# BML spider 600



## techrons78

Any thoughts on this...I mite purchase next 6 months or so looks like a great fixture..Osram leds built to order...36" arms 3 feet long no fan poly carbonate shell..


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## Grower13

techrons78 said:


> Any thoughts on this...I mite purchase next 6 months or so looks like a great fixture..Osram leds built to order...36" arms 3 feet long no fan poly carbonate shell..


 

I'm not going to pay 1500 for any light.............


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## techrons78

Grower13 said:


> I'm not going to pay 1500 for any light.............



Well that is good for you....thanks for waiting bandwidth to say absolutely nothing...

Anyone own one...??


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## Grower13

techrons78 said:


> Well that is good for you....thanks for waiting bandwidth to say absolutely nothing...
> 
> Anyone own one...??


 


You asked for thoughts........ you got mine.


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## Dr. Green Fang

Spyder is next level, according to "things" 

... at least is seems!


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## techrons78

Grower13 said:


> You asked for thoughts........ you got mine.



Im sorry I forgot to add  to answer with something  intelligent , you see no value in it..so of course you say no..expensive yes..get what you pay for yes...whats is gonna crack me up if these fly by night led companies people are buying in one years or syou they start breaking down..from growing better light more par more lumen  ... can u go wrong..will pay for itself over time with electricity and supposedly onky light to cover 4x4..im into making money investing in good equipment...are you gonna put your wife in a, cheap unsafe car..or woukd u rather get her the  McLaren Mercedes.....I like the finer things I see first hand difference from my apollo lights ti kind...world difference..


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## techrons78

Dr. Green Fang said:


> Spyder is next level, according to "things"
> 
> ... at least is seems!



Well im gonna find out lol


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## techrons78

One thing I like sbout them is no fan polycarbonate shell adjustable arms...the arms makecsince...with most led u need several fixture light is soocfocused. .but u branch out arms like an, umbrella everything gets par n lumens


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## Dr. Green Fang

Yeah, the Spyder stuff is top of the line LED right now. 

As for world of difference Kind vs Apollo... let's see some Par readings  
I saw the Kind light I almost got, at the hydro store the other day. Didn't fancy it..

The BML stuff though, now THAT is next level!


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## techrons78

Dr. Green Fang said:


> Yeah, the Spyder stuff is top of the line LED right now.
> 
> As for world of difference insiind vs Apollo... let's see some Par readings
> I saw the Kind light I almost got, at the hydro store the other day. Didn't fancy it..
> 
> The BML stuff though, now THAT is next level!



If I had par meter id give you one..but apollo wont put out par usually and wont give proof of daid Bridgelux leds ..if u want more info u can pm..but I have grown with both..I was sushi the apollo p8 its very bright but I guarantee the foods are close if not to full capacity..interodes were longer with apollo and was using advanced led ..switch to kind...has greens in it like the tech they are using in outerspacec tp grow my interodes are tight...im sure it won heightened last year for a reason..but I will find out in 7 weeks lol


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## P Jammers

The only light better IMHO is the BML 1200 which crushes the Gavita's at half the wattage.

A bit rich for my blood, but if they were half I'd replace my entire setup with zero hesitation.


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## NorCalHal

I definitely wouldn't say it crushes the Gavita's at half wattage. That BML runs at 670 watts as compared to 1000, my math tells me it is saving you approx. 330 watts. 

I wouldn't go by the comparision that 1 video, in a poorly designed room, shows. I am basing my opinion on the DE bulbs from my own experience with them. 

Again, some folks still go by the old skool method of measuring success by grams per watt, when the true test is grams per square foot. Any Professional in the MJ Industry will tell you it is all about the grams per square foot.

The BML light does have me interested, but the price point makes it unfeasible at the moment.


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## P Jammers

NorCalHal said:


> I definitely wouldn't say it crushes the Gavita's at half wattage. That BML runs at 670 watts as compared to 1000, my math tells me it is saving you approx. 330 watts.
> 
> I wouldn't go by the comparision that 1 video, in a poorly designed room, shows. I am basing my opinion on the DE bulbs from my own experience with them.
> 
> With how much experience with LED tech?
> 
> Again, some folks still go by the old skool method of measuring success by grams per watt, when the true test is grams per square foot. Any Professional in the MJ Industry will tell you it is all about the grams per square foot.
> 
> Actually, guys I know go by cost to produce said grams.
> 
> The BML light does have me interested, but the price point makes it unfeasible at the moment.



One video? Old school method? I been crushing HPS numbers for three years straight and ran HPS tech for 30+ years before that.

Lets not forget that the one of the most important factors is time, and because you can make plants larger with HPS you can do more because of this and that is the ONLY benefit. At the end of the day your cost I am willing to bet is twice my cost all things considered.

All things the same and a 14 to 21 days veg and I crush HPS at less than half the wattage and I really don't care what brand you want to compare it to. My average finish time from root to done is 83 to 92 days on every strain I run.

You may be able to achieve 1GPW with HPS but no way you do it on plants vegged 14 to 21 days, and at the end of the day all that really matter is how much it costs to produce said grams.

I am also using about half the power to cool, and half the cost to feed which also factors in.

I'll stand by orginal comment that good LED tech crushes the Gavita or any HPS for that matter. We can agree to disagree, but facts is facts.

How bout this? 

One of us shares a strain. I will use one my designed 180 watt lights, and you can use a 400 watt HPS so we keep it small scale and we do a comparison grow, you know just for fun. 2 gallon pot max.

We veg for 21 days and flip and document it all. You can use as much space as you like.

Whatcha think?

I'll define crush and we'll open up a few closed eyes around here. 

Also FWIW, if my lights were for sale I could cover 3 times the space for the cost of the Spydr's, so yeah we'll agree on their price point for sure, but there are other lights out there that crush it.


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## NorCalHal

P Jammers said:


> One video? Old school method? I been crushing HPS numbers for three years straight and ran HPS tech for 30+ years before that.
> 
> Lets not forget that the one of the most important factors is time, and because you can make plants larger with HPS you can do more because of this and that is the ONLY benefit. At the end of the day your cost I am willing to bet is twice my cost all things considered.
> 
> All things the same and a 14 to 21 days veg and I crush HPS at less than half the wattage and I really don't care what brand you want to compare it to. My average finish time from root to done is 83 to 92 days on every strain I run.
> 
> You may be able to achieve 1GPW with HPS but no way you do it on plants vegged 14 to 21 days, and at the end of the day all that really matter is how much it costs to produce said grams.
> 
> I am also using about half the power to cool, and half the cost to feed which also factors in.
> 
> I'll stand by orginal comment that good LED tech crushes the Gavita or any HPS for that matter. We can agree to disagree, but facts is facts.
> 
> How bout this?
> 
> One of us shares a strain. I will use one my designed 180 watt lights, and you can use a 400 watt HPS so we keep it small scale and we do a comparison grow, you know just for fun. 2 gallon pot max.
> 
> We veg for 21 days and flip and document it all. You can use as much space as you like.
> 
> Whatcha think?
> 
> I'll define crush and we'll open up a few closed eyes around here.
> 
> Also FWIW, if my lights were for sale I could cover 3 times the space for the cost of the Spydr's, so yeah we'll agree on their price point for sure, but there are other lights out there that crush it.


 

Sure are testy for an old man haha.

I based my comments on the Video posted about the commercial LED grow, not your grows. We all know you are the master of LED tech. I am not challenging your authority. ( I love South Park).


Thanks for the grow off invite, but I have outgrown my closet my friend. I simply do not have the time, or the need to document grows anymore. Do not take this as I am scared my friend, I just have a business to run.

The most I veg on my plants is 21 days, from rooted clone, I am not sure why you think this is an exceptional time frame to Veg, it seems normal to me. I too hit on average around 80 daze...yes....80 daze. That is correct, and not a typo. I cut like clockwork 56-60 days from flip. Last hit averaged 1.36 gpw for those stuck in the 90's method of measuring success. Besides...we both can agree that strain is the number one factor in weight per plant/watt/grow area.

Remember, Commercial environments are ALOT different then home grows. Think about co2 and the impact it has on veg times and flower times. Think about sub sonic wave harmonizers and the impact it has on the stomata.


Yes, cost per gram for finished product is, I am sure, lower then what I achieve. I have horrible power bills due to cooling and wattage, but it all washes out in the end. I am not greedy, so I don't complain. I keep myself and my employee's very happy.

As far as cost of nuits, I am probably lower then most. Less then $300 to grow 30+ lbs. That pretty low imho.  I am in the Mecca of commercial growing, I know many commercial growers. No one I know bases there herb on what it costs to grow per gram, just sayin'. It's all about weight out of area. True costs per gram for me would make you cry. Taxes/wages/fees/rent/power...to name a few. That's why commercial growers grow commercially haha....we HAVE to go big or go under.

So, end all be all, don't get so upset when someone disagrees with you bro. Believe, you or I have not seen anything yet. The Industry is changing faster then any other and all tech has it's place.


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## NorCalHal

And Yes PJ, I have zero experience with LED tech,  and that should be known.
I am just going off the posts yourself and other do on the tech. 
I have only seen a couple of live LED grows myself. Definitely impressive in the environment it was in.
I have much respect for you PJ, so don't take any of this personally, I just gotta say what I gotta say too. Maybe I poke too much, but I figure you can take it.
You and I BOTH know that the lights are only a small part of success, as method truly dictates skill.
All I am saying is Gavita's have their place, and they are keeping up with LED tech in the right hands. If LED was right for me and what I am doing, I would have changed already.

I must say that regular HPS should be discontinued. It's simple. Smaller environment...LED.  Bigger Enviroment...DE.  

Again, I see LED tech trying to get into the Commercial market, and I APPLAUD it. Once costs go down, it could have an impact. But, for me, cost is not the only factor.
Ease of use too. Having a big area lit with less fixtures is nice. If there was one giant LED that attached to the ceiling and lit the whole room crazy style, I'd be all over it, whatever the cost haha.

Believe me, I'm not out here spinnin' my wheels, I have one big advantage over most folks, I have an open mind. That is the one big mistake I see ALL growers go though, a closed mind. Why do you think I surf the 'net on grow sites. It's robbery, that's why. I will steal your idea with the quickness! But of course, the idea has to make sense and work.


btw....I'd love to throw u something to see how she grows under your skills and those lights. Can I say that?


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## P Jammers

NorCalHal said:


> Sure are testy for an old man haha.
> hahaha, didn't think the challenge would come across as Testy, but thought rather it would allow you to opened up to the idea that perhaps there is something to this whole LED thing.
> 
> Thanks for the grow off invite, but I have outgrown my closet my friend. I simply do not have the time, or the need to document grows anymore. Do not take this as I am scared my friend, I just have a business to run.
> 
> Not sure if you think I am a closet grower, but I harvest 52 times a year. It may be a smaller system in terms of size as I am not a commercial grower, but  my runs are computer controlled using the very latest in tech, including CO2.
> 
> 
> The most I veg on my plants is 21 days, from rooted clone, I am not sure why you think this is an exceptional time frame to Veg, it seems normal to me. I too hit on average around 80 daze...yes....80 daze. That is correct, and not a typo. I cut like clockwork 56-60 days from flip. Last hit averaged 1.36 gpw for those stuck in the 90's method of measuring success. Besides...we both can agree that strain is the number one factor in weight per plant/watt/grow area.
> 
> We will agree that the strain has a lot to do with it which is why I wanted to run the same strain to show you I'd do better at half the wattage. I would have had to set up a space as well.
> 
> Remember, Commercial environments are ALOT different then home grows. Think about co2 and the impact it has on veg times and flower times. Think about sub sonic wave harmonizers and the impact it has on the stomata.
> 
> So then we are even and it would be a fair test.
> 
> 
> Yes, cost per gram for finished product is, I am sure, lower then what I achieve. I have horrible power bills due to cooling and wattage, but it all washes out in the end. I am not greedy, so I don't complain. I keep myself and my employee's very happy.
> 
> As far as cost of nuits, I am probably lower then most. Less then $300 to grow 30+ lbs. That pretty low imho.  I am in the Mecca of commercial growing, I know many commercial growers. No one I know bases there herb on what it costs to grow per gram, just sayin'. It's all about weight out of area. True costs per gram for me would make you cry. Taxes/wages/fees/rent/power...to name a few. That's why commercial growers grow commercially haha....we HAVE to go big or go under.
> 
> So, end all be all, don't get so upset when someone disagrees with you bro. Believe, you or I have not seen anything yet. The Industry is changing faster then any other and all tech has it's place.



I am not upset. I feel you have nothing but opinions to share on LED tech and made the statement that LED's could not crush a Gavita watt for watt. I say you are wrong, and wanted to show it. Nothing more nothing less.



NorCalHal said:


> And Yes PJ, I have zero experience with LED tech,  and that should be known.
> I am just going off the posts yourself and other do on the tech.
> I have only seen a couple of live LED grows myself. Definitely impressive in the environment it was in.
> I have much respect for you PJ, so don't take any of this personally, I just gotta say what I gotta say too. Maybe I poke too much, but I figure you can take it.
> 
> Totally, I'm also willing to put up or shut up about the claims I make and am willing to take on any HPS grower on the planet and if someone wanted to teach me something I'd take them up on it.
> 
> You and I BOTH know that the lights are only a small part of success, as method truly dictates skill.
> 
> Yup, which is why I suggested we share and run the same strain.
> 
> All I am saying is Gavita's have their place, and they are keeping up with LED tech in the right hands. If LED was right for me and what I am doing, I would have changed already.
> 
> Had you followed up with me back in July you would have had the opportunity to run some of my LED's to test. Not sure if you have your product tested, but you could have done that also and seen on average that LED flowers of the same strain is improved with LED lighting. This is now being shown and documented on the net.
> 
> I must say that regular HPS should be discontinued. It's simple. Smaller environment...LED.  Bigger Enviroment...DE.
> 
> Again, I see LED tech trying to get into the Commercial market, and I APPLAUD it. Once costs go down, it could have an impact. But, for me, cost is not the only factor.
> Ease of use too. Having a big area lit with less fixtures is nice.
> 
> If there was one giant LED that attached to the ceiling and lit the whole room crazy style, I'd be all over it, whatever the cost haha.
> 
> Already exists. For the life of me can not remember the name of the grow, but it's documented on Youtube. Just searched with no luck...
> 
> Believe me, I'm not out here spinnin' my wheels, I have one big advantage over most folks, I have an open mind. That is the one big mistake I see ALL growers go though, a closed mind. Why do you think I surf the 'net on grow sites. It's robbery, that's why. I will steal your idea with the quickness! But of course, the idea has to make sense and work.
> 
> 
> btw....I'd love to throw u something to see how she grows under your skills and those lights. Can I say that?


Throw me a PM.

Of course we are good. We go back quite a ways and I hope the respect is mutual. I really wasn't trying to be testy. For whatever reason you think gavita's will hold their own against LED's watt for watt. I say you have nothing to base this on except opinion so I threw out a way for you and the rest of this site to see it first hand. 

Peace


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## Dr. Green Fang

P Jammers said:


> I really wasn't trying to be testy



Really, he wasn't...

...the prick just comes off that way sometimes :rofl: 

I love and respect both you guys....but I'd jab the SH!T out of PJ's ribs if I meet him in real life! Then buy him a beer 
PJ's changed the way I do everything, and for my larger / small operation, things seem to be for the better. Can't wait to see how the next few months go! 

PJ, NorCal, Hush, THG, etc etc.. there's so many of you I'd like to meet outside of "behind your keyboard"


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## techrons78

Thanks gang lol


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## Dr. Green Fang

Gavitas are Double Ended HPS units :aok:


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## techrons78

Dr. Green Fang said:


> Gavitas are Double Ended HPS units :aok:



Llmao wow im a dumass.with the name gavitas I think led sounds rich lol...thabks for heads up bro


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## Dr. Green Fang

techrons78 said:


> Llmao wow im a dumass.with the name gavitas I think led sounds rich lol...thabks for heads up bro



Hah, no worries.


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## NorCalHal

Great reply Sir.
Again...I am not trippin' on the "watt for watt", I do concede that an LED will produce more,watt for watt in the right hands, then a DE. Again...I can only achieve 1.36 gpw (so far my best with DE), but to cover a large area, DE is far more feasible and just as effective.

How much would it cost to cover an area 20' x 20'. I bet its a HUGE $$ amount. An unacceptable $$ amount. It takes me 16,000 watts of DE to do this. My best was in a 20' x 16' area with 12,000 watts.

 From my calculations, using the bml 1200 which runs at 670 watts....you would need 15-16 of these to cover a 20x16' area. I averaged 1.36 watts per gram on DE giving me 36 lbs off of 12 DE's. You would have to hit 2.5gpw with the BML, which I do concede is quite possible in the right hands, and with someone like yourself with much experience with them. You would have to hit 3+ gpw in that environment to "crush" a properly ran DE. Possilbe...yes....by any joe...heck no. Not any Joe will be able to hit 1.36 on DE's as well.

So, in my book, it looks like the DE's are keeping up with LED in a commercial environment quite well.

It cost me 6k for 12 Gavita's. It would cost 45k with BML tech. Enough said.

That was my first grow with DE's and that particular strain. I am sure I can improve this number, but I won't be running that particular strain again until winter.

Don't take too much information as being golden on the 'net old friend. The best growers in the world never log into the 'net. Trust me on this one. Internet showing growers are the MAJOR minority. Not one person I know who grows posts any kind of information on the 'net.

I am not sayin' that LED tech sux. I am simply saying that it is not feasible for me personally, or any of the commercial growers that I know. Believe me, we all have many conversations about it.

You made no mention of my Veg times, which you said is impossible.

Great harvest schedule Sir...you have me beat. I only click every 2 weeks...25+ plus each time...ya...I keep pretty busy.


So AGAIN...I am not arguing against LED tech, I argue that it just isn't feasible for commercial growers at this time.


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## NorCalHal

Yes Dr... PJ has improved all home growers methods more then ANY other poster I have seen, on any forum. I think that is awesome!


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## NorCalHal

Here is some more info on why DE's will continue to dominate commercial cultivation.

Stolen from a thread at ICMag. AGAIN...DE's are simply a better choice and just as efficient as a LED for larger grows.  AGAIN, not to take away from the effectiveness of the LED for smaller grows.  

http://www.gpnmag.com/sites/default/files/14_TechnicallySpeaking_GPN0614.pdf

http://cpl.usu.edu/files/publications/poster/pub__9913943.pdf

Economic Analysis of Greenhouse Lighting: Light Emitting Diodes vs. High Intensity Discharge Fixtures

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0099010


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## techrons78

NorCalHal said:


> Yes Dr... PJ has improved all home growers methods more then ANY other poster I have seen, on any forum. I think that is awesome!



Lol


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## 000StankDank000

NorCalHal said:


> Yes Dr... PJ has improved all home growers methods more then ANY other poster I have seen, on any forum. I think that is awesome!




I'm waiting for his book to come out.


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## techrons78

000StankDank000 said:


> I'm waiting for his book to come out.



Me too I want mine signed tho...


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## P Jammers

000StankDank000 said:


> I'm waiting for his book to come out.





techrons78 said:


> Me too I want mine signed tho...


If you guys read Skunk mag, or High times I am published in both.


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## techrons78

P Jammers said:


> If you guys read Skunk mag, or High times I am published in both.



Sweet..


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## Grower13

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ert3fmYQlk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9gdoTO3_kw


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## 000StankDank000

P Jammers said:


> If you guys read Skunk mag, or High times I am published in both.




What month and year High Times and skunk mag? I have a HUGE collection ......Remember lies make baby Jesus cry


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## HotelCalifornia420

techrons78 said:


> Well that is good for you....thanks for waiting bandwidth to say absolutely nothing...
> 
> Anyone own one...??



After I finish my current grow, I'll need to replace my 600-watt MH and 600-watt HPS bulbs.  And I may just put that money into a Spydr 600, along with the money I could get from selling all my HID equipment.

Otherwise, I'll have to shut down for the hot part of the summer because of cooling issues with a 600-watt HPS in a 3.5 x 3.5 grow closet...


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## techrons78

HotelCalifornia420 said:


> After I finish my current grow, I'll need to replace my 600-watt MH and 600-watt HPS bulbs.  And I may just put that money into a Spydr 600, along with the money I could get from selling all my HID equipment.
> 
> Otherwise, I'll have to shut down for the hot part of the summer because of cooling issues with a 600-watt HPS in a 3.5 x 3.5 grow closet...



That's prob what im gonnac do..sell 3 kind 300 and ancillumigrow pro series and get the bml


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## MR1

Did you watch the videos Grower13 posted, to me numbers from video two looked real high compared to what I saw in video one. Don't see much penetration with the Spider light. JMO.


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## Dr. Green Fang

Tech... that sounds like a wonderful plan. I had a look at a few of the Kind series installed in my hydro store and no offense to anyone, but was happy I didn't get them. I'm sure they work just fine, but I was happy ...  I think, if you can get this BML stuff, you'll be top doggin' it all day long. I would be jelly to the 10th power, hahaha! :aok:

(jelly = jealous for the older people reading... and it's also a horrible slang word that I never use, but found it very pertinent right now) :rofl:


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## techrons78

Dr. Green Fang said:


> Tech... that sounds like a wonderful plan. I had a look at a few of the Kind series installed in my hydro store and no offense to anyone, but was happI didn't get them. I'm sure they work just fine, but I was happy ...  I think, if you can get this BML stuff, you'll be top doggin' it all day long. I would be jelly to the 10th power, hahaha! :aok:
> 
> (jelly = jealous for the older people reading... and it's also a horrible slang word that I never use, but found it very pertinent right now) :rofl:



Peanut butter and jelly...in regards to the lights rhe hsve worked better than others I habe had they will grow some monsters..dont get me wrong I didnt pay 595 each either ...but I let u know how   they do .


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## Grower13

MR1 said:


> Did you watch the videos Grower13 posted, to me numbers from video two looked real high compared to what I saw in video one. Don't see much penetration with the Spider light. JMO.


 


I couldn't get past the fact they took the HPS readings at 3 ft below the light....... and when I posted the videos I didn't realize they were the ones posted on the site......... There are no simple answers with LED at this time.......... I believe they work.......... I'm waiting to see how DGF and highbrix  do before I pull the trigger on one.


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## Dr. Green Fang

Grower13 said:


> I'm waiting to see how DGF and highbrix  do before I pull the trigger on one.



So far, this is shaping up to be one of the better changes I've made in my room in the last 2 years of me doing this. The trichs are abundantly more than HPS, the terrapins are THROUGH the roof more, and my power consumption was cut almost in half (I got my electric bill for the month and it's $374... it was $600ish - $735ish every month before this) I was running 2400 watts before, and now I'm running 1400 *actual *watts, but have the "claimed output" of around 3200 watts. As for the heat thing.. yes, they are a LITTLE cooler.. with that said, I would NOT worry about these being "lack luster" for heating in the winter (THG, I'm directing this one to you specifically. They still produce significant heat IMO :aok: )  I mean, I could turn my vent speed up higher, but I'm waiting until I absolutely have to there. 

LED's really do feed your plants. I can not stress this one thing that I've learned enough!! Do not feed them normal HPS feedings, give them half that EASILY! I really like that, but wish I had learned it earlier on.. this Tent #2 I have finishing up soon is going to be good, but surely can be much improved upon, and I'm going to do just that!  

Ok.. ramble over.. I think... for now.


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## frankgrimes

these lights look very interesting i am excited to see what they can do but man they sure dont come cheap  osram diodes and a cool design these panels have potential for sure but have yet to see many grows completed with them. hope to see more in the future!


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## gottaloveplasma

Dgf surly plants don't get nutrition from light.


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## gottaloveplasma

Wow wondering what this could do with plasma light if you set the spectrum up properly.  Interesting.


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## gottaloveplasma

So if someone's getting 1gpw for hps how much equivalent led system wattage would you need to equal that.  How many units does that break down to?  So your not going to go get a 300w and beat the gavita pro.  You will need 3x them.  Now that is 4500 for a replacement for gavitas 500$ light.  Am I right here?  Hell no.  2 units 3000 $ to equal 1 gavita.  Save how much money per light In Electricity cost every month?  Guess you can throw retooling cost in for bulbs.  Seems prohibitivly expensive.


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## techrons78

gottaloveplasma said:


> So if someone's getting 1gpw for hps how much equivalent led system wattage would you need to equal that.  How many units does that break down to?  So your not going to go get a 300w and beat the gavita pro.  You will need 3x them.  Now that is 4500 for a replacement for gavitas 500$ light.  Am I right here?  Hell no.  2 units 3000 $ to equal 1 gavita.  Save how much money per light In Electricity cost every month?  Guess you can throw retooling cost in for bulbs.  Seems prohibitivly expensive.



Your shooting for high par with led..the spyder has 270x3w osram led...but only uses 333 w..more bulbs good drivers equally high par larger yield s


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## gottaloveplasma

Ok so 1200$ for 333w. And you need 2 0f those to compete with de gavita.  So 2400 or 500 its 5* expensive as best hps on market.  But you are using how much less electricity.  That id cool but not worth 5*cost.  And I cought hell for my plasma lol.  But hey,  I am actually curious, and called company.  I have enough light for 2.5x5' canopy using plasma only.  I am interested in the light bars they sell.  Problem with plasma is it has no or little reds.  What if I make up the reds with the led.  That may give me an awesome spectrum to flower under.  Also you want to increase DLI about 30% more in flower.  So maybee that is what I need in red spectrum just couple of leds.   what do you think techron, pjammers, dfg?


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## techrons78

gottaloveplasma said:


> Ok so 1200$ for 333w. And you need 2 0f those to compete with  gavita.  So 2400 or 500 its 5* expensive as best hps oscerket.  But you are using how much less electricity.  That id cool but not worth 5*cost.  And I cought hell for my plasma lol.  But hey,  I am actually curious, and called company.  I have enough light for 2.5x5' canopy using plasma only.  I am interested in the light bars they sell.  Problem with plasma is it has no or little reds.  What if I make up the reds with the led.  That may give me an awesome spectrum to flower under.  Also you want to increase DLI about 30% more in flower.  So maybee that is what I need in red spectrum just couple of leds.   what do you think techron, pjammers, dfg?



Yea ive seen a, couple induction companies adding LED to their set up...so yes I would...but as I said before we are looking for par not watt in a sense I sont personally own a spyder..I have not 2 illuminator 350  and1 magnum 357 plus 2.. ok m pushing 1075 draw in my 4x4


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## gottaloveplasma

I just talked to someone at Bml and the 600 is a veg light.  I asked if plants eat less under led and he told me opposite.  He also said DO NOT GET SPIDER unless you have 1200 ppm co2.  Then he said led rooms temp should be 80-82degrees.  Also he said you will have heavier load on dehumidifiers lights out spike.  Claims 20% more photons over hps.  For a
 5x5' room he said get a spider 1200 10" over canopy with light bars running just below Main colas.  Brings tent to about and only use 4x4 canopy.  That was his solution.  Said they penetrate better than hps.  We talked briefly about plasma and he said its not very efficient but spectrum is amazing.  Commercial grows need efficiency and max use of square footage.  The plasma is a quality at a cost of efficiency.


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## gottaloveplasma

techrons78 said:


> Yea ive seen a, couple induction companies adding LED to their set up...so yes I would...but as I said before we are looking for par not watt in a sense I sont personally own a spyder..I have not 2 illuminator 350 and1 magnum 357 plus 2.. ok m pushing 1075 draw in my 4x4


 

No, Par per watt is actually what is important.


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## techrons78

gottaloveplasma said:


> No, Par per watt is actually what is important.



It all depends id rather have more par than watts but thats just me...


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## techrons78

gottaloveplasma said:


> I just talked to someone at Bml and the 600 is a veg light.  I asked ifcolors......s eat less under led and he told me opposite.  He also said DO NOT GET SPIDER unless you have 1200 ppm co2.  Then he said led rooms temp should be 80-82degrees.  Also he said you will have heavier load on dehumidifiers lights out spike.  Claims 20% more photons over hps.  For a
> 5x5' room he said get a spider 1200 10" over canopy with light bars running just below Main colas.  Brings tent to about and only use 4x4 canopy.  That was his solution.  Said they penetrate better than hps.  We talked briefly about plasma and he said its not very efficient but spectrum is amazing.  Commercial grows need efficiency and max use of square footage.  The plasma is a quality ..
> hmmm


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## HotelCalifornia420

techrons78 said:


> Any thoughts on this...I mite purchase next 6 months or so looks like a great fixture..Osram leds built to order...36" arms 3 feet long no fan poly carbonate shell..



Did you buy the LED?  If so, how do you like it?


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## techrons78

I finally bought the spyder it's 9 days into being built  in texas. .should  have it soon been using lumigrow pro 650


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## Dr. Green Fang

Nice, grats on the Spyder. :aok:


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## Grower13

techrons78 said:


> I finally bought the spyder it's 9 days into being built in texas. .should have it soon been using lumigrow pro 650


 

nice light...... watching some grows right now with 3 of the better leds out there........ a good led can make up the extra cost in a couple of grows.


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## techrons78

Grower13 said:


> nice light...... watching some grows right now with 3 of the better leds out there........ a good led can make up the extra cost in a couple of grows.



Yes thank  you if I use the spyder and lumigrow I shul crush 7x7.... and to the poster above I guess u believe everything a salesman  tells you..they are a,start max and Grow max 600 1 for veg 1 flower...so he lied to you.


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## Grower13

techrons78 said:


> Yes thank you if I use the spyder and lumigrow I shul crush 7x7.... and to the poster above I guess u believe everything a salesman tells you..they are a,start max and Grow max 600 1 for veg 1 flower...so he lied to you.


 


there is a light made by Illumitex......... it does adjust from veg to bloom http://www.illumitex.com/.......... we are very close to LED becoming the Light of choice to flower marijuana.......     :48:


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## techrons78

Grower13 said:


> there is a light made by Illumitex......... it does adjust from veg to bloom http://www.illumitex.com/.......... we are very close to LED becoming the Light of choice to flower marijuana.......     :48:



Yes I got to solar luna controller  so I can dial down par with seedling and young plants like I can with my lumigrow here is a Lil harvest of turbo diesel 

View attachment 14480240084101770243138.jpg


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