# Is this a problem?



## mistisrising (Jun 2, 2009)

I recently germinated a couple of the kaya strain from nirvana. One of them turned out like this. I three starter leaves indicative of any future problems? 

Edit: Now that I've looked at the pic more closely, I see that there are also three single fingers coming out, also. What the hell is going on here?


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## umbra (Jun 2, 2009)

triploid...rare pheno. could turn out to be very special.


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## HippyInEngland (Jun 2, 2009)

Hello Mistisrising 

Are you using Flickr as an image host?

What you have is called a whorled Phyllotaxy.

The bad news is 95% of them are male.

eace:


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## Hick (Jun 2, 2009)

> &#8220;Ploidy&#8221; refers to the number of chromsome sets in an organism. A haploid organism has one complete set of chromsomes; a diploid has two; a triploid has three; etcetera.


I'm "pretty" sure, the _whorled phyllotaxy_ (which is what I see here) is not an indication of triploid or polyploid chromosomes. 
And "if" memory serves me correctly, dj or clarke says polyploids do not occur naturally in cannabis, but must be treated with colchicine (sp). 
umbra.. please correct me if I'm wrong. 

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36602&highlight=polyploid
http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15796&highlight=whorled+phyllotaxi
http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showpost.php?p=96708&postcount=89


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## umbra (Jun 2, 2009)

Hick said:
			
		

> I'm "pretty" sure, the _whorled phyllotaxy_ (which is what I see here) is not an indication of triploid or polyploid chromosomes.
> And "if" memory serves me correctly, dj or clarke says polyploids do not occur naturally in cannabis, but must be treated with colchicine (sp).
> umbra.. please correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> ...



i believe you & HIE are correct whorl phyllotaxy (how the leaves form on the stalk), however polyploids are naturally occurring. anytime rhizobia infects roots, endoreplication is possible up to 128n (where n = the number of chromosomes in the nuclei ). it can occur in mitosis as well as meiosis. at least, that my understanding .


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## umbra (Jun 2, 2009)

multi node, not multi leaf, yep


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## mistisrising (Jun 2, 2009)

The kaya strain is femmed, would that be the cause of this? Or do cetrain genetic lines carry this trait.?Is it possible that this is a S1, and could the inbreeding be the cause? And, is rhizobia a bad thing for cannabis, or is this something I should attempt to treat? Wiki says that it's beneficail for legumes, but surprisingly doesn't mention weed.


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (Jun 2, 2009)

mistisrising said:
			
		

> The kaya strain is femmed, would that be the cause of this? Or do cetrain genetic lines carry this trait.?Is it possible that this is a S1, and could the inbreeding be the cause? And, is rhizobia a bad thing for cannabis, or is this something I should attempt to treat? Wiki says that it's beneficail for legumes, but surprisingly doesn't mention weed.


 
Hi Mistisrising,
  I am really interested in this thread though the majority of the points on genetics being discussed are beyond me.  I also have one plant in Veg right now that is showing the same trait.  It is an Ed Rosenthal Superbud Non-femmed seed that I germed and planted in soil.  Unlike the other ones I germed this one is displaying much lighter coloring and slower vegetative growth.  The fan leaves are coming in structured differently than the other plants, looks like a completely different pheno.  Anyway, the point of this post is that this trait does show in non-femmed seeds.    Is it true as stated above that these are normally male or as stated above that this could be a great characteristic? 
  I can't get any pics of mine up right now but should be able to soon.  Mine is almost ready to be cloned and then thrown in flower so hoepully I will be able to sex mine soon.  
NYC


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## mistisrising (Jun 2, 2009)

That makes two of us. Is there anyone else that has a plant like this? If there is, why don't we start a thread somewhere and continue to update. It would be interesting to see how these do. I have a control subject, too. I started two of them, so there's something to compare it to.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Jun 2, 2009)

I had one--it was male.

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=97222&d=1232215385


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (Jun 2, 2009)

set up the thread and hit me up, I will post my updates on the Ed Rosenthal in there along with the pics, good idea.


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## mistisrising (Jun 2, 2009)

I'll hit you up when I start it, I don't think I'll do it till this weekend, though.


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## dowjones618 (Jun 5, 2009)

Strange look plant!


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## Weezy (Jun 5, 2009)

I always thought it was only the MasterKush from Nirvana that had this trait.  I have had this happen to two of them but yeah...both males for me as well.

What I mean is, out of all the different strains from Nirvana, only the MK displayed the whorled phyllotaxy...but I guess that isn't correct


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## mistisrising (Jun 6, 2009)

Couple of people now have said they ended up male. Since this is feminized, I hope it doesn't hermi on me. It might be nice to get a male, actually, since kaya is only available femmed. I would be able to keep the genetics without crossing it.


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## HippyInEngland (Jun 6, 2009)

Hi Mistisrising 

If you do have a girl, you really must take this on a full journal Journey.

They are very rare.

eace:


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## mistisrising (Jun 7, 2009)

I would've already started the thread, since I planted this one outside this morning. But, I forgot the camera. So, It'll have to wait until I water 'em.


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## BuddyLuv (Jun 8, 2009)

I had a WW do it that turned out to be a girl. Once she started alternating nodes you really couldn't even tell she was like that. She was pretty for the first four weeks though


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## zipflip (Jun 8, 2009)

i wonder wat would happen like said... if say a guy had one these whored philtlaxily... watever thing it called lol an it turned male as spoke of above and ya did pollinate one of ya ladies in flower. an both bein from the same batch feminized seeds.
  maybe ya'll get beans that feminized and  all turn female an absolute no male or hermiee rate. liek some wonder magic bean.  lol
 maket em an call em jacks magic beans. (jack n bean stalk) lol 
   thanks for the post guys.  i actually have one these tripods too. but mine looks like it more so had four an lost one but i honestly cannot recall if one busted off one or not and never paid that close attention as my other girls were finishin flowerin  
  i'll be sure keepin an eye on mine.
  theres a pic of mine http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=117031&d=1244266789


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