# 12/1 lighting--Any truth or banana in the tail pipe?



## Sin inc (Dec 3, 2013)

hey guys ive been following this issue for a while . there's has yet to be a round table on this here .
 copy and pasted from icmag
found this by
joe pietri  


Grow Bigger and Better,Saving 30-50% on your energy cost!

By Joe Pietri

The biggest innovator in the history of cannabis in my generation is Reinhard Delp. Not only did he invent and holder of the patent for ice water extraction, he has been building flower forcers since 1992. His new solar powered Sun-gate is the leader of the industry. He was the first to feminize seeds and sell them in Europe in the late 90s. His process was done naturally, without the use of any chemicals.

No one is more copied but seldom matched than Mr. Delp, who to me is the top grower of our generation.

The first time he impressed me he showed me 2 plants, planted next to one another, 1 completely covered in powdery mildew, the other completely clean and beautiful.
He was developing mildew and mold resistant genetics.

In the late 90s Reinhard brought back the gas lantern routine that you find in any college grade horticulture book, and applied it to cannabis. Cannabis needs only 13 hours to stay in growth state. The 18-6 lighting in growth pattern, actually stress your plants, that never get that much light in one-day outdoors. Cannabis is an outdoor plant. Growing indoors you should copy how it grows outdoors.

No Cannabis growing in Afghanistan gets 18 hours of light in growth pattern. Most strains today have some part Indica in their genetic pool. Even equatorial strains dont get 18 hours of sun a day.

12-1 lighting is as follows: 12 hours lights on, 5.5 lights off, 1-hour lights on, 5.5 lights off, and repeat schedule. The 1 hour on in between off period fools the plants that stay in growth state!

Your immediate savings is 5 hours in energy costs daily, as well as your bulbs and equipment lasting longer. But how do the plants react to this lighting schedule?

You see immediate growth response from your plants, they are happy from the added rest time. By day 14 the plants tripled in size. The plants are bushy with twice as many bud sites without topping or bending, In fact, when you top and stretch your plants out, you get many more bud sites than you would have had under 18-6 using same procedure of topping and stretching plant, your growing bigger and better and faster.

So you're saving 5 hours daily in energy costs, as well as your accelerated growth pattern which also saves you time and energy and equipment use.

In the growth cycle, never use 12-12, start your flowering period at 11 hours on 13 hours off. When your are growing outdoors each day you get less and less sun light, you should copy the way the sun acts naturally in your indoor grow. So first 2 weeks of flower you go 11 on 13 off, the next 2 weeks you go down to 10.5 on 13.5 off, next 2 weeks 10 on 14 off, next two weeks 9.5 on 14.5 off and the last weeks of flower you should be at 9 hours on and 15 hours off. Youll get bigger and better buds by copying the way the sun light works on cannabis outdoors.

Cannabis is an outdoor plant and you should copy the way it grows outdoors indoors. The only thing that 18-6, and then 12-12 do is make the energy companies rich as well as the people who sell lights and equipment, the more you use the more you spend. 12-1 is a more natural way to grow indoors and you well have the best results you have ever had and save as much as 50% in energy costs.

Something to think about for sure but would only work if you are doing your flowering plants in batches. Many growers do, so anyone want to try this and get back to us?

Might be good for folks who have smart meters hooked up. Not so likely to flag suspicious energy usage patterns and if it saves a buck so much the better.


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## Hushpuppy (Dec 3, 2013)

I personally believe this is total B.S. first because they say that 18/6 stresses the plants due to them having too much light. If that is the case then all of us here who veg under 24hr light would grow nothing but herms. 

Second; the idea that MJ is an "outdoor" plant and to get good results you have to more closely mimic outdoors is also bunk. MJ is one of the most adaptable plants and when grown indoors, will adapt to what serves its needs. For indoor growing, we have to optimize the needs of the plant not mimic nature as there is no way to fully mimic nature, and trying to only leads to more problems.

They say you see immediate growth response and plants triple in size. That is "stretch" not real growth. If I had not already experienced the differences in growth from lighting variations to prove what I am saying, then I would be more inclined to take a closer look at this, but my experience and others around me have shown that this theory isn't worth the bother.

Electricity is typically around 8-11cents per kilowatt/hour. That means that if you are running a system that is using 2000 watts per hour and you leave it on for 24hrs, then you are only using $5.28 of electricity at the higher rate. If you switch to their plan and save the "immediate 5hrs", then you are saving $1.10 while your plants are "By day 14 the plants tripled in size" stretching that much from the lack of light energy. 

I don't mean to sound like I am busting on you for this as you just posed the question, but experience has already proven this idea false. Just stick to the 24hr light for veg and 12/12 for flower, and you will get the best results.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 3, 2013)

I have to say that I believe that it is a "banana in the tailpipe".  I also do not believe that "Growing indoors you should copy how it grows outdoors.".  When growing indoors, we are attempting to optimize conditions, not mimic them.  In addition, Clarke has done some studies on light and different schedules.  He showed that even running your lights 10/14 (rather than 12/12) can result in 50% less bud.  He also showed that plants will grow all the time the lights are on and that there is no benefit from a "rest period" during veg.  

Although I have grown for decades, I have never heard of Reinhard Delp or of anything he "did".  If he created fems without chemicals, why aren't others using his method?  Where are the strains that won't develop PM?  I am not sure how you can actually patent ice water extraction.

I have read about this many times in the past, but no one ever reports back on how it works.  I have not seen one single grow posted on any site that I have frequented that shows the results of a grow done like this, although I have run into several people who were doing it.  The posts just fade away without ever posting any results.  I see it as one of those things that, if it worked, everyone would be talking about it and a lot of people would be doing it.  We would all love it if we could run the lights less, but at this point, I am trusting Clarke and his controlled studies and will continue to run veg at 24/7 and flowering at 12/12.


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## ozzydiodude (Dec 3, 2013)

> 12-1 lighting is as follows: 12 hours lights on, 5.5 lights off, 1-hour lights on, 5.5 lights off, and repeat schedule. The 1 hour on in between off period fools the plants that stay in growth state!



Total B.S here. This is one of the ways Soma makes femmed seed


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## Sin inc (Dec 3, 2013)

ok guys heres something else for eveybody to look over.
hxxp://theweedblog.com/how-to-use-the-121-lighting-method-for-efficient-marijuana-cultivation/
there are pics on the link page
By Dennis Ford

I&#8217;d like to talk about a subject you will here about often on Cannabis Dynamics. The 12/1 lighting method.

The 12/1 is a very simple concept, but for some reason has been very hard to catch on. People just don&#8217;t believe its that easy or that it works as well as it does.

In a standard lighting scheme, we have all come to believe in basically one or two camps. I won&#8217;t get into who&#8217;s behind the whole &#8220;conspiracy&#8221; of keeping 12/1 out of the masses, but if you want to hear some good **** please see John P. RN (you know who!) or Joseph Pietri on Facebook. There are some interesting stories, but the truth is the current methods that 99% of growers use create a very telltale footprint for LEO to follow if they begin to suspect you.

I&#8217;ve found that for veg growth there are the two camps of 18/6 and 24/0 (18 hours of light and 6 hours of darkness, this is not how 12/1 works though, that will be explained below). The fact is that all plants need a darkness period to process the days energy into food and growth. Therefore your doing yourself absolutely no favors using a 24/0 for anything other than cloning. All you have to do is look outside, there are only 2 places on earth that ever get 24 hour light at any point, and you aren&#8217;t going to find ANYTHING growing there. Cloning of course is not of nature, we are tricking nature, so we put the plant into a constant light period to facilitate this. We&#8217;ll talk a lot more about cloning someday in another post. 18/6 works on the other hand, but the truth is your wasting light. Its time to wake up! Its time to trick nature again!

Truth is you really only need to break up the photosynthesis dark period with an hour of light to maintain veg, and in doing so you give the little lady a massive darkness processing/growth period. 12/1 is simply 12 hours on, 5.5 hours off, 1 hour on, and 5.5 hours off. Then repeat through your entire veg period.

Again!

12 hours ON, 5.5 hours OFF, 1 hour ON, and 5.5 hours OFF for each 24 hour period.

This is only for VEGETATIVE PERIOD, we have another simple process to follow for flowering.

We are also not going to discuss nutrients or tea&#8217;s just yet either. Those will be other posts coming soon.

For vegetation, this is all you need to know lighting wise. Trust me, I was skeptical at first too, but John P. RN really convinced me after spending a couple years of listening to Joseph Pietri to try it. It worked great for him, and now it works great for me.

One of the obvious first things you&#8217;ll see is a significant drop in your power bill. Who doesn&#8217;t love that? But also your doing one other thing, breaking up the light period to prevent a multi-year footprint that LEO might find matches footprints they are looking for.

FOR FLOWERING!

Flowering is simple as well, but its important during this delicate period in a plants life cycle to follow as closely what the evolution of the plant is looking for. Veg is different, the plant just wants to grow as big and lovely as it can. During flowering the plant is following a very specific genetic code for its conduct to continue the propagation of its species. This is why we adjust our lighting every 2 weeks.

When we begin flowering, move everything to 11 hours on, and 13 hours off. You will keep this for 2 weeks, then drop the lighting period by 30 minutes, I.E. after two weeks you will switch to 10.5 hours on, and 13.5 hours off. Continue this 30 minute drop every 2 weeks until you reach 9 hours on/ 15 hours off. Finish your flowering at this lighting.

Trust me, have a look at some of the pics below. These plants were all grown, in the various stages you see here, using these methods.

12/1 works people, save yourself some money, and maybe just save your ***!

Dennis Ford, Cannabis Dynamics

Big thank you to John P. RN and Joseph Pietri


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## WeedHopper (Dec 3, 2013)

Total complete BULLSHIT. Go have a talk with REAL Commercial growers and they too will say the same thing,BULLSHIT.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 3, 2013)

How is the method in the second post different than the original post?  Are both of them claiming this method as their own?  It appears you want to try this but are looking for "approval".  If you believe it will work, go for it.  I personally am not willing to trust my crop to a method that I truly do not believe will be beneficial.  I keep going back to Clarke and his controlled studies.  I don't do Facebook.


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## Hushpuppy (Dec 3, 2013)

For comment on this second article, please see my entire comment on the first article above  The same facts apply.

However, like THG said, if you want to try it, try it and see. Then you can report it to everyone here with journal pics and tracking info. If you really want to do it right, do 2 grows side by side with same everything but lighting schedules, then we can all do a compare and contrast with real facts and figures.


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## WeedHopper (Dec 3, 2013)

> Cannabis is an outdoor plant. Growing indoors you should copy how it grows outdoors




 By the way,,didnt ya say to keep things the same on an inside grow as they are on an outside grow??Cause I have never seen the Sun do that 12 on,,, 5.5 off, 1 on,,,,5.5 off again crap ever,,have you? If so yur on some good ACID and i want some.


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## pcduck (Dec 3, 2013)

Sin inc said:
			
		

> 12/1 lighting--Any truth or banana in the tail pipe?



More like a potato in the tailpipe.

I read an article many, many years ago on a light schedule that was similar. Was so long ago I cannot remember who wrote article but their(the authors) conclusion was it did not work.

Hick and I had a conversation about it here at mP awhile back also. He had some real good links(info) on it. Maybe he will pop in and chime in.


Soma :rofl: Ozzy you are always good for a laugh.:laugh:
I would not purchase Soma's high priced seeds(hermies) even if he gave them free to me.


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## budz4me (Dec 3, 2013)

*12/1 lighting = Shake Weight.....
*


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## Hick (Dec 4, 2013)

pcduck said:
			
		

> More like a potato in the tailpipe.
> 
> I read an article many, many years ago on a light schedule that was similar. Was so long ago I cannot remember who wrote article but their(the authors) conclusion was it did not work.
> 
> ...



I dont recall the specific conversation pc, but my first guess would be that I posted the information found in this old antiquated text  ... hxxp://www.scribd.com/doc/55325688/Marijuana-Botany-An-Advanced-Study-1981
   It's still "IMHO" the most concise and correct book I've found on mj horticulture. Anyone thay hasn't read it, should...


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## 4u2sm0ke (Dec 4, 2013)

Hick said:
			
		

> I dont recall the specific conversation pc, but my first guess would be that I posted the information found in this old antiquated text  ... hxxp://www.scribd.com/doc/55325688/Marijuana-Botany-An-Advanced-Study-1981
> It's still "IMHO" the most concise and correct book I've found on mj horticulture. Anyone thay hasn't read it, should...



:ciao:   Thats a great read and Help...

:48:


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## Sin inc (Dec 4, 2013)

hey guys yes its thier saying the same thing. but the second post does have pics and will lead you to others that are trying the same. iam on 24/0 12/12 camp. i just thought  we were to help and provide the family with all grow techniques . i think its pretty cool that others are using techniques  other the norm . i ve been doing a lot of reading on the 12-1 i have read whole journals and it does work for some . i mean we all have advanced are grow tec using others information right.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 4, 2013)

LOL--Of course it is interesting to look at different growing methods.  However nothing about this seems good and we are letting you know why we think this.  I question most of their assumptions--like trying to mimic outdoors, that less light will not cause less bud, etc.  We know that even an 18/6 light schedule causes stretch.  I am with Hick on Clarke's dissertation.  This should be required reading for anyone cultivation cannabis.

And I just simply cannot take anything on you tube, facebook at face value.   People can make things look far different than they are in real life.


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## WeedHopper (Dec 4, 2013)

I still dont see how 12 on,,5.5 off,,1 on,,5.5 off again is mimicking the Sun on an outside grow. I have never seen the Sun do that,,and I hope i never do.


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## Sin inc (Dec 4, 2013)

ok understood thg/mom point as the norm. this my look on this. i think that each strain has a allowed or basic window to when it will flower . the norm says 18/6-12/12 ok we know this works well. then we have growers like me that came in say 2005. came in on the 24/0-12/12 and we know this works also. now for me my ewd#2 seams to do well on a 24/12 but to get the best quality out it. she likes a 24/0-12/12-10/14. yes it gives me a lil less mybe an oz less from the norm but over all its a better product her when grown this way. my other partner likes to grow landrace sativas and h strain wont even flower unless it has a 11/13 start and finish 9.5/14.5 +16 weeks.
i think 12/12 24/0 18/6 and now 12/5.5/1/5.5 are guide lines rules that do work and its up to the grower to find out what works better for them.
sorry for the rant but you guys are the only people i have to talk to about this stuff.lol


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## Sin inc (Dec 4, 2013)

just found this found here
hxxp://tokeofthetown.com/2012/02/exclusive_interview_cannabis_cultivation_expert_jo.php

Toke: Have you ever looked into the 12-1 growing method? If so, what is your opinion of this method?

Cervantes: Yes. The light regimen for vegetative growth claims to cut electricity bills and increase yield. This light schedule: 12 hrs light, 5.5 hrs dark, 1 light, 5.5 dark. Lights turn on and off 3 more times a day shortens bulb and ballast life even though less electricity is used. Any stress -- temperature, pH, EC/PPM -- can cause instability that manifests as intersex (AKA hermaphrodite) plants.

The plants stay in vegetative growth stage and use less light and electricity. Light is necessary for photosynthesis and stem, leaf, root and bud growth. According to some people plants grow more vegetative foliage and flowering sites.


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## WeedHopper (Dec 4, 2013)

:stuff-1125699181_i_


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## Sin inc (Dec 4, 2013)

thats funny


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## Hick (Dec 4, 2013)

Chapter 4 ... "FACTORS influencing thc production"...
  Research has shown (Valle et al. 1978) that nearly twice as much thc is produced under a 12 hour photo-period than under a 10 hour photo-period"...


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## WeedHopper (Dec 4, 2013)

Makes perfect since to me Hick,,,but ya sure 5.5,1,5.5,,and then 12  might not work better.


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## Sin inc (Dec 5, 2013)

thanks hick for the post i have read that book so many times. as i keep reading the 12-1 journals over on icmag. its seams to me like most of the 12-1 camp is trying to grow trees indoors most of them have big rooms or big tents. you cant deny the stretch from the pics. but because the size of there grow area i dont think they see stretch as as bad like the med to small room grower do. so to them it works i guess. i will stay with my trusty 24/0 12/12


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## 7thG (Dec 5, 2013)

Is this a tutorial on how to get hermies?

:giggle: jk


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## pcduck (Dec 5, 2013)

Sin inc said:
			
		

> its seams to me like most of the 12-1 camp is trying to grow trees indoors most of them have big rooms or big tents. you cant deny the stretch from the pics.



If I want to grow trees indoors, I veg longer under 24/7 lighting. Before flipping to 12/12


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## Sin inc (Dec 5, 2013)

yup same here pcduck. the more i read about this the more it falls apart. its funny on other forums they swear by 12-1 but when i posted a pics of my last grow.they asked how did i get my results . and then asked for tips . funny


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 6, 2013)

Sin inc said:
			
		

> yup same here pcduck. the more i read about this the more it falls apart. its funny on other forums they swear by 12-1 but when i posted a pics of my last grow.they asked how did i get my results . and then asked for tips . funny



Sin--that is pretty funny, but it does tell you something.  Obviously you are doing better with your 24/0 and 12/12 than they are doing with their 12/1 schedule.


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## WeedHopper (Dec 6, 2013)

Glad ya kept doing research Sic. We always come back to the MP for the truth.


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## zem (Dec 6, 2013)

Sin inc said:
			
		

> yup same here pcduck. the more i read about this the more it falls apart. its funny on other forums they swear by 12-1 but when i posted a pics of my last grow.they asked how did i get my results . and then asked for tips . funny


"on other forums" some guy says that you can flower these plants in that system LMAO


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## Sin inc (Dec 7, 2013)

poor fish. i wonder what it did to get put in jail.


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## WeedHopper (Dec 7, 2013)

He has a bad temper. He or She is a Japanese Fighting Betta. Does not play well with others.
What im concerned about is the roots getting direct light. That aint good is it?


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 7, 2013)

You know Weedhopper, that is something I hadn't thought about.  How do they handle algae with aquaponics?  Are the fish supposed to control the algae?


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## zem (Dec 7, 2013)

The Hemp Goddess said:
			
		

> You know Weedhopper, that is something I hadn't thought about.  How do they handle algae with aquaponics?  Are the fish supposed to control the algae?


they put algae eaters which are fish who live in bottom of aquariums and feed on algae


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## WeedHopper (Dec 7, 2013)

I really have never seen a grow like that go from start to finish. Seems ya would need more bubbles/Oxygen to the roots then what i see in that setup to grow nice plants. Plus,,im not so sure that the fish would supply enough nutrients to Flower MJ properly. A lilly pad is one thing,,weed is another.


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## zem (Dec 7, 2013)

WeedHopper said:
			
		

> I really have never seen a grow like that go from start to finish. Seems ya would need more bubbles/Oxygen to the roots then what i see in that setup to grow nice plants. Plus,,im not so sure that the fish would supply enough nutrients to Flower MJ properly. A lilly pad is one thing,,weed is another.


many people over the net post such trials trying to invent the wheel without reading from scratch lol i've seen people doing crazy things with no prior research, i bet he didn't ask himself this question wether the fish will supply enough nutrients or not or if he has enough O2 etc.., he would rather try it instead. at least he didn't chop all of the fan leaves, not yet at least lol


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## Hushpuppy (Dec 7, 2013)

Actually the plants will get a lot of nitrogen when the fish dies and rots from not having enough oxygen in the water. Either that or the fish will feast on the roots of the plant until it dies :doh:


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## WeedHopper (Dec 7, 2013)

What ever floats their boat,,or weed. Just seems like a waste of time to me,,but to each his own.

One other thing. With your Rez made of CLEAR GLASS,, wouldnt the heat from the lights that ya would need to grow good WEED cause the solution to get way to warm for healthy growth?


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