# How many Lights in a 10x12 room for max yield



## AlbinoDanko12GA

wat size and how many lights would u guys go with for a 10 x 12 room??? im trying to get max yield in this room!!!!! i just want some ideas from all you fellow growers 
thanks


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## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> wat size and how many lights would u guys go with for a 10 x 12 room??? im trying to get max yield in this room!!!!! i just want some ideas from all you fellow growers
> thanks



4, 1000 watt HPS will give you just over 5000 lumen's  per sq/ft


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## StoneyBud

And with 24/7 usage of four 1000 watt lights, your power bill will increase by 2,784 Kw used per/month.

This will translate into about 300-400 dollars a month increase in your electric costs.

Is your electric company going to ignore this jump in usage?


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya thats wat i figured, pretty much i want 3 or 4 lights! probally 3 1000's so it will cheaper, there about $100 ea to run 24/7 right?? plus my ac is another $100 per month cuz it runs on 12 amps! im a legal prop 215 pateint so i believe they cant do anything about the jump! im not sure though but ill be legal!


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## meds4me

IMO.....which means squat ! In my reading the new 600hps are throwin right at 1000 lumens at 600 watts useage. Thats why i bought 2 of them. 
For you i would think 3 0r 4 would be the ticket !


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

which new 600's??? lumatek?


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## purplephazes

Yeah that ! Sorry i need 2 posts so i can play in the arcade ! Peace out dawg ! Take care !


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

lol ok


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## Gman_517

(3) 1,000 watts hps or (4) 600 watt hps 
i personally run (2) 600 watt lights and find it sometimes hard to deal with the heat issue but if you can get some good inline fans and some  hoods to run your duct to,you should be fine.legal or not,good luck with your grow.i persoanally can get more then enough bud outta two 600 watt  hps but if you wanted to grow a bunch,and then have a bunch extra to last you.-peace


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

so how much do u get off 2 600's????

ya ive read around and see alot of people using 600's thats why i started this thread! so how do u think 4 600's would compare to 4 1000's???

im gonna be getting 2 8inch eclipse fans (around 750cfm) ea.


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## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> so how much do u get off 2 600's????
> 
> ya ive read around and see alot of people using 600's thats why i started this thread! so how do u think 4 600's would compare to 4 1000's???
> 
> im gonna be getting 2 8inch eclipse fans (around 750cfm) ea.



4 600 watt lights = ~ 360,000 lumens

4 1000 watt HPS lights = ~ 560,000 lumens

You want 5000 lumens per sq/ft for max yield, 10x12 = 120 sq/ft or 600,000 lumens needed. ( I was off on my first post )

Maybe you should down size your room.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

no the room is a decent size, shoot i wanted it to be 10x20 instead of a 10x12 imho! im just trying to get ideas! i think im gonna go with 2 1000's on a light track! just so i can save some money on pge! 4 1000's would be atleast $400 alone! anyone have a light track they want to express about????? ive seen some for $250 but thats only for one light mover! so ill need to buy 2 light movers for both my lights! im trying to go cheap since my room cost me so much, i need to harvest one time before i blow it up with 4 or 6 lights!!!


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## Rolling Thunder

A few things: First off, the best European and Aussie growers average a 1.5 lb to 2.0 lb yield per square metre, using 600w HPS bulbs; and that`s using HPS from veg to flower, and no MH`s. Some will supplement with UVB in the latter stage of flowering. That is the real bench mark, in my opinion. As someone else observed, the 600w HPS bulb is the most efficient bulb, bar none. That means you get more bang for the buck, in terms of your electricity.

The second thing is, the most limiting growth factor in most good or well-run indoor gardens is not the light, but the C02 which drives photosynthesis. You cannot maximize the full yield potential of a 600w HPS bulb without C02 supplementation. If that is true of the 600w bulb, it is even more so true of the 1000w bulb. 

The average C02 level in a well ventilated grow room is about 350-400 ppm. Between 30 to 60 watts per square foot, increase C02 to 1000 ppm and you will maximize yields; that is, only if all the other limiting factors have been properly addressed. Between 60 to 100 watts per square foot, it will require boosting supplementation to 1500-2000 ppm to maximize photosynthesis and yeilds. 

If you do not intend to introduce C02 supplementation, then the 600w bulb per square metre light system is more than sufficient. C02 supplementation, though, is essential if you room is closed off, and not equipped with a good ventilation system, for renewing the air and C02 levels. If the C02 level drops below 200 ppm, then photosynthesis virutally stops and your yield will suck huge! Also, with higher C02 levels, your babies can take more heat without getting all stressed out over it, which also obstructs maximum yields.


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## 4u2sm0ke

StoneyBud said:
			
		

> And with 24/7 usage of four 1000 watt lights, your power bill will increase by 2,784 Kw used per/month.
> 
> This will translate into about 300-400 dollars a month increase in your electric costs.
> 
> Is your electric company going to ignore this jump in usage?


 


Good point  Stoney...when i first started up  ..i was contacted by my power company..now this was after 3 months of running shed full out...Now i simply told them  that  I  ahd just got custudy of my children..my home is  not energy officient  and they like to stay warm..and for some reason i cant get them to turn a dam light off  or the tele...the operator on other end  said"  Say no more...we just wanted to be sure you are aware of this increase.". and they went on about  a budgt plan  to help break the payments up..only have one big bill a year..that will help..But  i say  pay the bill and you will be okay..hope this helps..take care and be safe


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## 4u2sm0ke

purplephazes said:
			
		

> Yeah that ! Sorry i need 2 posts so i can play in the arcade ! Peace out dawg ! Take care !


 



:rofl:  purple..you run outta quarters huh?


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## OGKushman

DONT FORGET.

For every watt you add to the room converts to heat; therefore, it has to be cooled by ~3.5 btu of cooling energy. So. A 4,000 watt system of lights would have to be cooled by _roughly _1.2 ton's or ~14,000 BTU a/c system (theoretically). Plus fans, air pump, sum. pump etc...

COST OF LIGHT IS NOT IT!
can I get an amen>?


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## NorCalHal

Rolling Thunder said:
			
		

> A few things: First off, the best European and Aussie growers average a 1.5 lb to 2.0 lb yield per square metre, using 600w HPS bulbs; and that`s using HPS from veg to flower, and no MH`s. Some will supplement with UVB in the latter stage of flowering. That is the real bench mark, in my opinion. As someone else observed, the 600w HPS bulb is the most efficient bulb, bar none. That means you get more bang for the buck, in terms of your electricity.
> 
> The second thing is, the most limiting growth factor in most good or well-run indoor gardens is not the light, but the C02 which drives photosynthesis. You cannot maximize the full yield potential of a 600w HPS bulb without C02 supplementation. If that is true of the 600w bulb, it is even more so true of the 1000w bulb.
> 
> The average C02 level in a well ventilated grow room is about 350-400 ppm. Between 30 to 60 watts per square foot, increase C02 to 1000 ppm and you will maximize yields; that is, only if all the other limiting factors have been properly addressed. Between 60 to 100 watts per square foot, it will require boosting supplementation to 1500-2000 ppm to maximize photosynthesis and yeilds.
> 
> If you do not intend to introduce C02 supplementation, then the 600w bulb per square metre light system is more than sufficient. C02 supplementation, though, is essential if you room is closed off, and not equipped with a good ventilation system, for renewing the air and C02 levels. If the C02 level drops below 200 ppm, then photosynthesis virutally stops and your yield will suck huge! Also, with higher C02 levels, your babies can take more heat without getting all stressed out over it, which also obstructs maximum yields.


 

Dude...who is this guy?

Is is spot on! Great post and, imo, is absolutly correct...'cept I believe 1000's aircooled produces an overall better result. Love my thoueys!
But a 600 vs 1000w is really a preference, nad I am not tryin' to start that debate! Just funnin.

But again, great post Rolling.


You wanna roll max in that room huh Albino?

Well...I am gonna throw you an idea...but it will cost loot to set up.

4- 1000watt 8" aircooled lites each over a 4'x4' area. I am not sure what media/method you are usuing. 
Ensure that your lights are beiing cooled with an 8" can fan or equivilant and air is being pulled from OUTSIDE the grow room,thru the lites, then being exhausted outside the grow area.

8"Exhaust fan hooked to a carbon filter, hung form ceiling if u want to get down.

CO2 enrichment system with a C.A.P. Contrller(Fuzzy Logic preferred) to control dispersment of CO2, and operation of your exhaust fan. This could also control an intake fan, but ensure that your intake has a dampner on it so that it will close when air is not being pushed/pulled into the grow room. Complete sealing of the Grow space is key to maximizing CO2 Enrichment.

Cirulatory fans and blah,blah,blah. You get the picture.


Man I'm stoned.

Set that CO2 level to 1500ppm, and rock and roll.


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## NorCalHal

Oh ya...$100 per 1000w lite....I have never seen that man. I live in Cali and we pay big for electricity, and my experience is around $30-40MAX per light. Know, this is just for the lights...not the rest of the show.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

Rolling Thunder said:
			
		

> um i plan on using co2 but to tell the truth probally not this grow! i will by controllers, co2, more fans and all that after harvest! i dont have much money now that i built the room! c02 sounds confusing though ive never looked into it! so how are these peeps pulling 1-2 lbs per 600???isnt that impossible? isnt it a gram per watt or so???? im a newb im just asking! that would be so nice though! where do i sign up and how do we do this??? for ventalation my plans are to have 2 1000's with one 8 inch eclipse inline and use my 12,000 btu ac if needed i want to try and not use it though, thats why im gonna by this new inline! how shouldi have it all hooked up ventalation wise?


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

4u2sm0ke said:
			
		

> well im legal and will pay it every month! they shouldnt mind, its more money for them just as long as u pay it right? i just jope its not too much


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

OGKushman said:
			
		

> well hopefully i wont have to use my ac, im gonna buy a 8inch inline to maybe cool 2 of them! im gonna run 4 next time when i get co2 and more equipment and better prepared!


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## StoneyBud

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> Oh ya...$100 per 1000w lite....I have never seen that man. I live in Cali and we pay big for electricity, and my experience is around $30-40MAX per light. Know, this is just for the lights...not the rest of the show.


Using my electric costs in a spread sheet, it would cost me $322.09 to run the four, 1,000 watt lights 24/7, 29 days. After the switch to 12/12, it would be half of course.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> well c02 is around $500 for a system right??? thats a lil too much for me right now! ill run that next time for sure after this harvest! as of right now it seems like ill be running 2 lights cuz i dont want to pay pge for more than 2! i have one light already i just need to get another one and also a 8 inch inline! so your saying pull air from outside through the lights and out the attic????? wont pulling air from outside bring in bugs,pests, dirt and stuff???? how would i attatch a carbon filter to it like that???? is there a drawing or pic of a similar setup, pics explain alot to me, i dont uderstand by reading lol sorry i kinda get it though but not all the way! how sohuld i run a intake system in that room since theres no windows or anything????
> 
> 
> well my bill jumped about $120 with my light and fan and then when i got my ac it jumped another $150!
> me and a buddy compared and his was 100 something and mine was 80 something since i bought a digi! so to run 24/7 veg there about $100 and to flower about $50, i also live in cali and ya the rates are about 8 - 10 cents, it blows i hate cali everything is so expensive now a days!


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

StoneyBud said:
			
		

> Using my electric costs in a spread sheet, it would cost me $322.09 to run the four, 1,000 watt lights 24/7, 29 days. After the switch to 12/12, it would be half of course.


 
ya that sounds about right!


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## mountain man

*runs out and flips the air conditioner off


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

mountain man said:
			
		

> *runs out and flips the air conditioner off


 
huh????


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

theres some pics of my setup and the girls in my journal check it out guys


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## NorCalHal

It's actually around 1200 for a CO2 system with the CAP controller.

Good post Stoney, I just based mine on 12 hour, as I only run all my lights when I flip to 12/12. I use only half of them to Veg, then spread them out for a max of 4-5 days, then flip.

IF you run aircooled lights, then if you EVER want to run CO2, then you need to seal off your lights intake and exhaust. Theis means pulling air thru the lights from a source outside the gorwroom, not neccisarily from "outside".


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## The Effen Gee

I use quantum 600's with open reflectors and an ac unit in the summer. Closed room, no external ventilation. Keeps the co2 through the roof. Those CAP controllers are expensive.

I run 2 6'' can fans, a blower on the floor and two oscillating fans. Plus my air pump and circulating pump.

My power bill is around $600 a month. 

I get over a pound per 600. 18" canopy control. Lollypopped plants, no lowers. 

I am setting up a few more rooms based on these principals. Being winter time, I will just pull in cold air and put the ac unit in cold storage.

What dictates mostly everyting is how you want to grow...

pots, ebb & flow, Dutch leech trays, Aero, Dwc...whatever.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> It's actually around 1200 for a CO2 system with the CAP controller.
> 
> Good post Stoney, I just based mine on 12 hour, as I only run all my lights when I flip to 12/12. I use only half of them to Veg, then spread them out for a max of 4-5 days, then flip.
> 
> IF you run aircooled lights, then if you EVER want to run CO2, then you need to seal off your lights intake and exhaust. Theis means pulling air thru the lights from a source outside the gorwroom, not neccisarily from "outside".


 
o ok you meant 12/12 with your costs, ya mines around the same when i flip but i got a digi lumatek supposily it saves 20%

damn that much for c02! i think i might wait a few harvests lol, i plan on running c02 soon but not right now as i dont have the funds and other equipment to do so! im trying to still learn! i doubt i have my setup ventalated right from the sounds of it! thats probally why the ac runs 24/7! i need to go get another inline dont i??? where do i put it?

so wat ur saying is i want my light to be on its own exhaust system (that pulls from somewhere else but the room??) so where could i pull air from then??? im just tryign to get all this right and suck up all this helpful info so i can step my game up with this growing idea! i want too happy with my last harvest and the setup is the same so i believe it needs to be changed as my temps are sky high


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

The Effen Gee said:
			
		

> I use quantum 600's with open reflectors and an ac unit in the summer. Closed room, no external ventilation. Keeps the co2 through the roof. Those CAP controllers are expensive.
> 
> I run 2 6'' can fans, a blower on the floor and two oscillating fans. Plus my air pump and circulating pump.
> 
> My power bill is around $600 a month.
> 
> I get over a pound per 600. 18" canopy control. Lollypopped plants, no lowers.
> 
> I am setting up a few more rooms based on these principals. Being winter time, I will just pull in cold air and put the ac unit in cold storage.
> 
> What dictates mostly everyting is how you want to grow...
> 
> pots, ebb & flow, Dutch leech trays, Aero, Dwc...whatever.


 
well for right now i want to go with soil and pots! what do u mean u have no external ventalation?????
i beleive i dont have the ventalation correct in my room!

damn why is ur bill so much? how many lights u running??


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## OGKushman

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> Rolling Thunder said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> c02 sounds confusing though ive never looked into it! so how are these peeps pulling 1-2 lbs per 600???isnt that impossible? isnt it a gram per watt or so???? im a newb im just asking!
> 
> 
> 
> 600 watts/28 grams = 21.4 ounces
> 
> CO2 is so simple
Click to expand...


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## OGKushman

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> o ok you meant 12/12 with your costs, ya mines around the same when i flip but i got a digi lumatek supposily it saves 20%
> 
> 
> 
> so wat ur saying is i want my light to be on its own exhaust system (that pulls from somewhere else but the room??) so where could i pull air from then???


Digital ballasts do not save you a penny. They make the light bulb run more efficient. But, 1,000 watt/hr is 1kwhr. Doest not change the draw into the ballast, just output.

For efficiently ducting air cooled lights...

Here I just made this:


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

wat about if its 90F plus outside???? it dont matter??? still getting rid of the heat off the bulb right??????

and do i need another inline anywhere else for intake or exhaust or watever??? 


sorry guys im a newb and i dont have everything dialed in like i thought i did! im wanting to learn and listen, my last harvest wasnt that good, i didnt yield wat i probally could of!


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

OGKushman said:
			
		

> AlbinoDanko12GA said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 600 watts/28 grams = 21.4 ounces
> 
> CO2 is so simple
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also is there a cheap way to get co2 in the tent for now until i can afford a complete c02 system????
Click to expand...


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## dr pyro

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> OGKushman said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also is there a cheap way to get co2 in the tent for now until i can afford a complete c02 system????
> 
> 
> 
> YOU NEED THE RIGHT EQUIPT TO MAKE THE ENVIROMENT PERFECT FOR CO2. WITH OUT CONDITIONS PERFECT THE CO2 IS A WASTE. SURE YOU CAN BUY THE TANK TIMER AND FLOW METER AND JUST THROW IT IN BU T IT WILL DO NO GOOD. I'VE DONE IT SAVE YOUR MONEY DO IT RIGHT THE FIRST TIME. O SORRY FOR ALL CAPS JUST NOTICED I HAD CAP LOCK ON
Click to expand...


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

o for sure, when i get money to get c02 i will buy a complete system with a timer and all


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## OGKushman

Is your grow near a pilot light? Water heater? Oven?


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

when i get c02 it will be in a detached 10x12 grow room that im building right now! the house is like 15 feet away


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## Rolling Thunder

Hey there AD12GA ~ 

Yes, you definitely need to do the CO2 thang, but in regard to lighting, I'm now beginning to think LED is the wave of the future, and if you have'nt already shelled out large for the HPS lamps, I would put on a hold on that until you've done a little research into LED's. They're new and a little pricey, so don't jump on anything too quickly until you've done some due diligence before hand. Go over to Google videos and run a search on LED Grows. I think you'll see something that will impress you. 

Check out the LED 300w Serena Broad Band Grow Light[/URL]: "New Solid State Technology. This LED 300w Broad Band Grow light is for serious growers who require comparable results to a 1000w HPS for flowering and fruiting production. The addition of extra (UV) Blue and (IR) Red in this unit produces higher resin production, enhanced flower/fruit formation and finishing in certain species of plants." It seems to me, though, that this LED light is still deficient in the UVB spectrum, despite the extra UV; so you will need proper UVB supplementation during the final phase of flowering. 

That is not to say that your bud won't be potent without the extra UVB supplementation, but only not as potent as with the extra UVB. This, imo, is now a proven and well established scientific fact. However, most growers are satisfied with the quality of bud grown without it; but those who have really checked out the the extra UVB, and the difference it makes, rarely if ever go back to growing without it. But it has to be the right type of UVB light and the right amount of UVB. ~ RT


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## The Effen Gee

OGKushman said:
			
		

> Digital ballasts do not save you a penny. They make the light bulb run more efficient. But, 1,000 watt/hr is 1kwhr. Doest not change the draw into the ballast, just output.
> 
> For efficiently ducting air cooled lights...



Um, no.

Digital ballasts use at least 100 watts less than a magnetic.

Magnetic 1000 watt = 1100 watts.
Digital 600 = 600 watts.

Yes, they do save you money on the power bill. Plus, they run cooler and quieter.


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## The Hemp Goddess

Yeah, I am switching over from a single 1000W magnetic ballast to 2 600W digitals--approx 35000 more lumens for an additional 100W.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya now that i thought about it i might save up a lil and get (4) or (6) 600's and hopefully cool them with a 8 inch vortex or eclipse fan! i would go with 4 1000's but that would be real high on pge for 2 months (basically $700 - $800) and the 1000's get hotspots! im still learning though but as i can see for wat im doing and can afford the 600's would probally be the way but im still not sure! thats why im posting on here!

i looked up leds and damn there pretty expensive! some grows really look good with them and people are saving money but there expensive to buy!

yes digitals are about 10 - 20% cheaper on the bill each month! i ran a magnetic months ago and changed to a digi and noticed it! there more efficient too and make the bulb last longer and the best thing is they dont hummmm

i checked a co2 price for everything brand new and its around $1000, so i will probally get co2 next harvest as i dont have a lot of funds right now.

pics on my journal, check em out


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## nvthis

Nice yard....


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## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> ya now that i thought about it i might save up a lil and get (4) or (6) 600's



6 , 600 watters will put you about 60,000 lumens short of ideal lighting conitions, (max yield)


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

6 600's would put me short???????

im wiring the room up soon, im thinking 4 220 outlets and 4 110 outlets on a panel!!!!!! for lights im thinking 3 dual  600 digi 220volt lumateks to put me at 3600 watts with more of a footprint than 4 1000's! wat do u guys think! im still thinking of the 2 1000's on a 9 foot track but i im trying to get your guys opinions! i almost ordered 4 1000's but gave it another thought, i better wait and ask you guys and do some more homework!

its either...
1. 4 600's on a 9 ft track
2. 6 600's 
3 2 1000's on a 9 ft track
4. 4 1000's

and defiantely 2 vortex fans or something similar, im making a shopping list so feel free to add any advice or comments

all should be running on 220 volts correct??????????


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## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> 6 600's would put me short???????
> 
> im wiring the room up soon, im thinking 4 220 outlets and 4 110 outlets on a panel!!!!!! for lights im thinking 3 dual  600 digi 220volt lumateks to put me at 3600 watts with more of a footprint than 4 1000's! wat do u guys think! im still thinking of the 2 1000's on a 9 foot track but i im trying to get your guys opinions! i almost ordered 4 1000's but gave it another thought, i better wait and ask you guys and do some more homework!
> 
> its either...
> 1. 4 600's on a 9 ft track
> 2. 6 600's
> 3 2 1000's on a 9 ft track
> 4. 4 1000's
> 
> and defiantely 2 vortex fans or something similar, im making a shopping list so feel free to add any advice or comments
> 
> all should be running on 220 volts correct??????????




Its all about lumens per sq\ft, you want 5000 per sq\ft

10x12 = 120 sq/ft x 5000 = 600,000 lumens.

1000 watt hps = 150,000 lumens
600 watt hps = 90,000 lumens
400 watt hps = 50,000 lumens

6 x 90,000 = 540,000 lumens.

IMO light tracks are not the answer, more lights are.

You did say for max yield.

240 vs 120 volts
The only difference this makes is how many circuits you have at what amp rating.
watts\votage = amps so make sure you have enough circuits to handle it at no more than 80% of the max amp rating of each breaker or circuit.\

And dont forget about fans and other stuff.


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## The New Girl

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> Rolling Thunder said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> um i plan on using co2 but to tell the truth probally not this grow! i will by controllers, co2, more fans and all that after harvest! i dont have much money now that i built the room! c02 sounds confusing though ive never looked into it! so how are these peeps pulling 1-2 lbs per 600???isnt that impossible? isnt it a gram per watt or so???? im a newb im just asking! that would be so nice though! where do i sign up and how do we do this??? for ventalation my plans are to have 2 1000's with one 8 inch eclipse inline and use my 12,000 btu ac if needed i want to try and not use it though, thats why im gonna by this new inline! how shouldi have it all hooked up ventalation wise?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Albino,
> 
> Have you thought of using light rails to move 2 1000s for the coverage? Just a thought and half the electric, the tracks only use small amounts of wattage. I think I read 5 watts but that was when I was high!
Click to expand...


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## Rolling Thunder

Growdude said:
			
		

> 6 x 90,000 = 540,000 lumens.


 
Hey there Albi, 

Go with GD's advice. Six 600w HPS lamps is definitely the right way to go. That's actually a bare minimum for a 10x12 flower room. If you divide 3600w by 120 sq/ft, you get 30w per sq ft, which is a bare minimum and hardly an ideal lighting situation.

However, when you factor into it the centre isle between the two sides of the room, that you need to leave open for walking and working in, then your actual growing area is 120 sq/ft minus the middle walk-way which should be about 2.0 feet wide, at least. 

So your actual grow area will be more like 4' x 12' on each side of the room, or 8' x 12' in total, for 96 sq. ft.; 3600w/96 sq. ft. = 37.5w per sq. ft. That is actually on the low side, but it will be sufficient for good yields if you plan to focus mainly upon pure indicas, and some largely indica dominant strains; but it is far from ideal. 

Now, these are your options. First, instead of six lamps, go with eight 600 watters, 4 on each side of the room. The advantage of this over going with six 1000w lamps is that it provides a better spread and more even distribution of the light along each side of the room. 8x600w = 4800w total, or 50w per sq. ft, when divided by 96; and 7500 lum per sq. foot, which is closer to ideal, for maximum yields. 

Your second option is to stay with six lamps but bump up the wattage to 1000w each, for a total of 6000w, or 900,000 lum; 6000w / 96sq/ft = 62.5w per sq/ft. ; 900,000 lumens divided by 96 sq. ft. = 9375 lum per sq. foot. This plan is even better, but is not without some negatives. Eight lamps will provide a better and more even light distribution throughout each side of the room; and you'll not be able to realize the full potential of this wattage without a sophisticated CO2 system and optimization of all other growth factors. 

The third option, if you wish to stick with the six 600w HPS bulbs, is to reduce your actual growing area to 63 sq. feet, by locating it in the centre of the room and leaving a 1.5 foot walkway around the entire outside perimetre of the garden; 1.5 feet of walkway on each side of the garden will leave you with an actual grow area of about 7' x 9', or 63 sq. feet. 

Now, 3600w/63 sq ft = 57w per sq. foot; and 540,000 lumens divided by 63 = 8571.42 lumens per sq. foot. That is fairly ideal and will be more than sufficient wattage / lumens for almost anything you'll ever want to grow, unless you're a real pure sativa freak; but even then, most pure sativas will perform well enough under those conditions when all the other growth factors are optimized. 

Sorry to complicate the crap out of it for you, but dem's the hard facts, bro'! If it was me, seeing this is your first set-up, I would be heavily inclined to opt for the third and last option, of the 63 sq. ft. grow area in the centre of the room. Once you've run that a few times, if you feel it's inadequate, you can always split the garden in two later, move it to the sides of the room, and install two more 600w HPS bulbs. 

Good luck with everything! 

RT


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

thanks nvthis, it will have grass and all here soon, its a fairly big yard so it will be nice!

ok so i want atleast 5000 lumens per sq ft! i didnt know that, now i do thanks man! well im in the middle of drawing out the design of everything and so far i have a little walk way in the middle of the plants so i dont think ill be at 120 sqft of growspace, it might be like a 100 sqft or so! so i should be good right with 6 600's right?? ya my buddy and me are gonna wire it up with 4 220 outlets for the lights at 20 amps each and the 4 110 outlets 20 amps each for the ac and inlines and etc!

ya i thought of 9 ft light rails but there like $300 and i would need 2 of them! i could get like 3 lights for that much! but idk im still thinking about everything cuz i have to think about 3 months of pge for it all so ill figure it out and take a pic of the drawing im making so i can kinda show u guys visually

damn RT your one smart dude! thats a lot of different options for me to think about, let me smoke a blunt and ill get back to you lol, ill probally go with 6 600's just cuz of money issue and ill leave a 2 ft walkway right in the middle of the 2 tables! and the ac will be in one of the corners of the room! im drawing all this out so ill get back to you when its done and ill take a pic, thanks


----------



## NorCalHal

Man...thats a lil too fancy for me. All this talk about Lumans makes me want to put on my tinfoil hat.

My okie rule of thumb is quite simple...1 -1000watter per 4x4 area.
Simple and great results.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

wat would you do for heat problems compared to the 600's???? bigger inline or just run the ac 247???


----------



## ugmjfarmer

StoneyBud said:
			
		

> And with 24/7 usage of four 1000 watt lights, your power bill will increase by 2,784 Kw used per/month.
> 
> This will translate into about 300-400 dollars a month increase in your electric costs.
> 
> Is your electric company going to ignore this jump in usage?



Stop spreading misinformation. 4000w is not a big jump to worry about, thats **. Most power companies would jump all over that kind of increase with a handshake and a smile as long as your paying that bill on time.

10x12 room is screaming for large adjust a wing reflectors, super spreaders, 4000w of light with highly reflective walls. They say that will yield well, but I think thats in a 7x10 space of your 12x10 room. 

I like RT's options better, they are spot on. I run 2kw over a 4x6 and its working ok aside from some small bleaching due to an INCREDIBLE stretch.


----------



## The Effen Gee

Yes, get them there Adjust-A-Wing reflectors. Best ever so far.

Fully tweakable and even better with the heat deflectors.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya the power bill for 4 1000's 12/12 would be no more than $200 per month! now vegging 24/0 they would be no more than $400 a month! its 9 cents right now here in cali per k! but pge wont care and they havent said nothing about a $400 bill last time, they love it as long as i pay it! im legal so im not worried about it! im going with high gloss white walls! that should reflect the light some uh! 

im also in the process of buying 3 dual digi lumatek 600 watt ballasts with 6 hoods! then ill get 2 4x8 trays! i looked at the adjust a wing hoods and it seems kinda cheap looking compared to these sealed hoods, you know wat i mean??? shouldnt i just go with like a daystar ac or radiant ac hood or cool tube or so?????????

(2) 4x8 trays=64sqft of growing space
64sqft x 5000 =320,000 lumens needed for ideal lighting
6 hps 90,000 lumens=540,000 total lumens which would be 8571.42 lumens per sq. foot which would be great

wat would u guys cool that with and how????? any pics or so of a similar setup so i can visually see it so i understand???


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

Rolling Thunder said:
			
		

> Hey there Albi,
> 
> Go with GD's advice. Six 600w HPS lamps is definitely the right way to go. That's actually a bare minimum for a 10x12 flower room. If you divide 3600w by 120 sq/ft, you get 30w per sq ft, which is a bare minimum and hardly an ideal lighting situation.
> 
> However, when you factor into it the centre isle between the two sides of the room, that you need to leave open for walking and working in, then your actual growing area is 120 sq/ft minus the middle walk-way which should be about 2.0 feet wide, at least.
> 
> So your actual grow area will be more like 4' x 12' on each side of the room, or 8' x 12' in total, for 96 sq. ft.; 3600w/96 sq. ft. = 37.5w per sq. ft. That is actually on the low side, but it will be sufficient for good yields if you plan to focus mainly upon pure indicas, and some largely indica dominant strains; but it is far from ideal.
> 
> Now, these are your options. First, instead of six lamps, go with eight 600 watters, 4 on each side of the room. The advantage of this over going with six 1000w lamps is that it provides a better spread and more even distribution of the light along each side of the room. 8x600w = 4800w total, or 50w per sq. ft, when divided by 96; and 7500 lum per sq. foot, which is closer to ideal, for maximum yields.
> 
> Your second option is to stay with six lamps but bump up the wattage to 1000w each, for a total of 6000w, or 900,000 lum; 6000w / 96sq/ft = 62.5w per sq/ft. ; 900,000 lumens divided by 96 sq. ft. = 9375 lum per sq. foot. This plan is even better, but is not without some negatives. Eight lamps will provide a better and more even light distribution throughout each side of the room; and you'll not be able to realize the full potential of this wattage without a sophisticated CO2 system and optimization of all other growth factors.
> 
> The third option, if you wish to stick with the six 600w HPS bulbs, is to reduce your actual growing area to 63 sq. feet, by locating it in the centre of the room and leaving a 1.5 foot walkway around the entire outside perimetre of the garden; 1.5 feet of walkway on each side of the garden will leave you with an actual grow area of about 7' x 9', or 63 sq. feet.
> 
> Now, 3600w/63 sq ft = 57w per sq. foot; and 540,000 lumens divided by 63 = 8571.42 lumens per sq. foot. That is fairly ideal and will be more than sufficient wattage / lumens for almost anything you'll ever want to grow, unless you're a real pure sativa freak; but even then, most pure sativas will perform well enough under those conditions when all the other growth factors are optimized.
> 
> Sorry to complicate the crap out of it for you, but dem's the hard facts, bro'! If it was me, seeing this is your first set-up, I would be heavily inclined to opt for the third and last option, of the 63 sq. ft. grow area in the centre of the room. Once you've run that a few times, if you feel it's inadequate, you can always split the garden in two later, move it to the sides of the room, and install two more 600w HPS bulbs.
> 
> Good luck with everything!
> 
> RT


 
hey hows it going RT, thank you for all that good useful information, appreciate it bro! after thinking about it im going to go with ur third option and go with 6 hoods and 3 lumatek dual 600's! with a center isle in the middle of 2 feet to work with them and 3 600's above each 4x8 tray!


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## The Hemp Goddess

Flat white paint will reflect far better than glossy paint.  Just because something looks like it reflects well, does not mean that it does.  Examples of this are mirrors and foil, which are both poor reflectors of light.  This is a link to the reflectability of different materials.

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=27355&d=1181919816


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

well flat white it is then!!!!! do u guys liek that white/balck panda film! i got a big ol role of it but its a pain on stapling it up and keeping it up! i think ill go with flat white


----------



## The Hemp Goddess

I use Panda film in my flowering room.  It protects the walls and blocks out light.  I have flat white walls in my vegging closet where "light leaks" are not a problem since I run my vegging closet 24/7.

Part of the problem that I personally have with mylar and Panda film is hanging it straight and without wrinkles.  The less smoothly it is hung, the less it reflects.  The low cost of flat white paint and the ease of cleanup makes flat white paint a good choice.  Panda film will reflect more, but, as you mentioned, it can be a pita to hang.


----------



## dr pyro

i would run a sub panel dedicated to that room. just remember if the ballast you choose runs at say 10 amps on 120 if would be half on 240. by doing 240 it would allow for more lights on that 1 circuit.20 amp breaker will run at 16 amps safely with out tripping. ok just did my math 1000 watt ballast will draw 9.5 amps on 120. 240 say 5 amps so you can run 3 1000 on a  double pole 20 amp breaker wired for 240


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya i might use it then since i have a lot of it! i probaly have 70 or 80 feet of it! 


im running the main wire with the 3 wires undeground from the main off the house to the room 100 feet away and putting a box on the inside with 2 20 amp switches for 240 and then 4 20 amp switches for 120! ill have like 8 outlets in the room or so! should that be good??


----------



## The Hemp Goddess

What size wire are you running (this is really important)?  You are running quite a bit of amperage and with a 100' run, you are going to lose some...


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## dr pyro

wow 100 ft run is gonna cost ya some cash.if you run a 100 amp sub panel your lookin at 2 gauge wire. take a look at these calculators they may help you. replace the xx with tt
hxxp://www.electrician.com/vd_calculator.html
hxxp://www.alternate-energy.net/voltlosscalc03.html 
hope this helps


----------



## dr pyro

they dropped the calc on the first link sorry but the 2nd one works make sure you have the correct ft. the less you go as far as ft wise the larger gauge you can do which will save you some cash. are you attempting this yourself or an electrician


----------



## dr pyro

also how many amp service you have at your home. you may also need to up your service if you dont have 200 amp service. always check your local codes as mine may and probally differ from your area


----------



## The Effen Gee

Those adjust-a-wings are much more durable than fixed hoods, plus you have a much more efficient light footprint.

Once I bought them I will never use anything else.
With the heat shields you can get the lights insanely close to your plants, not something you can do with a thousand watter....


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

dr pyro said:
			
		

> they dropped the calc on the first link sorry but the 2nd one works make sure you have the correct ft. the less you go as far as ft wise the larger gauge you can do which will save you some cash. are you attempting this yourself or an electrician


 
well on the 2nd link i typed in 100 feet and 60 amps and it said 6 awg!!!! my buddy is helping me that im working for right now, hes a contractor, he knows how to wire it up and all but doesnt know the standards and wat awg wire i need and how much voltage is actualy dropped with running a 100 or so foot main wire!

i dont know wat amp service i have at my house! i think the main breaker is 100 amps but not sure! i also have a lil breaker for 240 inside the garage for like power tools and stuff! too bad it was to hot or else i would of grown in the garage where there was already power!

im going with the extrasun hoods! or maybe i will go with sunlight hoods since there made in america unlike extrasun! the dude at the shop is hooking it up! 3 dual 600 watt lumateks, 6 hoods and cords, 6 hortilux bulbs for under $2000


----------



## dr pyro

ya my numbers where for a 100 amp sub panel with the 2 gauge the calc figures what you need for wire considering the footage.you will probally be alright if you run the 60 amp subif you go hire you will need to change your service to 100 amp but check your local codes as mine differ from yours


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

ok i just got back from the other pad and the panel is 200 amps over there so thats good right??? the 8 inch 110 foot long trench is finaly bug and ready for conduit and wire to be dropped in! where do i get this 2 gauge wire at??i checked home depot and lowes and they dont carry anything that thick!


also picked up 2 lumatek 400's for vegging in the 3 x 6


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## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> ok i just got back from the other pad and the panel is 200 amps over there so thats good right??? the 8 inch 110 foot long trench is finaly bug and ready for conduit and wire to be dropped in! where do i get this 2 gauge wire at??i checked home depot and lowes and they dont carry anything that thick!
> 
> 
> also picked up 2 lumatek 400's for vegging in the 3 x 6



You need to pick up the supplies from a local electrical distributor.

If you haven't laid the conduit yet you could save a lot by using UF cable or underground feeder, made for direct burial.


----------



## Growdude

Growdude said:
			
		

> You need to pick up the supplies from a local electrical distributor.
> 
> If you haven't laid the conduit yet you could save a lot by using UF cable or underground feeder, made for direct burial.




Also all you need is 4 awg hxxp://www.paigewire.com/pumpWireCalc.htm

The calculator in the second link is wrong as it will tell you only 16 awg is ok for 60 amps if your run is 5 feet and thats not true.


----------



## dr pyro

electrical supply house have your buddy get it he may be able to get a discount. 4 is more than enough for 60 amp 100 ft run. ya 200 amp service perfect you should have no problems.never used the clac for something so small like 5 ft but its good to know that that thing is out of whack for small numbers. thanks growdude for the correction and new link


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya i havent bought the conduit or anything yet! im doing some research first! isnt the underground wire expensive though??? i have 4 dogs so i think i better put it in conduit just in case they try and dig it up lol

so 4 awg would be enough, is there somewhere on the net i can buy this thick gauge wire, ive googled it but cant find any stores to sell it!


----------



## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> ya i havent bought the conduit or anything yet! im doing some research first! isnt the underground wire expensive though??? i have 4 dogs so i think i better put it in conduit just in case they try and dig it up lol
> 
> so 4 awg would be enough, is there somewhere on the net i can buy this thick gauge wire, ive googled it but cant find any stores to sell it!



Its going to be expensive no matter how you do it, here is a link to a place to get wire online, prob cheaper localy but not by much. hxxp://www.mcmaster.com/#single-conductor-wire/=3nmp19  - $151.00 per 100 ft.

Better get pricing on conduit and fittings, the pannel and the breakers as well as the wire.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

so i need a single wire cable???? dont i need the 3 wire cable to go from the main 200 amp house panel box to the new panel box?? or is it just one power wire needed to go to the new room


----------



## dr pyro

you dont have a supply house in your area.


----------



## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> so i need a single wire cable???? dont i need the 3 wire cable to go from the main 200 amp house panel box to the new panel box?? or is it just one power wire needed to go to the new room



If your running conduit you would run 3 single conductors from your panel to your sub-panel.
You can run 3 conductor cable in conduit but its more expensive.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

sorry i dont know anything about electrical wire, so home depot and lowes do not have it right??? i beleive i checked and there wasnt no 4 awg!! so i need to go to a electrical store, i bet theres one around here somewhere! ill be checking today! 

so i need a 4 awg 3 wire??????(3 wires in one cable), in conduit buried 8 inches)!!?? i checked that link u gave me but theres like 10 different types of wire!!!!!!


----------



## Growdude

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> so i need a 4 awg 3 wire??????(3 wires in one cable), in conduit buried 8 inches)!!?? i checked that link u gave me but theres like 10 different types of wire!!!!!!



As I stated , I would use single condutor wire, 3 # 4 and 1 # 8 for the ground.
if you ask for 4 awg 3 wire its going to be expensive and not needed unless you go with UF cable for direct burial.

Here is a new link to THHN wire hxxp://www.mcmaster.com/#single-conductor-wire/=3o71jq

And for a 220 volt sub panel your going to need 2 hots, 1 neutral and one ground.

Better get some help with the project its not something you should do without knowing how to do it.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

ok i got it now, thats wat i thought, the wire with 4 wires! i didnt know u needed 2 hots for 240 though, thanks! i have a buddy of mine that knows how to wire up a room, the thing is i have to have everything here, so im trying to go out and get everything myself and try to get an idea of wats going on!
he said he wants to wire it up for 4 220 outlets and 4 110 outlets.

went to the shop today and the guy said early next week ill have my equipment! i got 3 new dual dimmable 600 watters, 6 sun system hoods, and 6 solar max bulbs


----------



## thc is good for me

I really dont think this is the right forum for you ALBINO. 

Where just simple folks around here who enjoy smoking there own herb not trying to get rich quick.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

lol are you ok?????? u must not grow your own meds, in that case im sorry thc but keep ya head up playa! dont let her get to you, there other fish in the tank playboy


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

hey hows everyone doing?? ive been real busy with my room and moving out of my house into my other house and so on! anyway i got some stuff situated and i got all my equipment now and am just waiting to get the room cleaned and sprayed by my clark pest guy! im also trying to figure out how im gonna set everything up! anyway talk to u guys later im gonna take a few bong rips

i got 4 lumatek digi 600's with super sun 2 hoods and my 1 lumatek 1000 with a radiant ac hood! im thinking 2 3x6 trays and a 4x4 for the 1000! i got a 8 inch vortex and a co2 system with a ppm3! i have a preschool drawing ill show u guys. tell me what u think


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

heres the drawing! thats my basic idea! after drawing it up though i realized when my ac is on it will be wasted because the inline fan wil be exhuasting it out! but its now winter so i might be good!!

1 duct is for the ac exhasut and the other is for the lights exhuast


----------



## Locked

I don't live in a state where I cld ever think of going this big without going to jail quite quickly for quite a long time...hopefully some people who grow on a larger scale can help you out...


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

i dont think its that big! im all legal though and im staying under my limits so we'll see how it goes! thats why i love Cali! ya i think thats how im gonna run it though, it should work just perfect


----------



## 3rdbase

*REMOVED for language *


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

wat like 12 inches away from the top of the plant?


----------



## smokingjoe

StoneyBud said:
			
		

> And with 24/7 usage of four 1000 watt lights, your power bill will increase by 2,784 Kw used per/month.
> 
> This will translate into about 300-400 dollars a month increase in your electric costs.
> 
> Is your electric company going to ignore this jump in usage?


 
Ever installed a 7.5kw reverse cycle air conditioner?  Pay the bill and noone will care.  Ensure there is no smell to alert meter reader if not done remotely and you'll be good as gold.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

smokingjoe said:
			
		

> Ever installed a 7.5kw reverse cycle air conditioner? Pay the bill and noone will care. Ensure there is no smell to alert meter reader if not done remotely and you'll be good as gold.


 
wat is it???


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

wat type of ac is it, ill have to look it up, u got a brand?


----------



## leafminer

BTW you will need 220/240 for the air con. Single phase 120V is good only for small aircons like 3/4 ton capacity (like 7000 BTU).


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

i have a everstar portable 11,000 btu air conditoner thats 120v


----------



## 3rdbase

you dont need ac. unless your outside temp is high.....my set has won me awards with friends for 2 4/4 8 trays 6 600s will work fine.. even 2 on a lightmover.......dude its about how close you can get without burn...ive had 12" clones produce an ounce at 12" total......nobody has address the issue of how small that shed is venting wise if ur outside temp is say 74 youcan just pump that air in.......keeping the room at 74....but the trick is cooling those lights so they give of almost no heat to the touch.....light hoods leak so push air though them with cool outdoor air seprate from you intake air different fans.......put ur carbon filter in the room blow the hot air from the room throuh the lights .....that way is air leaks through the seem between the glass and hood it will get scrub again.........because ur pushing air out so all air in the room is getting filterd ......if you pull ul pull stinky air through the glass seam....that not filtered cuz remember ur filter is at one end...to the outside so the key is fan placement......and make them big 10" or 12" i use a 10" fantech and just keeps 4 600s cool........all digies


----------



## The Effen Gee

Couple things:

I recommend you try to not vent the lights too much, as we are approaching  winter, and its gonna get cold. This is depending on the ambient tempreture of the room however. An attic or second story will be warmer than a basement or outdoor shed. If you have sealed refpectors, leave two of them open , one on each bed to allow some levels of heat.
If youre room is sealed witha vent only you are going to need co2. I dont mean a bottle of yeast, as that is a waste of time nless you have a LED PC grow. I mean a co2 tank with a regulator.
Your bulbs on the front, where the ducting meets, should be pointed at the other bulbs, meaning the sockets should all be up against the walls of the box. This will allow maximum light dispersion.

Also, how are you going to water?
Auto?
Pump with a wand?

Dont stress people diggin you about profit. Clubs need meds and this is a lot of work woth a lot of overhead. My time is worth money if I have to spend all of it doing this, I need money to survive. Medical Marijuana has poor nutritional value and is not legal tender towards all debts, private and public. Money is and I believe it is a fair exchange for what you are trying to do. Indoor hydroponically grown tomatoes are INSANELY expensive, I dont see people on soap boxes shouting for free tomatoes and condemning the farmers.

Grow on, just be ethical and legal.
Mark your income from it on your 1040. The ol' govt wants their cut, give it to them. 


You are also going to need a dehumidifier. Maybe.


----------



## 3rdbase

man you better watch what ur doin.......you can cause a fire real quick and you dont want ta be sleepin when that happens...........if you have do wiring then i would grow less.........less is more


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

*the effen gee-* yes my room is sealed except in the lil attic, there is a gable vent which the ducting is going to be routed to for the lights and ac exhaust! o also there is 2 eave vents and 2 vents on top for air flow in the attic! so your saying take 2 of the hoods glass off cuz it will be to cold in there??? i could turn the inline fan down correct if thats a problem????? i dont think it would get to cold in there though with 4 600's and a 1000! also about the c02 i have a tank and regulator, im just waiting on my controller! why would i need one though if the room is sealed! arnt all rooms sealed????? ya we work hard at wat we do, we deserve some money, its not like its free growing these meds, our american labor is also not free, totally legal to sell to our clubs! thanks effen gee, grow on brother 

i dont know how im gonna water! thats the one thing thats still buggin me! i guess probally a rezi and pump and a hose and wand! wat u think???? drip sounds a lil complicated and i dont want lines getting clogged and stuff u know??? wat u think though wats ur advice???

*3rdbase- *ya i was thinking i dont need the ac in the winter but ill put it in there and set up the ducting for summer! so u got an ounce off a 12" clone! thats nice, congrats on that one! i hope i can succeed and do that one day. so ur saying put the charcoal filter in the room and route ducting from there to the hoods and then from there to the inline and then out the gable vent???????? would that be blowing or pulling air, im a lil confused, sorry!!! yes the hoods are all sealed, there super sun 2's! my vortex 8inch 750cfm should keep them all cool correct, cool to the touch probally!!!!?????

wat u mean i can cause a fire! everythings legit! i wired the room with a dual 60 breaker on the main! i used all the correct gauges of wire and everything! and the ac came wirhe 120 volt from the store so i think i should be good! im not doing hyrdro or nothing i dont have rezis full of water





god i mad some bomb ol treats with the canna butter i made! 10 cups golden grahm cerial, 14 oz lil marshmellows, 1/2 cup chochalte chips, 1/2 vanella chips, 4 tblsp of honey and 1/2 cup canna butter! im still high i wish i could give u guys some, there so good


----------



## 3rdbase

so the way i doit is put your fan on ur filterad blow filtered air from the room through the lights out the vent.....that way any smell leaks will just leak back into the contained scrubbed room


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

o ok so put the fan at the beginning instead of where the vent is up in the attic!


----------



## Time4Plan-B

albino you has a green light next to your name man

lol

well done fella


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya ive been trying i got off to a bad start in the beginning! 

how u doing bro


----------



## The Effen Gee

Speaking of a green light, you cold throw a green cfl in your room so you can work/observe your grown in the dark.


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya i planned on it cuz i wired in a switch for one outlet and i planned on puttin in a lamp with a few cfl green lights! its any green light for when the lights are off right??? thanks effen gee that reminds me to get that bulb, thanks bro


----------



## 3rdbase

yes thats where you put it in my setup it has never let me down.....what does the green light mean.....


----------



## dr pyro

green light is a green light plants can not absorb green light. so say your room went lights out and you need to do stuff in there by turning on the green light you will not disrupt the dark cycle. this can be extremely important during your 12/12. any light leeks or interuptions and plants can hermie


----------



## AlbinoDanko12GA

*3rdbase- *well i might just have to do that then, ive never tried blowing air through the lights, ive always pulled air! im always up for something new! the green light is for during the day when the lights are off and u wanna pest spray or water or something

*Dy pyro- *ya i sealed my room off pretty good! went through about 10 tubes of caulking! anything else i could do in that nature??? when im in my room i can see light through the door on a few sides, im thinking ill go get some sticking foam, like the stuff that came with my ac for mounting the duct kit to the window

heres some pics of the room mates, just got 2 pieces of ducting connected to the gable vent exhausting for the lights and ac


----------



## dr pyro

coming along nicely i see. i push air threw lights as well. im thinkin of adding fans to other side so one side pushes the other end will be pulling. i was readin one of jbones threads. i beleive he does it with great  results. the fans i use are hoffman fans used mostly in hvac, furnaces forget what else they blow some serious air


----------



## 3rdbase

dr pyro... i dont care for u but just a little lesson...if ur setup is like that then then putting a fan on the other side makes no sense ...only if ur cfm were aif that or more than the fan pushing.....not smart better to vent lights like this......so say you have 4 lights instead of pushing one end and pulling on the other ....u should either get an adequate fan for 2 or for 4//....but really you dont want say a 10 inch fan 1200cfm doing all 4 unnnnnllleeesss ..you split right off the fan then run 1 hose vent through 2 lights and then the other vent hose thorugh the other 2 lights rejoining at the other end then out... so as that your splitting the 1200cfm into 600cfm per two lights.....or have 2 10s clear out a pair each.....now put that in ya pipe and smoke it


----------



## dr pyro

holy sheep use some puctation in there i cant read 100 word sentences. its one big line of words. y you still starting crap.please go around the forum and criticize other peoples setup.i dont have my fans setup that way i was just sayin people on here do it that way.go back to 3rd grade and learn to read or have your mom teach you.sorry albino


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## dr pyro

there is no right or wrong way to vent as long as the end result is lower or acceptable temps. there are a couple links her on 2 fan setups you be the judge
http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42909
http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42831
there are many more allover the place


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## dr pyro

and i dont take lessons from 40 yr old men who live with there mom and dad and think that a gal of gasoline will last 12 hrs in a generator haha.your words mean nothing to me so ramble on some more ....i'll let you know when something makes sense


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## dr pyro

foam the crap out of it.i wanna see more pics of inside.ostpicsworthless:


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## NorCalHal

IMO, 3rd base is way off base.

Pulling air theu hoods is the CORRECT way to cool lights. Period. No debate or even a friggin doubt.
As far as heating up your fan because of the temps of the lights??? what r u talking about? That is completley false.

Modern hoods seal quite nicely. Back in da day, we would have to sael up the lights with that crazy silver tape, no need for that anymore. Most all new hoods I see are self sealed.

There is no need to split off either if you are just cooling say 4, 1000 watt lights. If you have aircooled hoods, and install hard elcows at your 90degree turns, and use insulated ducting and keep your ducting runs tight and to a minimal, you will have NO issues cooling 4 lights with an 8" Can fan or equivilant. Trust me on this.

If your gonna play the game at this level, money spent should be no issue.
You need your light exhaust SEPERATE from your room exhaust. ONLY the room exhaust needs to have a Carbon scrubber installed.

That brings me to the point of ensureing that your light loop intake is pulling air from OUTSIDE the room. No need for a filter thus no big CFM "drain" from ahving to pullthru the filter, then thru your lights.

I know some of you fellas sare going to think I am full of it. But this is coming from someone who has tried every method twice.
If you want cool temps on your lights aand your room, pull air thru your lights.


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## NorCalHal

Another 2cents, I frequently check rooms with a regular 60 watt buld that is standard in most homes. I turn it on, do what I need to, and turn it off. Soemtimes, it is on for an hour during the plants "nighttime", and I have NEVER had a hermie. Genetics.


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## 3rdbase

well pyro ..youv done it again you continually  show ur  juvenile ways .. with the mom and dad jokes cmon sir are 12...please only respond to my replies with your own well thought out expressions since i dont think ur capable i guess il understand ...ur a moron..further more enough of u is a good thing sir ....back to the point there are countless way to remove or lower heat from an area..it all depends on ur setup...lights venting ac etcetera.. mine was only an example..to the other point no hood is completely seald and if you pull air u will suck the glass to the hood minimizing leakage but not 100% no way.it will pull a little air from the room through the glass and hood.stinky air there are no hoods that will claim they dont leak...


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

*dr Pyro- *where Should I Put Foam At! The Drywall And Insulation Is Already On! I Caulked The Top And Bottom Plate Along With All The Channels Of Framing And From The Slab To The Bottom Plate! Went Through A Few Bottles U Can Say Lol! Anyway Ill Take Some Pics A Lil Later And Post Em

*3rdbase- *im Having Mine Pull Through All The 400's And Then Go Into A Y And The Now 1 Piece Of Ducting Through The 1000 To The Fan And Then Out, U Think Vortex 8 750cfm Will Cool All 5 Lights! 

*norcalhal- * I Got The Super Sun 2 Hoods, They Seal Quit Nice, I Love The Quality Of Them! I Cant Wait To Turn Them On! So Wat Do U Think About My Set Up?? Am I Venting It Right? U Think That 8 Inch Vortex Will Be Adequate? Or Do U Think I Should Run Them Sealed Like I Beleive You Were Saying!!?? I Posted A Lil Drawing To See If I Understood You Right, Check It Out! Thanks


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## 3rdbase

and to the point.........all you have to do is put a candle or any smoke near the glass and hood i _*guarantee it will leak unless u seal them with tape or silicone :argue:*_


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## 3rdbase

done right ...maybe but not to the point where theres no heat at all.. at thats what were striving for ya..


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## 3rdbase

what size are the lights in? that ur using the 8" for


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## dr pyro

put some pics up and show me where its leakin you should be able to get all leaks with alittle time and work.thanks hal for your post  you cant debate with this guy he has no idea what he is doing  and goes around spreading useless info on here that dont make sense. every post he has made is just flat out wrong  just really dumb wrong if there is such a thing. sorry albino for the rant again i got the ingnore button on him now so i dont have to read his foolish posts.


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## dr pyro

i misread your post so your getting leeks still aside the door like you said foam strips or black plastic. every room i have done has been lined with black plastic to unsure no light


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

*3rdbase-* im using 4 600's with super sun2 hoods and 1 1000 in a radiant ac hood, all my hoods seal pretty good with foam all the way around them! 

*dy pyro-* lol its alright its entertaimemnt lol! i dont have no batts for my camera ill take some pics later for you bro. its pretty much around the door though! ill take some pics later


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

so put some panda film in front of the door??? i was planning on painting the walls flat white and calling it good, i dont think im gonna use mylar or panda film! a lil fake wall with it in front of the door along with a zipper should be good! that way when i go in there light dont leak out as im walking in!


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## Time4Plan-B

Hi albino im good hope you are too man.

anyway your door leaking a little light easy fix pin some battens along the top and bottom and both sides from the inside pretty close upto the actual door then stick some draft foam along the edges so when the door shuts it compresses the foam hey presto no light leaks.

All of your lights are being cooled from 1 x inline fan may not be enough to cool but considering you appear to be pulling air through 4 x 600's into the 1 x 1000 and out the inline fan id expect heat to build up along the way and personally i would pull air from the fan from the outside pushing it through   the lights.

anyway where are the plants

lol

t4


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

im good, just working on this room and my house still. so put the fan in front of the set of 400's??? so that would be a sealed vent system then right???? i would need another inline for room exhaust! a inline fan on the ceiling sucking air out???? sorry im new to all this and im just trying to learn and ask as many questions as needed, thanks

there veggin up in the 3x6 closet


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## Time4Plan-B

Basically instead of pulling air through your lights and exiting out of your inline fan do the opposite and push the air through your lights p.s its says on your schematic 4 x 600's btw and exiting out of the room in other words just turn your inline fan around and re-attach the ducting then jobs done.

Yes an inline fan hung high in the room as heat rises therefore thats the best place to situate one would be needed as your other inline fan is purely to keep temps down in your room.

Any q's fire away man

t4


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## NorCalHal

T4 has some good advice on the light leak, and that is pretty much what I do to "light proof" door ways. Another thing is to build a "light trap" just inside the room where the door opens. I hang Panda from the ceiling to the floor just around the door way and use a Tarp Zipper to get in and out. That really helps cut down on light leaks with higher wattage rooms.

Your pic shows excatally what I was talking about, but I too agree that it MAY just not cool all 5 lights enough. As far as pushing/pulling, I do not think it will make a differance as afar as one cooling better then the other.
weather you pull air from the 600 side or the 1000 side, it still goes thru all hoods right?

I allways think it better to pull, and the MAIN reason is if you push, you WILL push small amounts of hot air into the room. Period. The MINIMAL leak you MAY have by pulling air and having "stinky room air" enter the hood cooling system is nothing to worry about and it will not be a cause for alarm or smell.
With the hoods you have, that glass will suck wight up to the foam seal around the hoods, and if you pushed air bro, it would try to seperate the seal and force hot air out, IMO.

The 6" room exhaust is the blower you need to have tied to a Carbon filter.

WORST case, you will need another blower and string up 2 of the 4 600's to one blower, and the other 2, 600's and the 1000 to one.

We are rolling into winter, so I think you can get a couple of clicks off before you really have to worry about big heat issues, so I think you can run with that one 8" for the next few months.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

*T4-  *wat are battens???? my door is a outswing so would that still work in my case?????? i plan on puttin foam on all sides of where the trim is gonna go so when the door shuts theres foam in fron of it in the room to block the light out like u mentioned! theres foam on the door casing but that sht sucks! ok so i will use my 6inch eco fan for the room exhaust along with a diy caron filter! then ill have my vortex exhausting the lights on a sealed system! pulling outside air from the north of the building and exhausting out the south of the building out the gable vent!


*NORCALHAL- *ya im gonna throw up some panda film and make a lil door with a zipper so no one can see theres a light in there at night when i go in there! you know wat i never thought about that with pushing air, it really will try and seperate the glass from the hood and IT WILL LEAK HOT AIR correct????? that makes a lot of sense! if i pull it will suck the glass to the foam and seal it pretty tight! i got another 6 inch laying around if needed so ill keep that in mind! so just attatch the diy carbon filter to the fan and hang them both off the ceiling right??? now is that room exhaust gonna run 24/7??  ya hopefully i can get 2 or 3 clicks off by april or so!




im going to the store to get batterys then ill take some pics for you guys, ill have some bud porn for all you guys too, oh and gals didnt forget about you 2dog lol


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

the first pics are of the door not being light proof that u guys wanted and the other is of the room with a whole bunch of trash in it. o and some babies hanging i just cut down lol! the res of the pics are some bud porn for u guys of some sour diesel, kryptonite, g-13 and ice queen! these came out of the tent a few weeks ago and are finishing outside now!


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

heres some equpiment and my plants vegging (grape punch, blueberry cheese, kanaga, shiva skunk, purple rock, purple kush, sour diesel, sour bubble, blue dream and a bubba kush) 

oh and heres some poor lil seedlings! i dont know wats wrong with them


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## 2Dog

those seedlings need many things...the light closer..watering more often, no nutes til 4 weeks, dead leaves get removed and flushed in my house because they will mold...light should be as close as comfortable heat wise also do you have airflow in the room and what is the temp...


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

well i just tested my water here at the new house and the ph in 8.2! thats a major role in all my plants health! i should immedietaly flush all them with 6.0 - 6.5 phed water huh?????? im getting GH's ph down right now, be back in 10 minutes

o the seedlings are probally about 2 months old or so


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## 2Dog

I would replant them into something bigger...then water with the good ph water...then get them under a light close as possible..even if they are old enough for nutes they may be root bound,.and too small for it.


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## 2Dog

the reason they are so tall and not bushy is they are straining towards that light with all their might...


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

i dont thnik they need to be transplanted! there hasnt been no growth or nothing im sure there root structure is very very weak and isnt producting! im gonna go look at them right now though!   OH YES THEY DO NEED TO BE TRANSPLANTED! THEY ARE REALLY ROOTBOUND! I JUST GOT PH DOWN AND SOME WATER MIXED UP AND CLEAN 10 1 GAL POTS FROM A PREVIOUS GROW AND AM TRANS PLANTING THE SEEDS IN THERE AND A FEW CLONES! ILL BE BACK IN A FEW


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## 2Dog

glad u r taking care of em hope they make it!! my Blue widow didnt grow much and was still root bound...it happens.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

thank you. yuuuum some blue widow sounds nice, wat is that some blueberry X white widow??? 

i transplanted them all in 1 gal's! some of them were REALLY ROOTBOUND! i hope they stay alive! i only have 1 more seed of ak48 and only 1 more of the white widow! i have 4 wonder woman though and 3 free seeds (white widow, blue hash, and cali hash) all from dynafem through Attitude seedbank. got them free with the beans i bought!


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## Dr.Greenbud

AlbinoDanko12GA said:
			
		

> thank you. yuuuum some blue widow sounds nice, wat is that some blueberry X white widow??? quote]
> 
> Yep, that's what it is, i have one growing now and 2 clones i took from it.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

nice, sounds like a wonderful strain


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## 2Dog

I would love to have some hash plants they are supossed to be awesome...good luck with the clones and seedlings!


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

thank you! ill post some pics in a couple days to see if u guys notice a recovery! thanks


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

2Dog said:
			
		

> I would love to have some hash plants they are supossed to be awesome...good luck with the clones and seedlings!


 
Well once all these girls get out of the veg closet ill be popping those seeds and will give ya some cuts, im making a 40 site ez cloner tonight! next time im down in ur area ill let u know and will bring some hash cuts along for the ride! ya im still lokking for that bomb ol purps in the bay, probally going to kens gdp next week cuz i have to work down by oakland!


also heres some pics of the seedlings and the clones from HS, does anyone know wats wrong with the leafs with the blue dream clone, there curling downwards and burnt on the tip! is that heat stress?? no other plant has that problem though! thanks talk to you guys later


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

wat do u guys think


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

wat do u guys thinks up with these leafs, more nutes or nute burn??


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

well it was a nute build up in the soil, i figured it out a couple weeks ago but forgot to update on this thread!!! the ppm of the run off using plain water was 3800 ppm in one and 2800 in anmother and some others were 1200! i flushed all of them with phed water last night so well see how they get here in the next few days, they should recover nicely!! also i flushed with 8.2 ph tap water a week ago and it messed them up a little so last night i flushed with 6.6 tap water!!! i didnt realize ph was so important but i do know now!!!!


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## leafminer

What on earth has happened to those poor plants in "newroomplants026.jpg" ?
Have you been picking the leaves off them?


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

those are seeds that have stretched and all of the older leafs have died off!!!! i have transplanted them and moved them closer to the light, there gonna get there first feeding in a couple days


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

well its 90% DONE! except i scratched the 6 600s and instead went with 4 600's and a 1000 watter! but my 1000 water is in use in the tent and will be hung up in the room in a few weeks when the time is right! ill have some pics for you guys tonight of some of the ladies that got deposited in there and have had 36 hours of dark!!! ill take some pics when the lgihts turn on!!! i still have to fill the other tray but am waiting 2 weeks! i might make a new journal but not sure, wat u guys thnik, this is gone be a fun one and there will be plenty of pics and vids! 3rd time is a charm hopefully, we'll see...... check in later guys

pics will be up around 9


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## nouvellechef

Doing the dark thing huh? Round three should see changes. Nute schedule, pest regime, lighting and ventilation. I am expecting big buds.


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

ya i figured i would try the dark thing that everyone talks about, i want to see for my self! ya its my 3rd time hopefully all goes well!!! i went from the 1000 to the 4 600;s and 1000 so we'll see how it turns out, as for the ventalation i got a 8inch vortex exhausting as well as pulling from outside through the wall with a 6" filter!!! temps should be around 70 - 75 max!! as for the pest regime im spraying with something different every 2 - 3 days!!! i hope this all goes well , ithink i know enough now this run!!!


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

heres some pics!!!!


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## AlbinoDanko12GA

o and the seedlings that will be in there shortly


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