# THERMAL IMAGE THIS!......pig



## 7thG (Feb 4, 2009)

Just let me know if this is common practice. I hear alot about thermal imaging to catch growers by, i guess, hot air spewing out their homes. But, unless u live in a hut all homes have an exhaust for ur clothes dryer. If u join those two systems wouldnt that be fool proof. 

"hey i have a lot of dirty clothes so sue me........pig"


----------



## yumyumbubblegum (Feb 4, 2009)

*I think they look for the heat signature of your light(s) *


----------



## 7thG (Feb 4, 2009)

what blocks that....mylar?


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 4, 2009)

The one I seen on Youtube can only see heat coming out openings of the house,,,such as the vents. They were watching the guy because of it. They cant see your light system or where its at unless your heating up the whole freaken rooftop. Or thats what they say..Thats what I seen on Youtube video. Heat Sig coming from vent(from growroom exhaust).


----------



## Tater (Feb 5, 2009)

I don't know of any dryer vents that run 12 hours a day non stop.


----------



## 7thG (Feb 5, 2009)

"hey i have a lot of dirty clothes so sue me........pig"[/quote]


----------



## hashplant420 (Feb 5, 2009)

im running my exhaust hot air threw my chinmney..
my hot water my hot water heater and furnace are exhaust threw there also


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 5, 2009)

hashplant420 said:
			
		

> im running my exhaust hot air threw my chinmney..
> my hot water my hot water heater and furnace are exhaust threw there also


 
That might work,,, if ya dont live in Florida.


----------



## RaoulDuke (Feb 6, 2009)

Don't quote me, but don't they need a warrant to use the camera on your house?


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 6, 2009)

RaoulDuke said:
			
		

> Don't quote me, but don't they need a warrant to use the camera on your house?


 
You are joking right? I bet you have never been in trouble with the Law! Which is a very good thing.


----------



## Pothead420 (Feb 6, 2009)

CowboyBudsky said:
			
		

> You are joking right? I bet you have never been in trouble with the Law! Which is a very good thing.


_On June 11, 2001 the Supreme Court ruled U.S. v Kyllo in a five to four decision that people have an expectation of privacy in their homes. Using high technology to detect heat coming from the premises is an invasion of that privacy and cannot be used to obtain a search warrant. 
but we all know how lowdown the police are im sure they still use it and then make some excuse like the neighbor smelling the weed or something like that
_


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 6, 2009)

_



but we all know how lowdown the police are im sure they still use it and then make some excuse like the neighbor smelling the weed or something like that

Click to expand...

_ 
_I reast my case. _
_ Im 53 yrs old and have been(Oh lets say I worked for the state a few times, WITHOUT PAY) and They will,,, and can,,, do pretty much what ever the hell they want,,unless you know someone,, or you have a GOOD lawyer and lots of money to beat their crooked asses. I didnt,,, and most dont. _


----------



## BuddyLuv (Feb 6, 2009)

Who has their exhaust runing 12 hours a day? Mine runs maybe 5 minutes every two hours.


----------



## Tater (Feb 6, 2009)

People with air cooled reflectors.


----------



## BuddyLuv (Feb 6, 2009)

I air cool my hoods but why on earth would you be dumping perfectly good hot air outside this time of year. I could see routing it outside in the summer but the winter is pointless. My gas bill went from $200 a month last year to $50 this winter. And my house stays a pleasant 68 degrees. The only time the furnace kicks on is late at night when it gets below 67.


----------



## NewbieG (Feb 6, 2009)

BuddyLuv said:
			
		

> I air cool my hoods but why on earth would you be dumping perfectly good hot air outside this time of year. I could see routing it outside in the summer but the winter is pointless. My gas bill went from $200 a month last year to $50 this winter. And my house stays a pleasant 68 degrees. The only time the furnace kicks on is late at night when it gets below 67.



+1. My room is the only warm room in the house


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 6, 2009)

BuddyLuv said:
			
		

> I air cool my hoods but why on earth would you be dumping perfectly good hot air outside this time of year. I could see routing it outside in the summer but the winter is pointless. My gas bill went from $200 a month last year to $50 this winter. And my house stays a pleasant 68 degrees. The only time the furnace kicks on is late at night when it gets below 67.


 
I Dont know,,,It was on Youtube. I have a small grow area and no heat problems. They would have a better chance locating a warm Fart coming out my bathroom vent. 

Thats nasty. Sick Bastage. Sorry,,Im high.


----------



## RaoulDuke (Feb 6, 2009)

CowboyBudsky said:
			
		

> You are joking right? I bet you have never been in trouble with the Law! Which is a very good thing.


 You're right! And I've accomplished this by knowing the law.



			
				Pothead420 said:
			
		

> _but we all know how lowdown the police are im sure they still use it and then make some excuse like the neighbor smelling the weed or something like that_


Touché.


----------



## The Effen Gee (Feb 6, 2009)

7thG said:
			
		

> Just let me know if this is common practice. I hear alot about thermal imaging to catch growers by, i guess, hot air spewing out their homes.



Negative.

The thermals will show a Huge White room, in a either mostly red, orange or violet (for cold) house. If they use the nicer color models.

Mylar won't insulate anything. 

You have to seal the room, then double insulate it, leaving a void or dead space at least 8'' around all five sides of the entire room (walls/ceiling) then use insulated vent ducting, run your lights at night and yes, use the dryer vents or tie onto the houses hot air ventilation systems either by t-ing off at your furnace, stove, fireplace or even vent into the sewer system like a true Covert Op grower.

thermals are no-joke. You can easily spend thousands insulating your room properly. Either you go all out or don't bother. If you are worried about your house getting scanned, they know already and you are a done deal at this point.


----------



## Bowl Destroyer (Feb 7, 2009)

BuddyLuv...And my house stays a pleasant 68 degrees...[/quote said:
			
		

> LOL not pleasant for sure. More like awkwardly uncomfortable. too warm for jacket, too cold for yr skivvies


----------



## tankdogster (Feb 9, 2009)

httx://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sudf5xDIhmM


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 9, 2009)

Yep,,thats what I said the other day. They see excessive heat buildup,,not yer freaken lights. And of course I know ya can get decent bud with Floras because I have done it,, and have some in flower right now,,looking mighty nice I might add,,,without the worries of FLIR seeing heat build up in my house.:hubba: And YES,YES,YES,,I know HIDS are better. 
Ya gotta make sure you say that,,,cause if you dont,,,SOME,,of the HID PPL will start telling you how your wasting money,,,and thats OK. To each his own. Im not an idiot,,I know Hids will give ya a bigger yield.
But for Personal Stash,,,I dont get why you would take that chance are go to so much trouble to get rid of heat,,if yer not a Dealer or MMJ Provider. If you are a provider,, then I get it. But ,,just for personal..I dont get it. And let me say this.I was at the Hydro store the other day and he has several setups. HIds and Floras. There is no comparison to the heat from Floras(T5) and the HIDs. The Hids are much hotter. Grab one,, and you will find out. I had someone tell me the other day that Floras put off as much heat as HIDs,, Yeah,,well ,,like I said,,,GRAB an HID bulb and tell me it aint hot enough to burn the **** outta ya. And,,, if it will burn you and the Floras dont,,how in the hell can ya say the Floras put off as much heat.:holysheep:


----------



## Hick (Feb 9, 2009)

burning watts/producing lumens, ...produces "heat".. the most efficient form of lighting.. lumens per watt consumed IS HID/HPS lighting.
  50,000 lumen of flourescent lighting will produce _very_ similar amounts of heat.. as 50,00 lumen of HID, but WILL cost more, consume more electricity.. :confused2:..

AND, I am not "dissing" anyone for using flou's,.. just keeping the information real..


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 9, 2009)

> 50,000 lumen of flourescent lighting will produce _very_ similar amounts of heat


 
Hick I have felt the heat coming off both,,and I dont see the simularity. Like I said..how can something that wont burn you,,put off as much heat as something that will. That doesnt make since Bro. You cannot make me believe that warm and hot are the samething,,, that just doesnt make since,,,plus I have seen this for myself. I am not saying that HIDs are not Proven to be a better light system for growing more Bud. Im not even gonna say Floras are cheeper to run,,,But the heat thing,, Come on ,,Burn ya,,not burn ya,,same heat?


----------



## Hick (Feb 9, 2009)

.. it's "just" science cowboy, not trying to be arguementative.. I'm not even going to say its "fact".. but....
400 watts of cfls will produce a "similar" amount of heat as a 400 hps.. IMO/E
 IMO.. the flos are distributing/dispersing the heat over many more sq inches of glass, in multiple paces, rather than it all being concentrated in one spot..(the hps bulb)..is probably why they _appear_ cooler to you..


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 9, 2009)

> 400 watts of cfls will produce a "similar" amount of heat as a 400 hps


 
OK,,whatever,,I will leave this alone.These guys (light Companies) aint paying me a dime to argue this point.:ignore: Besides I have too much respect for you and your knowledge to argue with you Hick. You are very good and have helped lots of PPL on this forum.


----------



## Hick (Feb 9, 2009)

> .how can something that wont burn you,,put off as much heat as something that will. That doesnt make since Bro. You cannot make me believe that warm and hot are the samething,,, that just doesnt make since,,,plus I have seen this for myself


.. the head of a match wil burn you, but.. if you disperse that same heat over 2 sq. ft., wil it still ??

I guess my point is, you are consuming equal amounts of energy and transforming it into "light and heat".. 
 since hps is proven without a doubt, to be more efficient(more lumens per watt consumed) it would be reasonable to assume that what energy expended, in not producing light, is producing "heat".. thus, would 400 w of hps actually be cooler than 400 w of flou's..??? 
I may be off my rocker with that analogy, but "I" don't _think_ so..  I'm sure if I  am, there wil be a sparky or a physics major to set me straight.. :rofl:..


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 9, 2009)

Read last thread again please. Maybe I was typing at the same time you were. IN short,,I dont care enough, to argue with someone I respect.


----------



## xxdjbud420xx (Feb 9, 2009)

If you have a crawl space under your house, couldnt you just go thru the floor?  If usually stays cooler under there.  Maybe put the exhaust hosing towards the center of the house.


----------



## Hick (Feb 9, 2009)

CowboyBudsky said:
			
		

> Read last thread again please. Maybe I was typing at the same time you were. IN short,,I dont care enough, to argue with someone I respect.


not arguing with you cowboy..and definately not disrespecting your views.. "I" am certainly not above being wrong/incorrect in my theory..    though I do try not t be.. :hubba:
 If I am, I certainly hope a more knowledgable member will correct me. I went into a li'l deeper detail in hopes it would either verify or discount the info', or at least "how" I came to the conclusion.. 
  I would welcome any evidence, information contrary.. other than "I can touch a 23 watt cfl, but can't a 400 watt hps".. that argument simply doesn't "hold water".. IMO...


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 9, 2009)

> I can touch a 23 watt cfl, but can't a 400 watt hps".. that argument simply doesn't "hold water


 
You sir are correct. And,, who said that anyway? That is not comparable,,I totaly agree. NOw,,I refer back to (for the last time). Me no care no more Hick. You win Bro. OK?


----------



## Hick (Feb 9, 2009)

.. It ain't "win or lose" cowboy.. it's about getting and giving correct information.. 
I don't want to be passing out bad info'.


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 9, 2009)

Hick said:
			
		

> .. It ain't "win or lose" cowboy.. it's about getting and giving correct information..
> I don't want to be passing out bad info'.


 
Well,,I agree. So we will just have to agree to dis-agree,,and go on with the very beautiful day it is outside,, here in Florida. Im gonna go smoke a bowl of my "Not as hot as HIDs,, Flora grown smoke,,and get high.  Sorry Hick,,JUst messen with ya now.:ignore:


----------



## Hick (Feb 9, 2009)

well . you coulda told me you was in Fla'... no wonder you can't tell hot from warm.. :rofl:.. 
messn back now ..


----------



## cadlakmike1 (Feb 9, 2009)

HID, florescent, everyone knows LED's are the best.......and they don't get hot!!!


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 9, 2009)

See what I told ya,,get yer facts stright next time. God I love Florida,,and Floras. Thats why I use them,,its in the name Florxxx.:ignore: Now Im just stoned.. and rambling.


----------



## TentFarmer (Feb 9, 2009)

Question on venting into the sewers.  The plumbing in my house has a vent going out the roof.  Therefore wouldn't vented air just go up and out vs down and away?

My **** stinks but not like a skunk.  Anyone here have skunk ****?


----------



## The Effen Gee (Feb 9, 2009)

Somewhere in that drain pipe there is a y joint.

Vent into there. Or up and out, whatever works for you.

I have seen many people in the MW use this method...especially back in the OG.com days...


----------



## 311Grower (Feb 17, 2009)

from what I've read and heard, infrared is only used after they have probable cause on you to obtain a search warrant and use it to validate what they have found out, normally from a snitch. Here's the deal, 90% of people busted growing in their home get busted b/c they can't shut their mouth and tell too many people. LOOSE LIPS SINK SHIPS. Everyone you show your grow off to probably smokes, so if they get busted, it's real easy for them to say hey I know someone who grows if you let me off the hook. The other 8% get busted b/c of the smell and neighbors calling the police and 2% for doing dumb **** like stealing electricity. If you're worried about the heat signature of your grow room, you can get black/white poly and insulate your grow room or grow tent with it to help hide the heat signature. Another good idea is a heat shield cover for your reflector, these will significantly reduce the temperature of your reflector and reduce the temps in your grow room. Most 6" reflectors have 8 sq feet of surface area that usually reach over 90 degrees when on and that heat dissipates into your grow room, using one of these on your reflector could reduce your grow room temps by up to 10 degrees. They even have a cover for your ducting for further temperature reduction although I don't find this to be all that necessary, from the video I saw it only lowered the temps of the ducting by about 3 degrees. 

Bottom line is, infrared cameras are the last thing you should be worried about. Worry about your landlord showing up out of nowhere, cops showing up from a noise complaint, paying your electric bill on time, keeping the odor down and keeping your mouth shut. It's hard to not show your grow off to your friends when they're in full bloom but everyone you know is strictly on a need to know basis, if they don't NEED to know, you don't tell them. 

Funny Story:  Sometimes you gotta straight up lie to your friends, my 2 friends who are brothers had a grow going in the one's walk in closet and our other friend who don't smoke walked in the room to get a lighter or something and happened to see the light coming out of the cracks of the door and asked why it was so bright in there; my buddy told him we decided we were going to try and make some bondage videos with some girls off Craigslist and sell it online and that was going to be our little bondage room and we needed good light to film. Our friend thought we were a lil off our rockers but the ******* believed it, couple weeks later he asked how the bondage vids were going....   LOL


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 17, 2009)

Better hope yer Buddy dont get religion..He might send the POPO to bust your Bondage and get your Budage,,,OH and your Buttage.


----------



## 311Grower (Feb 18, 2009)

here's the reflector cover I was talking about that reduces heat, it's made by Hydro Innovations and is called the Heat Shield. Unfortunately it's only being manufactured to fit a few different model reflectors but hopefully they'll expand their line of models....

I cant post links yet so just go to youtube and search "heat shield", should be the third video listed...


----------



## themadhatter (Feb 18, 2009)

as long as they are not on your property they can take pics of it. you can take a pic of anyone or anything as long as it is a public place (the middle of the street outside your home for example)




			
				RaoulDuke said:
			
		

> Don't quote me, but don't they need a warrant to use the camera on your house?


----------



## 311Grower (Feb 19, 2009)

themadhatter said:
			
		

> as long as they are not on your property they can take pics of it. you can take a pic of anyone or anything as long as it is a public place (the middle of the street outside your home for example)


 
You sir, are incorrect...  It was a Supreme Court Ruling in 2001 and to be reversed must go back through the Supreme Court and has not...  Now, I'm certainly not saying that some corrupt *** cops don't use it and just lie in order to get a search warrant, kind of like how they did on Barry Cooper's Kopbusters in Odessa, TX. They got a search warrant from what the police claim was an "informant tip" and there were no plants growing so obviously someone was lying.

http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=4307

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*Cops Can't Use Thermal Imagers Without Warrant, High Court Rules* 
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*June 14, 2001 - Washington, DC, USA*

"Police must procure a warrant before they can legally use thermal imaging devices or other new technologies to detect activities taking place inside the home, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled 5-4 Monday. Thermal imagers measure heat emanating from a house and are frequently used by law enforcement to identify indoor marijuana cultivation. "We think that obtaining by sense-enhancing technology any information regarding the interior of the home that could not otherwise have been obtained without physical intrusion into a constitutionally protected area constitutes a search - at least where the technology in question is not in general public use," Justice Antonin Scalia wrote for the Court. The decision overturns a Ninth Circuit ruling that found the warrantless use of thermal imaging did not constitute a search because "intimate details" were not revealed. "The Fourth Amendment's protection of the home has never been tied to measurement of the quality or quantity of information obtained," the high court rebuked. "In the home, ... all details are intimate details, because the entire area is held safe from prying government eyes." The defendant in the case, Danny Kyllo of Oregon, was charged with marijuana cultivation in 1992 after federal agents used thermal imaging to scan the amount of heat emanating from his home.
_For more information, please contact Donna Shea, Esq., NORML Foundation Litigation Director, at (202) 483-8751."_
[/FONT]


----------



## greenfriend (Feb 19, 2009)

From what ive read is that best way to avoid detection by FLIR is:
 1. a growroom should be constructed freestanding inside your house.  This will prevent the roof and walls from looking "hot" on the FLIR.  
2.  the growroom should be covered completely with either regular house insulation, space blankets (kinda expensive), or dense foam material (styrofoam)
3. as for venting hot air, if possible vent into a sewer line, or pipe that runs a long way underground.  or in winter dont vent, use it to heat your house. or cool it before it exits to the outside.

obviously the ultimate way to avoid detection is to buy a FLIR ($5000) yourself and image your house and insulate until there is no heat signature


----------



## Lemmongrass (Feb 19, 2009)

if its illegal for a peeping tom to put a crappy IR filter on his handycam and film me thru the thin window curtain, then how is this not illegal? We already decided that utilizing the benifites of a spectrum of energy to overcome limitations of other spectrum's is illegal(lol), so why is it even up for debate?


----------



## TentFarmer (Feb 19, 2009)

greenfriend said:
			
		

> From what ive read is that best way to avoid detection by FLIR is:
> 1. a growroom should be constructed freestanding inside your house.  This will prevent the roof and walls from looking "hot" on the FLIR.
> 2.  the growroom should be covered completely with either regular house insulation, space blankets (kinda expensive), or dense foam material (styrofoam)
> 3. as for venting hot air, if possible vent into a sewer line, or pipe that runs a long way underground.  or in winter dont vent, use it to heat your house. or cool it before it exits to the outside.
> ...



Thermal Image cameras can be rented for a few hundred dollars.  I've used them for work and wished I would have found a way to take it home for an hour or two.  However climbing my trees with a camera at night might look a bit odd.  However looking odd has never been a big concern of mine in the past.


----------



## TentFarmer (Feb 19, 2009)

lotek said:
			
		

> if its illegal for a peeping tom to put a crappy IR filter on his handycam and film me thru the thin window curtain, then how is this not illegal? We already decided that utilizing the benifites of a spectrum of energy to overcome limitations of other spectrum's is illegal(lol), so why is it even up for debate?



 I don't believe it is the legality that is up for debate.  However I know that I tend to speed on the highway and slow down when I think I might get caught.  I am willing to bet that this mentality is possessed by some of our fine men and women in blue.  If they use illegal tactics to discover your grow, and then look for legal methods to "discover" it in the eyes of the courts, then you and I are still screwed either way.  

I personally don't question that a cop would use an illegal methods to discover my grow.  However I strongly suggest that anyone who is truly concerned to find out for themselves what is visible.  

hxxp://www.infraredcamerarentals.com/


----------



## WeedHopper (Feb 19, 2009)

If you think for one minute the Police wont screw you as legal as they can,,,behind closed doors,,,no matter how illegal it is.Your living in different world the the one Im in. JUst watch the news. Dont ya see PPL getting thier asses kicked on Phone Cams by :cop:?


----------



## 311Grower (Feb 19, 2009)

I know what you mean Cowboy, we've become subjects when we're citizens and live in a police state... Cops will do what they want and rarely get punished, the problem is that cops can lie in order to get search warrants and cops lie just as much as the criminals they're trying to bust. You'd think they'd worry about the heroine traffickers, child molesters, robbers and meth heads but nothing puts a smile on a cops face like making a big marijuana grow bust no matter how small, that's why to a cop every plant = a pound, it boosts their ego. Yea dude, good job Barney Fife, you just saved like 50 bags of Doritos by busting those kids with a QP of weed. You got some seriously hardened criminals off the street, they're known for getting high and playing video games, real troublemakers....

I'm not saying Flir doesn't get used without search warrants, but if they do and you busted, most good lawyers can probably find some holes in their search warrant or the reasonable suspicion that lead to the search warrant.


----------

