# Bad Soil



## superballs (May 22, 2009)

Miracle Grow Organic Choice Garden Soil. I had one guy here tell me he used this stuff and told me it was garbage, it WILL cook my plants for sure...But I decided to leave her in it since I just transplanted and she had a little shock, plus he said this was meant for a topsoil and the stuff I got says garden soil. Others told me to leave it in, dont risk second transplant. Well I explained that I did not follow directions before and didnt mix this soil 1:1 with native soil also...plant has been looking great though, *BUT.....* I noticed now yesterday that the edges of the leaves are browning and this morning it seems to be just slightly worse...I'm really worried I've made a horrible mistake. Please, Can anyone give me some good advice??? Do you know about this soil?
Also, this is difficult because I just started a new job and wont have money at all to buy new soil or anything for 2 weeks.


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## The Effen Gee (May 22, 2009)

Yes, you have made a horrible mistake.

Never ever EVER use ANYTHING from that company for growing weed.
Your just going to have to chalk this up as a loss.


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## zipflip (May 22, 2009)

:yeahthat: and imo to try an correct all that may have gone wrong and al the trouble for one plant is not worth the hastle man.
  its fine to take advise an listen to others but also do alot of reading for yourself so you can make the final judgement . and that way you will be able to spot idiot answers and good answers when you hear/read them.
you get bak wat you put in. meanin if you go cheap and slack or take shortcuts etc.. your prolly not gonna be smokin very long off ya harvest if ya get that far.


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## superballs (May 22, 2009)

Son of a *****, mother ******.....I friggin knew it!!! Well I understand your opinion on it being to much hassle for one plant, and calling it a loss, but I'm not ready to give up yet! I dont want another plant right now...I want this one to live. I'm going for another transplant into native soil, any advice, What can help me here...I dont want this plant to die, ti still looks very healthy and perky minus a few leaves browning on ends


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## The Effen Gee (May 22, 2009)

well, what you want and what you are going to get are two completely different things...

I can smell MG grown weed from a mile away. 
I can always tell when I smoke it.

Trust me, just kill it and start over. It's just going to get much worse.


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## zipflip (May 22, 2009)

the problem will still exist as it will still contain the mg soil. jmo.
  honestly man. how old is this plant is it shown female or male yet?
  why not just start anew one and divert the attention and skills you may obtain in readin thru here for couple a days into a new plant. you will be glad you did and so will ya new plant, granted you go about it better.
  and native soil do you mean like the dirt in ya back yard? lol  sorry man not laffin at you but honestly i wouldnt do it. unless ya gonna add butt loads of ammendments to it liek peat moss and major perlite etc. 
  we could all sit here and answer questions for you all day long but they wont mean a thing if you dont try an learn a thing or two for yourself on ur own as well. i'd say do wat ya gotta do wit the current plant if need be but i wouldnt pull my hair out over it if dont work. but in mean time catch up on soem major reading thruout the forum here and then try tackling it anew when you feel confident man. just my honest opinion.


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## superballs (May 22, 2009)

thank you effen g and zipflip again, the thing is that the root clump is not in miracle gro soil, it is in the backyard,(native) soil and it has only been *surrounded* by miracle gro soil for 3-4 days now so the roots havent really had time to spread into the miracle gro soil. I think I could transplant it removing 95-99% of the miracle gro soil and put back in the backyard soil JUST UNTIL I get paid next friday and can get some real soil...I think it would be a real shame to waste such a beautiful female. She is about 3 months old and is definetely a female. What do you think? Is she salvageable after knowing this?


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## crozar (May 22, 2009)

hey zipflip , just observe for a second , if we wash MG soil in a big gallon of water and mixing it then remove it with a tinted filter and wash it again and again and again and squeeze and crumble and wash ... all the nutes of MG soil will disolve and go ... but will that soil be any good for growing ? as in a neutral soil with no nutes ... and have nutes added later ? is this an idea for successful grows with MG soil ?
i need to know this because i have 2 big pots 1 with the washing technique the other normal setup.
however im not sure which pot is which this is my problem , and one of them is living and the other is dieing ,  i need an answer to get my next grows perfect for which technique to use  lol.


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## zipflip (May 22, 2009)

well depending on if you feedin nutes yet crozar. and how often an how much, to at least rule out any nute toxicity/defficiency firstly. and how often are you watering, is it over watered underwatered? then iwould jot down wat the ph of water nute solution is that your puttin in. then i'd test the runnoff water and jot down the ph from that. and take all ya details and do ya homework from there.  then if everythin is up to par and not over/underdone then i would have to say IMO that the one that seems to be dien is the one in MG soil. 
  hence this is why i feel there should be 
 WARNING STICKY AT TOP OF EVERY FORUM SECTION ABOUT USING mg PRODUCTS FOR GROWIN MJ, OR AT LEAST A USE AT YOUR OWN RISK TYPE DISCLAIMER ON ALL mg PRODUCTS. LOL
 but i have read a couple times somewhere how people have rinsed/washed/flushed their medium that had ferts already in it like MG to try an get the nutes out as much as possible. but remember that when you do this not to have the plant in the medium while doin it . just cuz thats how mg works. when ya water it it releases the slow release ferts in it. so by watering it more your only releasing more an more ferts in it thus toxifying levels even maybe.

superballs 





> thank you effen g and zipflip again, the thing is that the root clump is not in miracle gro soil, it is in the backyard,(native) soil and it has only been surrounded by miracle gro soil for 3-4 days now so the roots havent really had time to spread into the miracle gro soil. I think I could transplant it removing 95-99% of the miracle gro soil and put back in the backyard soil JUST UNTIL I get paid next friday and can get some real soil...I think it would be a real shame to waste such a beautiful female. She is about 3 months old and is definetely a female. What do you think? Is she salvageable after knowing this?



idk man imo its more an "up to you" kinda thing here now.
  i'm sure many have encountered similar situations/binds and done wat your talkin of doin an succeeded an im sure there are others who have tried an failed an killed their maidens. but  if you were to do this. and put in all native soil again, by the time you get better soil next friday it may die or even suffer from so much stress that it wont ever be wat it was suppose to be it may even hermie or worse yet even die on ya. 
  but then again mj is a weed man. it can grow just bout anywhere in many diff conditions etc but will it produce  any fruits worth ya labor or even good or at the least decent quality.
  now this is strictly my opinion on wat i would do in ur situation , and in no way am i advising you to do so. just so that if it does die you dont go hatin on me for it lol.
  but if me i would do lie ya said  but really man if you got any sorta garden center inya town even wal-mart you should be able to find somethin better tho not best soil  mix. just go to wal-mart and get some cheap hyponex soil. that wat im growin in mnow. it royally sux. it really sandy and tends to clump up really hard between waterings.  just pik out the big tree bark chunks in it teh best ya can imo. its bout maybe 2 bucks most for small bag even. brand (HYPONEX. in black bag. and get bag of perlite.  perlite at walmart here when they have it is only bout 5-6 bux a bag.
  but honestly man if you absolutely cant find someone even to borrow you ten bux or if unable to scrape up measly ten bux for change to save this ladies life then i gotta say man. this is small potatoes if ya cant figure that out some how maybe ya should just chalk up the loss maybe. 
  the damage is prolly done by now and will not fix wat has been done. only prevent more from happening is all.
  just if ya get the hyponex soil  an perlite whish is a must wit this hyponex. i'd be extremely generous wit the amount you use. to keep it from hardening up on ya.
  idk man honestly it seems to me it so outta wack that maybe ya better off takin the chance an leavin it in there and if it dies it dies. cuz really the stress from wat ya wanna do even if done wit care  will probly be so much stress  not includin wat stress it went thru already an prolly go kapoot.
  its one them things where it all but chance left now imo. or do wat crozar said bout washin an rinsin the MG good an i mean real good. and let it dry completely. granted then it may be empty of all ferts then you'll have to start addin nutes but you will never knwo if to add or not or wats left in the mg that when you water an try adding extra nutes that it also continues to release more from the ferts already in ti.  
  good luck


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## zipflip (May 22, 2009)

i bet you both will never use another MG product again now huh? lol  sorry not laffin at ya both. we all make mistakes bein beginners. i have made so many myself. and i have also learned that  sometimes it better to chalkit up a loss an start a new or at least not stress over it and simply look at it as a learning experience.   
  i still make mistakes guys. and you will continue to do so as well im sure. just dont let it get you down an give up. 
  practice makes perfect my friends. and im sure all these guys growin awesome fat ol buds an tall beutiful full ladies aint ya avg  at home beginner either. im sure they too have all went thru many of these types mistakes as well and have lerned from it in ways to better their next grow and so on over  many years man.  
  ya cant just sew a seed an expect to be cheifin up some primo buds in few months that you can brag about.
  if it was that simple dont ya think the pot would be cheaper an more availabe in some areas?   just somethin to remember is all.


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## crozar (May 23, 2009)

i dont use MG soil , but my soil have is similar to MG soil and it releases the nutes slowly depending on watering . however its lesser fertilizer then the MG soil , but 1 ofthe 2 pots is been washed severly without the plant in offcourse and the other i didnt wash the soil , i am not sure which pot is which , but 1 is doing great and the other is not so well.


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## zipflip (May 23, 2009)

maybe outdoors it would work better. so i hear more on the outdoor aspect. i'm assumin  it cuz all is not confied to one lil pot of soil and thus a lot is prolly leached into the surounding soil  therefore diluting teh heat of the ferts added maybe? but i have read that its not too bad if in the growun outside and if properly ammended. and yes it would work wonders i imagine. i recall a guy on here who used MG and his girls were monsters. an if i'm not mistaken was the user oldhippy" or somethin liek that. not sure....
  anyone else know? and wat happened to old hippy anyway?


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## superballs (May 23, 2009)

Guys, thankyou for your advice and knowledge...I really do appreciate it *ALOT!!! *With the new light of it maybe working just leaving it in, I think I'll just go ahead and risk leaving her in. BUT, I am gonna dig around the site without getting too close to her roots and remove as much of that soil as I can and go and get some real soil, I made $85 today, I would like to try out Fox Farms...do they make an outside soil??? Or Anybody got any suggestions on a good soil...Thanks for the tip on adding perlite to hyponex for an ok, cheap soil zip. Youve been very helpful, but since I got the money, what do you suggest? I wont be adding any nutes to her unless I have too. But the leftover soil should be enough nutrients I'm guessing. I've been checking on her frequently and her growth is definetely not stunted...She is growing at a miraculous rate,(no pun intended), there are new shoots out of every site and the older branches are really spreading out every day and the browning edges seem to not be spreading anymore, all the new growth shows no damage, I dont know...maybe the browning was just shock from transplant???

   I know this seems like alot of work and to most...not worth it. But I enjoy playing in the dirt and I'm determined to make this work. Thanks again!

  Oh and I guess my questions are Whats a good soil for me to replace what I can, and use in the future. Also it gets *VERY HOT *here in Southern Texas, lots of 100 degree plus days here, so I want to start spraying the leaves at night with just water, gotta good mister today at the dollar store and it really mists...not squirts or sprays, my question is "What kind of water should I use, the tap water here is very hard water, one drop will leave white deposits on the leaves, is bottled water ok?


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## superballs (May 23, 2009)

Oh and *YES*  I have learned a valuable lesson for the future And thanks also to you Reddy, youre words and zips helped my decision and I guess goodluck to me, I'm sure I'll be here alot more to whine about what I did wrong guys  By the way...What does "IMO" mean?


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## dr_toker81 (May 23, 2009)

theres nothing wrong with MG .. as long as it doesnt have time released nutes in it....  i wouldnt recoment the nutes.. but if its a pure organic soil without the nutes.. its fine.....


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## superballs (May 23, 2009)

dr_toker81 said:
			
		

> theres nothing wrong with MG .. as long as it doesnt have time released nutes in it.... i wouldnt recoment the nutes.. but if its a pure organic soil without the nutes.. its fine.....


 

Miracle-Gro states that this soil was specially created for the organic gardener (and is not intended for commercial growing). It contains a premium blend of sphagnum peat moss, compost and natural fertilizers. The fertilizer offers both quick and continuous release of nitrogen and is designed for use with vegetables, annual and perennial flowers. 

The instructions are simple: Mix the Miracle-Grow Organic soil with native soil (the soil in your yard), plant, water well and cover the area with mulch. This soil is not meant for container gardening.


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## 420benny (May 23, 2009)

I read that as a warning that they know their soil mix has too many nutes in it. By mixing it with native soil, you are diluting the nute load. By telling you not to use it in containers says it has too many nutes and will burn the crap out of whatever you put in that pot. Just pass on anything MG and things will be better.


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## superballs (May 23, 2009)

420benny said:
			
		

> I read that as a warning that they know their soil mix has too many nutes in it. By mixing it with native soil, you are diluting the nute load. By telling you not to use it in containers says it has too many nutes and will burn the crap out of whatever you put in that pot. Just pass on anything MG and things will be better.


 

Thanks Benny, Yea me too......After I already had her in the ground with it....thats when I did my little tantrum dance and sang my obscene, profane song:doh: 
 You really do need to do some research....at the very least, read the darn back of the product your buying,lol.
Again though, Does anybody know if bottled water is ok to mist your plants leaves with at night? 
 Also, what is some good outdoor soil?


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## dr_toker81 (May 23, 2009)

oh well IMO.. ive used it many many times and got great yeilds that taste completely normal.. its all in what KIND you get


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## 420benny (May 25, 2009)

superballs said:
			
		

> Thanks Benny, Yea me too......After I already had her in the ground with it....thats when I did my little tantrum dance and sang my obscene, profane song:doh:
> You really do need to do some research....at the very least, read the darn back of the product your buying,lol.
> Again though, Does anybody know if bottled water is ok to mist your plants leaves with at night?
> Also, what is some good outdoor soil?



I use Roots Aurora brand soil. They ship all over. Check it out. I misted all my plants with a weak milk and water fine spray last night and 2 hours later, they were happier than anytime lately. No burning of leaves either. I am under t5s. Big oscillating fan on 24/7 dries the leaves fairly quickly.


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## Sir_Tokie (May 25, 2009)

420benny said:
			
		

> I use Roots Aurora brand soil. They ship all over. Check it out. I misted all my plants with a weak milk and water fine spray last night and 2 hours later, they were happier than anytime lately. No burning of leaves either. I am under t5s. Big oscillating fan on 24/7 dries the leaves fairly quickly.


You mist your plants with MILK/Water? I would think that the milk would spoil and create molds/fungus to grow. Could you please explain the milk/water method and why you use it? Thanks...take care..


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## nvthis (May 26, 2009)

If you are worried about it at all, just pull it from the pot and knock off the soil you don't want.

Here is a great link for ya. 

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35928

I have taken mother plants from 5 gal buckets to 2 gal pots and they did fine. Not neccesarily recommended, but it obviously can be done.


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## Daverenich (May 26, 2009)

Im using MG Organic Mix now, im my second week in and no bad signs yet.


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## 420benny (May 27, 2009)

Sir_Tokie said:
			
		

> You mist your plants with MILK/Water? I would think that the milk would spoil and create molds/fungus to grow. Could you please explain the milk/water method and why you use it? Thanks...take care..


I know it sounds really weird. I am dealing with a powdery mildew problem and the calcium in the milk helps get rid of it. After seeing happiness on the infected plants, I decided to use the rest of the spray bottle on all the plants. They like it! If you don't use it all and forget the sprayer for a few days, the smell will tell you  right away that it spoiled. Under big lights, it might be better to do it with the lights off, just to be safe. You need lots of moving air to dry the plants or you will be making the problem worse, imo


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## The Effen Gee (May 27, 2009)

I am just going to put it like this:

If you use MG soil and think your doing good by your cannabis, you are not only a lazy grower, but stubborn and ignorant too.

...even novice growers in my area KNOW that it is bad for your plants and harms your finished product. 

...and if you believe that MG produces quality...than I invite you to take a look at what your opinopn of "top shelf Cannabis" really is.

If you went into ANY hydro store and asked for MG anything, you will get laughed out of the store, because you prolly need to quit growing.

There, I said it. Mg is crap, and if you think it's good for your plants...you need to get a bit more reading done.


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## crozar (May 27, 2009)

maybe 1 day MG products will make a new mix  its all about the competition soon with these soil companies lol


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## superballs (May 29, 2009)

Well guys, thanks for all the advice! I found my problem with the leaves browning...it was the pesticide/miticide/fungicide spray product I was using. It's called Neem ll, by Greenlight. The lady I spoke with at my local shop said it was good for fruits, vegetables, herbs, flowers and all, but to spray at night cuz its an oil base and the sun will burn...so I did and I just realized thats when my problems started happening, I tried it on other random plants and weeds all over the backyard with the same results everywhere. I stopped using and the palnts browning stopped. I guess the oil sticks around for a few days with a shiny coating and the temps here climb over 100...Problem solved...It might work outside for other places where the temps dont reach 100. Oh and as for the soil, I found a place near me that carries Fox Farms and bought some...dug up my baby and removed all miracle grow soil pretty easily. She is doing great since the transplant 5 days ago and growing like an erection in a porn shop


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## Old Bud (May 29, 2009)

While I don't use soil containing slow release nutes or any hot soil for any young plants, there is nothing wrong with using MG ferts in veg. They are cheap and if you start at about 1/3 the recommended dosage and work up from there you should have no problem. Of course they don't sell MG, Or any similar nutes in hydro shops, they try to convince you to buy something that costs 20 times as much and may work 5% better. I suspect that most of those who rant about MG have never actually used it. There are some I am sure who can tell MJ grown with MG by the smell just as there are those who can tell a $50. bottle of wine from a $100 dollar one but I am not one of them and I suspect most others are in the same boat.


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## astrobud (May 29, 2009)

i dont mean to be rude but it sounds to me like your putting a lot of bad stuff on your grow, of course i grow indoors it all seems a bit extreme to me.  (milk, pesticide, ect) i use mg at first and it sucked (btw) and imo means in my opinion


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (May 29, 2009)

superballs said:
			
		

> Oh and *YES* I have learned a valuable lesson for the future And thanks also to you Reddy, youre words and zips helped my decision and I guess goodluck to me, I'm sure I'll be here alot more to whine about what I did wrong guys By the way...What does "IMO" mean?


 
IMO=In my Opinion

  True, MG soil is not the best, yes you can grow good weed in it, no there is no reason to kill the plant and start over.  Some bud is better than no bud.  If I put 1 plant in MG soil and flower it under a 1,000 watt HPS and give it a lot of TLC, I can guarantee that my plant will still be better at harvest than your plant if you use the world's best growing medium and flower it under a 100 watt CFL and give it no TLC.  Are the buds feauted on the cover of High Times grown in MG soil? No, Does this mean buds can't be grown in MG soil? certainly not.   have used MG soil and had decent reslts, but no I would not use it again.


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## superballs (May 30, 2009)

astrobud said:
			
		

> i dont mean to be rude but it sounds to me like your putting a lot of bad stuff on your grow, of course i grow indoors it all seems a bit extreme to me. (milk, pesticide, ect) i use mg at first and it sucked (btw) and imo means in my opinion


 
Well I haven't put milk on my plants, but I here that a watered down mist of milk, (dried well after), helps kill fungus. The only things I have given my plant was half the reccomended dose of superthrive during the transplants to help overcome shock. The miracle grow soil didnt harm it, but it is gone now and I just have Fox Farms soil. The only other thing I put on is that Neem ll stuff one time because I have a pest problem, yea it did burn the leaves, so I stopped using it. But this is all. Oh yea and thanks for telling me what IMO means, I've still been trying to figure that one out, lol.


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