# should i change my soil??



## tmone (Jun 27, 2007)

i am growing outdoors. i transplanted my seedlings that were in dixie cups into 2 gallon buckets using potting soil, should i use a better quality soil??
   the plants are about 6 in tall.


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## bombbudpuffa (Jun 27, 2007)

What brand soil are you using?


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## 420check420 (Jul 1, 2007)

the brand doesnt matter so much, as the consistency... some potting soil is dense and heavy, easily compacts.. what you really want is something light and airy... roots have trouble thriving in compacted soil, cuz its harder for them to tunnel.. when you shop for soil, pick up the bags comparitavley and feel the different weights.. get the lightest stuff.. the roots will zoom through it  theres plenty of soil amendments you can add to the mix too.. such as perlite (improves drainage) vermiculite, and peat moss, which will hold 20 times thier weight in water, allowing the h20 to be used by the plant as needed, cutting down on the risk of root rot dramatically..


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## bombbudpuffa (Jul 1, 2007)

> what you really want is something light and airy


 This alone won't do it. Peat moss is light and airy but the ph is very acidic. The reason I asked what brand is because there are alot of diff soil out there that is light as a feather but doesn't have ph buffers(what you really need). Find you a light, PH BALANCED soil and you'll cancel most of the problems you could have in a grow.


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## maineharvest (Jul 2, 2007)

ask some of the experienced guys on this site what they use for soil and get whatever they are using.   Where I live we all use a soil called Pro-Mix and it works great.  I dont know if this soil is available where you live but i would recomend it.  Fox Farm is always the best but it cost more.


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## 420check420 (Jul 2, 2007)

bombbudpuffa said:
			
		

> This alone won't do it. Peat moss is light and airy but the ph is very acidic. The reason I asked what brand is because there are alot of diff soil out there that is light as a feather but doesn't have ph buffers(what you really need). Find you a light, PH BALANCED soil and you'll cancel most of the problems you could have in a grow.


 
the mass majority of peat moss comes ph adjsusted right out of the bag


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## 420check420 (Jul 2, 2007)

and you can also buffer it yourself  with calcium carbonate.. a little shroomery trick haha


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## TheStickyIcky (Jul 2, 2007)

You definitely want something light and airy. Thats a mistake a lot of people make. The get too heavy of a soil OR they want to compact it down and keep shoving more and more dirt in the pot. Bad idea. The roots can't get any oxygen this way and the soil doesn't take on water well. You want the dirt to be good and broken up and not just one big "rock" of soil.


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## bombbudpuffa (Jul 2, 2007)

420check420 said:
			
		

> the mass majority of peat moss comes ph adjsusted right out of the bag


Hmmm...not in my experiences. Get Sunshine potting mix. Very light mixed, has hydrated lime in it, plants love it and it doesn't cost an arm and a leg.


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## Birdman Burke (Jul 2, 2007)

i use peat moss dude and i havent
had a problem with it. What kinda problems do
occur cuz it never really occured to me
that Pete Moss is bad but its in my parents
garden were tomatoes are growing so mine
is propally fine for weed.


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## 420check420 (Jul 2, 2007)

there is no real problem with peat moss (ph adjusted) its all in yer preference as to what you wanna use


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## bombbudpuffa (Jul 2, 2007)

The problem with peat moss is it's acidic(with no buffer), has a low nutritional value and by itself is very hard to saturate with water. A plant with just peat moss as a medium will have dry spots throughout the pot. It's true peat moss is used in a lot of soil mixes but unless they have a ph buffer and added nutrients like compost or manure they aren't too mj friendly(like MG organic).


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## Birdman Burke (Jul 2, 2007)

bombbudpuffa said:
			
		

> The problem with peat moss is it's acidic(with no buffer), has a low nutritional value and by itself is very hard to saturate with water. A plant with just peat moss as a medium will have dry spots throughout the pot. It's true peat moss is used in a lot of soil mixes but unless they have a ph buffer and added nutrients like compost or manure they aren't too mj friendly(like MG organic).


 
well i got Miracle Grow Soil Mixed with some peat moss
so i would be fine with it not getting dry spots.. dang
dude ur a genius when it comes to stuff like this hopefully
if i listen to what u say and what ppl post i can be
to that would be sweet 

peace


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## RatherBBurnin (Jul 2, 2007)

problem with winning poster of the month.. is everyone tries to one up you for the rest of the following month LOL...


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## bombbudpuffa (Jul 2, 2007)

Everyone should look at my join date. I've learned 85% of what I know here. I just like helping people and if i've made a mistake and I notice someone making the same one i'll speak up. All i've done is read, read, read, grow, grow, grow...everything...that's the key.


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## Birdman Burke (Jul 2, 2007)

haha allright dude so looks like i should
stick with this site then man then i can be
a smart grower like yourself sounds like a
good plan 

peace


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## 420check420 (Jul 3, 2007)

bombbudpuffa said:
			
		

> Everyone should look at my join date. I've learned 85% of what I know here. I just like helping people and if i've made a mistake and I notice someone making the same one i'll speak up. All i've done is read, read, read, grow, grow, grow...everything...that's the key.


 
what mistake? most of it is adjusted before you even get it in your hands.. its not like you shouldnt use the stuff, which it seems like is what you are pertaining to.. its all in preference and experiment.. but you'd be surprised how much of it is is already adjusted and even if its not, adjusting it is as simple of a procedure as any, just mix it with calcium carbonate and yer good to go.. i know the soil blends you speak of are good to use, dont get me wrong, but if you really know whats in any potting mix you use, the majority of it is already peat moss, just not as light and airy as bulk PM right from the bag.. its just such a helpful amendment (in my experiences at least)  im not arguin with ya, but, dont discourage people about using sphag, its really good benificial stuff, which provides alot more than a potting mix alone (in addition to its excellent water storing abilities, it has the same ability to store nutes just as easy, and slow release the h20/nutrient solution exactly as its needed).. but it is best combined with verm. and perlite ... the best bet is to just look on the bag and itll tell ya whether its ph adjusted, and if you cant tell yourself, ask someone who works there about it and theyll be able to get an awnser for ya (unless youre at walmart, theyre jackasses ) but on  other hand, my only exp. is outdoor growing, the use of peat moss inside, i cant speak for.. dont get me wrong, im not trying to challenge your knowledgeablility, and i know how important a good soil blend is.. its the base, the most important step... but peat moss is nothing to be scared of or shy away from, and if you shop around a bit you can definently find it in its ph adjusted state.. i work at lowe's and we have four different kinds that are buffered  plus a MG brand of enriched sphag which isint buffered, and (in my little experiences) found it to be no different than any of the adjusted peat mosses, ive used it in countless mushroom casings, which are 10 times more ph sensitive than pot plants with no problem at all..  like i said, its all in experimenting and trying new things, what works for you may not work for someone else and vice versa..


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## bombbudpuffa (Jul 3, 2007)

420check420 said:
			
		

> what mistake? most of it is adjusted before you even get it in your hands.. its not like you shouldnt use the stuff, which it seems like is what you are pertaining to.. its all in preference and experiment.. but you'd be surprised how much of it is is already adjusted and even if its not, adjusting it is as simple of a procedure as any, just mix it with calcium carbonate and yer good to go.. i know the soil blends you speak of are good to use, dont get me wrong, but if you really know whats in any potting mix you use, the majority of it is already peat moss, just not as light and airy as bulk PM right from the bag.. its just such a helpful amendment (in my experiences at least)  im not arguin with ya, but, dont discourage people about using sphag, its really good benificial stuff, which provides alot more than a potting mix alone (in addition to its excellent water storing abilities, it has the same ability to store nutes just as easy, and slow release the h20/nutrient solution exactly as its needed).. but it is best combined with verm. and perlite ... the best bet is to just look on the bag and itll tell ya whether its ph adjusted, and if you cant tell yourself, ask someone who works there about it and theyll be able to get an awnser for ya (unless youre at walmart, theyre jackasses ) but on  other hand, my only exp. is outdoor growing, the use of peat moss inside, i cant speak for.. dont get me wrong, im not trying to challenge your knowledgeablility, and i know how important a good soil blend is.. its the base, the most important step... but peat moss is nothing to be scared of or shy away from, and if you shop around a bit you can definently find it in its ph adjusted state.. i work at lowe's and we have four different kinds that are buffered  plus a MG brand of enriched sphag which isint buffered, and (in my little experiences) found it to be no different than any of the adjusted peat mosses, ive used it in countless mushroom casings, which are 10 times more ph sensitive than pot plants with no problem at all..  like i said, its all in experimenting and trying new things, what works for you may not work for someone else and vice versa..


Yep...i'm telling people to shy away from it. Theres a lot of newbies reading this. There are premade soil mixes that are far superior to peat moss. Yes, I know many have peat in them but they also have nutritious stuff like compost and manure. Lowes doesn't carry anything i'd start my babies in but to each his own. Heres an excerpt from a Q and A from a gardening mag I have- Q)_Which is a better soil ammendment-compost or peat moss_? A) Compost. It improves soil texture and adds nutrients.* Peat moss, or partly decomposed sphagnum moss, is not the best soil ammendment by itself*. It improves soil texture, but it's nutrient-poor. It's also slightly acid, which your garden may not need. Add peat moss to your compost pile and put the compost on your garden to take advantage of the composts nutrients and the peat moss' water holding capacity. Don't use peat moss as mulch-it takes water from the soil and *forms a crust water can't penetrate*.


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## 420check420 (Jul 3, 2007)

see, people dont need you to TELL them what to use.. like i said, and you said, to each his own.. it might not work for you but it might be great for the next guy.. this is simply your PREFERANCE... and as far as premade soil mixes being better as far as nutes.. well DUHHHH... but your soil mix is the BASE, peat moss is an AMENDMENT.. i know PM has no nutes, but when you FERTILIZE, it HOLDS the nutes and SLOWLY releases them as needed.. and for the record i didnt say PM by itself, i said w/ verm and perlite.. which makes a world of difference.. i mean jesus i have four plants in this mix right now that grew damn near two vertical feet in less than two weeks once they hit this mix.. your basically trying to tell me it doesnt work.. but oh well, some people you just cannot argue with because they are as hardheaded as can be, and its thier way or the highway.. you think theres only one strict way of doing things and thats just not the case.. do you really know whats in most soil mixes to start? it includes compost.. coupling that with fresh peat helps to loosen and airate your soil, while holding on to more water.. does compost hold 20 times its weight in water? nope.. i know it has nutes but damn, any fertilizer you put on will do the same thing as compost, just without the consistency.. compost has much more of a chance of compacting on you, leaving the roots oxygen depribed..  oh well.. now that youve scared everyone away from the peat moss, more for me  and btw, i dont know anything about gardening, im only a horticulturist/mycologist...
oh and another thing, just cuz you have 1500 posts and obviously spend WAY too much time online, doesnt make you the authority on anything, and you shouldnt TELL people to shy away from anything.. when you say things like "look at my join date" it makes you look silly, as if to say "hey ive been here for ten months, i am now the god of cultivation" which youve proven to me you obviously are not by a long shot.. REAL gardeners experiment.. not take other jackasses words for it and abide it like a law


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## bombbudpuffa (Jul 3, 2007)

420check420 said:
			
		

> see, people dont need you to TELL them what to use.. like i said, and you said, to each his own.. it might not work for you but it might be great for the next guy.. this is simply your PREFERANCE... and as far as premade soil mixes being better as far as nutes.. well DUHHHH


People only need others to give them sound advice, thats the most beneficial for their plants. Making your own mixes should be left to more experienced growers. Theres a lot of things that could go wrong with a homemade mix. All i'm saying is that people should go for a good premade mix with a ph buffer if they don't want problems later. This is fact, not preferance. Sorry I insulted you but lets keep it cool here. I feel an uncotrollable outburst of anger about to come out:rant: which isn't cool here. Peace.


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## 420check420 (Jul 3, 2007)

bombbudpuffa said:
			
		

> People only need others to give them sound advice, thats the most beneficial for their plants. Making your own mixes should be left to more experienced growers. Theres a lot of things that could go wrong with a homemade mix. All i'm saying is that people should go for a good premade mix with a ph buffer if they don't want problems later. This is fact, not preferance. Sorry I insulted you but lets keep it cool here. I feel an uncotrollable outburst of anger about to come out:rant: which isn't cool here. Peace.


 
yup, yer right... no need for anger.. but last time i checked, 2:2:1:1 aint exactly quantam physics


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## TheStickyIcky (Jul 3, 2007)

I agree BBP that homeade mixes are best for my experienced growers. But, I have to agree with 420 in the aspect that its all about PREFERENCE. And I can understand where he is coming from, because I HATE when people tell people to shy away from MG soil. Don't blame MG for nute burn, because someone is too trigger happy with adding Nitrogen. It's not something thats worth arguing over though. Everyone do what works best for them.


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## 420check420 (Jul 3, 2007)

exactly... like i say, i know the soil mix is THE most important part of your rootball.. im not saying use straight peat moss or anything.. the peat moss is simply an AMENDMENT.. an add on.. a lil extra for happy roots  ive had these plants in 5 gallon buckets for two weeks almost, and roots are already poking through all the holes... i can even slide it out of the bucket when its a bit dryer and its already an established rootball.. i know for sure that premade soil mixtures are good, in fact way more important than peat.. but when you add the bulk peat and blend it really nice, you can just feel how much more light the soil is.. when i was like 15, i used to use just straight potting mix with no amendments.. the plants did okay, but compaction is just imminent with potting soil/compost.. ive been using this mix for the past two years and its been like a break through (for me at least.. like mentioned before its all in the persons preferences) ive been able to attain plants of massive size and much better yeilds, and overall way healthier, just by switching to this mix.. i have pictures i took yesterday, and im trying to figger out how to upload em and post em.. but BBP, like i said a couple posts ago, i am in no way, shape, or form trying to challenge or discredit you.. im just sayin, different strokes for different folks


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