# 5 weeks flower leafs look bad



## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

Hey everyone, my lady is in 5th week of flower and in the past two weeks the leafs are progressively getting worse even in a day i will find a new one that has just completely wilted and fall off. Not just the few yellow ones from the bottom, but these are all over. More pics are in my sig. to give a better idea, I was told it may be ph being off but thats been dialed in pretty well, i decided to give a flush and a break from the nutes on tuesday but since then it has got a lot worse, maybe i didnt flush well enough i dont know. any help please i hate to be this far and not make it.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

?????????????????????????????????


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## kaotik (Mar 12, 2010)

are they just hungry maybe? for some nitrogen i'm thinking?
(i really don't know, look a little hungry, but yet other leaves are still nice color.. looks like something else going on too, so i'm not confident to say that's what it is, why i didn't reply)

what was your feed before you satarted adjusting stuff?

*warning, this is a shot in the dark, my only real advice is wait for the better growers to chime in.. hopefully someone will shortly. but in the meantime if you can add any other info you can think that may speed up diagnosis..


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

I actually only gave them 2 bloom feeds since shes been in 12/12 of 15-30-15
bloom booster before that i gave all purpose 20-20-20 up until 1 week in and fish emulsion but not on a strict schedule until right before 12/12 i finally tried getting a schedule on track, hope this helps its been a confusing grow


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## Rosebud (Mar 12, 2010)

Too much water? Just a guess.


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## erwinsweeney (Mar 12, 2010)

I have not had the exact same looking issue, however, when I get anytype of leaf discoloration or spotting, I flushed them with plain water at the rate of 3X the amount of the medium the container can hold.  While I'm flushing, I PH test the runoff water and PH adjust the water I'm adding accordingly in order to achieve a runoff of 6.5.  Basically, if my runoff is reading 6.2, I then adjust up the water I'm flushing with to say 6.8 or so, until the runoff shows 6.5.  At the end of the flush with plain water, I then flush lightly with a mild nutrient solution, like half strength.  After all the flushing with water and nutrient solution, the medium is very soggy, so it is important to let it dry out well before watering or feeding again.  Within a few days my new growth is looking much better, salts are washed out, root zone ph is within parameters, and if you're using proper nutrients, they should have everything that they need.  Give it a shot.  Hope the best for ya!


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

I am actually in the process of doing just that and you just helped me to think it may be a good idea, so i appeciate that, do you think it will hurt considering I gave plain water just tues.?


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## erwinsweeney (Mar 12, 2010)

stinkyelements said:
			
		

> I am actually in the process of doing just that and you just helped me to think it may be a good idea, so i appeciate that, do you think it will hurt considering I gave plain water just tues.?


 
It wont hurt them worse.  Whatever the exact issue they are having is stressing them much more than the flushing will.  Overwatering comes into play when you consistently keep them too soggy.  Its important that after you do the process that you let them dry out before watering or feeding again.  Not to the point that they wilt from lack of water, but that they get back onto the proper wet/dry cycle as soon as possible.  They more than likely will have that droopy, heavy, leaves curled down look for a little while until they dry out some.  I now flush mine every 2-3 weeks, and I haven't had any spotting or nasty leaves.  Keep in mind, as you may know, those damaged leaves will stay that way.  You will be looking for improvement in your new growth in about 3-4 days.  Let me know how things work out.  I think you will be fine.

PS!  I'm a huuuuge philly fan!  I grew up near there, but now live out west.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

Thats exactly what I was asking too, thanks


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

Heres the deal exactly......This is my first decent real grow, so with that in mind bear with me. From the start I had nute burn issues from soil choices and went through several transplants before she was happy at that point I was feeding Neptunes Harvest fish emulsion only, I wanted to go organic but MG soil fom the start kinda changed that and hearing the fish emulsion was good but just a start itself. At that point I was almost about ready to flower but wanted to get her on some feeding schedule. So I used jacks classic 20-20-20 because going organic at this point was out of the question. Right from that I flushed and switched to 12/12 I then used the fish emulsion again because she seemed to like it and wasnt sure about the jacks. I then did not feed anything other than ph'd water for two weeks until i started the bloom booster 3 weeks in 15-30-15. And did that for two feeding. Things started looking great, buds comin in nice although they smell like the fish emulsion still, So i watered again and flushed a little because of the change, afraid that she wasnt used to the nutes and mixing organic with chem didnt seem a good idea and now Im having these issues. wow!!! yea....................


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

:holysheep:

I have leaned a lot from this, with my clones doing great, but the flowering mother took the hit bad and this far in to lose her would be horrible shes a beauty


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## Budders Keeper (Mar 12, 2010)

Looks to me like you may have locked something up..phosphorus perhaps. A flush would be the perfect solution. Too moch iron and/or ph could cause that.
BTW, the buds seem to be doing nicely and the problem doesn't look like a killer to me...don't worry, be happy


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

Thanks to everyone on here i wouldnt be this far, just to throw that out there MP you are great, i really appreciate it a thousand times over everyone who has helped along the way


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## dman1234 (Mar 12, 2010)

is it just me or does this not look like typical plant in its 6th week of flower.

you have plenty of green still, IMO those leaves are doing what they are suppose to do, their dying, congratulations.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

Budders keeper- Thanks for the input and uplift of confidence i may be ok

dman- you have been helping my grow a lot, your the man, I have a smile on my face now. 
but do the fans really get that bad lookin?


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## erwinsweeney (Mar 12, 2010)

I'm sure you're already thinking about it, but, for your next grow, have your nutes already lined up.  It will make it easier to pinpoint problems.  I still use the Fox Farm nutrient trio myself.  Only one of the three parts are organic.  I also use their Ocean Forest soil.  There are normally 2 parts to a flowering ferterlizer.  One contains the base elements required, the other contains the trace elements, a bloom booster basically.  I also use a bud hardner towards the end of flower.  It hardens em up a bit making them more dense.  There are many many factors when doing a completely organic grow.  You are essentially replicating a completely natural environment indoors.  If you want to do the organic thing, I recommend taking a look at the Earth Juice line of nutrients and additives, they are comparatively inexpensive, and make good stuff if used properly.  If you want to go with ease of use, I would recommend either Fox Farms Trio, or General Hydroponics 3 part.  Both not organic, but very beginner friendly, and very widely used, great results.  If you do an adequate flush at the end of flowering, you should not taste any feterlizer even using non organic ferts.  I use Clearex solution at the end of flower, it's a flushing solution, aids in getting rid everything.  I also use the Clearex during regular flushing as well, helps break up the salts.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

erwinsweeney said:
			
		

> I'm sure you're already thinking about it, but, for your next grow, have your nutes already lined up.  It will make it easier to pinpoint problems.  I still use the Fox Farm nutrient trio myself.  Only one of the three parts are organic.  I also use their Ocean Forest soil.  There are normally 2 parts to a flowering ferterlizer.  One contains the base elements required, the other contains the trace elements, a bloom booster basically.  I also use a bud hardner towards the end of flower.  It hardens em up a bit making them more dense.  There are many many factors when doing a completely organic grow.  You are essentially replicating a completely natural environment indoors.  If you want to do the organic thing, I recommend taking a look at the Earth Juice line of nutrients and additives, they are comparatively inexpensive, and make good stuff if used properly.  If you want to go with ease of use, I would recommend either Fox Farms Trio, or General Hydroponics 3 part.  Both not organic, but very beginner friendly, and very widely used, great results.  If you do an adequate flush at the end of flowering, you should not taste any feterlizer even using non organic ferts.  I use Clearex solution at the end of flower, it's a flushing solution, aids in getting rid everything.  I also use the Clearex during regular flushing as well, helps break up the salts.




I definately have a better idea for how to get a strict schedule and nute line up, I hear that organic is a whole other ballpark and many have more issues with that. But i am looking into a nice nute line up to follow and with your info, definitely helps, I now have my clones on a good schedule it took a cpl losses and learning experiences but they are good. But i am hearing what your saying and taking it all in, much appreciated:48:


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## erwinsweeney (Mar 12, 2010)

dman1234 said:
			
		

> is it just me or does this not look like typical plant in its 6th week of flower.
> 
> you have plenty of green still, IMO those leaves are doing what they are suppose to do, their dying, congratulations.


 
Doesn't look typical to me.  Late in flowering I usually see a gradual yellowing of leaves, and they kinda get soft like.  The ones in the pictures appear spotted and blotchy, and crispy.  It appears he still has a good bit of flowering to go, and shouldn't be seeing a change that drastic yet.  Take a look at the link below.  It's a link to some very good looking plants at 6 weeks, they were posted by Budders Keeper, who posted above in this thread.  IMO, thats what they should look like.  You'll be fine with the good flush.

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53041


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

erwinsweeney said:
			
		

> Doesn't look typical to me.  Late in flowering I usually see a gradual yellowing of leaves, and they kinda get soft like.  The ones in the pictures appear   It appears he still has a good bit of flowering to go, and shouldn't be seeing a change that drastic yet.  Take a look at the link below.  It's a link to some very good looking plants at 6 weeks, they were posted by Budders Keeper, who posted above in this thread.  IMO, thats what they should look like.  You'll be fine with the good flush.



Yea that is exactly what they are spotted and blotchy, and crispy. Should not be happening like this yet I do agree with that also! Yea i have a few soft yellow ones at the bottom but that shouldnt be goin on all around like what i have


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## erwinsweeney (Mar 12, 2010)

stinkyelements said:
			
		

> I definately have a better idea for how to get a strict schedule and nute line up, I hear that organic is a whole other ballpark and many have more issues with that. But i am looking into a nice nute line up to follow and with your info, definitely helps, I now have my clones on a good schedule it took a cpl losses and learning experiences but they are good. But i am hearing what your saying and taking it all in, much appreciated:48:


 
Yeah`dude.  I nute burned mine plenty of times!  Takes a little while of using specific nutes and growing specific strains to get things in balance.  I'm finally really learning to see the signs early of when to feed, when not to, when to flush, when to final flush, etc.  Be patient, each round will get better and better.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

Again thanks. Your support is calming and encouraging, I'll get there.


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## degenerative_disc (Mar 12, 2010)

I want to agree with the Dman on this one.
At week 6 your plant is going to start taking the energy away from larger unwanted or needed leaves and put that energy into budd production. It will continue to discard wqhat it can live without in order to give you the final product and that just good budd. As long as your budds are healthy and not dieing man just monitor and happy smoking your almost there!!


cheers!!!!


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

degenerative_disc said:
			
		

> I want to agree with the Dman on this one.
> At week 6 your plant is going to start taking the energy away from larger unwanted or needed leaves and put that energy into budd production. It will continue to discard wqhat it can live without in order to give you the final product and that just good budd. As long as your budds are healthy and not dieing man just monitor and happy smoking your almost there!!
> 
> 
> cheers!!!!



DegD- Hey man thanks for the input and stopping in. Yes I want to agree with DMan too and understand that cycle completely, but in the 5th week I cant imagine them deteriate like they are, and i have the few lower leaves doing what they do but i dont understand the other fans looking like that........


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## degenerative_disc (Mar 12, 2010)

Hey Stinky

I had a big bushy plant in my hobbo setup last year that when I put her into flower she immediatly started to look like she was dieing. I kept an eye on her and she killed off all off her outer foilage like big fan leave and then medium fan leaves and eventualy she plained out and stopped with just small little budd leaves and thats the way she finished and may I say she finishe FINE!!! She looked like slow death but she pulled it the way she wanted to pull it. 


Cheers!!!


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## dman1234 (Mar 12, 2010)

You should flush it if it will make you feel better,  we cant see the whole plant, but some strains can get pretty ugly near the end, got a pic of the whole plant.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 12, 2010)

DegDisc- Really? your giving me hope man

DMan- You got me looking forward that Im doing ok, I appreciate it yeah I can get a pic of the whole plant. 

Thanks to helpful fellow growers like you guys Im learning more about how strains and other factors are so big in the cycle


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## stinkyelements (Mar 13, 2010)

Hey I also moved my clones up closer to the hps about 12-18in. but temps still stay at 80 at canopy no more, but within the next day it looks like the top cpl leafs are bleached looking almost, just a little and only on two clones of ten, so im not sure whats up with that.


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## erwinsweeney (Mar 13, 2010)

stinkyelements said:
			
		

> Hey I also moved my clones up closer to the hps about 12-18in. but temps still stay at 80 at canopy no more, but within the next day it looks like the top cpl leafs are bleached looking almost, just a little and only on two clones of ten, so im not sure whats up with that.


 
Sometimes you have to harden them off a bit with going under the HPS.  If they haven't been under the HPS before, and/or are freshly rooted the HPS can be too much.  I would move those couple a little further from the light.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 13, 2010)

erwin- They have been under the hps for about 3wks, before that they were flowering under just those tube fluoros. But they are all rooted and flowering for a bit. I just thought they could be closer to the hps, i was looking at a chart that showed how close to get them to get the most lumens without burnin em, with all different watts mine is 250 so i decided to try and get them closer, canopy was almost 2ft. and it didnt seem hot to my hand when i moved them up.


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## BBFan (Mar 14, 2010)

Mr. Elements-

What is your ph running?  While I agree that you'll get some die off towards the end of flower as the plant enters senescence, that is not what is going on with your plants.  The leaves turn yellow, not blotchy and burned.  The plants in this photo are clones at 6 weeks flower that were 1 week from harvest.  For the most part, the leaves are yellow, but not blotchy (if you look close, you can see a few burnt leaves- but that's a nute problem I had).

View attachment 156570




A moderate flush is not a flush at all IMO when growing in soil.  You're just overwatering.  5 times the volume of the pot is the recommended flush amount.  If the problem is a salt build up, 1 good flush should resolve it.  Continually flushing is messing with the rhizosphere and probably more harmful than beneficial as far as soil goes.

You're really doing great.  One good flush, stop feeding them, just use plain *PH adjusted *water until you get the problem under control.  Looks like you still have a few more weeks to go at least.

Keep up the great work and you will be rewarded.  Just my thoughts.


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## stinkyelements (Mar 14, 2010)

BBFan- Yes I agree with you completely, you helped me see it was more like a issue with ph in the first place and decide to flush, my ph is usually dialed in well at 6.5 though, but somewhere in the mix it got tweaked, i noticed my runoff wasnt so good, so im working on getting it right again, just didnt want to make any drastic changes now at this level if I didnt need to.


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## legalize_freedom (Mar 14, 2010)

I'd say solid advice from BBfan, as usual.  Either flush it and be done with it or don't.

I'm not familiar with the fish emulsion, but I'd be willing to bet that your plants are starving.  You said that you have only fed them 2x in 6 weeks.  Plants use alot of energy producing flowers, and that energy has to come from somewhere...nutrients.

You need to feed them once a week, especially since you switched to a soil with no nutes in it.  Like I said I'm not familiar with the fish emulsion, the GO freebies I got have an emulsion included as sort of an add on to the regular program.  Is the stuff you have 1 part of a set?  If so you need to get the rest of the products that go along with it.  If it's not part of a set, then I would say that the nute is seriousely lacking in something.

It could also be that all the transplants and ***** footing around with being afraid to overdue it with nutes during the veg cycle, that your plants were lacking the N they needed to have stored up to get them through the bloom cycle.  

How to fix it now...it's hard to say (especially not being familiar with your nutes)  If it were me I would do one good flush as recommended, and make sure that the run-off is pH'd in the zone.  Imediately after I would feed it with your bloom nute, and also apply some kind of micro nutrient...see if the company who makes your nutes has something to go along with the emulsion, if they don't, get something from any of the reputable companies that makes a micro-nute.

You are so far along with this one, you may just have to settle for what you get...and chalk it up as a learning experince.  If it's an 8 week strain...you really only have 1 or 2 more feedings that they will get any benefit from.  So you may just get what you get...but you have definately learned something from this and thats always a bonus granted from any mistake.

You've got some buddage there...so it's not a total loss, and trust me when I say I have seen worse!

I do think that plants need to be fed once a week, if your using a soil that has not been amended, and definately when using chems.  I understand wanting to go easy on the nutes, but you can go too easy on them to, and not give your plants what they need.

In the future when feeding a strain you have not grown before,  use 1/4 str. the first week, 1/2 str the 2nd week, 3/4 the 3rd week...etc and just keep gradually going up until you get just the tips a slight nute burn, and then back off a bit.  Then when you grow out the clones, you can basicly start out with close to the max feed that the donors used (I usually take a step down from the max for the first feeding, and build back up, just to be safe) But you don't need to start at 1/4 strength once you know your plants (unless 1/4 is max...but I doubt it) 

Anyway...thats about all I can think of right now man...like I said, they don't look THAT bad...your going to have something to smoke, it just may not be the max yeild for that strain...but you will get something.  PM me again if this post triggers any questions, because I have not been on here all the time like in the past few months...when I get on I usually only check out any PM's and a few threads.  I haven't been reading everything from top to bottom.  Good Luck bud!  Hang in there...you will be smoking on them soon!


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## stinkyelements (Mar 14, 2010)

Just to clarify, I swithched to 18/6 for 1wk 1/2 before 12/12. I was using the fish emulsion occasionally up until then in veg, because I spoke with jman and read his nute study and realized it was only a start and good with the other products. At this point he told me it wasnt too late to get on a schedule so i switched up my nutes. I started with chem nutes and went to all purpose 20-20-20 and still used the veg nutes until 1wk into 12/12 and used the NHFE once more because she loved it. I then fed just water the second wk, started bloom nutes MG bloom booster 15-30-15(yea i know) on the third week and 4th week. This past week was the fifth week and i noticed a problem getting worse, so I just watered to get ph right and fed bloom nutes again. I did feed at full dose each time with the bloom nutes thinking she would be be able to handle it. So she has been fed nutes 4 times in 5wks of flower, 3 bloom nute feedings...I think not having the nute lineup schedule down and all the changes must have a big part. But she was doing great, and very tolerant of the changes and nutes..........
I have definitely learned a lot through all of this thats for sure.


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## legalize_freedom (Mar 15, 2010)

Oh...okay...sorry for misunderstanding.  Yeah, I'd say all the switching and what not were definately not a good thing.

I would definately get soem micro nutes, or at least do a couple runs of cal mag, along with your next feeding (I believe you told me you bought some)  Especially if the chem nutes that you got are not designed for MJ you'll want to add some cal-mag, even alot of the nutes that are designed for mj are not strong enough for some strains in this department.  I have come across it a few times with the FF line-up, and I used all 6 products (liquid and solubles) and have had to add cal-mag.

So you just started the 5th week...you will have time to get some things corrected then IMO...If nothing else you learned some things, which is priceless!


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