# OMG!!what did i do!!!!!!!



## annscrib (Aug 31, 2008)

hiya guys and gals 

got home from work and this is what i found,,,,, my oldest lowryder all its leaves are orange and they arer very brittle  last night i notice some spots checked the ph and it was high so i use a teaspoon of vingar and almost a gallon of water,,,,,PLEASE TELL ME WHAT I CAN DO HERE


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## KGB30 (Aug 31, 2008)

Did ya get water on the leafs while watered them when the lights where on Ann... That truely sucks Ann.


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## Mr.Wakenbake (Aug 31, 2008)

That is classic over fertilization man. 
Sorry you killed em with kindness.



That must be some kind of soil that has time release nutrients or you have already begun feeding the plants which it is way to early for. Flush em out with 3 times the amount of water as soil,  and keep your fingers crossed.

you have almost killed them with too much love. Whether it was you or in the soil as time release, or in your hands ... they are dying from too much love.


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## BuddyLuv (Aug 31, 2008)

prey for them.


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## PUFF MONKEY (Aug 31, 2008)

always flush timed release soils BEFORE planting anything..


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## annscrib (Aug 31, 2008)

thanks guys i have alot of perlite going to try to put in that to see what i can do wish me luck


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## BuddyLuv (Aug 31, 2008)

I did have a clone look that bad. It lived so there is hope.


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## Alistair (Aug 31, 2008)

Hey Ann,

I'm sorry to see what happened.  But as BuddyLuv said, I think there's hope for your plants.  That is to say, if you have corrected whatever has caused the problem, then perhaps they will spring back.  I nearly killed one of my plants once because I watered with too much vinegar. I'm not criticizing you for using vinegar, I'm just saying that I once used too much.  I flushed the soil and watched it recover over a period of several weeks.  The plant got healthy again.

Cheer up Ann, it's an unpleasant learning experience, but in the worse case scenario you can always start all over again.  However, I advise to try and fix the problem, because fixing problems is good experience.


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## massproducer (Aug 31, 2008)

It is looking to me as if there may be a fungal problem happening.  How often are you watering, how does the soil smell?  Does it smell kind of sour?


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## That crazy vancouver guy (Aug 31, 2008)

sorry, Ann... but that thing's toast... don't waste yer time and stress over it any more... it's beyond help now... if you want... put it aside and give it straight water and if it lives, so be it... but I'd say it's toast.


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## Mr.Wakenbake (Aug 31, 2008)

Any type of stress can negatively affect your yeild in the end. Especially over Nutrification which has happened here. 

The leaves tell all ann...it's nutrient burn.

FLush em!
Edit:  i got ur plant probs mixed in with someone elses.Sorry for the wrong description of the plant. I was drunk and watching the wind blow from the hurricane last night. Forgive me.


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## massproducer (Aug 31, 2008)

Mr.Wakenbake said:
			
		

> Any type of stress can negatively affect your yeild in the end. Especially over Nitrification which has happened here.
> 
> The leaves tell all ann... and im telling you it isnt fungal, it's Nutrient burn.
> 
> Brown necrotic patches, affecting the whole plant, clawed leaf ends, leaves cupping downward from the center vein all signs of nutrient burn. flush em.


 

the leaves tell it all?  Where do you see a rams horn claw?  Where do you see yellow burn marks creeping in?  

Nute burns always start from the tip and work there way in, leaving actual tell tale burn marks.  I can tell you that this is not over nitrification, this is root damage that too me looks to be caused by your ph or a fungi.  If you have a high tds then your ph would read as low because of the acidity of the ph of the minerals

Nute burns do not affect the entire plant this way, they affect whatever is activly growing, firstly the new growth, the fact is that you could burn your plants serverly, and only see the effects on 1 set of leaves, if you flushed your plants properly.  

Leaves cupping is a sign of a deficiency not nute burn... Magnesium to be exact, which is also displayed on the bottom set of leaves by the edges yellowing then browning, but infact the browning on the bottom edges was more then likely caused by whatever problem that caused the entire top leaf to discolor and die.

Brown necrotic patches are once again not caused by overfeeding, they are caused by fungi, ph or rarely a phosphorus deficiency which often gets mistaken for a fungal problem.

I have included a picture of a classic nute burn.  One just starting and another very bad which did not happen over night, more like over the life of that leaf.

Also please notice how in the picture with the badly burned leaf, the other leaves from the same plant are totally fine, even the growth tips.

You may want to look into Fusarium, Phytophthora and Pythium, which all cause root rot and occur naturally in soil.


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## MercyEternity (Aug 31, 2008)

Maybe everybody will be able to come up with a better answer if you tell them what is in the soil or what kind you use plus what you were feeding them, how often and how much, the size of the container, and your light system.


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## Mr.Wakenbake (Sep 1, 2008)

Mass... i got ann's plant and the other fella's that 's having over loving problems mixed up, however i still believe what i said. I hope though that you figure it out. I wasn't trying to make anyone pissed off dood. 

I could care less who is right here. I just want to see her plants live.I mean were not measuring penis size here dood.The main reason i said what i did is because new growth is affected also just the same as the old growth. The leaves are dying from the tips in from the top of the plants to the bottom. Necrosis can be cause by over fertilization too due to the high N locking out other nutrients. 

Thus the plant begins to look like it's defficient or has a  disease, which is all actually caused by too much of one of the macronutrients.Brittle leaves.... another classic sign.

I will provide a picture to go along from a nutrient disorder guide. 
I brb


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## gettinggray1964 (Sep 1, 2008)

1tsp of vineger is way to much...... you only need like a drop or two in a gal. of water... flush,flush it is probally to late...


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## massproducer (Sep 1, 2008)

Bro, you are saying it is too much N, locking out micro nutes, then you are saying it is too much micro nutes.  

Overfeeding N is very obvious, it causes dark grren leaves that curl under like a rams horn, and then burn from the tips creeping in, it does not affect the whole leaf this way, especially not overnight.

THis is far from classic anything, as for you talking about a pissing match, you came and directly challenged what I said, the difference is that I gave Ann my experienced opinion.  In fact Ann on your last grow, I helped you with overfeeding, which actually was a classic over nitrification, showing the classic rams horn, with very dark leaves.

You say that all you are interested in helping, but it does not help to give out information that is not correct.  Please show me the information from the disorder guide that supports any of the symptoms you stated.


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## massproducer (Sep 1, 2008)

Remember that anytime you add something organic to your medium, like vinager, it has to be broken down by the microbes and fungi in the soil.  This is a fact, wheather you know or not, they are there, some are beneficial, some are pathogens and some are neutral.

If you do not want these to get out of control because you are not growing organically, then limit your organic amendments, never overwater, and keep things sterile.


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## andy52 (Sep 1, 2008)

boy i sure know what nute burn looks like now.i burnt my last lady,but not quiet that bad.but i sure learned to back off feeding too much.not saying it won't happen again.one never knows what 1 strain will do,especially being newbie.thanks all,very educational.sorry for your plants


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## Mr.Wakenbake (Sep 1, 2008)

i wasnt' meaning to challenge you dood. Here is what i said man...

Necrosis can be cause by over fertilization too due to the high N locking out other nutrients.

Thus the plant begins to look like it's defficient or has a disease, which is all actually caused by too much of one of the macronutrients.Brittle leaves.... another classic sign.

Brittle leaves on new growth is normally caused by too much love. 

Lockout caused by too much Macronutrients in the soil such as N-P or K. I didn't say it was micronutrients man..... go back and read it.


Ann, honestly we need to know what type of soil your growing in to find out what's what. Brand, Nutrient content, Ph, drainage , which your soil looks fine, but we need some more info. Really we are all pissing in the wind anyways without it.I didn't think about it earlier but what is the temperature in the room?It could very well be heat.


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## Mr.Wakenbake (Sep 1, 2008)

I actually  mixed your plant up with eaglepilots... sorry.Ph problems can cause the same symptoms also. Just to throw that out there. 

I found it easy to know what's wrong if i kept a journal. 
In it keep a recording every time you feed and water, also make sure to check the ph and record it too. 

Keep this up religiously and when you run into problems like this you can pretty much diagnose them yourself, or atleast have enough info for us to do so without us going in blind like we are. A pic says a lot, but you telling us things like 

Exact PH -
How many times you've fed-
Available nutrients in the soil and if the soil is time release or not-
How often are you watering-
Room Temperature-
ph of water that  you are giving the babies to drink( chlorine has been known to cause lockout as has Hardwater).


With that info and the pics someone here should be able to give you a proper answer without us having to argue over what it is. Even if it is all in fun .....MASS.  

I am sure your experience far outweighs mine man, but i think we should all back up and cool off and get some more info before giving the advice. (MYSELF included)It may very well be fungal, but until we get the information we need, we won't know.Neither will ann


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## massproducer (Sep 1, 2008)

my bad i misread that part...Sorry about that, but what I am saying is that each nute toxicity has very clear and distinct traits.  It is hard to overfeed most marconutrients except for Nitrogen, that is why that WILL be the first thing to show up.  N hardly ever locks things out, especially that quick.

Nitrogen Toxicity: 
Leaves are often dark green and in the early stages abundant with foliage. If excess is severe, leaves will dry and begin to fall off. Root system will remain under developed or deteriorate after time. Fruit and flower set will be inhibited or deformed. 
With breakdown of vascular tissue restricting water uptake. Stress resistance is drastically diminished.


Phosphorus (P) Toxicity: 
This condition is rare and usually buffered by pH limitations. Excess phosphorus can interfere with the availability and stability of copper and zinc. 


Potassium (K) Toxicity: 
Usually not absorbed excessively by plants. Excess potassium can aggravate the uptake of magnesium, manganese, zinc and iron and effect the availability of calcium.


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## Mr.Wakenbake (Sep 1, 2008)

Go back and read the last two posts on page two bro I agree with what you said above also.


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## BuddyLuv (Sep 1, 2008)

I just talked to the Miami CSI squad. They said after a thorough investigation it was indeed the vinegar. I know a lot of you guys/gals want to be truelly organic but there are ways to lower ph other then vinegar. Trying using distilled water, which in my local grocery has a pH of about 5.7-5.9. I would rather flush my plant with distilled and then start over using fresh nutrient rich water again rather then use vinegar which can be different per the manufacturer.


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## gettinggray1964 (Sep 1, 2008)

thats what it is when you added 1tsp of vinager to 1 gallon of water that made you water to acidity... thus that is your problem... if the plant was fine before you watered it with 1tsp of vinager per gallon of water... plane and simple.......


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## gettinggray1964 (Sep 1, 2008)

i use it all the time to lower ph and have never had a problem, but it just takes a drop are two to lower the ph, not 1 tsp. that was probally enough for 50 gallons..... i am talking about distilled white vinegar!!!!!!! you can also use lemon juice......


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## massproducer (Sep 3, 2008)

I would honestly say that using Any organic matter to fix a Ph problem is probably not the best and definiately not the most efficient.  As I stated all organic matter will be decomposed starting as soon as it hits your medium.  It is the cycle of life.  While Vinegar is not the worst substance as in decomposition, mother of vinegar can form even in store bought vinager bottles while even unopened.  Vinager is made by bacteria and fungi.

I would recommend buying some PH up and Down from a hydro or garden shop, for the simple fact that these will not be broken down by microbes as the vinager will because this cantains all inorganic chemicals, or the end product of decomposition.

Plus ph up and down are really very cheap and they last a long time


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## 4u2sm0ke (Sep 3, 2008)

gettinggray1964 said:
			
		

> thats what it is when you added 1tsp of vinager to 1 gallon of water that made you water to acidity... thus that is your problem... if the plant was fine before you watered it with 1tsp of vinager per gallon of water... plane and simple.......


 

It wasnt fine when he/she added the vinager..his/her ph was 8..IMO..you should read the whole thread...then read up on the person GJ a bit...get to know the whole story  not just the last few posts..and by the way...white Vinager only comes Distilled..


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## gettinggray1964 (Sep 3, 2008)

so


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## gettinggray1964 (Sep 3, 2008)

well i was just trying to let annscrib know that that was way to much vinager. but i bet it aint to high now....and yes annscrib said she had a few orange spots before, thats right, but atleast the plant was still alive!!!!! so 4u2smOke whats the whole story???? and yes white vinager only comes disstilled.. just stateing what is on the bottle. there are many ways of growing MJ. hell ithought you were going to tell me something i didnt know.... so you just posting to help me?? i aint the one with the problem. fix annscrib plants aint nothing wrong with mine thank you very much!!!!!!! OMG !!! WHAT DID I DO!!!!! annscrib put to much vinager in water, thats what i answerd to.... thats what killed the plant not the orange spots or the 8.0 ph.......


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