# Leaves curling.... Too much nutrients?



## Robrob075 (Mar 18, 2010)

I have some hash plant in a dwc setup that is 3 gallons. They are about a month old and I changed the water 5 days ago and upped the nutes a little from 400 ppm to 530 ppm and I lowered the t5 light so they are about 4 inches away. They don't look like they are dying or anything but the tips of the fan leaves are pointing up and the ends of the leaves are curling down. They stil look healthy and the roots look nice and white. I'm using ro water and the ph is at about 6 but it goes up everyday. They temp is 75 most of the time and humidity around 40. Anyone know what it could be. Or could it just be rapid growth? Help would be much appretiated.


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## LEFTHAND (Mar 18, 2010)

*bring your ph down to 5.8...it can drift to 6.0 but wouldnt let it get any higher.. and bring it back to 5.8
LH*


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## Robrob075 (Mar 18, 2010)

Thanks lefthand but my ph is never stable. It goes up everyday.  Any suggestions.


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## LEFTHAND (Mar 18, 2010)

*how do you mix everything?? and when you add water/nutes do you ph that water or the res??.. i always ph the ress not top off water/nutes.
i run ebb n flow and every day to 2 days i have to adjust a lil .. not much.. 
its nice to have that lil bit of a drift.. allows the plant to uptake more or less or nutes.. as long as it isnt jumping from 5.8 to 6.5 or 7 by the next day your fine.. just need to add the ph check as a daily process..
LH*


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## Robrob075 (Mar 18, 2010)

Oh okay. Mine never goes above 6.5. I had it at 5.6 last night and when I woke up it was 6.1. But I added water too kind of dilute the water a little because I was concerned I might have too much nutes.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Mar 18, 2010)

What kind of nutes are you using and how are you mixing them?  I draw water and let it sit for 24 hours.  I then nute the water.  I use GH 3 part so, I add the micro first, and then the other 2.  This sits for another 24 hours.  If the water needs to be pH'd, I add the pH down (or up). The pH up or down is mixed with a quart of water before I dump into the res or buckets.  This sits for another 24 hours before I retest and either use it or adjust the pH again.


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## D3 (Mar 18, 2010)

Also, GH 3-part is a little lacking in mg. In some systems & grows you dont see this. In mine you do. I use an Aeroflo2. I always add a little ebsom salt each time I flush.


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## Robrob075 (Mar 18, 2010)

I'm using gh 3 part too. I let the water sit for 24 hours but I just add the water then add the nutes. I don't know what it could be. The first 3 weeks I used distilled water and I didn't seem to have such extreme fluctuations in ph. I added some water this morning to dilute the nutes a little hoping that will help. The ph was 5.6 last night and when I checked this morning it was 6.2 and it seems to go up ever day or so so I have to bring it back down. I don't know if this has anything to do with it bu I moved the light closer to the plants. It's a t5 4 bulb setup and it was about a foot away and I moved it to about 4 inches away the same day I changed out the Rez and uped the nutes.


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## D3 (Mar 18, 2010)

Salt that the plant releases can mess with your ph. You might need to flush more. What is the ppm's of your starting water?


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## Robrob075 (Mar 18, 2010)

The ppm of the starting water was 4ppm. And I added 10mm of flora gro 5mm of floramocro and 5mm of florabloom and 30mm of diamond nectar and 2 drops of super thrive in the 3 gallon Rez. It put total ppms to 530 and the next day it was up to 565. The ph goes up about .4 or .5 everyday if I do nothing. I adjust it every other day. I'll try and get some pics up later. :holysheep:


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## The Hemp Goddess (Mar 18, 2010)

Robrob075 said:
			
		

> The ppm of the starting water was 4ppm. And I added 10mm of flora gro 5mm of floramocro and 5mm of florabloom and 30mm of diamond nectar and 2 drops of super thrive in the 3 gallon Rez. It put total ppms to 530 and the next day it was up to 565. The ph goes up about .4 or .5 everyday if I do nothing. I adjust it every other day. I'll try and get some pics up later. :holysheep:



Do you mean ml rather than mm?  Where did you get these dosage recommendations? They aren't like any kind of formula I have ever seen.  Generally in vegging you will use 3 parts grow, 2 parts micro, and 1 part bloom in the GH Flora series.  I think you are a little heavy on the Diamond Nectar for 1 month old plants.  I think I would use about 1/2 what you are.  If your ppms are rising, your concentrations of nutes is too much.  Your plants are taking up more water than nutes.  Back your ppms down a bit.

When you add plain water to your res to dilute the nutes, this is almost certainly raising your pH in the res.  What is the pH of your water 24 hours after you add nutes (before you add pH up or down)?


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## Robrob075 (Mar 18, 2010)

Yeah I did mean ml oops. I actually got these measurements online and I used less then what it said to use. I got the measurements fro hydroponics dot net. I tried posting the link but I'm too new. It has you put in the size of Rez yiu are using and it calculates how much to put in. 

if you have a better way to do it I would love to know.


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## Robrob075 (Mar 19, 2010)




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## Robrob075 (Mar 19, 2010)

okay, here are some pics. they are kind of blurry because my batteries dies lol


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## D3 (Mar 19, 2010)

I never had a ph drift like that using GH 3-part. Like THG said your nutes are messed up, but I think it's a combo of things causing your problem. Only use 1/2 strength of what it says on the bottle. What is the temp of your res water? Do you have mold or algee growing in it? That would make your ph drift. Like I said before, as the plants are taking in nutes they are spitting out salts. You need to flush to get rid of them. Salt build up will cause a big ph drift. Later Man


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## panic in paradise (Mar 19, 2010)

looks more like some kind of stress.

ive had Mg trouble which caused the ends to abruptly jut up, then cause lock out. P o/d will cause the ends to point up or down, different then this IME, and new small growth will grow climbing up against the main stem, then later some nasty leaf coloring.

medium and heat stress can send the leaf tips sideways, and do all sorts of weird stuff.

i was going to say, your plant looks over watered... then i remembered this is DWC...

she may be having trouble 'breathing', hows youre Ozone?!?


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## The Hemp Goddess (Mar 19, 2010)

Robrob075 said:
			
		

> if you have a better way to do it I would love to know.



LOL--well, yeah.  I follow the *manufacturer's* recommendations that are printed on the back of the bottles.


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## oneshot (Mar 20, 2010)

Iam running the same 3gallon system as you and heres what I follow with good return..I found this on MP but cant find it now..
My plant will drink close to a gallon a day so I must add same mix of nutes to feed it with when it needs water or the ph will go crazy,mine will lower ph real fast and the PPM come down fast in this small system..I also use rain water,its great!
My two cent and hope it helps..
oneshot

So OK - feeding schedule week by week. This is the GH weekly feeding program, slightly tweaked. I will only call out the volume of each part per gallon of water in the following manner: grow, micro, bloom, ppm range. Example - 5-2.5-2.5-400/800 would mean 5 ml grow, 2.5 ml micro, 2.5 ml bloom and a ppm of 400-880. Remember it's per gallon. You Euro's can easily convert to liters. 4 liters is just a little bit over 1 gallon. It should also be noted that I use the hardwater micro due to my tapwater. I suggest using the hardwater micro in place of the regular micro if your tap water is over 200 ppm total or you have over 70 ppm Ca. RO water users should use the regular micro.

Veg 
week 1 5-2.5-2.5-400/600
week 2 10-5-3- 600/800
week 3 12-6-3 800/1000 (continue week 3 formula if additional veg time is required.)

Bloom
week 1 6-6-10- 800/1200
week 2 3-7-12 - 1000/1400
week 3 3-8-14 - 1000/1400
week 4 3-8-16 - 1000/1400
week 5 (discussed in detail below*)
week 6 0-7-20 - 1000/1400
week 7 0-6-20 (see bleow**)

* During week 5 if not using a booster like Superbud, Bushmaster Kabloom etc. run 2.5-7-18. I use MOAB (Mother of All Blooms) or BushMaster at 50% of recommended strength, and use 1.25-3.5-9 for the fert base. 

**If running an 8 week strain you should only run the ferts during week 7 for a maximum of 3-4 days. This gives you 10 days for flushing. 

The ppms work out almost exactly. I tend to lean toward the lower side of the range, unless I have a really heavy feeder that I know can handle it. 

At every ressy change out I add in 5 drops per gallon of 35% food grade H2O2. During flush use ph adjusted water at 5.5-6.0
I will add epsom salt at week 1 of bloom if the plants are heavy feeders AND I see signs of an Mg def. Otherwise I won't use it. The only time I have ever had Mg def is during transition. The GH 3 part is a little low on Mg, but the PBP and Canna nutes are way lower. 

Now- how to control your PH...
There are a couple factors that cause your PH to drift. The most common is running the nute solution too strong or too weak. If it's too strong, your PH drops. If it's too weak the PH rises. You have to find the balance point. If you find that the formula above is say, a little strong, and say you have a 20 gallon ressy, mix the nutes for 18 gallons. If it's a little weak, mix it for 22 gallons. You follow?
The other common mistake is mixing your nutrient solution and trying to adjust the PH right away. You have to allow time for the ph buffers in the nutrient solution to do their job. Mix the nutes up, and bubble or circulate for 12 hours before even looking at your PH. You will find the PH to be almost right on target.
I use little or no ph adjusters. (Except during flush). I use tap water, with a starting PPM of 300-400 and a starting PH of 7.4-9.0 (Thats crazy you say! The water is too hard, you will never get stable PH and you will have too much Ca, causing a lockout of Mg!) Bollocks I say.
Every week, on Friday I drain the ressy and fill with plain water. I let that run overnight giving the plants a little flush. This also allows the chlorine and ammonia to evap. On Saturday morning, I mix the nutes into the ressy. I DO NOT adjust ph at this time. Let that run as is overnight. On Sunday morning, I check ph and adjust if needed. Usually don't have to. 
Doing things this way has saved me from constant PH drifts, and using about 150 ml of ph down every ressy change, and a little here and there throughout the week to keep it in the desired range. Now, the most I ever have to use is about 30 ml.if any at all. (I have a 35 gallon ressy btw) My Ph stays at a constant 5.5-5.8. 
__________________


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