# ph issues



## daf (Dec 3, 2009)

i am 5 weeks into flower , greenhouse glh seeds, e&f, when i was in veg my nutes will drift from 5.5 to 6.0 in a couple of days. for the past 2 weeks my nutes are drifting down from 5.8 to 5.5 the same as above but down drift is this normal, using ff nutes just added cal mag a week ago some fan leaves turning yellow.


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## pcduck (Dec 3, 2009)

if your  plants are feeding properly your pH should drift up ^

Not having enough nutes in the res will cause this as will not having a clean environment.(they plants maybe feeding so rapidly that they are depleting the nutes, checking ppm's will help here)
some plants when trying to counter a disease or virus will lower the pH themselves trying to rid themselves of the disease/virus.


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## IRISH (Dec 4, 2009)

what are you checking your ph with?


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## daf (Dec 4, 2009)

hanna ph tester,  ppms are at 1400


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## zem (Dec 7, 2009)

get som ph drop tests used in aquariums they can tell you the ph close enough are cheap and fool proof you can use em to check if that testr breaks. i threw my tester aside when its probe broke been using the drop test ever since. however these drifts in PH are within normal so no much worry here


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## pcduck (Dec 8, 2009)

I used those drops on my first grow, they are not very accurate. When the drops were reading a pH of 5.8, the pH was actually 6.2. The plants grew but grew a lot better once I got a accurate meter and adjusted the pH properly


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 8, 2009)

zem said:
			
		

> get som ph drop tests used in aquariums they can tell you the ph close enough are cheap and fool proof you can use em to check if that testr breaks. i threw my tester aside when its probe broke been using the drop test ever since. however these drifts in PH are within normal so no much worry here



Sorry guy, but you are just full of bad advise.  

The drops are not nearly accurate enough for our purposes--the pH scale is expotential.  There is a ton of difference between 5.5 and 6.0 when feeding your plants, but very little change in your pH strips color.  Stick with a quality meter and calibrate it as it is needed.


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## Budders Keeper (Dec 8, 2009)

IME with E&F I've found that in certain stages plants will eat a lot of nutes (which buffer PH) causing ph to rise...and other stages they will drink a lot of water, causing a higher concentration of nutes, lowering ph. As pcduck stated, a ppm meter will allow you to monitor whether your plants are eating more...or drinking more. Pcduck is also right on about the cleanliness affecting ph also. This is because fungas/bacteria will feed on your nutes causing a more rapid depletion of them(eliminating buffer) causing a more rapidly rising ph.


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## zem (Dec 8, 2009)

The Hemp Goddess said:
			
		

> Sorry guy, but you are just full of bad advise.
> 
> The drops are not nearly accurate enough for our purposes--the pH scale is expotential.  There is a ton of difference between 5.5 and 6.0 when feeding your plants, but very little change in your pH strips color.  Stick with a quality meter and calibrate it as it is needed.


not strips i said drop test, the litmus paper don't work but a good brand of drop test works perfect. i have a quality milwaukee ph tester and i compared them time after time, every time i did the quarium ph test it gave me the same reading as the tester every single time! you won't be off by more than 0.1 except if you're color blind hemp goddess try them yourself and tell me what you find out, i use the sera brand ph test drops


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## pcduck (Dec 8, 2009)

I tried it myself *zem.* my pH had a difference of .4 between the 2.  the meter read 5.8 for pH and my drops read 6.2 pH


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## zem (Dec 8, 2009)

pcduck said:
			
		

> I tried it myself *zem.* my pH had a difference of .4 between the 2.  the meter read 5.8 for pH and my drops read 6.2 pH


0.4??? you must be uising phenol red test drops those are not for readig just to know if acid or base i dont think youre using the right stuff. look at the color chart 6 is yellow 6.5 is light green 7 is green and 5.5 is light orange 5 is orange i never had such a difference in reading the color changes perfectly with ph swings. i use sera brand the only i ever tried. i only switched to using drops after my tester broke and i always saw the results to be the same and the drops are cheap and fool proof. theyr used to keep fish alive. if i were to go with a tester i wont use any pen i'd get a full time dipped probe auto calibrating otherwise it's too much fuss cleaning the probe and calibrating my tester


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## pcduck (Dec 8, 2009)

Yes *zem* it is the right ones...I have been growing for 30 years and have had more tropical fish then I can count.


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## zem (Dec 8, 2009)

pcduck said:
			
		

> Yes *zem* it is the right ones...I have been growing for 30 years and have had more tropical fish then I can count.


lol you know if i haven't tried comparing the results with drop test so many times i'd go buy a new probe for my tester after that post of yours. i cant believe that you've been off by 0.4 no way except if you managed to find some really bad brand i tried them countless times with drinking water from closed bottles they give me the same ph as written on bottle, i've tried them when they're old and they still worked and all i had to pay was like 10$ every 400tests. and if you say that 5.8 on meter was 6.2 in drops so you're suggesting a + or - 0.4 that is 0.8! why do they even sell this stuff? maybe your metr was off  i'll show you some pics of the experiment on ph drop test with bottled water and you'll judge for yourself i'll take the pics next time i visit my growroom will be posting them by tomorrow


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## pcduck (Dec 9, 2009)

zem said:
			
		

> lol you know if i haven't tried comparing the results with drop test so many times i'd go buy a new probe for my tester after that post of yours. i cant believe that you've been off by 0.4 no way except if you managed to find some really bad brand i tried them countless times with drinking water from closed bottles they give me the same ph as written on bottle, i've tried them when they're old and they still worked and all i had to pay was like 10$ every 400tests. and if you say that 5.8 on meter was 6.2 in drops so you're suggesting a + or - 0.4 that is 0.8! why do they even sell this stuff? maybe your metr was off  i'll show you some pics of the experiment on ph drop test with bottled water and you'll judge for yourself i'll take the pics next time i visit my growroom will be posting them by tomorrow



Do not bother  *zem* your pictures have been all over the internet all ready:rofl:

I do not have to use your items to judge, I can judge for myself. The drops suck..when are you gonna get it?


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## iamtd (Dec 9, 2009)

Just to jump in. I was using aquarium drops in my last grows and i wasn't very successful. I bought a ph tester from ebay for $20 dollars or so and this grow is going alot better. I haven't done any test's. But as far as i can tell. I haven't changed. So i would have to say using anything that gives you a more accurate reading has to be better.


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## pcduck (Dec 9, 2009)

:yeahthat:

To bad zem won't listen. He could learn a lot if he would only open his eyes and mind.....BIU :bolt::bong2:


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## Budders Keeper (Dec 9, 2009)

pcduck said:
			
		

> Yes *zem* it is the right ones...I have been growing for 30 years and have had more tropical fish then I can count.


OK that's it! I've been fairly sucessful with drops over the last several years...with an occasional lock-up or deficiancy battle...but fairly successful. With that said, I'm getting a meter today...to possibly eliminate those occasional battles. I can't wait to see how far off everything is and will report when hydrostore opens, like 5 hours. Hmmmm, maybe this is why I can't keep a healthy mom for more than a year or so?????


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## DonJones (Dec 9, 2009)

One thing about the drops, they have to be used BEFORE the additives are mixed in because you have no way of knowing what kind of a chemical reaction they may have with the drops that will effect the out come.

I have been using what I think is probably the same thing from PETSMART -- you put 3 drops into 0.5 ml of water and then compare the color change to the chart and occasionally checking it against the shop's Hanna meter and it has always been within 0.1 but I have a very stable water source.

As to challenging the 0.4 plus or minus, maybe this will help to give you a better perspective -- the blood glucose monitors for adjusting insulin dosage have a plus or minus 20% range and that is used for adjusting a life threatening as well as saving medication that is often titrated on a difference in a blood sugar of less than 2%.  Now doesn't that make a fish water testing method tht is plus or minus 0.4 over a range of 15 forph pretty accurate.

Using soil, that is probably acceptable, but for hydro I think I'll still use the meters. Incidentally a cheap meter of unknown accuracy is worse than no meter at all because you will be chasing a false reading and may actually be making the PH worse than if you left it alone.  That is not to say that you  can't get some good meters on sale some where but you are better off to stay with a known brand, or at least with one that you have personal experience with.

Good smoking.


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## zem (Dec 9, 2009)

a good tester will be more accurate but a cheapo tester is most of the times no use. with drops your eyes might make you believe it is 5.8 when it's really 5.9 so yes for the most accurate reading ph tester would be better but i dont think your grow problems were ph related if you were testing regularly with drops you should be close to 0.1  and not 0.4 points this will not do significant damage if any. i'm startig to believe that there are some bad brands of drop tests since many growers are sayin they were off by several ph points. with my sera drops i always got it right. sera is a well known german brand has very good reputation for quality products try it out compare results with your tester only 5$ you'll be impressed hxxp://www.aquariumspecialty.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1241
and i'm not suggesting anyone throw his good tester and gettin drops but after my milwaukee ph pen probe broke i decided i stick to drops since i've tried em in many ways i'm only sayin they work if you broke your tester or if you dont wana buy a tester. i wish i had some fancy autocalibrating constantly dipped ph tester but i dont and i hated having to clean the probe and calibrate the pen so i stuck with drops but thats just me, every grower has his conditions and goes with what works best for him most important is that it works. for me cheap effective low maintenance is key others have other priorities  cheers


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## Growdude (Dec 9, 2009)

I believe you can get "close enough" using the drops.

That said my Milwaukee PH pen only needs cal once per grow and is always spot on.


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## pcduck (Dec 10, 2009)

I thought that I was close enough too and I was. I grew some killer weed. But what a difference in the grow room once I got a  pH meter. IME..


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## daf (Dec 10, 2009)

my ph seems to have gotten stable 5.8 i cleaned out everything but my leaves are still turning yellow


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