# Single leaf formation with some yellowing



## elwigum (Jul 21, 2008)

I was wondering someone could help me out. My biggest problem it seems now is the single leaf formation in the flowers. A few of the pics are of an aeroflo I cut down early due to poor development and now I am getting it on most but not all of my plants. Besides the poor growth everything seems pretty decent. 
Oh also the plant in the picture is a tad yellow any ideas on that one?
Some other useful info would be that I collect rainwater off the roof and that is the water that I use along with the dehumidifier and some tap water that is very hard (700 to 1000ppm). We have a new (very deep) well. 
*
1. How tall are your plants now? 
*about 3 feet

* 2. How far from the lights are the tops of your plants? Is this a constant distance or have you changed it recently? 
*about 1 to 3 inches too close, I have 7 foot celings so i'm doing the best I can
*
3. How old are they? 
*All of them are in the 4th through 6th week of flowering. They are clones of clones of clones.

* 4. What strain are they? 
*Half sativa and half indica
*
5. Did you start them from seed or clone? 
*Clones
*
6. What type of containers are you using and what size are they in gallons?
*1 gal and 3 gal               *WHAT TYPE OF GROW DO YOU HAVE?


7. Dirt? 
*Hyponex, peat moss and perilite

* 8. What mixture of dirt or type of dirt did you use? 

9. Is it a type that has added nutrients like "Miracle Grow"? 

10. What mixture of perlite, vermiculite and other additives have you used if any? 

11. Hydroponic? 


* *WHAT TYPE OF HYDROPONIC SYSTEM DO YOU USE?


12. Ebb and Flow 

13. NFT 

14. Bubbler/Deep Water 


* *WHAT TYPE OF MEDIA DO YOU USE? 


15. Gravel 

16. Hydroton 

17. Rockwool slab 


* *WHAT TYPE OF LIGHTS DO YOU USE? 


18. Fluorescent 

19. Halide

20. HPS 

21. Wattage? 
*3-1000 watt HPS*
22. Ballast, is it digital or analog? 
*One digital, two analog

* 23. Is it remote or in your grow area? 
*The balasts are in an air cooled box

* 24. What nutrients are you feeding your plants? 
*Advanced Nutrients, just the 2 parts now, ran out of everything else
*HYDROPONIC FERTS?


25. What brand? What mix? What strength? 

26. How often, and when was the last time?


* *SOIL FERTS? 


27. What brand? What strength? What mix? 
*AN-I am using the moderate strength off of thier website

* 28. How often, and when was the last time?
*Once a week per the person on the 800 number
*ENVIRONMENTAL CONDITIONS OF THE GROW AREA


29. Do you use ventilation for your indoor grow? 

30. If so, what do you use? 

31. Do you use a fan?
*2 fans, one occilating and one stationary in the back

* 32. What type of fan and where is it pointed? What speed? 

33. Temperature of the grow area?
*83 to 87 during the day and low 70s at night*

34. Humidity of the grow area? 
*I keep the machine at 55 to 60 but it adds heat so I will kill it for an hour from time to time
* 35. Is CO2 being introduced? What method? 
*no-too hot to close the door

* 36. Do you use Odor Control, (carbon, ionizer, ozone gen)? 
*no
* 37. Do you use LST? HST?*


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## slowmo77 (Jul 21, 2008)

take a look at the links in my signature.


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## elwigum (Aug 10, 2008)

I spent about an hour this site last night looking for a similar problem I have with these indoors, but to no avail. 
If someone would be so kind to give me a link I would really appreciate it.

My problem is that I am about 2 weeks from cutting them all down. I had about 100 plants and only about 7 to 10 of them produced like they should have. The other ones are huge, nice nugs, chunky, but no THC or bud smell. So basically I have somewhere around a pound or so of almost useless buds. There's just no trichs on them.

My 2 theories are that I took them as clones too late into flower and it screwed up their genetics or it's not getting cold enough at night.


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## wedginfool (Aug 12, 2008)

hi i'd just like to know if you got these clones from someone else or if you took them yourself from a proven good budder. 
i have some plants like that that i grew from seed from a seed bank and got a batch of *EDIT*up seeds  it's bad genetics and i'm going to have to cull it, however not all of the seeds were bad but i'm still not going to be using the strain anymore it takes too long to bud and with too small buds.............these single leaf plants dont produce a bud for*EDIT*

I definitely wouldn't take anymore clones off of those plants i'd get some new seeds for the next grow
i don't see how taking clones too late in the flower cycle would effect genetics.....breeding it to itself too many times will......................a person needs to take a lot more clones than he actually needs and select from the best of them to keep the genetics from degenerating

the next time i get new seeds i'm going to only clone from the best ones....i've got kind of a problem with that now. the last seeds i got were all good but some of them have that purple trait which in my opinion messes up the taste of the bud , the ones not with any purple at all in them taste so sweet it's unbeleiveable.............this new batch of clones i've got going now i'm numbering and that way i will be able to single out the best plants to clone from


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## Tater (Aug 12, 2008)

Those single leaf formations are normal at that stage of flowering and the water you are feeding your plants is garbage.  Most likely doing way more harm than good.  How do you even add nutrients to water that is starting off in the 1000ppm range?


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## Barrelhse (Aug 13, 2008)

If the clones were taken from a flowering plant somewhere along the line, and put back in veg, they will produce single leaves until they re-adjust and return to vegetative growth- this can take several weeks. Any clones taken before reversal will go right to flower, with the one leaf trait. They can be good smoke, often a single stalk covered with buds, but they tend to be that leather-leaf type of plant that lacks flavor and looks better than it acts.


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## elwigum (Aug 14, 2008)

Thanks for the comment wedginfool. I think you are right for the most part about the bad genetics from the seed. 
There's mad drama here and to make a long story short I just wasn't paying as much attention to the garden as I should have been. Thinking back now what I did was I took these clones from a plant that grew like mad crazy and though that that would translate into great generations. But that one turned out to be really lame and not strong at all. It's just too bad I used that one to make up 80% of the garden.
Now on the other hand just tonight I came across one of the problem plants and on some lower branches there is completely normal development. So the main stem is what I have been describing (strong flowering but severely separated flowers, no bud smell, single leafs and no tricombs) and a few lower nugs with a deep indica smell. So I had a brain fart and thought it might be the heat. It averages 83 to 86 in the room with lights on and at night it is what ever the temp is outside since I am drawing in outside air all night long. There are 2 batches in there right now (2 different flowering dates) with only one of them having one feeding left and the other is on flush so I'll see what happens.
I know it has to be either the genetics or the heat  because everything else is the same and I have at least 5 plants that are doing outstanding, both sativas and indicas. The best ones are also the shortest so I was thinking that the distance from the lamp might be a factor since all the problem plants are too close to the light. Oh I only have 7 foot ceilings and the plants are about 5 to 6 inches off the ground in a tub.
I had to let them get that way because I wanted to give them the full minimum 21 days of veg since I took them so late in bloom. (Now I know I should have been doing some mad trimming and configuring of the branches. 
I've just chalked it up to a semi bad grow. If I'm really lucky I can just use them for hash. Disappointing though since I have to have at least a pound of the poor buds and a few ounces of the bomb.


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## elwigum (Aug 20, 2008)

elwigum said:
			
		

> Now on the other hand just tonight I came across one of the problem plants and on some lower branches there is completely normal development. So the main stem is what I have been describing (strong flowering but severely separated flowers, no bud smell, single leafs and no tricombs) and a few lower nugs with a deep indica smell.



Update-
Actually it is 2 different plants in one pot. So it has to be just this batch of clones, which make up 80% of the room.


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## elwigum (Aug 20, 2008)

Here are some updated pics from today. I rearranged the room a bit and brought the lights up as high as they possibly will go. I think I will be letting these go a few more weeks in hopes of getting the most out of them. I don't suppose it will hurt anything and all they can do is grow more trichs.


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## HippyInEngland (Aug 20, 2008)

To me it looks like you have leaf bleaching, it happens when the plants get too much light, your using 3000w of lights, how big is your grow room?

What is the N-P-K value of your feed?

What is your water PH?


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## elwigum (Aug 20, 2008)

Hey English hippy
Thank you for the reply. Now I have to search for leaf bleaching when I get back from work. From what I was reading it was impossible to have too much light, just plants that are too close to the light, which mine were for a long time. I wanted to wait the 21 days since they came from a flowering plant but that made them really tall for my short basement. I was even told I could run 4 or 5 lights in the 10 by 15 room.
I am using the Advanced Nutrients for bloom which they recommend a 1-1-1 of their product in increasing strength and then tapering off.
I make my water about 6.2 to 6.5 and it is predominantly rainwater.

Any other recommendations for salvaging these guys would be great.


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## elwigum (Aug 28, 2008)

So mixed in with all of these freaks were a few decent ladies. I cut down 2 indicas and one of the sativas. 
Both smell great. The indica has a deep pungent smell and the sativa has a bright fruity smell.

If anyone would could help out with identification of the strains that would be great. 
If you'll notice the top of the larger indica has a bit of the odd growth the rest of the room is exhibiting.

The sativa had a touch of purple to a few of its leaves, looks really nice. I made sure to put them in a book.


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## elwigum (Aug 28, 2008)

Afterthought

So without going into a ton of drama I realized now how much attention growing takes. I had quite a bit on my mind during this grow and realize now that a big mistake I made was taking so many clones of a plant I hadn't fully flowered.
I basically had 2 strains, the ones above, which are phenomenal to say the least. What I must have done is I displaced the two great strains with a strong growing female that I had never fully flowered.
Disappointing to say the least. I can only imagine what a room full of the goods would have looked and smelled like. At least I got a few of the bomb and many of the mids.


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## elwigum (Aug 29, 2008)

Just another shot


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## elwigum (Aug 31, 2008)

So I have taken all of the best growing plants out of the room and wanted to share some more pics and talk about the type of high each has. 

From post 12 the one in the top 3 pictures smells really fruity and has an uplifting cerebral high, sativa I'm assuming. Very nice.

The plants below that must be indica. It smells deep and heavy and has a similar high, or rather low. Very nice as well.

So there were those 2 strains and from what I could tell everything else is the same. Well I happen to eyeball a rather octopus looking one in the back that had fallen over and snapped. So I dried it and well, dam am I blown away. 
I don't know what category it falls in but I have been smoking the other 2 strains back and forth and they are very good like I commented above, but the snapped plant took me to a whole different level. It lasted all afternoon and gave me energy and motivation. I took a couple puffs and I was up and doing all kinds of things around the house. I call it The Phelps, after Micheal Phelps. 
So I'm guessing everything in there is this strain, really low frost/trichs but packs a major kick. I should be cutting everything down in the next week or so.
Let me know what type the Phelps is if anyone has an idea.


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## elwigum (Aug 31, 2008)

Oh here is the last indica I pulled out. Note the multiple layers of growth on top. Any ideas about that?


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## elwigum (Sep 1, 2008)

I took down the 2 more from the room. These 2 look the best but exhibit the same odd growth. In a week I'll let you know how they smoke.


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## wedginfool (Sep 2, 2008)

hi elwigium
I don't know what to do either i have a bunch of plants just exactly like that

i had been supercropping or stem pinching, to give the stems more girth and provide more nutrient to the buds and i was really amazed how my buds grew.........i have got one bud the size of a coffee can..........things were going great the majority of my plants were supposed to be 8 week budders and i was getting into the 8th week and i had a lot of very nice buds however they weren't maturing all the way.... just clear to cloudy trichs...a few amber trichs...........so i have decided to take a few of the nice buds out to provide more light to competitng buds as it is way too crowded in there anyway.....since then i have been fighting the ph and keeping it where i want it and the buds kind of stalled out quit growing...........they've taken off now and they look exactly like your buds .............they were all growing nice and fat crystally and now i just have a single stem growing out of the top of the bud and it's skinny and only putting calyxes every quarter inch or so apart on the stem...........i'm 11 weeks into flower now and don't know what to do...........they're still growing very stretched out but seem to be doing better now....like they're trying to tighten up a little..........i'm pretty sure i had nut lockout which stalled them and put me into this 11th week of flowering.......................i'm wondering if i shouldn't cut this new growth off the top of my buds to continue fattening and maturing the nice parts of them ..................there's not too much time left before i have to chop them all and start with my next new batch of clones cause there getting about the size to put into flower themselves.............i might be able to delay another 2 weeks
i wonder if maybe pinching the stem would help.............. it might make that skinny top piece fatten up a little in the 2 weeks left

any thoughts from anyone on this???


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## trillions of atoms (Sep 2, 2008)

one clone turned out bad?? how? its the same genetic line as the other clones- that makes no sense.


the leaf formation and strechy growth is most likely from to much N, NOT genetics if the mother formed well u can see its nutrient problem with the leaf discoloration is to many nutes. use distilled water. get a good ph meter, flush the plants and lower the feedings until they show fresh growth.


mkae sure there is no light at all in the growroom at night. even a light on a power strip can hinder flower if it was added inside the grow during budding or even moved around.


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## BuddyLuv (Sep 2, 2008)

How big is this room. I have 2 1000w in a 48 sq.ft. area and there is no way I could cram 60 plants @ 3 ft. a piece. I am using your math of 3 1000w lamps with 100 plants as an example. also temps in the upper 80's is going to create most of your problems right there.


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## elwigum (Sep 10, 2008)

Well the lights are off for good and the clippers are coming out in the morning.
I think they are about as good as they are going to get.

Had a minor bummer today when I found a bit of mold. This is the only one that has any and it only got the top 3rd of the main cola.


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## KGB30 (Sep 10, 2008)

cute dog


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