurting myself, so why should you care.!!!!!! It my life to use and destroy..!!     It's Called Compassionate on the courts part.   
There way getting around in getting that Good job, B-Clean or other stuff to clean your system, but keeping that job is up to you to show that there NO sign of drug use.
Myself I Wouldn't work at walmart or target, or any such place like that, just because they throw random testing and they have Zero Tolerant to any medication that alters your mind..


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 13, 2010)

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> MMJ is NOT protected as far as the workplace goes. If a Company has a "no Drug" policy,




No Drug Policy" would that be for all medication.??


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## Cowboy (Feb 13, 2010)

As far as I am concerned, I don't want Mj legalized because it would mean nothing for all the years we worked to make it legal for toughs that need it as a med.

Also, there is one thing getting missed here. If a law is passed to tax growers, legal or other wise, then you can be held on two counts by the law if you don't comply.
1. For growing illegally.
2. Tax evasion.

Then what? Smokers?

It may be 2010, but to me each day looks more and more like 1984.

happy trails of smoke to all.


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## dman1234 (Feb 13, 2010)

This is for anyone from Canada.



A.  The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms
Challenges to government mandatory drug testing programs would likely be based on sections 7, 8 and/or 15 of the Charter.  Section 7 sets out the right to security of the person, and the right not to be deprived thereof, except in accordance with the principles of fundamental justice.  Security of the person includes liberty from physical constraint, privacy (see section A.1 of this paper), and freedom from state intrusion into personal matters.  Section 8 guarantees the right to be secure against unreasonable search and seizure.  It is also possible that a challenge could be made under section 15 of the Charter, which guarantees the right to equality. 

The application of these constitutional rights is limited by section 1 of the Charter, which permits reasonable restrictions as long as they are prescribed by law and can be shown to be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society.

Another important consideration in relation to the Charter is its applicability.  The Charter, as per section 32, applies only to Parliament and to provincial legislatures, as well as to the federal and provincial governments.  Thus, it does not generally apply to private actions of individuals or corporations, although it may do so, for example, through judicial extension of its guarantees to human rights codes.   Therefore, if a mandatory drug testing program is established by legislation, any employee would have the right to challenge the law under the Charter.  If, however, a federally regulated corporation implemented such a program as its own policy, an employee would have recourse only under human rights legislation.


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## Cowboy (Feb 13, 2010)

We have a Constitution also but what good has it done from Nixon alll the way to today?
The magic words for our lost rights is NATIONAL SECURITY. And we all know that pot smoking radicals are threatening It and the way of life for the privileged.

happy trails of smoke to all.


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## Piperson (Feb 13, 2010)

:holysheep: Just finished reading this thread. And I just wanted to say ur all stupid idiots! (no, I'm just kidding, I apologizes to every1) 

But, in my humble oppinion, I think it should be leagelized for everything that it is good for. Like the 1937? Popular Mechanics Magazine artical saying it was the new billion $ crop for over 5000 different uses, including medical, fuel, fabric, ect. 

The medical aspect can still remain, but come-on, there r 1000's of uses for cannabis, includding gettn high.

My body has aces n pains, i still smoke it mainly because i enjoy the high.

4 the ppl that like to some it to get high, I think that if it was legalized it could be produced and distributed like beer n wine is, n i guess tobacco. Like beer, wine n tobacco, there could be a lot of big and small companies all doin biz at the same time, like all the micro breweries and wine companies big n small. I think there would be enough biz to go around 4 every1, even u folks that are growing now for a profit. N if it was legal, u could still grow ur own for personal use n not be taxed like beer.

For ppl that need it for medicinal uses, if it was legal this aspect of it could continue n the the scientific research could proceed just like with any other medicine.

I hope i haven't offended any1. jmo


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## spiritlovescolorado (Feb 15, 2010)

Hey Piper,.. I say you should lay down the gonge for a day and see if you can get in to a "higher" education facillity, .. just for a hobby,.. I am not blind to where "Progress" has taken the world!,... No where fast in a freewheelin hand basket to hell! :hitchair: They say (mostly government people) say you can't controll it,.. so therefore it can not be legallized!:ignore: If you had read that article from the 30's all the way through,.... You would have seen that they could have held a monopoly on the market,.. We wouldn't have to "replace those jeans",... or that rope,.. any time soon,.. had we legallized it in manufacturing; and our system of "buy and replace" would be gone! There is an answer out there where we could all be happier,... The feds.. The States,.. our local governments,... Heck,.. in the end.. US! :holysheep: Alma Colorado has a church that opens each day at 4:20 and they pass out there "offerings" maybe you should make a visit and "get in line" If you don't need the smoke for med reasons!  SOME OF US DO,....DESPERATELY!!!! I may be speaking out of turn here, but I don't believe any of us HERE are growing it to make a hat!!  We know (most of us) about the "many uses" of cannabis,.. and thank-you for sharing the "little knowledge" you have about it here, .......I am offended,.. to a point! :**: You could call US idiots!????! When you my child,.. are IGNORANT!:doh: 
Clearly,......Crystal,...... think supply and demand

'Whatever you give a woman, she will make it greater. If you give her sperm, she'll give you a baby. If you give her a house, she'll give you a home. If you give her groceries, she'll give you a meal.. If you give her a smile, she'll give you her heart. She multiplies and enlarges what is given to her. So, if you give her any crap, be ready to receive a ton of *#@$.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 15, 2010)

spiritlovescolorado said:
			
		

> 'Whatever you give a woman, she will make it greater. If you give her sperm, she'll give you a baby. If you give her a house, she'll give you a home. If you give her groceries, she'll give you a meal.. If you give her a smile, she'll give you her heart. She multiplies and enlarges what is given to her. So, if you give her any crap, be ready to receive a ton of *#@$.



Did you Peg the "woman" on the spot..


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## spiritlovescolorado (Feb 15, 2010)

Hey I'm in my 40's if you peg this,.... It will run,....lol


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## Cowboy (Feb 15, 2010)

spiritlovescolorado said:
			
		

> Hey Piper,.. I say you should lay down the gonge for a day and see if you can get in to a "higher" education facillity, .. just for a hobby,.. I am not blind to where "Progress" has taken the world!,... No where fast in a freewheelin hand basket to hell! :hitchair: They say (mostly government people) say you can't controll it,.. so therefore it can not be legallized!:ignore: If you had read that article from the 30's all the way through,.... You would have seen that they could have held a monopoly on the market,.. We wouldn't have to "replace those jeans",... or that rope,.. any time soon,.. had we legallized it in manufacturing; and our system of "buy and replace" would be gone! There is an answer out there where we could all be happier,... The feds.. The States,.. our local governments,... Heck,.. in the end.. US! :holysheep: Alma Colorado has a church that opens each day at 4:20 and they pass out there "offerings" maybe you should make a visit and "get in line" If you don't need the smoke for med reasons!  SOME OF US DO,....DESPERATELY!!!! I may be speaking out of turn here, but I don't believe any of us HERE are growing it to make a hat!!  We know (most of us) about the "many uses" of cannabis,.. and thank-you for sharing the "little knowledge" you have about it here, .......I am offended,.. to a point! :**: You could call US idiots!????! When you my child,.. are IGNORANT!:doh:
> Clearly,......Crystal,...... think supply and demand
> 
> 'Whatever you give a woman, she will make it greater. If you give her sperm, she'll give you a baby. If you give her a house, she'll give you a home. If you give her groceries, she'll give you a meal.. If you give her a smile, she'll give you her heart. She multiplies and enlarges what is given to her. So, if you give her any crap, be ready to receive a ton of *#@$.


No truer words ever spoken.
"if you give her any crap, be ready to receive a ton of *#@$".
 I doubt that he can even straight.


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