# Yet ANOTHER thing to hold your breath for...



## The Effen Gee (Feb 23, 2009)

*Legalize It: Ammiano to Introduce Legislation Monday to Allow Pot -- and Tax It*

                 By Joe Eskenazi,
                 Sunday, Feb. 22 2009 @  5:00PM

​ The story _SF Weekly_ broke on Fridayhttp://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2009/02/sf_sheriff_decriminalize_marij.php is true: Assemblyman Tom Ammiano will announce legislation on Monday to legalize marijuana and earn perhaps $1 billion annually by taxing it. 

Quintin Mecke, Ammiano's press secretary, confirmed to _SF Weekly_ that the assemblyman's 10 a.m. Monday press conference regarding "new legislation related to the state's fiscal crisis" will broach the subject of reaping untold -- and much-needed -- wealth from the state's No. 1 cash crop. 

Mecke said Ammiano's proposed bill "would remove all penalties in California law on cultivation, transportation, sale, purchase, possession, or use of marijuana, natural THC, or paraphernalia for persons over the age of 21." 

The bill would additionally prohibit state and local law officials from enforcing federal marijuana laws. As for Step Two -- profit -- Ammiano's bill calls for "establishing a fee on the sale of marijuana at a rate of $50 per ounce." Mecke said that would bring in roughly $1 billion for the state, according to estimates made by marijuana advocacy organizations.

hxxp://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2009/02/legalize_it_ammiano_to_introdu.php#


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## tcbud (Feb 23, 2009)

Legalize and tax, Prohibition would be over!
But....
isn't there some federal law that says states may not make laws contrary to federal law?
The Medical MJ inititive I think circumvents that, as it was an inititive and MJ is only used for medical cases.  I am not a lawyer but I think this is why the feds dont hammer the medical MJ states more than they do.
Will be real interesting if the State Legislators actually pass a bill that legalizes use and sale of MJ.  The DEA would be going bananas, but my local Sherrif would prolly give a huge sigh of relief, and the local Supervisors would be having caniption fits.
As usual, California leads the nation.
Thank goodness we all have experience holding our breath!
Thanks for the info Effen.


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## xxdjbud420xx (Feb 23, 2009)

> establishing a fee on the sale of marijuana at a rate of $50 per ounce."


  Thats cheaper than the sales tax would be where I live for what I pay for an O.  Roughly 5%.


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## umbra (Feb 23, 2009)

tcbud said:
			
		

> Legalize and tax, Prohibition would be over!
> But....
> isn't there some federal law that says states may not make laws contrary to federal law?
> The Medical MJ inititive I think circumvents that, as it was an inititive and MJ is only used for medical cases.  I am not a lawyer but I think this is why the feds dont hammer the medical MJ states more than they do.
> ...



Yes. They can not tax it if feds don't approve of it. But once the door is open, its hard to shut when everyone wants to know how we're going to pay for stimulus and all the others expenses and what to do to stimulate the economy and create jobs. When there is an obvious solution, I don't think there's going to be to many alternatives that accomplish so much. Just my 2 cents.:ignore:


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## yumyumbubblegum (Feb 23, 2009)

*Here is a update from the site:  *


				Monday, Feb. 23 2009 @ 11:21AM

 				 					 Tom Ammiano's press conference this morning announcing his marijuana-legalization bill started punctually and stayed relentlessly on-point -- thereby denying a barb to every journalist present.
  Ammiano and the assembled speakers at San Francisco's State Building also spoke calmly and methodically, at one point being drowned out by a floor-waxer. The famously funny lawmaker reined himself in, presenting "The Marijuana Control, regulation and education act (AB 390)" as a simple matter of fiscal common sense. If you believe Ammiano and his straitlaced panel, it is. 

  In a nutshell, here's what the bill would do: "Remove all penalties under California law for the cultivation, transportation, sale, purchase, possession, and use of marijuana, natural THC and paraphernalia by persons over the age of 21," "prohibit local and state law enforcement officials from enforcing federal marijuana laws (more on that later)" and establish a fee of $50 an ounce on marijuana on top of whatever pot will cost in a legal future - which legalization advocates say is about half what it costs now. This tax rate figures at about a buck a joint.

Ammiano addresses the crowd

  Betty Yee, the chairwoman of the Board of Equalization, called Ammiano's proposal "a responsible measure on how to work out the regulatory framework of the legalization of marijuana." Her board's research indicated $1.3 billion in tax dollars could immediately head into the state's coffers from the fee on marijuana and the sales tax on medical pot. She figured the halving of marijuana's street price would cause a consumption increase of 40 percent, but the $50 per ounce levy would cut use by 11 percent. 

  Steve Gutwillig, the state director of Drug Policy Alliance, noted that regulatory measures like Ammiano's bill can work: Teen smoking is way down, and he claims juveniles report it is easier to obtain marijuana than purchase smokes. "Marijuana arrests actually increased 18 percent in California in 2007 while all other arrests for controlled substances fell," said Gutwillig. "This costs the state a billion dollars a year and taxpayers are footing the bill. Meanwhile, black marketers are laughing all the way to the bank." 

*But the morning's most forceful speaker was Judge James P. Gray, who retired from his 25-year post on the Orange County Superior Court six weeks ago. With his gray suit, tasseled loafers, and conservative salt-and-pepper haircut, he looked like central casting's offering for "Republican candidate for higher office." Not surprisingly, Gray did run as a Republican for Congress against Bob Dornan and Loretta Sanchez and Senate vs. Bill Jones and Barbara Boxer. He now says he's "not a politician - and I have the votes to prove it." 

 "I served 25 years on the bench and I've seen the results of this attempted prohibition. It doesn't make marijuana less available, but it does clog the court system," said the judge. 
  					 					 					 						"The stronger we get on marijuana, the softer we get with regard to all other prosecutions because we have only so many resources. And we at this moment, have thousands of people in state prison right this minute who did nothing but smoke marijuana." 

 Gray noted that anyone who tokes up while out on parole can immediately be sent right back to prison, at great cost to the taxpayers. 
  "You and I as adults can go home tonight and drink 10 martinis. It's not a healthy thing to do but it's not illegal. Someone who smokes marijuana and goes to bed risks jail," continued the judge. "I don't smoke marijuana and if you legalized it today and gave it away at every street corner I'm still not going to. But the most harmful thing about marijuana today is prison - and also the most expensive. I take President Obama at his word - he said let's look at what's working and what is not, and jettison those programs that are not working." *

  Obama also wrote in his autobiography that he did "a little blow" and Ammiano is hopeful the new president will look upon this issue differently than his predecessor (it warrants mentioning that those fighting against torture and rendition also hoped that - and were disappointed). 

Judge James Gray notes that quaffing 10 martinis is perfectly legal

  Ammiano told _SF Weekly_ that he doesn't expect his bill to pass "overnight," but doesn't see it as merely a "placeholder." As far as superseding federal law, he pointed to a similar bill recently introduced in Congress by Rep. Barney Frank; hopefully the law of the land will change. If not, Ammano hoped to exploit "fuzziness" regarding state and federal laws and the low priority this state has given to busting marijuana users entitled by Proposition 215.

 He predicted that, in these dire economic times, "support will fall all over" for his bill. 
  Perhaps, perhaps not. But this much is certain: If Ammiano pulls this off, there's a place for him reserved on the Mount Rushmore of Pot Gods, right between Cheech, Chong, and Bob Marley.


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## slowmo77 (Feb 23, 2009)

i don't see this passin right away but atleast someone is trying something new. the same old stuff isn't gonna work forever. thanks for the info guys, good read


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## cubby (Feb 23, 2009)

The only way I can immagine mj becoming legalized would be simmilar to the end of alchohol prohibition. It may find a way to be legal for commercial production but not for personal growth.
If it was legal for personal grows the chances of an actual tax revenue for the gov. would be nill.
The average persons grow would still be illegal based on phony cocerns such as "Thc content",and other rediculous regulatory concerns.
The "chicken littles" of drug control will defeat any chance of legalizatiion by crying "think of the children" and "gateway drugs"
Not happy to burst your bubble but this never gonna happen !


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## yumyumbubblegum (Feb 23, 2009)

cubby said:
			
		

> The only way I can immagine mj becoming legalized would be simmilar to the end of alchohol prohibition. It may find a way to be legal for commercial production but not for personal growth.
> If it was legal for personal grows the chances of an actual tax revenue for the gov. would be nill.
> The average persons grow would still be illegal based on phony cocerns such as "Thc content",and other rediculous regulatory concerns.
> The "chicken littles" of drug control will defeat any chance of legalizatiion by crying "think of the children" and "gateway drugs"
> Not happy to burst your bubble but this never gonna happen !



*Yes, you may be right BUT, no one said this was going to be a easy fight, all we are looking for is more exposure and always keeping MJ in the forefront. By politicians standing up to "chicken littles" and pointing out all the advantages of this "cash crop" they will have to make a decision either way, be it good or bad...
No bubble burst here, I am just happy that the snowball is getting a little bigger - besides, all  the "chicken littles" are starting to shrivel up and die and pretty soon we will have alot of our "chicken strips" in office - it is already happening...*


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## noneedforalarm (Feb 23, 2009)

yumyumbubblegum said:
			
		

> *Yes, you may be right BUT, no one said this was going to be a easy fight, all we are looking for is more exposure and always keeping MJ in the forefront. By politicians standing up to "chicken littles" and pointing out all the advantages of this "cash crop" they will have to make a decision either way, be it good or bad...
> No bubble burst here, I am just happy that the snowball is getting a little bigger - besides, all  the "chicken littles" are starting to shrivel up and die and pretty soon we will have alot of our "chicken strips" in office - it is already happening...*


this is exactly right.soon people with sense will be in office and not the slave driving god fearing people of today.thanks for the informative post effen and bubble.


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## cubby (Feb 23, 2009)

yumyumbubblegum said:
			
		

> *Yes, you may be right BUT, no one said this was going to be a easy fight, all we are looking for is more exposure and always keeping MJ in the forefront. By politicians standing up to "chicken littles" and pointing out all the advantages of this "cash crop" they will have to make a decision either way, be it good or bad...*
> *No bubble burst here, I am just happy that the snowball is getting a little bigger - besides, all the "chicken littles" are starting to shrivel up and die and pretty soon we will have alot of our "chicken strips" in **office - it is already happening...*


LOL Chicken strips!!
An additional point that should be made in a state the size of california is the cost of maintaing a prison population that's growing exponentionally.
Even if the correction establishment is farmed out to private prisons the cost of incarcerating nonviolent MJ offenders just borders on the bizzar.:hairpull:


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## Wiseguy_Chef (Feb 23, 2009)

well its moving full steam ahead!!!!!!! its about time. pot ant bad, i stopped drinking my self an moved full time to being a smoker again. going back to basics lol.


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## 420benny (Feb 23, 2009)

Pot is bad, but if it makes us some money, it's okay with us. ***! What hyp ocrites the politicians are about this. If it saves our A$$, then we change our mind about it.


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## Lemmongrass (Feb 23, 2009)

This wont work. Never.

how much of the cost of pot now is due to the fact that its illegal? if it is less than 50$/oz then we will all just be guilty of tax fraud because the natural market wont accept that kinda price. there will still be a black market, but it will shift to the white man's white collar market of dirty cpa's and so will the profits.

In my state almost 75% of the price of a pack of smoke is cause of taxes. they is something like 2oz of tobacco in a pack of smokes. that means that an equivalent 2oz pack of Mojo would cost around $250 assuming that it held to the rate of taxation as tobacco products. this means there is only $150 to go to transport, the store, and the grower for 2oz.

thats alotta bad math but its similar to what would happen.

i just think 50/oz is way too much to work. maybe 20 bones for <15% $40 for >15%

ill wait for a bill that has a section ok'ing personal growth.


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## Shockeclipse (Feb 23, 2009)

People can grow tabbacco as far as I know, and brew their own brew so to speak but the majority of the people in this country have a "now" perspective.  Look at fast food, and all of the other things that people get because it is faster.  I think thatm yeah a few people here or there will try to grow it but give up in the end do to not wanting to wait and possibly the availability of top notch green.


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## Lemmongrass (Feb 23, 2009)

You can but i dont think you can distill your own >40%. or something. i really cant remember. maybe you cant sell it cause of tax/distribution/production regulations or similar. maybe you'll be able to grow pot if its under 2000 lumen's/ftsq to lower thc%. who knows. the alcohol industry is 60% beurocracy and 30% taxation.


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## fellafrompocatella (Feb 23, 2009)

lotek said:
			
		

> You can but i dont think you can distill your own >40%. or something. i really cant remember. maybe you cant sell it cause of tax/distribution/production regulations or similar. maybe you'll be able to grow pot if its under 2000 lumen's/ftsq to lower thc%. who knows. the alcohol industry is 60% beurocracy and 30% taxation.


 
Correct. Distilling liquor is still illegal,(once again i believe its to protect us from ourselves, because if done incorrectly it can really f u up) but its like anything else; the internet and a little wilpower can go along way. Moonshine baby! I swear on my mothers life, i don't care what state it was, but if it legalized mj i'd move there within a week, except for North or South Dakota, blah. I wonder what kind of sport would come from trafficking MJ, like NASCAR from bootlegging.


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## Shockeclipse (Feb 23, 2009)

lotek said:
			
		

> You can but i dont think you can distill your own >40%. or something. i really cant remember. maybe you cant sell it cause of tax/distribution/production regulations or similar. maybe you'll be able to grow pot if its under 2000 lumen's/ftsq to lower thc%. who knows. the alcohol industry is 60% beurocracy and 30% taxation.


 
But even so, how would they enforce that?  One of the reasons that people want to legalize it in the first place is to take those resources that we are wasting and put them to better use.  They would have to a) find out IF you are growing b) take the time and waste the resources to come and spend more money and time testing your crop?  It just doesn't seem that it would work.  And as for the alcohol thanks for clearing it up, but we can maybe take the fact that high alcohol content is dangerous to your health and THC is not?


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## LowRider (Feb 23, 2009)

glad to here.  i can see this as a very good thing, especially for those who don't want to grow there own (me).  Wounder what the prices would come down to if this did pass.  man i could imagine all the GREAT WEED that will be floating around.  you know they would have to pass laws on a much bigger bases around Cali and it would have to expand.  other states would be getting over run with flow of bud.  which can be a down side to this cause they would play that to the masses but we all know its caused by it being illegal.


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## cubby (Feb 23, 2009)

fellafrompocatella said:
			
		

> Correct. Distilling liquor is still illegal,(once again i believe its to protect us from ourselves, because if done incorrectly it can really f u up) but its like anything else; the internet and a little wilpower can go along way. Moonshine baby! I swear on my mothers life, i don't care what state it was, but if it legalized mj i'd move there within a week, except for North or South Dakota, blah. I wonder what kind of sport would come from trafficking MJ, like NASCAR from bootlegging.


The sport already exists....competative eating lol...turbo munchies!


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## 420benny (Feb 23, 2009)

I got the turbo munchies now. 2 cookies down, what's next???


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## homegrown998 (Feb 24, 2009)

how can i help get the bill passed?


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## nvthis (Feb 24, 2009)

I wonder.. If something like this were to pass (And I am doubtful, at best, but willing to endure all the "I told you so!'s" that y'all can dish:ignore: ) how would that effect the industrial hemp market? Positively, right? I mean, these are law makers we are dealing with, I just couldn't see them being so obvious in their contradiction with themselves over it. In fact, I think this will turn out to be the downfall of legalization period. How could they make the medicinal/recreational marijuana laws different from the industrial hemp laws without showing the governments 'well payed for' hand in a backwards attempt to quell an industrial market and, in doing so, state publically that smoking weed is great but buying your kids harmless hemp products is bad?  Nope. I see a myriad of impossible-to-overcome hang ups and red tape that will block any legalization anytime soon. They _must_ address both issues (medicinal/recreational and industrial) simultainiously in order for it to come to pass. They won't. Yes, I hope I am wrong. But I am not. Hemp has the potential to meet and overtake the dank bud market, straight up.
By the way, to the people that think legalization will make weed cheaper, that last statement was your answer. It won't. There are only so many folk that can, or want, to grow. Most people grow big weed gardens as an enterprize. If the hemp market is legalized then people will go where the money is. And I mean "Less work/more money" money. There will be markets for both but there won 't be as many dank farmers as you think. You won't want to be smoking what it is they be growin'  . 
Could you even imagine what that would do to the dank market? Won't even go into the stories of "terminator seeds" or "extreme high-ratio male genetics" but just all that free floating pollen from _HUGE_ industrial grows. It would send the dank market back to the stone age. Not even the most secure indoor grow would be completely out of harms way. But when you can find the good sensimellia you're gonna pay. Dearly. Things like this can make a guy wonder if decriminalization isn't the way to go. Lots to think about. Lots.


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## Hick (Feb 24, 2009)

..._*"Alcohol, tobacco, and firearms"*_...sounds like a _partaaaaae_... anyone bring the chips 'n cards? :rofl:


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## PencilHead (Feb 24, 2009)

THEY, whoever THEY is, say that if we opened the doors to our jails and prisons and turned everyone loose who had a marijuana conviction, plus all those who's fruit came from that tree (example: young guy worked for me was on probation for not-pot charges. He got trespassed for having too much fun, had to pee for his probie and subsequently did like 3mos) we would reduce prison roles by at least 1/3. That right there sounds like an economic recovery plan to little old me. Thanks for starting this post--very interesting.


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## yumyumbubblegum (Feb 24, 2009)

*Very well put nv* :hubba:

*EDIT:

Along with having all the hurdles to overcome, we would also have to deal with all the people out there that would flat out take advantage of it (you know there would be) and basically LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE run it into the ground. So, it kinda does make you think would it be worth it? :confused2:  of course it is easy for me to live in the most liberal state and ponder (of course high) cuz that is what I do best.

On another note, my local news was talking about this bill last night...*





			
				nvthis said:
			
		

> I wonder.. If something like this were to pass (And I am doubtful, at best, but willing to endure all the "I told you so!'s" that y'all can dish:ignore: ) how would that effect the industrial hemp market? Positively, right? I mean, these are law makers we are dealing with, I just couldn't see them being so obvious in their contradiction with themselves over it. In fact, I think this will turn out to be the downfall of legalization period. How could they make the medicinal/recreational marijuana laws different from the industrial hemp laws without showing the governments 'well payed for' hand in a backwards attempt to quell an industrial market and, in doing so, state publically that smoking weed is great but buying your kids harmless hemp products is bad?  Nope. I see a myriad of impossible-to-overcome hang ups and red tape that will block any legalization anytime soon. They _must_ address both issues (medicinal/recreational and industrial) simultainiously in order for it to come to pass. They won't. Yes, I hope I am wrong. But I am not. Hemp has the potential to meet and overtake the dank bud market, straight up.
> By the way, to the people that think legalization will make weed cheaper, that last statement was your answer. It won't. There are only so many folk that can, or want, to grow. Most people grow big weed gardens as an enterprize. If the hemp market is legalized then people will go where the money is. And I mean "Less work/more money" money. There will be markets for both but there won 't be as many dank farmers as you think. You won't want to be smoking what it is they be growin'  .
> Could you even imagine what that would do to the dank market? Won't even go into the stories of "terminator seeds" or "extreme high-ratio male genetics" but just all that free floating pollen from _HUGE_ industrial grows. It would send the dank market back to the stone age. Not even the most secure indoor grow would be completely out of harms way. But when you can find the good sensimellia you're gonna pay. Dearly. Things like this can make a guy wonder if decriminalization isn't the way to go. Lots to think about. Lots.




:yeahthat::yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat:


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## greenfriend (Feb 24, 2009)

well if drug mj will be legalized then industrial hemp will be too, as it should have been all along.  hemp is cheaper to grow than cotton, makes thousands of materials and products and would generate more revenue than the taxation of med mj.  not even the suits on capitol hill can ignore TWO products able to produce billions of dollars to stick in their pockets.


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## yumyumbubblegum (Feb 24, 2009)

greenfriend said:
			
		

> not even the suits on capitol hill can ignore TWO products able to produce billions of dollars to stick in their pockets.



*The shame is that they do...*:confused2: *all while having a glass of wine or scotch and smoking a cigar*


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## JBonez (Feb 24, 2009)

i will move to cali if this happens, its funny, but everyone who looks down on it will suddenly have nothing to say if its legal, like family and friends.


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## nvthis (Feb 24, 2009)

greenfriend said:
			
		

> well if drug mj will be legalized then industrial hemp will be too, as it should have been all along. hemp is cheaper to grow than cotton, makes thousands of materials and products and would generate more revenue than the taxation of med mj. not even the suits on capitol hill can ignore TWO products able to produce billions of dollars to stick in their pockets.


 
Exactly the point Green. Unfortunately it may prove far more difficult to legallize industrial hemp than it would be to legalize dank. Weve have two distinct classes of enemies here. It's not anti-drug fanatics. They are negligible for the most part. It is pharmacuetical companies and everyone else (textile/tobacco/oil etc.) Companies that _fund_ anti-drug fanatics and their policies with endless amounts of money. We seem to be making quite a bit of headway with the pharmacuetical side, but what of the industrial side? Like I said, they need to be addressed simultainiously for anything to really happen. It's not. Not really. They seem to be dividing into two separate entities. Same plant! I could be wrong but when was the last time the news covered a well organized petition of noticable size and effort to legalize industrial hemp? Been a while? HR 1009 in '07? How many current USA hemp farms? The movement is alive, it just isn't getting the same play. They're not being addressed together. The major movement right now is medical. To me that is like driving around in a car with no back wheels on it. We can't possibly expect that our govt. is going to agree to such a blatant double standard. It will happen, some day. It just has to. I just don't think the time is ours.. Yet.. And timing will be everything. 
These are my opinions (and, probably, mine alone ) I just don't believe the USA is going to come out and say "We were wrong, you were right, so do whatever you want, we don't care, pay taxes". But then I have been wrong before....
It is amazing what can be 'overlooked' when the need for money is bad. That _will_ change things, but how quickly? 
Check out the President, man. Things _are_ changing. The first black President ever and he ran against a _woman. _I amtotally cool with this. And I have a medical for marijuana! Never thought I would see this day in my lifetime. Guess anything is possible now. Question everyone wants to know is, how long's it gonna take? Don't mean to be down on anyones spirit. Truth is for the marijuana cause the financial depression we are in is the best thing that could happen. If that was a plan in the beginning, to get mmj a foot hold before the markets went belly up, it was pure genius.
I am home today with no work. Bored. Sorry for the mindless ranting. Just ignore it


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## JBonez (Feb 24, 2009)

if it does happen, i will be throwing an official mp party, and all those in cali are invited!


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## NorCalHal (Feb 24, 2009)

Wow. I bail to Reno for a couple of days and look what happens. I heard about this on the news in Nevada, but I havn't really read much about it, yet.
 I just printed out the actual Text of the legislation, and it is 41 pages long.
My Lawyer is going to come by today, he's out of smoke, so I am going to run this by him, but I know he is aware, as we talked briefly over the phone.

From the BRIEF cnversation we had, he stated that anyone over the age of 21 can operate as a "Marijuana wholesaler" subject to an starting fee of $5000 and annual renewal of $2500. Retailers will be charged $50 an ounce tax. This is for Retail sales. I read some posts in this thread stating that herb will be sold for $50 an ounce, that is NOT the case. the TAX is $50

As I said, believe I am going to read up on it and get some educated opionions, but this is a huge bill. Something of the likes noone in our lifetime has ever seen.
All the naysayers, stay the hell out of my state when this passes. JK. Watch, folks will flock again out to the west in a new gold rush.

Do I think this will pass? Not sure at all, as I don't know enough yet, but gut instinct tells me hell ya. Cali is hurt for $$.

One thing y'all have to understand, is it ALLREADY is a huge pretty much OPEN market out here, but disguised as "Medical Marijuana". The state sees this, and they see they have barely tapped the keg open to a flood of sales tax revenue. I have allways said that MMJ is a stepping stone to full legalization. They see that they are str8 missing out, and, more importantly, that people are going to do it regardless. 
I'm here to tell you, anyone over the age of 18 can get a MMJ rec in Cali. Plain and simple. Cops know it, judges know it, and so do all the politicians, as well as each one of you.

Well, I am eager to read into this and see what is up. I think that the politicians in my state are at witts end, and this has a good chance of passing. Cmon meow, this is Cali, we pass all kinds of crazy laws and cater to freaks. 
Sad thing is, my local State Assemblyman is leading the effort to defeat this bill. Clown. POTUS, you will be happy to know I sent him a letter, just before I logged onto MP.


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## nvthis (Feb 24, 2009)

$5000 to start, $50 per oz. Boy, they _really_ want their cut!  Sounds like a barn buster. Are there any sales limits in product amount NCH?


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## JBonez (Feb 24, 2009)

wow, i would take outdoor gardening to a whole new level, just have to be in a rural area where i would hope no male pollen could find its way, he he.


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## homebrew420 (Feb 24, 2009)

I would have posted the hyperlink but I haven't posted enough for the site to allow me.  Copy and paste.  

blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2009/02/get_up_stand_up_ammiano_introd.php


Let us all hope!!!


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## cubby (Feb 24, 2009)

nvthis said:
			
		

> Exactly the point Green. Unfortunately it may prove far more difficult to legallize industrial hemp than it would be to legalize dank. Weve have two distinct classes of enemies here. It's not anti-drug fanatics. They are negligible for the most part. It is pharmacuetical companies and everyone else (textile/tobacco/oil etc.) Companies that _fund_ anti-drug fanatics and their policies with endless amounts of money. We seem to be making quite a bit of headway with the pharmacuetical side, but what of the industrial side? Like I said, they need to be addressed simultainiously for anything to really happen. It's not. Not really. They seem to be dividing into two separate entities. Same plant! I could be wrong but when was the last time the news covered a well organized petition of noticable size and effort to legalize industrial hemp? Been a while? HR 1009 in '07? How many current USA hemp farms? The movement is alive, it just isn't getting the same play. They're not being addressed together. The major movement right now is medical. To me that is like driving around in a car with no back wheels on it. We can't possibly expect that our govt. is going to agree to such a blatant double standard. It will happen, some day. It just has to. I just don't think the time is ours.. Yet.. And timing will be everything.
> These are my opinions (and, probably, mine alone ) I just don't believe the USA is going to come out and say "We were wrong, you were right, so do whatever you want, we don't care, pay taxes". But then I have been wrong before....
> It is amazing what can be 'overlooked' when the need for money is bad. That _will_ change things, but how quickly?
> Check out the President, man. Things _are_ changing. The first black President ever and he ran against a _woman. _I amtotally cool with this. And I have a medical for marijuana! Never thought I would see this day in my lifetime. Guess anything is possible now. Question everyone wants to know is, how long's it gonna take? Don't mean to be down on anyones spirit. Truth is for the marijuana cause the financial depression we are in is the best thing that could happen. If that was a plan in the beginning, to get mmj a foot hold before the markets went belly up, it was pure genius.
> I am home today with no work. Bored. Sorry for the mindless ranting. Just ignore it


 
The reason, as far as I can see ( I admit, I'm a bit jaded ) that industrial hemp dose'nt get much news coverage is it's just not "sexy" enough.
T.V. news can play shock factor to Mid-America by showing a 20 something slacker with dreds and a dead T-shirt but if the visual is a mid-fifties farmer losing his land because of crop prices in balance with taxes and regulations the subject becomes much more sympathetic.
The corporations that own the airwaves also own the pharmasuticles, textiles, petro-chemical corporations and the timber industries.
It's going to require an outcry from small-town,conservative America to shake the shackles of prohibition.
I believe it will happen, but I also believe America will have to sink to a economic depression unlike anything ever concieved by modern man.


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## homegrown998 (Feb 24, 2009)

I hope it passes, the first time i heard of this i almost cried lol.. I didnt think it would happen in my lifetime. I sighn every petition and write letters to the white house and my state, other peaples states i hope they open this up to the whole country and let everyone vote on it.


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## LowRider (Feb 24, 2009)

yumyumbubblegum said:
			
		

> *The shame is that they do...*:confused2: *all while having a glass of wine or scotch and smoking a cigar*


 
Actually they would but there would be a major back lash.  Tobacco and Alcohol have been around longer or just as long.  so we don't see it as bad, at least not the way some uninformed people in society see marijuana as bad.


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## yumyumbubblegum (Feb 24, 2009)

LowRider said:
			
		

> Tobacco and Alcohol have been around longer or just as long.



*I read in HT or WCC that they found something like 500 grams (some huge amount, I forget the exact #) in a grave/tomb (whatever the called it) in China that was supposedly 5000 years old and they where saying that is was cured for "psychoactive purposes" 

I think MJ has been around for much, much longer (for alchohol) IMO*


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## NorCalHal (Feb 25, 2009)

nvthis said:
			
		

> $5000 to start, $50 per oz. Boy, they _really_ want their cut! Sounds like a barn buster. Are there any sales limits in product amount NCH?


 
All in all, sounds fair to me. 
There are no limits for a wholesale grower, or a Retail outlet owner. As far as I have read so far.
There are many restrictions on who can get a "license". Big background checks, with no prior's is one. Your facility has to be secured, the bigger the Op, the more security.

There are many little things in this bill, but all in all, it is really a good deal for folks.  More to come.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 25, 2009)

*California *

*Lawmaker: Legalize Pot To Generate Tax Income*


February 23, 2009
Associated Press 

SAN FRANCISCO -- A state legislator is reviving the debate about legalizing marijuana as a way of raising money for cash-strapped state and local governments.Assemblyman Tom Ammiano, D-San Francisco, introduced a bill Monday that if approved by the California Legislature would put pot on the same legal footing as alcohol. Adults over the age of 21 would be allowed to buy it, and driving under the influence of marijuana would be prohibited.
Under Ammiano's proposal, which has been endorsed by some law enforcement officials, pot would be taxed at a rate of $50 per ounce and bring an estimated $1 billion into state coffers.
In 1996, California became the first state to legalize medical marijuana.
"It is simply nonsensical that California's largest agricultural industry is completely unregulated and untaxed," Marijuana Policy Project California policy director Aaron Smith said in a prepared statement. "With our state in an ongoing fiscal crisis -- and no one believes the new budget is the end of California's financial woes -- it's time to bring this major piece of our economy into the light of day."
Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger last week signed bills intended to close the state's $42 billion budget shortfall for the next year-and-a-half. The plan includes $15 billion in spending cuts, $12.8 billion in temporary tax increases and $11 billion in borrowing.



We r heading in the Right Way.. Yahoooo let this pass so we ALL can Be HAPPY.


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## NorCalHal (Feb 25, 2009)

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38448


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## homebrew420 (Feb 25, 2009)

Both funny and ironic is that my family and i just moved to Colorado from Cali.  Oh well it's all for the cause, and 1 out of 50 is a start.  Probably take two or three times before it will pass, or until people realize how bad the financial situation is there in Cali.


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 25, 2009)

lotek said:
			
		

> i just think 50/oz is way too much to work. maybe 20 bones for <15% $40 for >15%.


 
50 Bucks or not I'll pay that for the chronic for a Qz..  I can't wait to see this..


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## kubefuism (Feb 25, 2009)

hxxp://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2009/02/24/wian.pot.tax.cnn

California boldly takes first steps to correct prohibition...

Thank you Cali-
Best of wishes


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## Dillan (Feb 25, 2009)

I hope it passes because if it passes in one state i'm sure others will follow .


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## PencilHead (Feb 26, 2009)

*Marijuana Policy Project California policy director Aaron Smith*

How do I apply for a job like this? I could really get self-motivated, show up on time, smile a lot.


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## city (Feb 26, 2009)

Cool cool. The Gov already has large scale MJ farms back east. Seen pics of it. Large electrical fences,camera's everywhere. So you can only guess where the initial taxxed crops are going to be comming from. 
Hell even the BLM grows Gov. Seeds in the mountains just to see how well they do..
I can only imagine if cali starts growing in large commercial operations. All the large electric fences.
Also seeing Hemp farms starting up,getting large contracts from major bussiness like the corn industry did then loose all there contracts cause the federal gov inforces its federal laws. Ruining thousands of lives bringing a complete economic downfal to the state of cali amd bringing on its seperation from the Union it would be more like our 51st state.. willing to be associated to the union but won't follow federeal laws.


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## The Effen Gee (Feb 26, 2009)

Things are going to go nuts if this passes.

Like...a Thunderdome for growers to see who makes it and who does not..

"500 growers enter, three leave"

I hope I get so good at it I can just get bought out for a decent sum (like the tobacco companies did) and sit pretty or just grow for a distributor.

Other than my fallback plan, we are looking at parcels of prime farming (hillside) land in northern california.

"Number one, all ahead full"

"aye-aye sir"


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## Shockeclipse (Feb 26, 2009)

yumyumbubblegum said:
			
		

> *I read in HT or WCC that they found something like 500 grams (some huge amount, I forget the exact #) in a grave/tomb (whatever the called it) in China that was supposedly 5000 years old and they where saying that is was cured for "psychoactive purposes"
> 
> I think MJ has been around for much, much longer (for alchohol) IMO*


I was reading the HT Stoners Handbook last night and i believe it said the earliest known use was 6000 BC


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## Flyinghigh (Feb 27, 2009)

If they made this MJ legal to smoke and buy from a Alcohol store then I was wondering How would the law find out if u just smoked a hour ago or 5 hour ago.   What I mean is that the THC is stays in ur system for a month or so and I can say I have a HIGH tolerance of THC in my system and if I test it will always show dirty.. Not worried about it.
This is going to be ineresting when they (IF) it pass.


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## Shockeclipse (Feb 27, 2009)

They have saliva tests they can give if your stopped while driving and suspected of being under the influence, i am assuming that THC only remains in your saliva for a short period of time?


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## IRISH (Feb 27, 2009)

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> All in all, sounds fair to me.
> There are no limits for a wholesale grower, or a Retail outlet owner. As far as I have read so far.
> There are many restrictions on who can get a "license". Big background checks, with no prior's is one. Your facility has to be secured, the bigger the Op, the more security.
> 
> There are many little things in this bill, but all in all, it is really a good deal for folks. More to come.


 

>>> sounds as if they've done thier homework, and are now saying, lets' put it to a vote.

(>>>can i see a show of hands'?<<<) :clap: :cool2: :welcome: :ciao: :aok: :yay:.


when you say no priors' , what exactly does this mean??? (posession, distributing, sales, delivery, convictions???)...bb...


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## Flyinghigh (Mar 1, 2009)

Shockeclipse said:
			
		

> They have saliva tests they can give if your stopped while driving and suspected of being under the influence, i am assuming that THC only remains in your saliva for a short period of time?


 
Well I don't know about the saliva test but I can sure u that thc stay with u for 1 or 2 or more months and that depends on how much Body fat ones has, and if the THC is out of ur saliva in a hour or so then we all must treat smoking like drinking when driving and I am REAL BAD about smoking and then driving and that because I HATE TO WAIT. :giggle: 
Knock on wood I never had a problem smokin weed, Like I did with Alcohol.


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## NorCalHal (Mar 1, 2009)

banjobuzz said:
			
		

> >>> sounds as if they've done thier homework, and are now saying, lets' put it to a vote.
> 
> (>>>can i see a show of hands'?<<<) :clap: :cool2: :welcome: :ciao: :aok: :yay:.
> 
> ...


 

Basically, anything that isn't MJ related.


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## Flyinghigh (Mar 1, 2009)

Shockeclipse said:
			
		

> They have saliva tests they can give if your stopped while driving and suspected of being under the influence, i am assuming that THC only remains in your saliva for a short period of time?


 
Here a web sight about saliva testing for MJ.
A hour up to 24 to detect MJ on ur saliva and that Puts us all in Jail.!
So if u smoke the night before and work the next morning and the job did a saliva test right then,  then that sounds like a person will get fired right on the spot. What a chance a person has to take to get relaxed.
Alcohol is better except for the hang overs, liver problems,ect and u will still keep ur job because it LEGAL...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_test#Saliva_drug_screen_.2F_Oral_fluid-based_drug_screenhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_test#Hair_alcohol_testing
*[edit] Saliva drug screen / Oral fluid-based drug screen*

Saliva / oral fluid-based drug tests can generally detect use during the previous few days. Saliva or oral fluid based drug tests are becoming more prevalent because of their convenience and the fact that they are very difficult to adulterate. Furthermore, on-site oral based tests in particular enable the implementation of random testing programs, proven to be the most effective type of drug screening. Oral fluid based tests are as accurate as urine and can be obtained from suppliers in the United States. Testing is usually performed by employers, for either pre-employment, random, post-accident, reasonable suspicion, or return-to-duty testing. Oral fluid based testing most closely mimics results found with blood and is preferable for detecting on-the-job drug use or in post-accident applications in this case because the degree of intoxication can be approximated based on the amount of substance.
Detection in saliva tests begins immediately upon use: this is wrong

Marijuana and hashish (THC): an hour after ingestion up to 24 hours.
Cocaine (including crack): From time of ingestion up to 2 to 3 days
Opiates: From time of ingestion up to 2 to 3 days
Methamphetamine ("Tweak," "crank," "ice") and ecstasy (MDMA, "Molly") : From time of ingestion up to 2 to 3 days.
Benzodiazepines: From time of ingestion up to 2 to 3 days
Amphetamines
Phencyclidine (PCP)


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## LowRider (Mar 1, 2009)

Well if this passes, i'm going to Amsterdam i mean Cali, a trip out there would be less expensive.


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## schoolboy420 (Mar 1, 2009)

holy sheeps, for 21 year olds though. oh well, i think it should be 18 but who cares, i still find ways to get alcohol when i need it lol. and you know once it legalizes in cali, dea raids are gonna go crazy there, but then Obama will stop the raids, and then legalization is gonna start jumping state to state.

POTUS!!!! the letters might not be as necessary, im still sending it either way, bc all of america should be legal not just cali.


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