# C99



## Mutt (Jan 24, 2010)

just puttin up some pics for a couple of peeps 

C99xK2 is a project of mine. Also going to make K2xC99 get both sides. K2 and Cindy are very stable so should be easy to work through. I got a loooong road ahead. The F1 cross is sure showing its hybrid vigor  One has some sign of the c99 traits in veg, but mainly showing its K2 side.


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## 420benny (Jan 24, 2010)

Which one is that tall boy?


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## Mutt (Jan 24, 2010)

Its Bros Grimm F3 Cindy99 awaiting to drop some pollen for collection %


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## The Hemp Goddess (Jan 24, 2010)

I will be following along--C99 and K2 are two great strains.  I can't wait to see what you get with those 2 :hubba:


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## Mutt (Jan 24, 2010)

here's a shot of the female I picked out to make more seeds with. Thanks all for the compliments 
Hey Umbra...any more i like to see 50/50 female male ratio. tells me plant is behaving like it should. but thats just me.
Males are just as important as females in this game IMO. Why i don't like femd seeds. To me its blocking of any future progeny which to me thats very important.

on a side note: I have almost quit completely using any wet ferts...i finally got my soil chimed in to be dry ferts with an occasional booster at the end. I just do xplants into a newer hotter mix each time until flower...then at the end i just get the microbes dancing with some FF big bloom. What has worked a huge amount is greensand as it takes a little time to break down and breaks down right when its needed  K has always been the harder of the macros for me to get.  My dirt is hot as a firecracker tho  Bone blood horse crap and some other goodies.


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## legalize_freedom (Jan 24, 2010)

You perked my interest...lol...anything cindy has got me!  I'd like to get my hands on some grimms stock...but can't find any.  Is that something you've been holding for awhile Mutt?

I'll be following this thread for sure!


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## Tater (Jan 24, 2010)

Locked and loaded buddy, I can't wait to see how this turns out.  And good news I got the interweb in camp!!!! that means I can stay in touch, muahahaha.  Good luck bro, like you'll need it, shoot me your soil recipe if you get a second.


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## Mutt (Jan 25, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> I agree about males being important. However, whenever such a small sample size is used then the probability of 50/50 is off a bit. A larger sample would even it out more, I believe.


So true..like i joke about with some med grower friends...you got the left side of the plant 
Joey weeds seemed to do very well off the pheno he got from his cindy ...like a euro peep said...anything cindy touches turns to gold  I'm glad he kept it alive for others to get...he knew what he had 
I wouldn't trust gypsy bro on that one...i'd let that one roll on for a bit and see what happens  Gypsy been known to do some funky stuff.

LL i been runnin Cindy crosses for 5 yrs (crossed with both indy and sats). i'm die hard about this strain...she works for me almost perfectly. I know she just needs that certain sumit.....but we all know what kinda hell thats gonna be to find 
K2 hit my spot...NL5 x WW that one has sumit goin on as well  The cindy seeds i got luckily came from very reliable sources that took special care in selecting parents all from bros grimm orig, F1 stock.. So I've been blessed in that dept.  There are some very killer cindy phenos rolling around  -REv has some cindy hybrids that are jam slap up 
K2 beans i got have been Bx'd and inbred to F4 so extremely stable stock  I've abused this plant left and right and would recommend it over the IBL of NL5 for newbs....its the best of both white and indy sides rolled into a 9 week strain ... works great for pain insomnia and appetite ;-) K2 version i got was inbred for more advanced cancer peeps


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## Mutt (Jan 25, 2010)

Tater said:
			
		

> shoot me your soil recipe if you get a second.


Epsoma Bio-tone
Blood meal
Bone meal
Horse manure compost
regular pit dug OD compost...got everything in it from eggshells to worm castings as well as hardwood ash from the stove and leaves and mushies picked from the horse pasture
lime
greensand
0-0-60
epsom salt
composted cow plop
Coco Coir
Perlite
Vermiculite
and in my main compost heap the newspaper from the bottom of the bird cage. 
I keep DE handy and sprinkle the top at the sign of gnats.

the rest of the time its just add water


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## Mutt (Jan 25, 2010)

another note...dude i know is watching this grow always said late flowering males are the ticket. I will never arugue that...but when looking at it at a certain perspective...late flowering might not be what the person is after. Would it not be shooting for the sativa side of a male when it comes to hybrids? So I chose a different path to find the male that mimics the female i want. i hope others chime in and give us there concepts on male selection  It seems to be the most lacking info on the net. fems are more than covered 
Its such a debatable breeding concept but so very very important 

just some notes from my note book...
The male and female showed preflowers within 48 hrs of each other. Both had same stretch period, both were same leaf structured, both switched from stretch to flow within 24 hrs of each other. both were vigorous and had the best overall health.


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## PencilHead (Jan 25, 2010)

Hey, Mutt, is there any particular sign that says the male is ready to gather pollen from?  I'm doing my first collection and like my first grow, I don't know squat about what I'm doing here.  I've got this WW male that's just beginning to put out flowers, but they're all different sizes and different maturities.  When can I take pollen and know it's viable?  I can freeze the pollen to store it, right?

I got some C99 X Apollo 11 from Joey--I'll try and post those when I grow them out.

Thanks.


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## PencilHead (Jan 25, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> *Pollen can be frozen, BUT...no moisture.*


 
Silica gel?


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## legalize_freedom (Jan 25, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> Gypsy has Grimm F2 @ seedbay


 

Thank You!  You know I think you mentioned this to me before...and I spaced it out or something.  Thanks for reviving that braincell!  I think you mentioned that they were not cheap, and that made me not even look right now, because I'm laid-off and can't justify spending any $ on seeds right now.  Thanks for the info though!  It's not selfed seeds is it?  Nevermind I can look for myself...thanks man!


Mutt yeah I know about gypsies reputation...I'm not in the right financial situation to be buying any beans right now anyway.

As far as males go in a perfect world I would keep pollen from every male in the set, but don't always have the room to do that.  So for me selection was based on structure and smell of the plant.  I know that this could possably not be the best way to do things as I believe that recessive genes play alot into the equation.  With my C99 hybrids all the males (4) showed at the same time about 5 days before the fems.  This was with preflowers at about 4 weeks into veg.  I pollinated 2 different fems from this set, and saved the pollen in an airtight tin.  My intentions are to use this pollen again on the offspring from the seeds that are produced.  Unless I decide to make a bigger male chamber, then I will keep all the males from the set from these seeds.  I'm not saying I'm doing this right either...if I'm off base one of you guys that is more knowledgable then me please correct me!  I'm in no way a breeder.  I am excited to see what the f2 of these hybrids will give me.  With the ones I'm growing right now, you would think they all came from clones...they are very close to the same.  Leaning more towards the C99 I think...the smell is fruity, nothing like I have smelled when growing straight AK47.

Am I right in breeding this male pollen back to the offspring, or should I collect and breed from the brothers of the same set?  Not trying to jack the thread either, if someone would rather PM me an answer to my question that is fine...but we are talking about C99...so it may be fitting to post it here if Mutt doesn't mind.

This is going to be an interesting thread!


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## legalize_freedom (Jan 25, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> I prefer to use males that pollen out from the center of the plant, rather than the the top.


 

I've never heard this.  Can you go into some detail as to why?


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## Mutt (Jan 25, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> Pollen can be frozen, BUT...no moisture.
> Yes Mutt later blooming males. I mentioned before that when all you chase are early flowering males, eventually you emulate ruderalis traits. So that is not a trait I look for in males. I prefer to use males that pollen out from the center of the plant, rather than the the top.


I totally agree with the early flowering males on that one.
I typically in the past have gone for the later ones, but this one seemed to chime right in. Just told me yep i'm the one you want. This one wasn't fast to show either. just fit the selected female. 



> if Mutt doesn't mind.


not at all 



> Hey, Mutt, is there any particular sign that says the male is ready to gather pollen from?


When they open up its dropping and viable. I leave mine in under the HID until i get nervous  Then out by a window on top of plexi with NO draft. Ussually within a couple of days from when i pull it.. it drops.


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## PencilHead (Jan 25, 2010)

Mutt said:
			
		

> I totally agree with the early flowering males on that one.
> I typically in the past have gone for the later ones, but this one seemed to chime right in. Just told me yep i'm the one you want. This one wasn't fast to show either. just fit the selected female.
> 
> 
> ...


 
I'm not good enough to leave it indoors--it's on the patio, but I'm waaay down south, past the land of cotton.  I was gonna use foil backed insulation board under it to gather the pollen. 

Thanks, sir.


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## Mutt (Jan 25, 2010)

I'd be worried about the wind pencil head....it might blow all the pollen away.


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## legalize_freedom (Jan 26, 2010)

My oppinion is the male needs very little of anything to shed.  I put mine in a box in a different room with a cfl.  Made some tin foil basins that wrapped around the stem to catch falling pollen.  I collected quit a bit like this, and then cut the tops, and put them in a baggy leaving the stems sticking out to realease anymore that they wanted to.  I didn't get a bunch of pollen, but it doesn't take much...good luck to you PH!

I've been wanting to make just a breeding chamber where I can put say 3 palnts in it a male and 2 or 3 fems...but then I'd need more room, and would be dealing with fully seeded plants.  I really don't need that many a couple branches on a couple plants does me fine.


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## PencilHead (Jan 26, 2010)

I hear you , Mutt, but I'm more afraid of central haet and air taking it into my grow room.

I think I'll take Legal's advice--I gotta shed out back and plenty of flouros for shop lights.  I guess I could let him hang out there for a bit.

Here again, this isn't a save-the-world endeavor--I'm just trying to take things up a notch this year, produce some of my own seeds just to see if I can do it.  These are my last WW seeds (and an easy as hell strain for this newbie to grow out several times) and I'd like to have some in the future-box.

If I keep screwing around until I pollenate my current grow, I'll have lots of seed, won't I?


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## PencilHead (Jan 26, 2010)

:yeahthat: :hairpull: 

That's what I'm talking about.  I'd love to put it in the yard, but stealth is out the gate once I do that.  I've got great neighbors who seem to like me, but I wouldn't wanna push them that hard to keep MY secrets.


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## legalize_freedom (Jan 26, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> I just recently did build a box for pollination. I kept 1 male of that hazeolope to breed with ogr's whitegum and fire og. The pollen got on my clothes and in my hair, and completely pollinated my whole tent.


 
Oh man that sucks!!!

My plan was to keep the breeding box in the upstairs of my house, (veg and flower cabs are in the basement) with exhaust running outdoors, through a series of filters.  This last time I did a breeding with the male in it's own box, I kept it upstairs, and changed clothes and showerd after any time that I had to mess with him.  When I was ready to pollinate a couple branches I brought the 2 fems upstairs, brushed some pollen on a branch of each fem.  I waited an hour, spritzed them down, and took them back to the cab.  It seems to have worked but I still have 2 1/2 weeks until the 8 week point.  I can see what seems to be seeds formed in those buds, but won't know for sure untill I see the calyx split open a bit.  It doesn't look to me that any of my others got pollinated, but we'll see.

When I grow these seeds should I use the pollen from the father of them again? (f1) or collect pollen from the brothers of the seed set? (f2)  I have the f1 pollen avaliable still if it will stay viable until The f2 plants are ready.  Is it even worth my time to do this with a hybrid, trying to stabalize it so that I have a constant seed supply?  I like to shut down occasionaly.  So sometimes donor plants must go.  This is all just experimenting for now, if the quality and yeild is not up to par with the f1, then everything will go to the compost anyway...but if it turns out to be decent I would like to keep it in seed form, but try to get it close to stable.


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## Mutt (Jan 26, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> I just recently did build a box for pollination. I kept 1 male of that hazeolope to breed with ogr's whitegum and fire og. The pollen got on my clothes and in my hair, and completely pollinated my whole tent.


dahum....
i slap on my grow work clothes...after i spray down with lysol...other things goin on in my area so cleanliness is critical


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## Tater (Feb 3, 2010)

Any news mutt?  How are the kids doin, lets see some more family photo's


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## Mutt (Feb 7, 2010)

Tater said:
			
		

> Any news mutt?  How are the kids doin, lets see some more family photo's


I'l post some up tonite. Been hectic. here's a shot of one of my friends grow. Not bad for a 1/2 gallon pot and 70w hps and 100w of flos.
K2 clone trained one i gave him same cut from the one i'm pollenating. and unknown bagseed is the single cola.
I gave him my soil mix too  Sorry they were cam phone pics.  first two are a couple of weeks prior to the last three.


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## the chef (Feb 7, 2010)

Very nice Muttster! Interested in the K-2. How's she smoke/taste? Thanks.


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## Mutt (Feb 7, 2010)

the chef said:
			
		

> Very nice Muttster! Interested in the K-2. How's she smoke/taste? Thanks.





> A classic strain, K2 is a long-standing, reliable commercial Dutch strain known for its easy cultivation, as opposed to the other White strains that it is classified with. White Widow, for instance, is similar to K2 in its production of small forming plants equipped with tight, compact buds. Yet, K2 is much more simple to grow than its other white siblings.
> K2 is an indica and sativa cross which carries with it a pleasant, spiced, fruit-like taste and a tangy aroma. K2 gives a very zoneable high that affects the smoker quick. K2 is a very strong plant.
> When choosing to grow K2 plants indoors, it takes to using the Sea of Green method best as well as does growing K2 hydroponically.
> K2 can also produce extremely high yields in limited spaced environments. K2 is a short, stocky plant, which produces white flowers within eight to nine weeks of harvesting. An easy grow for experienced growers.


shes a good one.


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## Mutt (Feb 9, 2010)

C99 and K2 in flow...all had successful pollenation. could tell hairs browned where i pollenated...rest is pink n white 
1st two Cindy 2nd 2 K2's
PS both these needed to be outcrossed soon...both strains been inbred by a lot of folks  Why is it you can only find ouctrosses of Cindy :stoned:


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## legalize_freedom (Feb 10, 2010)

I know what you mean man, on finding only crossed!  But I tell you what, I'm loving the cross I got!  My oppinion is you could breed her to a feral hemp and get some good smoke....lol....definately will improve alot of lines!  I'm thinking on just buying several packs of Joey's and trying to find a keeper.  My problem is that I was not lucky enough to see the BG Cindy to be able to compare.  I think I can pick a good pheno though if 1 shows up...the seeds are cheap enough from JW that you could do a good run and not have to spend alot.

Things are looking good man...I can't wait to see what you get out of those seeds!  This is going to be a long process....but I have time to watch!


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## Mutt (Feb 10, 2010)

umbra said:
			
		

> I have some of the classic crosses, as well as some of the new ones. Still just plain cindy is mighty fine as far as I am concerned.



 I've had some oddball crosses with C99. All of em great.


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## Tater (Mar 16, 2010)

Mutt you crazy dog you, how about an update on the ladies?  You know, for all of us stuck out in the mountains away from home   I can't wait to get thing rocking at home.


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## Mutt (Mar 16, 2010)

yeah i been a busy mofo my bad, cindy is chopped got some beans..here's a couple of shots for yas tho 
C99xK2 from last years batch just to see whats up. think outa those 300+ beans i might have sumit to work with 
Next couple of K2 clones i screwin around with... all from the reveg thats the last pic.
and a pic of a c99 future mom that is in dire need of training been negligent around the grow as of late 
and one more pic of Cherry Malawi x DP99
and a K2 reveg tester 
no pics but got more K2 as well as NL5xHaze in flow 
i know i'm confusing..but its all in my gonzo nature


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## the chef (Mar 16, 2010)

Looking good Muttster! Is that c-99 and k-2 your mix?


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## Mutt (Mar 16, 2010)

yep and did a vice versa 
with a diff. F3 pheno of cindy 
got a pool to play with now :48:
almost where i need to be as far as locale then i can do what i been wanting to do for yrs  just work grow weed work my garden harvest my chicken egs and harvest my deer and all the other stuff too long to list is within my grasp of a year.in the home stretch and its a mf to get to. sorry for my rant...just been a long journy for me. 
grow on :48:


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## the chef (Mar 16, 2010)

Schaaaaweeeet!


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## Mutt (Mar 16, 2010)

all of em are freindly  but you know me i have a habit of growin things small. 

been using the hell outa espoma products...been workin good for me here on the east coast without having to order crap online and no decent grow shops around.
Blood and bone meal whatever brand they got, bi-tone plus, holly tone all from the nursery, composted horse crap and mushrooms (whatever grows out in the horse pasture and no they aint the good ones so don't ask) along with all the veggie matter from the kitchen well rinsed first. with some red worms tossed into to procreate and do there own thing is my compost heap, organic topsoil from the hardware store is mixed in with the ready to use compost, cocoa coir from the reptile store, perlite, greensand, and lime let sit for a while trust me i got 3 stage holes.its dialed in and skid steer helps. just need to get another worm bin goin and should be on track again.  gnats get on my tail once in a while but nothing DTE can't cure...haven't had ...knock on wood .....mites as of yet.
K has always been my shortfall on every dry mix. one day i'll get it locked in


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## 420benny (Mar 16, 2010)

Howdy Mutt! Very interesting project. I am a breeding noobie, so please bare with me. Let's say you get a desirable female from one cross and you pick a male from the other opposite cross, what do you call the next generation, both in strain and f numbers? Just curious, I don't even understand the whole stable, unstable f1, f2 thing. benny's simple brain says that dankxdank=dank. Here's some GREEN MOJO for the cause


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## Mutt (Mar 17, 2010)

> what do you call the next generation, both in strain and f numbers?


in my notes it states
(Bros Grimm C99 F3 (euro pheno) female x K2 F3 Bx male) is my C99xK2 F1
(K2 F3 Bx female (same batch as above) x Bros Grimm C99 F3 (us pheno) male) is my K2 x C99 F1
This is my first batch of unstable F1 hybrids.
The reason for doing so is both strains i got were on the brink of inbred depression and would and could possibly end the lines i had...all other were outcrossed as well that i recieved. might not have been the next gen or maybe the one after that but it will happen. 
i just loved both strains made my genetic pool of both very broad in hope to find a good one for me to work with for a few yrs. I still retain some moms and dads as well as original seed stock to introduce to the pool or bx if need be  whats fun about weed growin and not selling is it is all about me 


> I don't even understand the whole stable, unstable f1, f2 thing


that is such a debatable thing. some say Bx %2


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## loolagigi (Mar 17, 2010)

super sweet. thanks for the thread.....sounds yummy for sure.


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## burnin123 (Mar 17, 2010)

very nice Mutt..will be fallowing along the rest of the way..thanks for shareing with us..


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## legalize_freedom (Mar 17, 2010)

Thanks for the update Mutt....sounds like the life of a retired man to me!  I have a long way to to go (I'll be 40 this year) But it definately sounds like the dream life...living off the land, and what she provides for ya!


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## kal el (Mar 17, 2010)

Cool project. I do a lot of work with c99. All my stock comes from BG stock.
I have 3 killer males that I use for breeding currently. A Kryptonian Haze, a NL#5 and a C99. They all have trichs covering their flower sacs. I find that those are the most potent.


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## Tater (Mar 18, 2010)

Thanks for the post mutt.  Glad to see things are moving along quick for ya.  I just got home for breakup so I got some time to play around now.


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## panic in paradise (Mar 19, 2010)

thought id add, i have a (durban x thai) x c99

she's in the flood table, very young, but very stable seeming, i took a cut already for the airocloner. ii had heard chatter that the owner of some old stock being released _Cannacare heirlooms, may of heard of them recently_  but forgive my ignorance, but i believe this and several others where grown from seed, sexed, and cloned out, 1st cut...

to my knowledge the durban should flower relatively quick, and hurry the female thai along _yummy_. the nodes are spaced very well, some of the others took a couple weeks to catch up in growth spread.

the leafs are very large, it looks like a straight indica plant, but my maui big bug has small skinny leafs at the bottom, graduating to big floppy fans up top! a nice split, im expecting the DT x c99 to get fairly tall, or would if allowed.

i can put up a pic or two if any one is interested. she still small, but defined.


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## kal el (Mar 19, 2010)

6 backcrosses will give you a 99% pure plant.


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