# Acetone



## leafminer

Gonna make some hash oil later today; I'll use acetone as the solvent. Isopropyl alcohol is too slow to evaporate, I think acetone should be a lot faster. I was considering using carbon tet but it's too carcinogenic. I'll let you know how it goes.


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## Lemmongrass

it also dissolves far more alkaloid/ml then -hol


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## nikimadritista

Nice one!
Upload some pics 
Would be nice to see how's that made...


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## Lemmongrass

when i was working with salvinorin-a blotters(when it was legal in my state) i found that ethanol could dissolve ~2-3mg or alkaloid per ml. acetone, on the other hand, could dissolve something close to 30mg/ml. this meant that you could hold the extraction from a qp of foliage in 100ml or less of acetone, versus gallon jugs of ethanol. 

for anyone interested in pure alkaloid extractions, look into an ABC extraction using non polar--polar--non polar. you end up with a nearly white fluff often crystalline product.


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## umbra

you should read the MSDS on acetone. You wouldn't you use it a second time, I guarantee


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## leafminer

I take your point. Darn. Have to come up with a better method! Oh well. Maybe there is a good reason ppl use iso...


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## Lemmongrass

lol. read the msds of any solvent.

acetone, is a ketone, which is  liquid at room temp. acetone is not a diluted solution. it is one chemical. and since it both has a smell, no industrial identification trace chems need to be added. the blue and yellow  can at wall to wall mart is 100%.

Now as acetone is a volatile liquid, it evaporates totally out of the finished product. unless you use nail polish or a strange adulterated brand of acetone(both being toxic), you can pour it onto glass, let it evap and there will be nothing left(maybe a gathering of already present dirt).

When doing AB/ACB extractions, often people(Read: people in the tubes) say to use naphtha as your polar solvent. this is bad because naphtha is a gross mixture of various petroleum distillates, all with unique boiling/evaporation properties. Naphtha is also often adulterated with industry markers and chemicals. if you plan on using a polar, id either make/buy chloroform and use it correctly, or find a way to make a different polar work. if you have the Tek and patience, you can do acid/base titration and end up with a perfect product. but burrettes are expensive and not toke&grow friendly.i derived crystalline and blotter viable sally using these techniques from dried foliage and my product was clean.

TL/DR: Acetone is a clean and safe solvent when produced by a reputable manufacturer. naphtha sucks.


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## umbra

lotek said:
			
		

> lol. read the msds of any solvent.
> 
> acetone, is a ketone, which is  liquid at room temp. acetone is not a diluted solution. it is one chemical. and since it both has a smell, no industrial identification trace chems need to be added. the blue and yellow  can at wall to wall mart is 100%.
> 
> Now as acetone is a volatile liquid, it evaporates totally out of the finished product. unless you use nail polish or a strange adulterated brand of acetone(both being toxic), you can pour it onto glass, let it evap and there will be nothing left(maybe a gathering of already present dirt).
> 
> When doing AB/ACB extractions, often people(Read: people in the tubes) say to use naphtha as your polar solvent. this is bad because naphtha is a gross mixture of various petroleum distillates, all with unique boiling/evaporation properties. Naphtha is also often adulterated with industry markers and chemicals. if you plan on using a polar, id either make/buy chloroform and use it correctly, or find a way to make a different polar work. if you have the Tek and patience, you can do acid/base titration and end up with a perfect product. but burrettes are expensive and not toke&grow friendly.i derived crystalline and blotter viable sally using these techniques from dried foliage and my product was clean.
> 
> TL/DR: Acetone is a clean and safe solvent when produced by a reputable manufacturer. naphtha sucks.



It is my opinion that soxhlet extractor using ethanol is both safer and healthier. And if you're really into oil, soxhlet extractor will allow further processing of oil for refluxing (isomerization), so that the other compounds closely related to THC but non psychactive are converted to delta 8, or delta 9. It is not just an extraction that makes good quality oil, it also requires the higher rotating forms as they are more potent, more psychedelic and with more of a spiritual effect.

The quanity of cannabidiol in the oil is important, as it may be converted to THC, thereby increasing the potency of the oil proportionally. Experience has indicated that the quanity of THC to cannabidol ratio to be at least equal. Because of this, the strength of the oil can be at least be doubled through the isomerization process, and in some cases the potency be increased 5 to 6 times. In regards to extractions using various solvents, such as chloroform. "There is recent evidence ( Bonuccelli, 1979) that solvents such as choloform which promote free radical reactions can result in large decreases in THC content. A chloroform solution of cannibus exposed to sunlight for 30 minutes lost 25-35% of its THC; the reaction was slower in the dark but still significant."


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## TerrorAP2

umbra said:
			
		

> you should read the MSDS on acetone. You wouldn't you use it a second time, I guarantee



I highly agree. As someone who is HAZMAT certified, I can tell you that would not be a wise decision.

http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/A0446.htm


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## leafminer

"When doing AB/ACB extractions"
- This interests me. I am expert at inorganic chem but not too well up on organic. I do have the resources of a well equipped lab available and a fair amount of the usual reagents and solvents. Actually I think I will try the acetone, except I will work in the garden and upwind. I'll just try a little bit first. More later! Got a lot to do.


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## Lemmongrass

right.


Explain to me how a volatile chemical with no solute has any effect once its evaporated.


please impart me with logic....

butane leaves a smell when making oil, acetone does not. the smell in butane isnt the gas, its an added chemical. that makes your product dirty and required an extra cooking. how can that be clean, but a chemical your body makes(tho toxic, you make it yourself to some degree) that evaps, isnt. what what.
isomer controlled products are aways good.


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## The Effen Gee

I know for a fact that "Professionals" in my area use Ethinol, and some crazy 3k machine that rotates the liquid in question in a vat of hotter liquid, then condensed it or something crazy like that.

I used to remember the name of the equipment used, I got to watch them make a batch..

Using this method THC extracts of 80-90% are common.


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## Lemmongrass

% Volatiles by volume @ 21C (70F): 
100 

right from the msds. 

tell me it leaves something.


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## leafminer

OK, I'm half way through. I used about half an oz. of trim from my Aurora and about 2 oz. of acetone, placed the ground-up trim into a small reagent bottle, added the acetone, shook well for a few minutes. A green liquid was produced.
Took three coffee filters, made a cone, filtered the acetone wash into a second reagent bottle.

The hardest part was squeezing out the filter full of used weed. Got acetone all over my fingers which I hate because it defats your skin. Reminds me of when I was a kid working in a gov. lab and used to have to get into a bell jar and clean it out with wads of tissues soaked in acetone ... surprising that I am still alive. 

Right now the green liquid is sitting in an evaporation dish in a warm sunny part of the garden. It's around 30C so I don't suppose I will have to wait very long. More later.

Oh, and Lotek is dead right. I am using pure lab acetone certified 99.95% pure. There won't be anything left over that wasn't in the weed to start with. I have a whole bunch of solvents available, but like I said earlier, don't like to use the carbon tet, it is too toxic (the fumes I mean), and chloroform .... well I prefer to stay away from that because it tends to turn into phosgene .... and various alcohols. I think ethyl ether should work super well if you could get it in pure form (that stuff they sell for starting cars is no good it has additives).


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## umbra

The Effen Gee said:
			
		

> I know for a fact that "Professionals" in my area use Ethinol, and some crazy 3k machine that rotates the liquid in question in a vat of hotter liquid, then condensed it or something crazy like that.
> 
> I used to remember the name of the equipment used, I got to watch them make a batch..
> 
> Using this method THC extracts of 80-90% are common.



hxxp://www.edenlabs.org


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## leafminer

umbra said:
			
		

> hxxp://www.edenlabs.org



The PRICES! 

Think I would just as soon use a filter flask and Liebig condenser.


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## Lemmongrass

ether is amazing for alkaloid extractions but i cant seem to get it anywhere where i am. i know you can buy it otc in UK from the pharmacy\ist. comes in like 20-50ml bottles. say you need to remove some glue off a model.


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## leafminer

Hmmm .... (about 5 hours later)
The bulk of the acetone evaporated really fast in just about half an hour or so leaving a small lagoon. After five hours it is a thin sludge of dark green. I can still smell acetone in it.
I seem to remember that water is soluble in acetone. If so then probably what's happened is that the acetone extracted the remaining water in the "dry" trim, and the sludge is a solution of water and hash oil in acetone.
I will just have to be patient and wait for it to completely evaporate out and see what's left.


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## leafminer

Aha ... the sludge has dried out and there is no smell of acetone any more. I'm going to scrape it up and make it into a small ball. There isn't as much as I had hoped for!


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## Lemmongrass

=] thank you.

good job, enjoy the hash. if the smell is ever there just hit it with some heat for a few seconds and stir it. the smell is from dissolved bubbles and pockets which get steamed out.


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## HippyInEngland

Absolutely fascinating.

Every now and again something on the forum crops up and I find myself compelled to go and do research.

Thanks guys 

Excellent post :aok:

eace:


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## WeedHopper

So I shouldnt use Alcahol?


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## Lemmongrass

if you are comfy with that tek, go for it.

acetone, regardless of its safety, may more may not pick up tannins/waxes/pigments that you dont want. 

i cant for the life of me remember if it dissolves more or less plant matter then etho.


when i was growing sally crystals i would extract with acetone, which would give me this DAAAAARK green almost black liquid. then i used naphtha(i didnt know it was questionable at the time) and mixed it with the acetone. when you did this alot of the waxes and tannins shifted to the naphtha. the two liquids were vacuum filtered out of a sepratory funnel. the acetone was at this point a brownish green but lost most of the black color. next came a few drops of nitric acid in a sep funnel , parcipitate decanted, then again with naoh. from this the product liquid was a lightly colored acetone. i placed a seeder crystal in the bottom and placed it in the cooler. a day or so later i have crystalline salvinorin which i could then crush and dissolve into blotter or vape the rocks 

this method isnt too far off from how you can make a canabinoid solution similar.


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## umbra

Vacuum filtering with activated charcoal will remove almost all those impurities.


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## Lemmongrass

you talking about the naphtha or the finished product?


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## WeedHopper

You guys are killem me,,with all this lab stuff. I have a hard enough time remembering which Bong I wanna use. For now,,,I will extract with fire,,, and try the Alcahol(other method) later.:ignore:


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## umbra

lotek said:
			
		

> you talking about the naphtha or the finished product?



the final product


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## Lemmongrass

^^word. after titration before precipitation.


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## umbra

"THC acetate has twice the potency of THC. On the Adams scale THC = 7.3, while its acetate = 14.6. Furthermore,there is a 25% increase in weight after adding the acetate structure."  Journal of Pharmaceutical Sciences 68

The effect of the acetate is more spiritual and psychedelic than that of the ordinary product. The most unique property of this product is that there is a delay of about 30 minutes before its effects are felt.


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## Lemmongrass

thank you for that umbra.


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## Lemmongrass

wonder if the other noid's can pick it up too?


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## leafminer

CowboyBudsky said:
			
		

> So I shouldnt use Alcahol?



That's not what I'm saying, I was just curious about using other solvents that I can get. I would personally prefer a solvent that doesn't dissolve in water.


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## leafminer

Umbra or Lotek, I have access to glacial acetic, do you have any info on the process to make the acetate? A URL maybe?


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## umbra

no url from me. i have way too many reservations about posting this info i will send you a pm later.


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## eastla_kushsmoka

what about that dust off stuff if you hold it upside down it looks like it can do the job but i know nothing about it anyone else?


forgot to mention theres alot of stupid kids that inhale the stuff so it seems reasonable somebody should try making some with there butane extract tools


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## leafminer

Oh you mean those cans that blow dust off ... took me a minute there to think what you meant, I was picturing helicopters ... it is basically butane so far as I know.


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## leafminer

Final result on the hash:
Yeah, it worked. I ended up with a ball the size of a small pea from about a half oz. of trim. I expected it to come out like hash oil, but no; the first day when I scraped it up it was a bit 'thin' but by the following day it had solidified into hash. It looks like Paki Black but it is a bit softer. I'm gonna try it tonight, mixed into some pure bud. Wowee! This was a cool experiment.


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## leafminer

But I did find this interesting item on 420:

_If you want much more buzz from your bud, then, IMO, its best not to smoke it. Try "bud pills" instead. When yoou smoke a spliff you only take in 15% of the THC in that spliff. 85% is wasted.

If you eat it, after decarboxylating the THC, you will get 100%.

What you need to do is grind the trichome laden bud until it is as fine as flour. Add a teaspoon of vegetable oil and zap in the microwave a minute at a time until it smells strongly of hash and smokes very slightly. The THC has now been decarboxylated, which makes it more active when ingested. Now just pack the gunk into gelcaps (or small squares of cling film, so they can be made into capsule shapes) freeze them, then swallow. An hour later you WILL be off your face!_


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## eastla_kushsmoka

ooo alright i didnt know what that stuff is made of just that it might freeze the thc off into a liquid ...  


i kinda did that second thing but with straight butter it was 3x stronger than anything you can buy at the local clubs


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## leafminer

yeah thinking about it, the whole thing looks like it comes full circle with the cannabutter ppl over on the foodie part of the forum. LOL! They are decarboxylating their bud as well as correctly using a lipid to dissolve a lipid. Haha. Probably all this is rubbish. it is the result of testing the experiment.:woohoo: :lama: :ciao:


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## kalikisu

My brain feels 10x bigger. Wow, the possibilities and experiments I will carry out. Cant wait till my girls are ready.


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## Lemmongrass

science is really fun dude


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## leafminer

Yeah science IS fun! 
It was such fun making that experiment that I'm going to try an extraction on oregano. (No, I am not going to try smoking it!) I am just curious to see if I can make oregano oil that I can just add a drop when making Italian food. I must be mad . . .


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## Lemmongrass

actually i can tell you how now.

its called "Infused Oil". or Herb infused oil. you take a small amount of olive oil, add fresh chopped herbs, onions, garlic shallots, peppers, anything with an oil based flavor. now for things like berry flavors and water based flavors, match them to a vinegar that sounds good be it balsamic, white, champaign, rice wine, red wine, etc.

you simmer whatever in your oil until the flavoring gent seems totally cooked out. strain out the solids, and save the oil/vin. You cant save these out on a counter very long so fridge-it or use it within a week.

I made a very fine extraction of only oils from habenero peppers one night at work. it was 95%+ capsaisin oil. evil deeds were had.

be sure to only use fresh herbs. the oils and aromatics need to be undamaged.


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## leafminer

It had crossed my mind to extract capsaicin, I admit! I have had a run-in with those damn peppers.
Extracting using oil ... yeah, why not, like dissolves like. I am curious though to see what "oregano hash" looks like. 
I just unfortunately got a reminder last night of the downside of smoking hash. I ruined a pair of perfectly good almost new trousers with ... yeah you guessed it ... the damn PINHOLE BURNS. Argh! (Once upon a time I had two rock-star-style satin shirts. They went the same way.) Well it was a hell of a stone. I can't remember any of the PPV movie I was watching ... in fact I can't recall anything from 8 pm onwards.


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## wineman

So Leafminer, how'd it go? Are you still alive after Acetone? I'm curious cause I use it for work all the time. There are No VOC's because it all flashes off, and it would be quicker than ISO.


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## leafminer

It's perfectly ok IMO. There was no detectable trace of acetone left, to my sense of smell and as we know, acetone is detectable by human noses in very small ppms.
It was relatively fast. I left it outside in a light breeze and within a few hours it had reduced to a small pool of what smelt like 90% water, 10% acetone. This IMO is the only weakness, that acetone dissolves the moisture content of the sample. It took another 24 hours to get rid of the remaining water and acetone. So if I use acetone again, I would make sure to dry - even dessicate - the sample prior to extraction. 
It did produce a 'thin' hash. Pretty good method.


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## Lemmongrass

^_^


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## WeedHopper

leafminer said:
			
		

> It's perfectly ok IMO. There was no detectable trace of acetone left, to my sense of smell and as we know, acetone is detectable by human noses in very small ppms.
> It was relatively fast. I left it outside in a light breeze and within a few hours it had reduced to a small pool of what smelt like 90% water, 10% acetone. This IMO is the only weakness, that acetone dissolves the moisture content of the sample. It took another 24 hours to get rid of the remaining water and acetone. So if I use acetone again, I would make sure to dry - even dessicate - the sample prior to extraction.
> It did produce a 'thin' hash. Pretty good method.



Did it work any better then Alcahol?


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## leafminer

I've never tried it with isopropyl. I tried making it in the African bush once, with brandy, but the results were pretty terrible!
I'll have to obtain some isopropyl alcohol and see how it goes.


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## imager777

If this is as good as it sounds, then it's my new method.  My usual methods consist of screening (Works best but smaller yield,) cold water extraction, and 100 proof vodka (If I don't feel like going through the trouble of the other two.)  Acetone seems like it will pruduce a stronger end product, with less waste -- thanks!


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## Lemmongrass

yes it works much better.


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## leafminer

imager, this is what I learnt:
1. Acetone can dissolve a huge amount of thc per ml. So you can process a lot of trim by running it consecutively. However this brings me to a problem I xperienced:
2. Pressing the trim. Once you've extracted all the vital products, you need to get the acetone out of the trim and into the evap dish. I didn't anticipate this and probably lost about 1/2 of my product. You need to procure or build a small press to crush the trim and recover as much acetone as possible. Or possibly you could spin it out in a 'fuge of some kind. But I guess this is the same with any solvent process, ISO, ethyl, whatever. 
3. Lightly toast the trim in a toaster oven set to bare minimum for about 20 min. to dessicate it, prior to the extraction. You dont want water in the product it takes days to dry. Or use calcium chloride dessicator.
4. After a few days it forms up nicely into mini temple balls!


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## Lemmongrass

go to walmart and find a kitchen strainer that fits a bowl you have/buy. press thru strainer into bowl then from bowl into funnel w/ filter.

zero loss. =]

i also would suggest using a desiccant in a proper desiccating chamber(google).


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## imager777

You guys are the best.  I was just going to click the thanks button, but this requires a hand typing.  Thank You


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## wineman

Some additional facts and experience with Acetone you should consider;

Acetone is HIGHLY flammable. Do it outdoors or have good ventilation. No open flames! No water heater flame, no furnace flame, no gas stoves, no smoking!

Acetone is very dangerous to inhale - not high, just giggle, pass out and take the big dirt nap. if confined space, use respirator with "organic" filters. (lowes, home depot...)

Acetone is an "absorption" hazard - 6 seconds from skin contact to entering blood stream, where it heads straight for your liver. There it cannot be broken down and disposed of - it sits in your liver - toxifying. Google liver detox. 

Acetone in the blood stream also causes "chemical depression". This is real and can last for weeks or months. I know... Makes you feel like crawling in a hole and dying. 

So be careful!


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## Lemmongrass

I was soaked in it my teenage years between making experimenting with apan and organic extractions, moltov(much better than gas... i was a kid.). im sure these things are a worry, but just like you shouldn't speed.


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## leafminer

lotek said:
			
		

> I was soaked in it my teenage years between making experimenting with apan and organic extractions, moltov(much better than gas... i was a kid.). im sure these things are a worry, but just like you shouldn't speed.



I used to work in a government lab when I was a teen, where I would soak an entire box of tissues in acetone and climb into a giant belljar to clean it out! And then there were the years I spent using organic solvents custom-spraying cars. And all the ether I inhaled running a disco lights projector. Surprising I am still walking around, really....
Seriously though, Wineman is correct, use precautions please. I simply work outside in the garden and keep my nose out of the fumes.


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