# Electricity, marijuana and the law



## FruityBud (Feb 21, 2010)

Homeowners have a reasonable expectation of privacy over information concerning most activities that take place in their homes.

Therefore, absent a search warrant or a potential emergency situation, police arent entitled to enter a home to discover the activities taking place.

But what about electrical consumption patterns? Do homeowners have a reasonable expectation of privacy over their electricity consumption? Must police obtain a search warrant before they may obtain or access records concerning electrical consumption patterns?

People in the indoor marijuana cultivation business certainly dont want police anywhere near their electricity consumption records.

You see, certain patterns of excessive consumption are indicative of a grow op. Also, abnormally low consumption doesnt necessarily mean one is trying to conserve energy. It may mean that someone has bypassed the hydro meter and is stealing electricity.

Grow ops use large amounts of electricity, hence the desire to steal electricity.

I cant see how the disclosure of energy consumption records reveal personal information concerning personal non-criminal activities taking place within a home. These records dont reveal any personal or lifestyle information.

Looking at electricity consumption records doesnt provide any meaningful information on what activities are taking place in the home, other than perhaps if theres a grow op or electricity theft.

They dont even disclose how many people are in the house. So how could there be a reasonable expectation of privacy in the consumption records?

Regardless of what I may think, the law is all over the map.

In Alberta, the latest word is police must obtain a search warrant before they can access consumption pattern records.

In Saskatchewan, police dont have to obtain a search warrant.

The most recent Ontario case also takes the position no warrant is required. But all of this may change later this year when the Supreme Court of Canada hears an appeal in the Daniel James Gomboc case.

Gomboc was convicted of producing and possessing marijuana for the purposes of trafficking in Calgary, but the Alberta Court of Appeal set aside the conviction after ruling police should have obtained a search warrant before they obtained the electricity records. The warrantless search was said to have violated Gombocs privacy rights under section 8 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms so the evidence seized, hundreds of plants, 165 kgs of bulk marijuana and 206 grams of processed marijuana, was deemed inadmissible.

The Supreme Court is slated to hear the Gomboc appeal in May. Normal practice is the decision will be reserved and not released until months later, leaving the law in a state of uncertainty in the interim.

If police require a search warrant to access consumption pattern records theyll be at a real disadvantage. Often police have a suspicion, perhaps even a strong suspicion, of the existence of a grow op. The suspicion may come from various factors such as condensation on windows, strange odours, visitors coming and going at odd hours through garage or rear doors.

But they cant get a warrant with mere suspicion. They need reasonable and probable grounds sufficient to justify a search. Without evidence from electricity consumption patterns they often wont have such reasonable and probable grounds.

Our marijuana laws dont make much sense.

We spend far too much money enforcing silly marijuana laws.

Having said that, marijuana grow ops hidden in homes in residential areas are illegal, can present a danger and should be closed down.

Allowing the police to easily access hydro records so as to better deal with this problem makes sense.

*hxxp://tinyurl.com/y95arhg*


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## dman1234 (Feb 21, 2010)

And then comes the smart meter.


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## Tater (Feb 21, 2010)

So then you buy a battery bank that pulls current during lights off and stores it and releases current during lights off to hide the tell tale 12/12 consumption spikes.  Anything that can be developed to detect us can be countered with enough time, energy, and money.  Its an arms race and the people on our side of the line have been winning it since day one.


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## nouvellechef (Feb 22, 2010)

In all honesty. I am very close, I mean very close, to spending 20k on solar panels for new house. In the region I live in, I can substitute 50% of my power usage annualy from the panels. Its not much and its alot of money, but its a lifetime investment and being a green kind of guy in and out of the kitchen, I think its very cool.


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## degenerative_disc (Feb 22, 2010)

OK
So what are you guys saying? Start shutting everything down? Tare it all down and stop before we get caught? What are you suggesting?

Cheers!!!


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## nouvellechef (Feb 22, 2010)

Nope. No way. Dont tell a single person, Dont steal the power, Pay your damn bill on time, keep it stealth. Trust me, energy companies dont care what your using as long as your paying your bill. I could rent a auto shop down the road, make it a fortress and run 50 lights in there. I know a few ppl at our local energy company that have been there for years and sit in on the board meetings. Guess what, they puff a little here and there. They flat out said, pay the bill and as long as nobody has a little warrant for that info from them, your good. However I will be honest. I was also told about ppl paying off customer service reps to get power usage info, spikes, etc. It can be found by those ppl and watched for a bit by anybody, now thats more scary than above, IMO.


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## NorCalHal (Feb 22, 2010)

How about joining a pro Decrim/legalization group and fighting for your rights to cultivate andpossess MJ? 
It's time to stop being scared and to stand up.

What is sad to me is that the majority of folks on this site are great people, thier only "Illegal" activity is growing or possesing MJ. If it was legal, then we all would litterally have nothing to worry about from the Police. Talks of warrents and searches just would not apply to us.

I understand that alot of folks live in other States/Countries that have alot harsher penelties then others, but you can still help the Decrim effort in your area. I know, eaisier said then done.


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## nouvellechef (Feb 22, 2010)

NorCalHal said:
			
		

> How about joining a pro Decrim/legalization group and fighting for your rights to cultivate andpossess MJ?
> It's time to stop being scared and to stand up.
> 
> What is sad to me is that the majority of folks on this site are great people, thier only "Illegal" activity is growing or possesing MJ. If it was legal, then we all would litterally have nothing to worry about from the Police. Talks of warrents and searches just would not apply to us.
> ...


 
Agreed brother. I donate serious coin to the fight each year in donations. We had our local dispensary shutter for a bit and cleaned house across the state for filters. As stated, gonna get tough to a peak before it runs at a baseline of feeling safe.


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## AcesUp (Feb 22, 2010)

dman1234 said:
			
		

> And then comes the smart meter.


 

With the smart meter the utilities can track hourly usage data. If lights are turning on every day at the same time for 12 hours, seems like a big red flag that says come and get me. I know that leo needs a warrant but... 

What is this battery bank you speak of Tater?
"So then you buy a battery bank that pulls current during lights off and stores it and releases current during lights off to hide the tell tale 12/12 consumption spikes."


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## NorCalHal (Feb 23, 2010)

Honestly...I know a few folks that work for the Big Electrical companies.
They all agree that the Elec Co does not care how much power u use or when u use it. They are not looking for patterns. The Smart Meters are simply an easy way to shut off your power for non payment from the main office, rather then sending out folks to manually do it.
So, it's not about tracking growers...it's about eliminating jobs with technology.

I know a friend who runs a $2500 a month elec bill, and this is all due to many HID's. He pays his bill each month and has no issues.

Bottom line...if they want to get you, they will. It is not because of smart meters being installed, imo.


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## greenfriend (Feb 23, 2010)

i know this may not be an option for most ppl, but if you are using enough lights to have a huge bill, why not grow in a commercial/industrial area where its not unusual to have high power usage.

or if you want to go super green...use a biodiesel generator, and make your own biodiesel.  

alternatively, modify a car/truck engine to run on waste vegetable oil (WVO) and somehow connect it to a generator.  in theory you could not pay for power at all.

if youve converted a vehicle to biodiesel or WVO, you'll know thats its not that much work to save that $2500 in electricity.


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