# Medical usage poll



## the widowmaker (Mar 12, 2008)

Exactly what it says above.

If marijuana is continued along the medical path eventually it will fall into one of the big medical corps for legality.

This will come in a tablet form from maybe someone like glaxo smith or whatever.

If they could get all the good stuff out of mj without any of the bad and it came in tablet form and acted without getting you stoned would you prefer it.


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## SmokinMom (Mar 12, 2008)

Hey widow-

I am not a med user, but I voted anyways.

I would still smoke for sure!  I like the highness.  And its the highness that gives med patients their relief, isn't it?


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## the widowmaker (Mar 12, 2008)

I like to get stoned, i'm not ashamed i'm not one for taking pills either, i just think its inevitable that the pharamaceutical companies are aiming at making this pill to replace legal home growing for med purposes.

I'd even bet that its government backed.


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## Runbyhemp (Mar 12, 2008)

They've tried. It's called marinol ... Synthetic THC. 

They still have a long way to go yet.

The psych active properties and therapeutic properties go hand in hand. Ya know them tablets that you have at home for pain that says "may cause drowsiness, do not drive or operate heavy machinery" .... exactly the same thing.

Why havn't the government been able to remove the drowsiness with painkillers. Because the drug targets the brain. Same with MJ.

I don't think we need to worry about that


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## the widowmaker (Mar 12, 2008)

What will happen when they get it right in their minds?


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## 85cannabliss (Mar 12, 2008)

then people will have a choice!! admittadly i smoked to get stoned to start with, as did 99% of smokers (probably) but stopped for years. i only started again after a VERY painful leg injury. painkillers the doctor supplied DID work, it was the side effects that got me down (depression, physical symptoms) to smoking for the pain. yes, i enjoyed being stoned again, but it DID take away the pain just as good as the meds the doc prescribed.

ive even been smoking during a chest infection because MJ is knkown to open the airways of 80% of asthma suffers. and guess what?..... it was better than any of my inhalors ive used. ill be smoking as long as i need to, even if there is a pill. coz like RBH is saying, "common side efects are GENERALLY the same as MJ" (ei. drowsiness)

helps me sleep easy. see you around bro

85C


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## HGB (Mar 12, 2008)

If they made the pills like these then no problem:hubba: 


decrim is the way to go, NOT legalization IMO


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## The Effen Gee (Mar 12, 2008)

I like going through the motions of prepairing my medicine to be smoked.

Besides...I hate taking pills, thats why I smoke weed in the first place!


Too bad on that joint rolling contest....I am very competitive and take pride in my rolled products.


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## trillions of atoms (Mar 12, 2008)

well the stoned relaxed effecdt is what defers my mind from the pain....it diesnt hide it completely as an oxycotten would but to take pain meds is to cover up and dull pain.....doing MORE damage to the area of pain if it an injury because u cant feel the pain you overexhert yourself in the process making that injury your trying to dull worse in the end.


if your poll had said...if MJ was in a pillform and the exact effects were in the capsule would you consume it, id still say no. only because the funky tasting dank and phenotype variation is what i seek when smoking anyway. the aftereffect is a bigger benifit- but to have one medicine in so many variations, thats what hooks me.

ive had marinol (orangish colored liquid filled pills), and it doesnt compare to smoking homegrown.


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## Mutt (Mar 12, 2008)

I voted the later of the two. If I could choose the consumption of my meds...with weed unlike many other script drugs...can be smoked, or cooked into food, or extracted into hash. I would have to say allow me the freedom to which i prefer.
And yes widow....if not for weed I would be a LEGALLY pill poppin fool. with weed I remove over 30 side effects to just 1 I get high. 

BTW....weed has been attempted to put into pill form (marinol think it is) it was a flop....many many side effects and barely any benefits.
Some strains will work with some med patients while not others...tells me that it hasn't been tested nearly enough to see what CBNs will do much less the THC.


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## The Effen Gee (Mar 13, 2008)

You ca buy cannabis tincture pills at the clubs, but those just put me to sleep. 

Great for a 14 hr plane ride.


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## mal_crane (Mar 20, 2008)

I have to vote no for multiple reasons. The biggest NO is that the world is already a slave to the pharmaceutical companies. People are completely dependent on pills for the most ridiculous things these days. Second, I smoke for two reasons; to alieviate lower back pain caused by deteriorating vertabrae and slipped discs and TO GET HIGH. I'm sure many people would be more than willing to take the medical pill w/o the euphoria, I'm just not one of them. So give me a big old recliner, a doobie, an 18-pack, and the stereo and tv remotes and you can keep whatever pill they come up with. Thank you .... :fly:


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## Barrelhse (Mar 20, 2008)

Um... I think somebody lied!


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## mal_crane (Mar 20, 2008)

Nah, I'm sure there are medical patients who would rather just take a pill for whatever symptoms and not get high. I mean especially depending on the job description too. Who would rather see they're employee get stoned and try to operate a maintenance crane then see them take an all-natural painkiller and still have an unclouded mind. Like I said i'm sure there are people who would rather just have the medicinal effects than being stoned. I mean I love the high but let's face it, it's not for everybody.


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## lyfr (Mar 20, 2008)

half the fun is preparation/smokin!


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## I'ma Joker Midnight Toker (Mar 20, 2008)

I'll go out on a limb and call a spade a spade... I say the majority of med users are bullcrap about their med reasons. They say and do whatever it takes to get MJ legally and many hide behind that MJ med card. I would be willing to guess that 95%+ of them smoked pot before they had med reasons. If you have real pain...REAL PAIN, as I do, MJ just takes a nick off of it... but sometimes it even amplifies it depending on the pain level and type of MJ. Nothing beats opiates when it comes to pain. I know, been on them for 10 years and have real pain and have tried every drug imaginable... some may get nauseous from them but if you have real pain that's better than the pain. There are plenty of other drugs that work better than MJ for aliments that most complain they need MJ for. I think the true med people who benefit are cancer, glaucoma, and aids patients, most others have taken advantage of the system. That's OK, you got your MJ, I just hate the arrogance that some have acquired now that they are med users with their card to justify why they smoke and are not just "pot smokers". I'm a pot smoker, period....with a med release.


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## The Effen Gee (Mar 20, 2008)

I smoke/grow cannabis and use other related cannabis products for these reasons:

1. I just plain LIKE painkillers way too much. They are hard on your liver and even harder to kick. Doctors just trow them at you like candy at a parade.

2. It levels out my unstable mind. It keeps me from acting out on the constant anger I have to my fellow man, for all his ignorance and greed.

3. It helps my pain a little. I have used cannabis for a long time, so the pain effect is mild. Still better than painkillers. It gives me the ability to "forget" about the pain, if I think about it...it's still there.

4. Adult ADD is VERY real. Cannabis helps.

5. No more street weed. Now I can cultivate for myself and other patients...ONLY. My bud's never hit the streets. EVER. I know what I am smoking, and what's in it. No more rip-off's. No more sketchy paranoid highschool kid know-it-all ***hole drug dealers. Last but most important, NO COP'S. I respect law enforcement, I just don't always agree with policies. 

6. The taste, look , smell. 

7. Cultivation. A true art.

can you cram all that into a pill, that has; 

NO HARMFUL EFFECTS? 

NO SIDE-EFFECTS? 

doubt it.


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## mal_crane (Mar 20, 2008)

The door swings both ways there buddy. How many people can you count everyday on the street who say and do whatever it takes to get PRESCRIPTION OPIATES and then hide behind it saying they need it for their pain. No sense in calling the neighbors grass brown if yours is a swamp, right? Personally I do everything I can to keep people off of HIGHLY ADDICTIVE prescribed opiates. I've had my share of painkillers and find none that can compare with an evening of smoking a very heavy indica. Not to mention, scientists have found that the tar that clings to your lungs after smoking a joint is broken down and metabolized in your body, while the prescribed opiates doctors throw around like candy, shuts down roughly 70 livers everyday due to the toxins in pills that can not be broken down in the body. And if one form of real pain doesn't come from deteriorating vertabrae and slipped discs, than what is real pain? I mean I'm a pot-smoker first and foremost whether I am in pain or not but there are many who did not smoke before being diagnosed with deadly or debilitating illnesses.



			
				I'ma Joker Midnight Toker said:
			
		

> I'll go out on a limb and call a spade a spade... I say the majority of med users are bullcrap about their med reasons. They say and do whatever it takes to get MJ legally and many hide behind that MJ med card. I would be willing to guess that 95%+ of them smoked pot before they had med reasons. If you have real pain...REAL PAIN, as I do, MJ just takes a nick off of it... but sometimes it even amplifies it depending on the pain level and type of MJ. Nothing beats opiates when it comes to pain. I know, been on them for 10 years and have real pain and have tried every drug imaginable... some may get nauseous from them but if you have real pain that's better than the pain. There are plenty of other drugs that work better than MJ for aliments that most complain they need MJ for. I think the true med people who benefit are cancer, glaucoma, and aids patients, most others have taken advantage of the system. That's OK, you got your MJ, I just hate the arrogance that some have acquired now that they are med users with their card to justify why they smoke and are not just "pot smokers". I'm a pot smoker, period....with a med release.


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## I'ma Joker Midnight Toker (Mar 20, 2008)

mal_crane said:
			
		

> The door swings both ways there buddy. How many people can you count everyday on the street who say and do whatever it takes to get PRESCRIPTION OPIATES and then hide behind it saying they need it for their pain. No sense in calling the neighbors grass brown if yours is a swamp, right? Personally I do everything I can to keep people off of HIGHLY ADDICTIVE prescribed opiates. I've had my share of painkillers and find none that can compare with an evening of smoking a very heavy indica. Not to mention, scientists have found that the tar that clings to your lungs after smoking a joint is broken down and metabolized in your body, while the prescribed opiates doctors throw around like candy, shuts down roughly 70 livers everyday due to the toxins in pills that can not be broken down in the body. And if one form of real pain doesn't come from deteriorating vertabrae and slipped discs, than what is real pain? I mean I'm a pot-smoker first and foremost whether I am in pain or not but there are many who did not smoke before being diagnosed with deadly or debilitating illnesses.



Dude, oh I mean Buddy , Opiates are legal..period, Federal and State. Yes there are a lot of addicts for those too and those who abuse them to get high...no arguement there. But... for real pain relief and legitimate patients who need it...... Pot does not kill pain the way opiates do, plain and simple, right or wrong. I have pain that would make you crumble like a mouse my friend so don't give me the "grass brown swamp thing". My doctors don't throw my pills at me or anyone else. 

What do you do to keep people off opiates I would like to know? What is your crusade and how do you do it? You brought it up. Where did you get your stats for 70 livers a day? Were they medical stats, drug abuse stats? If you are going to throw numbers, what is your research?

Yep, they are highly addictive, I've got a handle on it as many do...and many don't...but again, let's call a spade a spade. If your pain is so bad you certainly must have documentation. I'm considered disabled by the government and a team of doctors, but that's not why I do oxy's...I need them to survive and to keep sanity from the pain...if I make one step walking, I feel pain...severe nerve damage, severed spine...pot doesn't do crap for it except relax me. Does it help? A little, but the drugs help ten fold...my point. No swamp, brown grass my friend, just real pain. If you have real pain there isn't enough pot to smoke to get rid of it so you're only fooling yourself...which was my point on MJ....


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## I'ma Joker Midnight Toker (Mar 20, 2008)

The Effen Gee said:
			
		

> I smoke/grow cannabis and use other related cannabis products for these reasons:
> 
> 1. I just plain LIKE painkillers way too much. They are hard on your liver and even harder to kick. Doctors just trow them at you like candy at a parade.
> 
> ...




Effen, I like a guy who can at least admit to his limitations. If you know you will abuse pain killers, and have some instability and pot works for you...great. I never said it doesn't help or please people, it's just that some of the med users make it to be more than it is for them, and hence get a med card. Again, that's OK, my point is the born again arrogant ones that hide behind that med card that irritate me, they put themselves above the every day pot smoker who does it for enjoyment yet they do it cause they "have to". I love pot, smoke it, and most likely always will. Thanks for being honest dude.


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## mal_crane (Mar 20, 2008)

You didn't even take the point of my argument, instead you saw it as nothing but an insult, which it wasn't. My point is that in no way possible can you say or even attempt to prove that 95% of people smoked pot before applying for a med card and there is certainly no way those 95% of people who did smoke, only manipulated the system to get there med cards. The majority of people who apply for medical usage of marijuana are people who it genuinely helps or could help.


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## I'ma Joker Midnight Toker (Mar 21, 2008)

mal_crane said:
			
		

> You didn't even take the point of my argument, instead you saw it as nothing but an insult, which it wasn't. My point is that in no way possible can you say or even attempt to prove that 95% of people smoked pot before applying for a med card and there is certainly no way those 95% of people who did smoke, only manipulated the system to get there med cards. The majority of people who apply for medical usage of marijuana are people who it genuinely helps or could help.



Dude, you NEVER made that a point in your arguement, am I suppose to read between the lines? Don't try to turn it around and say I saw it as an insult, I saw it as an erroneous statement and nothing more. I made a statement and stand behind it. You don't have to agree but you didn't make any reference to 95% (which I said was 'my' guess) of people smoked before med cards or manipulating the system....NONE...read your own posts. If you got something to say OK, but don't try to say you made a point and never did, it's black and white here for all to see. I've read some of your other posts and you seem to argue a lot with little or no basis except for the sake of causing distress, please do your homework or at least follow up with what you say, not what you may have wanted to say... peace out 

"The majority of people who apply for medical usage of marijuana are people who it genuinely helps or could help."

I'll say this, this is absolutely wrong, this system is so abused, you need to take a closer look my friend before you just jump on some bandwagon, no insult intended, just common sense and street smarts. Many ask how they can qualify or ask what they need to say or do to get medical MJ with no problems whatsoever.
PS...You never did follow up with where you got your research and numbers from, just a question I have for you if you wouldn't mind answering.


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## mal_crane (Mar 21, 2008)

And I saw what you said as an erroneous statement as well, using your 95% numbers that you yourself haven't looked up. I also made a statement and am standing behind it. It feels like I'm talking to one of those automated machines, everything I say is being completely ignored by the receptors in your brain and something completely irrelevant spews back at me in your posts dude. All I did was try to answer this threads question as best as I could. You came into the thread NOT answering the question but instead debating how many med card users should not be able to use.

So where are all these threads that I have been arguing in for no other sake but distress. Please send me links .... that is if you can actually find some hard evidence to back your words up ... as for my documentation sure thing I'll send you every bit of documentation I found before writing that and send it directly too you, but I'll be waiting to see documentation of your numbers as well. Show me links to where 95% of people are abusing the med card system ... Couldn't find anything? EXACTLY!


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## mal_crane (Mar 21, 2008)

By the way, I believe there is a place for members to report undersirable posts, so if there is a problem with anything I said, feel free!


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## I'ma Joker Midnight Toker (Mar 21, 2008)

mal_crane said:
			
		

> And *I saw what you said as an erroneous statement as* *well,* *using your 95% numbers that you yourself haven't looked up. *I also made a statement and am standing behind it. *It feels like I'm talking to one of those automated machines, everything I say is being completely ignored by the receptors in your brain and something completely irrelevant spews back at me in your posts dude*. All I did was try to answer this threads question as best as I could. You came into the thread NOT answering the question but instead debating how many med card users should not be able to use.
> 
> * So where are all these threads that I have been arguing* in for no other sake but distress. Please send me links .... that is if you can actually find some hard evidence to back your words up ... as for my documentation sure thing I'll send you every bit of documentation I found before writing that and send it directly too you, but I'll be waiting to see documentation of your numbers as well. Show me links to where 95% of people are abusing the med card system ... Couldn't find anything? EXACTLY!



Dude , this is my last post, here's my original quote:
*
"I would be willing to guess that 95%+ of them smoked pot before they had med reasons." 

*I believe it is quite plain that I said it was a guess on my part, I did not say this was fact or a stat from anywhere...I like the way you turn it around and say send my documentation first, I asked you, you don't have it - fine. You have not answered one thing I've asked you and you tell me my brain receptors are ignoring your posts. I don't need documentation as I plainly expressed that it was of my personal opinion. If you're going to argue or debate something read what is said before your speedboat fingers get to typing 
Here's some of your negativity...IMHO

Here's the way you set up arguemnets in your posts, just negative stuff, you probably don't even know you do it.

"All you guys are saying its alright to smoke near your plants?? *You all must be ill-informed."*

"It's a TV SHOW people, *get real*. I have seen survivorman before and the show seems ok. Now about people on here not being able to live in the wild, you are *quite wrong.*"

"Especially when I could veg and flower your 15 plants under my cfl's for less than half the price of your 1000w and still get 3/4 of the yield."

You get on people about their spelling...
"Sorry Cole, I just have a pet peeve, do you mean the Dalai Lama?"



"Can't say I agree with you there buddy. I've grown quite a hefty number of plants from seed using 12/12. Using just 12/12 I can usually begin seeing sex around week 2-3."
 "Oh don't worry you won't piss me off on this one. Apparently it's not as well known as chicken eggs coming from chickens. I'm being honest when I say I've been using this method for several years now when I don't have time for a full harvest, or if i'm low on space. Besides, that quote just helped my case unless I've read it wrong."
"Well if you're truly done with this conversation, so be it, I'm just trying to be helpful. I mean, unless I went blind in the past couple years then,"     

Bad info...

 			 			 		 		 		 		 	Quote:
 	 	 		 			 				Originally Posted by *mal_crane*
_Flo's and cfl's will grow bud just fine and can be used for both vegging and flowering. How many lumens per sq ft is what will make your buds more dense. Both flo's and cfl's would suit a closet grow much better than a HID or Hps. Be reasonable with what size light you are using in small places so that you don't start the apartment building on fire just because you picked a 600w hps to put in a little closet just because someone told you flo's aren't good for growing. Out of 20+ grows, I have used flo's and cfl's on almost all and I have grown some of the most dense bud I've seen. It's all in personal preference, trial and error, and what is most reasonable for the size grow you are looking for. No sense in buying some $500 light just to grow a couple plants when you could spend $100 dolalrs on cfl and flo supplies and get just as good of bud._


Hick: A 400 w/hps can be purchased for very close to that same $100 dollar bill, and is "both" more efficient and produces more grow power/lumens/PAR. Facts.. not "opinions".. 


"I didn't say that HPS isn't good, I said it's his responsibility to not burn down the house with too much high powered lighting in a small area, but we now see that the area isn't small. Even with his larger area, I would still use cfl's or flo's, like I said it's just a personal preference. I've grown with an HPS and didn't like it, simple as that."

So I've shown you some quotes you asked for, I'm not going to read all your posts... answered your remark about the 95%. Please answer all of my previous questions you have ignored to date. Thanks. 

PS These are the questions I asked long before you posed a question to me....brain receptor lock???

"What do you do to keep people off opiates I would like to know? What is your crusade and how do you do it? You brought it up. Where did you get your stats for 70 livers a day? Were they medical stats, drug abuse stats? If you are going to throw numbers, what is your research?"


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## allgrownup (Mar 22, 2008)

i smoke weed to get high and to mellow me out so i can sleep. although since i found this great site i find myself stayin up later than ever so.........

personally....i am all about the high...i don't think i could ever stop smokin weed just based on the premise that i love to smoke weed.  HOWEVa....if those little green pills were developed to pack a wholup i'm sure id givem a go.

I find myself wondering why no one is extracting and improving the weed now like they do with salvia? could you imagine WW times 10 :holysheep:

  :bong::shocked:


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## Carrie (Mar 26, 2008)

I'ma Joker Midnight Toker said:
			
		

> I think the true med people who benefit are cancer, glaucoma, and aids patients, most others have taken advantage of the system. That's OK, you got your MJ, I just hate the arrogance that some have acquired now that they are med users with their card to justify why they smoke and are not just "pot smokers". I'm a pot smoker, period....with a med release.


 
Just because you don't have the sickness or know someone that uses medicinal cannabis for other reasons then cancer(for the chemo),aids and glaucoma does not mean they have taken advantage of the system, becuase clearly it's a different system then the one I believe in and is part of.
The system is black or white, no room for personal belief. Like it or not, your put in a catogory, 1 and 2. 
You have only named 1.5 of choronic or terminal illness's as catogory 1 applicants.
If you need to know some information please ask but don't pass judgement when you clearly just don't know how cannabis is shown to be beneficial to each individual.
I'm so upset about this and need to go blaze to calm down.


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## ms4ms (Mar 26, 2008)

this is a touchy subject and i didn't even vote. I stopped smoking pot in 1980 when I joined the Marines.I got sick in 1998 officially with what has turned out to be chronic progressive ms, severe spasticity, and a host of ailments. My wife reintroduced me to smoking in roughly 2004(she does not smoke) or so. If you throw up from pain then  you have pain. It took me a while to figure out it is the "high" that gives me relief,instantly. Sometimes, not often pot can make problems for me condition wise. Fine line as I have morphine alacarte which I take and it helps also,jjust not as much or as fast as a couple of bowls. I hate taking pills and I am at 15 a day.


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## Carrie (Mar 26, 2008)

Thank-you so much ms4ms, you made me feel better and not alone. Besides being a medicinal user and activist, I have relapsing-remitting ms so I'm sure you understand why this thread makes me upset.


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## Hick (Mar 26, 2008)

I'ma Joker Midnight Toker said:
			
		

> Effen, I like a guy who can at least admit to his limitations. If you know you will abuse pain killers, and have some instability and pot works for you...great. I never said it doesn't help or please people, it's just that some of the med users make it to be more than it is for them, and hence get a med card. Again, that's OK, my point is the born again arrogant ones that hide behind that med card that irritate me, they put themselves above the every day pot smoker who does it for enjoyment yet they do it cause they "have to". I love pot, smoke it, and most likely always will. Thanks for being honest dude.


"Arrogance" seems to be contagious..
  The majority of your last post is absolutely irrelevant to the subject at hand, and could be interpretted as getting pretty close to a "personal" attack. 
  I don't see you pulling up "numbers/statistics", nothing more than your biased opinion.
  Seems many in the medical field, yes, "Doctors", professionals in the field, don't agree with your diagnosis of "who"' it benefits and "who" it doesn't. Do you have some form of degree that makes you an authority, and qualified to dispute their findings?..

  I'll agree that the system is abused, not unlike the SS system, welfare, unemployment, VA, ect. ec. ect. That doesn't mean it isn't a valid program. 
  "I" personally believe it should be decriminalized for medical and/or recreational use. But a medical provision is definately a step in the right direction IMO. 
  This "poll" came about in the hopes of stirring up an arguement..It was posted as a response to "we" here at MarPassion, being about "personal" grows, rather than "commercial" op's. ..about providing information for folks to supply themselves and eliminate the "black market" and street corner drug dealers.
 I see it has served it's purpose. Dissention among the peacefull potheads.. 
  I wish everyone who wants to, to be able to provide for themselves. Recreational or medical. 
  What concerns me is the "black eye" that commercial growers give to those of us who do grow for personal use.


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## mal_crane (Mar 26, 2008)

Carrie and MS4MS, I am sorry to hear about your MS. My mother was diagnosed with severe MS. She is constantly in pain but nothing I say or do can convince her to try using marijuana as she did in her youth.

Hick, thank you coming into this discussion.

By the way Joker Midnight Toker, after having had to read through your ridiculous PM's and posts of hatred and ignorance towards me and the topic at hand, here are all the sources you were claiming were a "bunch of b-s because i'm talking out of my a** not using sources".

&#8220;An estimated 48.7 million people have used prescription drugs for non-medical reasons &#8211; almost twenty percent of the population.&#8221; (Source: National Institute on Drug Abuse)

&#8220;Opiate abuse usually starts with a person simply following a doctor&#8217;s orders. But for some people, drug use turns to drug abuse without them being aware of it happening. Addiction to opiates can occur in a matter of days and it can happen to anyone.&#8221; (Source: Meditox)

&#8220;Opiates can cause many side-effects including depressed activity of the central nervous system, reduced pain, induced sleep, over-sedation, nausea, vomiting, constipation, addiction, overdose, and death.&#8221; (Source: Meditox and NIDA)

&#8220;FDA approved opiates have surpassed cocaine and heroin at the #1 drug problem in America.&#8221; (Source: Modern Psychiatry)

&#8220;Acetaminophen in prescription opiates causes several hundred deaths per year due to overdose in the liver.&#8221; (Source: NIDA)

&#8220;In 234 comparisons in double-blind studies against non-narcotic pain treatments covering tens of thousands of patients, the track record for opiates by is 7 wins, 171 losses, and 58 ties.&#8221; (Source: Modern Psychiatry)

&#8220;1014 Oxycontin overdose deaths occurred in 23 states from August, 1999 to January, 2002. Hydrocodone related deaths were 592 in 2001 and 618 in 2002. From 1998 to 2002, Tramadol was involved in 382 deaths.&#8221; (Source: DAWN [The Drug Abuse Warning System])

&#8220;King County, Washington reported a 40% increase in prescribed opiate deaths in 2004 to 118 from 28.&#8221; (Source: Modern Psychiatry)

&#8220;In 2004, there were over 900 prescribed opiate-related deaths in NYC alone.&#8221; (Source: Modern Psychiatry)

&#8220;Most prescription drug abusers were first hooked by physicians. In a recent survey, 84% of opiate abusers stated that they had legitimately been given a prescription for opiates for pain at some point from a physician. Of these 84%, most (91%) had since purchased prescription opiates from a street dealer while 80% had altered the delivery system of the drug (examples: snorting, chewing or intravenous administration).&#8221; (Source: Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center and Cornell University)

&#8220;Research shows that there are no significant differences in pain relief between non-opiates alone and non-opiates plus opiates for moderate pain.&#8221; (Source: World Health Organization)

&#8220;One DB study showed that even acetaminophen administered alone improved pain control in patients already on high doses of opiates.&#8221; (Source: University of Sydney)

&#8220;Acetaminophen in prescribed opiates can cause overdose at relatively low doses and causes liver damage and/or failure.&#8221; (Source: Dartmouth University)


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## ezdavedawg (Apr 3, 2008)

I like to smoke it!!!


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## Thorn (Apr 20, 2008)

gees people are tetchy on this site!

anyway i just wanted to know where widowmaker was? he sent me a message saying hi so i replied but he has set it not to accept PMs ??? i'm confused. Anyone know anything?


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## widowmaker (Apr 22, 2008)

One time I ate to much weed and I got so sick I quit smoking for like half a year.  so I would pass on ingestion of thc.


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## THE_DUDE (May 3, 2008)

Isnt smoking the whole point?


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## THE_DUDE (May 3, 2008)

Great thread


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## GreenMan74 (May 6, 2008)

I can honestly say my first experiences of MJ were medicinal.  I was in my early 20's and had been dealing with strong suicidal depressions for many years, interspersed with weeks of pure mania.  MJ leveled that out, and additionally, has a strong spiritual side to it as well if you're in that kind of headspace.  
   Now my mental health is considerably better, and I consider myself a recreational stoner.  But when taking a long break from MJ, those ups and downs resurface, particularly when I wasn't growing and had no contacts.  That stuff is no **.
   I agree though with the sentiment that the medical argument is being diluted by the recreational argument, interspersing with it.  This plant has been used medicinally throughout human history, excepting the modern age.  The case for its medicinal properties is very strong.  Put it this way - were it not for the pschoactive qualities, there wouldn't even be a debate as to the medicinal qualities.  
    So the real heart of it has nothing to do with medical marijuana.  The whole issue is around "operating your brain" as Dr. Leary put it.  
   What a wonderful multifaceted Goddess this plant is.  Fiber, fuel, medicine, ganja.


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## NorCalHal (May 11, 2008)

Wow, great thread.

Not to be the devils advocate, but I have to agree in part with Joker. It is my opinon that the majority of card holders here in California is for the sake of having some sort of protection from the Police rather then a dire need for pot to evliviate an illness. I see it every day, all day.

Sure, there are folks that started using pot after it became "medical", and use it to "fight a pain issue" or a number of other reasons. But really, we can ALL say that weed helps us in some way, otherwise none of us would smoke it.

What frustrates me is some of the advocates shoving propaganda at folks. Trying to convince folks that Medical is the ONLY reason pot should be decriminalized. The pure and simple fact that millions of americans smoke pot should be cause enough for the goverment to relax penelties. Folks are getting locked up for small, personal grows and finished product. Should they be locked up because they don't have an illness defined by law to be recommended by a doctor that they can have pot? Hell no.

Bottom line, MMJ is an avenue to full decrimilazation. This was the first step since it became a Class B substance that states have relaxed their veiws on it.

Carrie, this question is for you, If I do not have an illness you beleive MMJ would help, in fact if I am as healthy as a horse, would it be ok for me to grow my own herb and consume it in my own home? Or should it only be legal for Ill folks? Not trying to be a jerk, just want your opionon.

What if they made it legal for ONLY Cancer and AIDS patients? Folks would be up in arms. Point is, anyone of us can find a reason to smoke. It is just the veiw of waht an individual perceves as "a reason" to get a card. Because a girl gets it because of menstral cramps, does it make her not worthy?

IMHO, here it is, the argument here is what folks see as illnesses that MMJ can help. If you ask guy "a" he will say only aids and cancer, you ask guy "b" he could say any type of pain. 
I say, if you like it and it helps you out in anyway, go for it. As I said before, we can all find a reason we smoke pot. State Goverments gave alittle when passing the MMJ laws. Folks who have smoked for years of course ar going to take advantage and protect themselves. Just as if the Goverment said if you have high bllod pressure, you can legaly not be cited for speeding violations. Even folks who don't really speed would sign up for the sake that one day they may get pulled over. I hope you understand what I am tryin' to say.

So I firmly beleive that the majority of folks get thier MMJ recommendation for law enforcment protection rather then a medical treatment. Plain and simple.


Don't get me wrong here, I am not anti MMJ, not at all.


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## ms4ms (May 11, 2008)

great post hal. this of course is very touchy and a little personal. First, I wouldn't be smoking if I didn't get sick in 1998. I was a smoker and inhaled in the 70's. Got the white picket fence 2 kids and way to many grandkids. I actually was against people smoking to just get "high" then I realized that is very hipocritical. It is the high that gives me the relief now and it was the high I chased in the 70's. My wife is a nervous wreck that my little grow will cause big problems but she see's the help it gives me. She thinks it should be decriminalized period and she does NOT smoke for employment reasons. If smoking just to get high ruins your life or you can't handle life then you could have a problem with mj just like any drug or alcohol


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## NorCalHal (May 11, 2008)

Thanks ms4ms. I hope that I don't offend Carrie. I'm just curious if she is down for the whole program, or just the MMJ side. It should go hand in hand.


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## lyfr (May 12, 2008)

just so happens i ended up qualified for MMJ but i was smokin long before i became qualified(for lack of better term) to get it. i would/will probably smoke it my whole life..."legal" or not.  and i also do not care who is legal or not.  am i really supposed to refuse to smoke with anyone not "qualified"...cause this would really shrink down my circle of friends, to like 3.  should i bid the rest farewell?:stoned: :bong2: i been smokin all day and really dont know where im goin with this but,...  oh yeah, _*everybody must get stoned*_ ..uh,if they want to


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## Bella420 (May 22, 2008)

I love the smell and taste of mj.  I don't think a pill can give you that too plus when its a pill its not from "nature" its from a manufacturer.... so what else will "they" put in??


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## tcooper1 (Jun 26, 2008)

I have been geting stoned for 40 yrs....bot thats along time I just now realized it.....


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## ms4ms (Jun 26, 2008)

this is a catch-22 question. I think it would be good science if "they" could make a pill that would take away my pain and body spasms. The "high" from mj is what helps me deal with the medical ** in my life. I take powerful narcotic pain meds and I prefer mj over these. In my expereince(11 years) with a chronic condition there is NO pill, powder, or plant alive that will help with or eliminate the PROBLEM(pain..etc) without getting you high to some degree.


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## KGB30 (Jun 26, 2008)

I prefer a fatty tasty bowl over tastless pills. lol


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## Stoner94043 (Jul 8, 2008)

The only fact about medical use marijuana like said earlier is it does absolutely nothing to eliminate pain. All it does is make the pain more tolerable by dulling your senses.

In California the whole usage for "medicinal reasons" has gotten out of control. A quick example was a friend went with me to Hayward and one of the clubs that had a Doctor issue licenses. With me there was no reason to fabricate the reason I was there. My friend on the other hand was filling out a form the Dr gave us. Under the reason the patient was seeking a license my friend listed 'Stress'. He got the license. While it's great he got it the reason was bogus. This is why the Fed's are hitting the clubs now. They sit and watch as people enter the clubs then upon exit they walk to a car and exchange money for product. As usual, it's a few people that will ruin it for those really needing it. 

As a concerned friend I'd like to remind you that *having a license is not a bullet proof vest* and you need to be smart about using it. When I had my license active, a neighbor called Police saying they smelled "Mota" coming from the house. A police officer showed up amazingly. I invited him in. Showed him my license and all he said was "Do me a favor and just keep your door closed while I medicate."


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## jeffca (Jul 11, 2008)

I'ma Joker Midnight Toker said:
			
		

> I'll go out on a limb and call a spade a spade... I say the majority of med users are bullcrap about their med reasons. They say and do whatever it takes to get MJ legally and many hide behind that MJ med card. I would be willing to guess that 95%+ of them smoked pot before they had med reasons. If you have real pain...REAL PAIN, as I do, MJ just takes a nick off of it... but sometimes it even amplifies it depending on the pain level and type of MJ. Nothing beats opiates when it comes to pain. I know, been on them for 10 years and have real pain and have tried every drug imaginable... some may get nauseous from them but if you have real pain that's better than the pain. There are plenty of other drugs that work better than MJ for aliments that most complain they need MJ for. I think the true med people who benefit are cancer, glaucoma, and aids patients, most others have taken advantage of the system. That's OK, you got your MJ, I just hate the arrogance that some have acquired now that they are med users with their card to justify why they smoke and are not just "pot smokers". I'm a pot smoker, period....with a med release.


 
i think there are people who benefit from it in less direct ways, like people with things like muscular distrophy and like you said cancer patients need it on top of the pain and everything else just to build up an appetite to eat, instead of getting food from a tube. but i got off track here, the people that get help from it indirectly (the people who "don't really need it") it's true they could go without it, but if it helps things like mild depression and anxiety, do you think that's a legitimate reason? 

it's all about where the government thinks people should draw the line, as of now America is a medicinal country, i mean everytime i get something done (surgery, or something else) they give me vicodin, even when i could do without it. i just don't understand these politicians that deny it's use, what's so much worse about it than vicodin? vicodin can kill you.

and ya i agree with you, those people really do need it, other people can do without it. (but should they have to do without it or should they be able to make their own decision? ya know)


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## nikimadritista (Jul 11, 2008)

I hope they never discover such pill! 
Legalization for medical use is the first step to MJ Legalization for everyone 
And if anyone can grow it that makes it impossible for Pharmaceutical Companies to patent the plant and charge us mad prices on each treatment...
Such pill could mean highly overpriced Drugs and back to Criminalizing the herb , so that they would be the only once allowed to make it....
Does that make any sence?? 
I'm stoned again I'm sorry


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## nikimadritista (Jul 11, 2008)

Stoner94043 said:
			
		

> The only fact about medical use marijuana like said earlier is it does absolutely nothing to eliminate pain. All it does is make the pain more tolerable by dulling your senses.
> 
> In California the whole usage for "medicinal reasons" has gotten out of control. A quick example was a friend went with me to Hayward and one of the clubs that had a Doctor issue licenses. With me there was no reason to fabricate the reason I was there. My friend on the other hand was filling out a form the Dr gave us. Under the reason the patient was seeking a license my friend listed 'Stress'. He got the license. While it's great he got it the reason was bogus. This is why the Fed's are hitting the clubs now. They sit and watch as people enter the clubs then upon exit they walk to a car and exchange money for product. As usual, it's a few people that will ruin it for those really needing it.
> 
> As a concerned friend I'd like to remind you that *having a license is not a bullet proof vest* and you need to be smart about using it. When I had my license active, a neighbor called Police saying they smelled "Mota" coming from the house. A police officer showed up amazingly. I invited him in. Showed him my license and all he said was "Do me a favor and just keep your door closed while I medicate."



Maybe the way to stop this is legalizing marijuana for everyone... Like it is in Holland... Than dealers won't have to lie any more  And people won't have to buy from dealers no more.. And Feds won't be spending your tax money hitting clubs... And medical users can relax and not think others will spoil it for them...  And everyone can get high with paranoia levels reduced to zero... 
It's a win win situation really!
It could be a better world!


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## tcooper1 (Jul 11, 2008)

nikimadritista said:
			
		

> I hope they never discover such pill!
> Legalization for medical use is the first step to MJ Legalization for everyone
> And if anyone can grow it that makes it impossible for Pharmaceutical Companies to patent the plant and charge us mad prices on each treatment...
> Such pill could mean highly overpriced Drugs and back to Criminalizing the herb , so that they would be the only once allowed to make it....
> ...


 
you said it bother.....you are so right....imo
i feel the same way
have a great day and stay safe


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## Wolfie (Nov 14, 2008)

You don't need to fix what isn't broken, there's no need for a synthetic pill (marinol). I just love how the government allows THC in manufactured, processed, unhealthy, not-as-effective, pill form to be legal, while throwing sick people in jail for smoking the real thing, (which they claim (lie) has no medicinal use). Last time I checked no one in the government is myself or my doctor, so it's really none of their goddamn business how I treat my pain/discomfort, or what I put into my own body in the first place. Even implying that they have this power is a blatent, disgusting invasion of our personal rights/freedoms. 

Also, where do people, (the government) get off thinking they can make parts of nature, (certain plants) illegal? Is that not insane? No one, NO ONE has any authority over nature. Ever.


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