# Ultimate lighting set up?



## Newbud (Apr 24, 2009)

Hello again 

Found some info little while back about using 4k for cuttings, 6.4k through most of veg, 4k for last week of veg, 3k for most of flowering and 10k for final week.

Was wondering how many of you do this or what anybody considers to be the ultimate lighting set up is.

I would consider purchasing said bulbs if there is a definite advantage.

I will be setting up a new room in next few months so would like to do it proper, plus i just thought it may be interesting to see what people would use in an ideal situation.

Any info regarding different bulbs or where to purchase is also welcome.

Keep em green people


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## White WidowMaker (Apr 24, 2009)

Nothing like the sun...

...but if you are indoors, I think a mixture of MH and HPS together at the same time.  Maybe some Flouros also if you can fit them in without blocking the MH & HPS.


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## BuddyLuv (Apr 25, 2009)

when I think ultimate, I think closed loop freon cooling bulbs:hubba:


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## Newbud (Apr 25, 2009)

Explain i'm dumb


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## BuddyLuv (Apr 25, 2009)

self contained freon cooling bulbs, freon is what juices your freezer.


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## Newbud (Apr 25, 2009)

not getting nothin on google i'll look when not so stoned, cheers.


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## BuddyLuv (Apr 25, 2009)

Newbud said:
			
		

> not getting nothin on google i'll look when not so stoned, cheers.


 
here is what you do... find a delorean, build a flux capacitor, and convert it into a time machine. Set your date on meter into the future, get her up to 85 MPH and bammmm, you can't miss em, they even sell them in gas stations.


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## Newbud (Apr 25, 2009)

Cheers for that, i already got the flux capacitor i been trying to retro fit it to an Audi its faster than a Delorean.

Shouldn't take long, back in a min


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## crozar (Apr 25, 2009)

im going to post some pictures about my new customized lights , 

right now im using this which isnt that good because the lights are ontop of each other , 
the customized light will be done tonight , it will be a board with 8 cfl's beside each other so i can put them closer to the plants unlike this one. however the good advantage of this circle reflector is i can exhaust all the hotair out quicker from the big hole on the top.


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## zipflip (Apr 25, 2009)

BuddyLuv said:
			
		

> self contained freon cooling bulbs, freon is what juices your freezer.


 this got me thinkin bout my mini fridge i got. its one them mini scale fridges that comes wit a cig lighter plug and wall plug. like for office or sumthin. i was thinkin of findin a way to rig it like an AC of sorts in like say my small grow space. and when ya talkin these cool tubes an freon... im wonderin if it'd be possible to rig up one them standard cool tubes and mount the cooling element from that fridge somehow wit a fan blowin or sucking the expelled cool air from the element in thru the cool tube...
  im always tryin to come up with ideas for new things or ways to improve existing things etc but hardly can i afford to go buyin all the materials to be experimenting so maybe.
  so just a lil  idear for some you gadgeteer's out there who have the time and money on your hands or just might happen to have a cool tube already and one these mini fridges or even one them coolers u plug in to ya cig lighter in car.
  i dont know exactly how much heat an HPS really puts off. and i know that them lil fridges put off a lil heat but im assuming no where near as much heat it would be eliminating..??


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## BuddyLuv (Apr 25, 2009)

I say go for it. We will not know if it works unless someone does it.


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## Newbud (Apr 25, 2009)

Well crozar i gota say that although its not what i'd call an ultimate set up i must say at first glance i really like the light set up in the pics, pretty handy for someone into the DIY CFL game.

Zipflip, you got me curious man.
Off the bat i'm not too sure but i'll do a little digging sounds intriguing


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## Super Silver Haze (Apr 25, 2009)

zip, if you put that mini fridge in your room then the heat it puts off would offset any cooling effect.  

i have a cooling shirt used by race car drivers to keep them cool.  it uses a freeon can and it has quick connect connections so the coolant goes through tubes inter-twined into the shirt like radiant floor heating.  i use the shirt when i work out b/c i dont sweat, it keeps me from overheating.  

Cool Shirt   hxxp://www.coolshirt.net

they sell the connectors, tubes etc..

SSH


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## The Hemp Goddess (Apr 25, 2009)

Newbud said:
			
		

> Hello again
> 
> Found some info little while back about using 4k for cuttings, 6.4k through most of veg, 4k for last week of veg, 3k for most of flowering and 10k for final week.
> 
> ...



Where did this info come from?  I always have to look at the source before I give anything credence.  In all my years of growing, I have never read this anywhere...


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## Newbud (Apr 25, 2009)

Posted it a while ago in a thread called 4k to 10k or something like that lol.
I'll look for the thread.
Strange you should say that, i read a thread on here other day where someone mentioned using 10k for last week i'll try find that too 

It was originaly brought to my attention in one of the cannabis magazines i forget which one now, then i followed it up on computer


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## Newbud (Apr 25, 2009)

They are sunpulse lamps if you wanna do a little digging.

This pretty cool site, has the sun pulse lights and spinners and other stuff hxxp://www.lifelighttec.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1
Here a website with a chart and a little info on em hxxp://sunpulseusa.com/ and heres a little bit here from a guy i came across else where,,,


Okay,
The science behind Sunpulse lamps has been discussed in previous threads and I thought I'd give them a try. I sprung for the whole line of Bulbs, (3K, 4K, 6.4K & 10K ), and I'm running cuts that I've been running so I know what to expect from the plants.

I normally Veg with T5 flouro's and then put them in flower with HPS, this time I took my plants that vegged for about 3 weeks under T5's then I transplanted them into 7gal smart pots, put them in the flower room and used the 4k Sunpulse for 7 days then switched to 6.4K Sunpulse for 5 days the back to 4K for 5 days then the 3K for flowering. Currently I'm 15 days into flower and things are looking real good. The plants didn't stretch as much as they would have with the HPS and I was concerned about that so I vegged them an extra week under the Sunpulse lamps.

The plants are lush and green and progressing nicely, I think the addition of some UV spectrum has real positive benefits.

I'll update as much as possible.

Peace...


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## Newbud (Apr 25, 2009)

And here is something else i found. 



> I thought you might be interested to hear this info on Sunpulse. They've been working on these since 1999!
> 
> These are nothing to do with "Sun Master" - these bulbs are totally new - they have been engineered right from square one, designed for horticulture - not a re-packaged street-lamp!
> 
> ...


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## The Hemp Goddess (Apr 25, 2009)

The source for this???????????


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## crozar (Apr 26, 2009)

hmm you gave me an idea 
i will veg my plants with my CFLS for 2 days , and 1 day with a special UV spectrum light , i found it ill get the name of it and its power , but they are not very strong.


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## Super Silver Haze (Apr 26, 2009)

Newbud, thanks for the info.  you starting a journal for this?  

i want to see the Frostyness!

SSH


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## Newbud (Apr 26, 2009)

The Hemp Goddess said:
			
		

> The source for this???????????


 
:confused2:  could you be a little more specific?
I already said i originally seen it in a cannabis mag, have provided some websites for info on the lights, mentioned my original posts and said some of the posts above are ones i've stumbled across while trying to find out about the lights  
:evil:


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## astrobud (Apr 26, 2009)

BuddyLuv said:
			
		

> here is what you do... find a delorean, build a flux capacitor, and convert it into a time machine. Set your date on meter into the future, get her up to 85 MPH and bammmm, you can't miss em, they even sell them in gas stations.


 
you crack me up buddy:48:


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## Newbud (Apr 26, 2009)

Got to say i'm a little surprised, even if no-one knows of or wants to use the sunpulse lights i'd of thought you guys would have had a little more to say on what would be your ultimate set up.
Or are you guys keeping the tricks of your trade to yourself lol 

How about this then guys,,, As i use duel spec bulbs for both flower and veg do you guys see any advantage in me switching to a hps with a closer spectrum to 2700k for flower??????

:evil:


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## BuddyLuv (Apr 26, 2009)

I break crap too much as it is. If I had to switch bulbs out that much I would run out of money after the second grow.


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## Newbud (Apr 26, 2009)

:laugh: yeah i can be a bit heavy handed too


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## donkey942 (Apr 27, 2009)

Well NB for me in my grow room I would have gone with 4 x 400w lights instead because the more lights you have the better the penetration will be, being as I dont rightly remeber what size your room is all I can say is the ultimate room would have multiple light verses having a couple big lights better coverage over the room with more light. Ill be going with my 1000w into a mother closet and ordering 3 more 400w lights for my room that I have now and 2 400w MH for a veg room. This would be my ultimate light setup.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Apr 27, 2009)

LOL--no, there are no tricks of the trade we are keeping secret.  To me, it just seems like kind of a PITA to be changing the bulbs like that every week or so and I have a hard time believing that it would justify the time and expense.  IMO, you would be better off just adding more lumens.  I have a very large reflector that has a glass shield.  It almost takes 2 people to remove the glass and change the bulb.  I'm kind of klutzy too.


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## crozar (Apr 27, 2009)

Hey all , here is my customized 10CFL board , i can make the wholes narrower if i put an aluminumfoil ontop of it , but right now this reflector isnt that good this metal is made of aluminum quality, i might use foil inside to have better reflection .


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## Newbud (Apr 27, 2009)

Finally some replies lol.
Donkey yeah get what you mean bout spreading light out, i do that now, i got 2 600's in a 4ft by 4.5ft area, been told that one would cover that area but i didnt think so myself even with an open wide angle hood.

THG i'm already beating the sun for lumens so i'm all good there i just expected more people to be running liquid cooled, multiple spectrum blah blah blah and stuff i never heard of.

Crozar not bad man, once you get the reflective hood sorted it should be quite good that.

Guess i'll have to be a little more self creative with my next room then lol.

Another question then...
                                 Who runs what spectrum hps bulbs in flower????

I'm running duel specs 600's. I think they 4000k but i'm open to correction.
One 600 in veg room and two 600's in flower


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## donkey942 (Apr 27, 2009)

wow high electric bills huh? I cant say much Im running the 1000w along with 2 gaming computers in the house both of those have 1250w power sources. Im expecting a horrible bill this month and Im adding a 400w into my grow room as soon as HTG supply finds out why I dont have it yet.


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## Newbud (Apr 27, 2009)

Well i havent been slapped yet so guessing bill not that bad to be fair.
We got a pretty big house and since starting growing i been more conscious of not leaving unnecessary lights on etc so i have probably offset some of the bill.

I think simply because of the money side i will go to flouro's/CFL's for my next mother and cutting room so not to impact on the bill any further as i want a nursery/mother room, veg room and duel stage flower rooms.


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## Waspfire (May 5, 2009)

"THG i'm already beating the sun for lumens so i'm all good there i just expected more people to be running liquid cooled, multiple spectrum blah blah blah and stuff i never heard of."

so 2 600w hps puts out light then the sun?If so didnt know that


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Simple maths fella.
Sunlight ( aparently ) puts out 10 000 L per sq ft, my set up putting out 10 555.5555554


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## meds4me (May 6, 2009)

interesting, I'm running 2 600 hps in a 5'x8' room and was wondering what else could be done w/o changing bulbs aall the damn time. Good thread !


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

It could be a good thread lol.

I thought more people would be doing different things.

Soon as i got the cash i gona get all the diferent spectrums and see for myself.


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## Waspfire (May 6, 2009)

Newbud said:
			
		

> Simple maths fella.
> Sunlight ( aparently ) puts out 10 000 L per sq ft, my set up putting out 10 555.5555554


 
wasnt trying to be rude newbud i thought that the sun put out 10,000 Foot candles a sq ft on a sunny day and like 1000-5000 on cloudy over cast day didnt know it was lumens i have looked but could never find a answer always conflicting ones.Thaks for clearing that up for me


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Dont take my word for it i just repeating what i have come across 
I just took what i read for granted, i'll look into it and try clear up any questions


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Damn i good lol.
Sorted it mate here goes,,,



> SO HOW DOES MY LIGHT COMPARE TO THE SUN?
> Well, direct outside daylight in the summertime averages somewhere in the neighbourhood of 10,000 foot candles. This is equal to 10,000 lumens per square foot. If you compare this to the output of our thousand watt metal halide bulb earlier, we can see that the sun does a pretty good job.
> 
> However, the sun is subject to annoying little changes in weather that our artificial lighting is not. On an overcast day, the amount of lumens that the sun produces drops to about 1,000. If you were standing under a large, tall tree, the amount of light falling on your head is referred to as open shade. Open shade produces about 300 foot candles. In the deep shade, you would be experiencing around 50 to 100 foot candles, and under the light of a full moon you would be subjected to .02 foot candles.
> ...


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Well it seems apropreate to post this here so here goes 


As I mentioned earlier, the most important tasks facing the indoor gardener are copying and improving upon nature. Okay, now that you are a god, you have to make a sun. Poof! Are you done yet? Probably not.


TERMINOLOGY
There are four basic terms that are used to describe light and how it affects your plants. These terms are Lumen, Foot-Candle, Watt, and Lumens per Watt.

The term "Lumen" is the basic unit of light. If light were tangible and you could somehow grab it in your hands, the amount of light that you would be holding would be described as lumens. If you took that handful of light and stuffed it into a sandwich bag, or let it loose in a dark room, the amount of lumens would be the same. Lumens do not decrease or increase as that light you were holding condenses into a smaller space, or expands to fill a room. For that particular amount of light, regardless of the space it is filling, the amount of lumens remains constant.

The term "Foot Candle" measures the amount of light intensity, or how much light you manage to shine on a given area. The foot-candle is based on how many lumens of light you distribute on a given area, which are measured in square feet. To illustrate this, if you shone one lumen of light on one square foot of space, you have achieved one-foot candle of light. You can use this formula to measure the foot candle output of any bulb. What if you were operating a 1000 watt Metal Halide bulb over a garden which measured five feet by five feet? Well, first you need to find out the amount of lumens that your bulb produces. The packaging that your bulb came in should inform you of this. A 1000 watt metal halide bulb produces 120,000 limens. The next step you need to perform is to find out the square footage of your area. The area we are using for this example is five feet by five feet, so we know that our square footage is 25' (Length (5') x width (5') = square footage (25 square feet)). Now we have to divide the amount of lumens (120,000) by the amount of square feet (25). Doing this, we come up with 4,800 foot candles. The amount of light intensity or foot candles that you produce is the most important measurement of light to a hydroponic gardener because it tells you how much light is available for your plants to "drink". 

The "Watt" is probably a term that you are already familiar with. It is a common term used to measure the amount of energy a bulb requires electrically.

"Lumens per Watt" is another term, like the Watt, which is applied strictly to artificial lighting, whereas Lumen and Foot Candle can also be applied to natural light. This term refers to how many lumens of light that a bulb can produce per watt of electrical usage. The higher the ratio, the more efficient and economical your lighting system will be. Ideally, you would like to create the desired amount of lumens with the lowest wattage cost possible.


SO HOW DOES MY LIGHT COMPARE TO THE SUN?
Well, direct outside daylight in the summertime averages somewhere in the neighbourhood of 10,000 foot candles. This is equal to 10,000 lumens per square foot. If you compare this to the output of our thousand watt metal halide bulb earlier, we can see that the sun does a pretty good job.

However, the sun is subject to annoying little changes in weather that our artificial lighting is not. On an overcast day, the amount of lumens that the sun produces drops to about 1,000. If you were standing under a large, tall tree, the amount of light falling on your head is referred to as open shade. Open shade produces about 300 foot candles. In the deep shade, you would be experiencing around 50 to 100 foot candles, and under the light of a full moon you would be subjected to .02 foot candles. 

So, artificial light is not subject to the interruption of inclement weather, and we can run our light for the optimum period of 12 to 18 hours per day on our plants, whereas the sun only produces six or seven hours of useable light.


WHAT LIGHT SHOULD I USE FOR MY PLANTS?
There are quite a few choices of lighting for the hydroponic gardener. However, not all lights are acceptable, even though by looking at them you might think that they are bright enough.

Following is a list of different bulbs that are suitable and unsuitable for use in your hydroponic garden.


INCANDESCENT BULBS
A regular household incandescent bulb is not very efficient. It only produced somewhere in the range of four lumens per watt. This means that if you were using a 100 watt incandescent bulb, you would only be producing 400 lumens. So, if we could reflect all of the light into a one square foot area, we would have achieved 400 foot candles. However, for this example, and all of those to follow, we will assume that we are only reflecting 75% of the light that our bulbs are producing. Even with reflective material and reflectors, some light is going to be "spilled" where it is not needed. So, our 100 watt incandescent bulb is only shining 300 foot candles on our one square foot area (400 foot candles multiplied by 75% = 300 F.C. (Foot Candles)). 

Earlier we figured out that the sun produces 10,000 F.C. on a perfect day, whereas a single 100 watt incandescent bulb produces 300. If we hung that 100 watt bulb over the five feet by five feet garden we used in one of our earlier examples, we would see that that garden is receiving only 12 F.C. (300 foot candles divided by 25 square feet = 12 foot candles). If we were shooting for 1,000 foor candles for our garden, we would need to install 83-100 watt bulbs. Outside of the fact that your hydro bill will be higher than that of the Griswald's around Christmas time, you just turned your grow room into an oven. Because of this, incandescent bulbs are really unsatisfactory for hydroponics.


QUARTZ HALOGEN BULBS
Halogens are much more efficient than incandescent bulbs. They weigh in at about 20 lumens per watt. Halogens are available in a 1,000 watt bulb, and since we are trying to produce as much light as possible, we will use this for our example. A 1,000 watt halogen bulb, at 20 lumens per watt, will give us a total of 20,000 lumens of total light energy. As we did with our last example, we will multiply this number by 75% to adjust for out "spilled" light. Therefore, our 1,000 watt halogen bulb is producing 15,000 useable lumens. Our sample garden that we have used before measures five feet by five feet, giving us 25 square feet. When we shine 15,000 lumens on our 25 square foot area, we end up producing 600 F.C., or foot candles of light intensity. This is getting us closer to a useable light source, but it is still barely adequate. Also, a major drawback of the halogen bulb is that it produces a large amount of HEAT! This heat would cause foliar burn, and would be a welcome invitation for infestations. Because of this, we can conclude that halogen bulbs are also inadequate...leave them in your fog lamps where they belong.


FLUORESCENT
Fluorescent bulbs come in varying wattages, and spectrums. Ultimately, you would like to use the highest output, fullest-spectrum bulbs that you can find. When a plant is growing, it not only requires enough light, but that light should be rich in both ends of the light spectrum. There are two definitive stages in a plant's growth and they are the vegetative and flowering stages. The initial stage is vegetative. This is where the plant performs most of its vertical growth, and strengthens the main stalk. The flowering stage takes over as the plant begins to get "busy" and starts to produce its flowers. When a plant is in its vegetative state, it focuses its thirst mainly on the blue-violet end of the spectrum. When it is flowering it focuses on the red-orange end. Ultimately, you would want to incorporate a 40 watt full-spectrum tube. This would provide you with the greatest results.

These tubes produce 68 lumens per watt, for a total of 2750 lumens. Fluorescents are ideal for initial propagation because they produce almost no reciprocal heat. You can hang a four tube fixture six to eight inches above your plant canopy, and then just keep raising it as your plants grow, without fear of burning your leaves. In this example, we will scale down the size of our test garden. Earlier, we have been using a five feet by five feet garden as a reference point. For this example, we wil use a two feet by four feet garden. A two feet by four feet fixture can hold four bulbs. This will give us a total of 11,000 lumens (4 bulbs multiplied by 2750 individual lumens = 11,000 lumens). Allowing for "spilled" light, we are probably generating about 1031.25 F.C. (11,000 lumens multiplied by 75% = 8250 lumens...8250 lumens divided by eight square feet = 1031.25 Foot Candles). This is assuming that the lights are placed DIRECTLY over your plants. As you raise your lighting, your light intensity drastically drops. When you double the distance between your light and your plants, you cut the light intensity by four times.


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

As I mentioned earlier, fluorescents are ideal for initial propagation. They provide a good supply of full spectrum light for your seedlings or cuttings, without fear of burning them when they are at this fragile stage. A two feet by four feet area can support up to 400 plants. Because of this, even though fluorescents are adequate for the full life-cycle of a plant, most indoor gardeners use them as an initial propagation area, then move the plants to another area as they begin to mature. 


METAL HALIDE
Metal Halide Lamps are the most widely used hydroponic bulbs. They carry an efficiency range of 80-120 lumens per watt, depending on the bulb. Although the initial cost of a metal halide bulb is quite high, they are two to 20 times more efficient than any of the earlier listed bulbs because of the amount of lumens they produce per watt. 

Some companies even produce super high output 1,000 watt metal halide bulbs that produce anywhere from 10 to 15% more total lumens, without costing you any more on your electrical bill. 

The metal halix output is very economical, when compared to their output and the light they produce is far superior to any of the other bulbs we have looked at so far. They also have a very long lifetime. A 1,000 watt bulb will last for about 12,000 hours, whereas a 400 watt bulb will last for about 20,000 hours. 

As for the cost of operating a metal halide bulb, you can find that out by contacting you local electrical company. 

A "kilowatt hour" is a measurement used for the consumption of electrical energy. It refers to the cost of running 1,000 watts of electricity for one hour. Take the total wattage of the bulb or bulbs that you are using (example: 400 watts) and divide that number by 1,000 (400 divided by 1,000 = .4). Multiply this number by what your electrical company is charging you per kilowatt hour ( .4 multiplied by 5.7 cents = 2.28 cents). So, a 400 watt bulb will cost you 2.28 cents an hour to run. Plants thrive with the infusion of between 12 to 18 hours of light per day. So, if you were running a 400 watt bulb for 18 hours per day, that would cost 41 cents per day to run. Taken further, the consumption of your 400 watt bulb would be $12.30 per month. There, you've built your artificial sun and it really isn't costing you an arm and a leg to run! 


SODIUM VAPOR
High Pressure Sodium lamps are even more efficient than Metal Halide lamps. They produce somewhere between 90 to 150 lumens per watt, depending on the size of the bulb. The only drawback to a sodium vapor bulb is that the spectrum is shifted severely towards the red-orange end of the spectrum. The most ideal use of a high pressure sodium is to either replace, or ultimately, accompany your metal halide bulb once your plants reach their flowering stage. There have recently, however, been some amazing advances with sodium vapor bulbs. One such advancement is the Son Agro bulb.

The Son Agro bulb has been designed to utilize 30% more of the blue-violet end of the spectrum than traditional high pressure sodium bulbs. Also, the light that they produce is much more economical because their output is 430 watts of light, while running off a 400 watt ballast (transformer). This is actually like getting 30 watts of free light...thank you, Son Agro!

There is also a hybrid bulb that is produced by Eye Sunlux. Every bulb that you use in your indoor garden requires its own ballast, and a normal high pressure sodium bulb that will not work in conjunction with a metal halied ballast, and vice versa. However, the Eye Sunlux bulb is a specially designed high pressure sodium bulb that Will work when plugged into a metal halide ballast. This saves you the expense of buying a new ballast for your lighting when your plants reach their flowering stage. These conversion bulbs, however, do lose a portion of their output. They are available in 3760 watt and 940 watt sizes, which plug into 400 watt and 1,000 watt metal halide ballasts respectively.

Please keep in mind that the light that the standard sodium bulbs produce is severely limited to the red-orange end of the spectrum. It is mostly used for your plant's flowering stage.


IS THERE ANY WAY I CAN MAKE MY LIGHTS EVEN MORE EFFICIENT?
The answer is yes! Throughout this chapter I have mentioned "spilled" light. This term refers to the amount of light that is generated, but not focused on the growing area. As light travels, it funnels out from its source. If you could draw an outline around the light generated from any bulb, the resulting diagram would look like a cone. The best way of directing the light that is traveling out of your growing area is to use something with a reflective surface that will "bounce" it back to where it is needed.

There are many things that you can do to clean up your "spilled light". If your garden is completely contained by surrounding walls, painting those walls with a flat, white paint will reflect your light. If your garden is only taking up part of a room, hanging sheets of material with a reflective surface can accomplish the same effect.

A special two-sided poly, with one side black and the other white is one option. The white side faces your plants to reflect your light while the black side faces out to make sure that no light escapes. Mylar is another option. It reflects light with up to 95% efficiency, but is brittle, easy to tear and hard to clean. Aluma-Glo is like Mylar, but is veined with a re-enforced mesh so that it is much stronger and easier to maintain. Aluma-Glo reflects with about 94% efficiency. The king of reflective materials is a product called Foylon. It strongly resembles Aluma-Glo, but reflects light with an amazing 97% efficiency! This will take care of redirecting the light that is funneling downward from your bulb, and a reflector, or hood, will redirect the light that travels upward.

Reflectors or hoods, come in many sizes and configurations. Two of the most common are a "flat-cone" and a "parabolic" reflector. The standard size for these reflectors are two feet and four feet, with the 2 foot model being suitable for a 400 watt bulb, and a four foot being suitable for a 1,000 watt bulb. Of these, the parabolic is the most efficient because besides just the upward traveling light from your bulb, the angles of the reflector actively bounce the light where it is most needed.

There are also some new self-contained hoods that are air-cooled. Any bulb produces head as a by-product as it is producing light. These hoods are attached to a blower via air hose, so that fresh air is rushed through the hood thus cooing the bulb and dissipating any reciprocal heat that could be harmful to your plants.

Another way of improving the efficiency, and even the range of your lighting, is to install a light mover. One of the most popular methods is to use a Light Rail .

A Light Rail is powered by a small motor that continuously travels over a straight six feet track, and kept in motion by small, rubber wheels. The obvious advantage of using a light track is that it basically doubles the area that your light can affect. It also ensures that all of the plants in your garden receive the same amount of light from all angles, so that their growth will be uniform. As I mentioned earlier, light funnels as it travels towards your plants, and the distance that it travels is greater reaching the plants at the end of your garden than it is reaching the plants directly below your bulb. Because of this, the plants directly below your bulb will grow at a more accelerated rate than those at the edges of your garden. A light rail alleviates this problem.

The standard light rail is 6' in length, but you can buy extenders that can increase the range of your light as long as your garden demands!

That should hopefully answer most of your questions concerning lighting for your indoor garden.


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## crozar (May 6, 2009)

i have read that Newbud thanks for reminding us with the great info ,

btw i did a newer customized CFL's , its exactly like the board i made in my recent pictures however its with 16 CLS  rather then 10  , ill post pictures soon, 

i have a 600watts HPS on my big plants , im getting heat problems i might switch to CFL in my last weeks. or increase the height of my HPS right now its on 28" abbove plants.


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## Callawave (May 6, 2009)

This is all very confusing to a new grower. After some reading I decided on a 200 watt Maxibright 6400k blue spectrum for seedlings and rooting clones.
Then a 600 watt Sunmaster duel spectrum 90,000 lumens for veg and flower.
I dont know anything about the pros and cons of different manufacturers bulbs, but Id like an opinion on whether Ive made a reasonable choice?


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## Callawave (May 6, 2009)

Sorry. I'll be using four square feet of growspace


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

I'd say a very good choice.
I too use duel spec bulbs and i no complaints.
As for the 6400k for rooting and seedlings thats perfect mate.

I clone, root and veg under the 600 duels so no need for your 200 ( dont listen to critics saying 600 too powerful it just not true, or not in my own experiences anyway ) although if you running a seperate veg and clone room it spot on.

Whats confusing you pal maybe i could help or point you in right direction


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Callawave said:
			
		

> Sorry. I'll be using four square feet of growspace


 
2ftx2ft?

90000/ 4 sq ft is like 22500L pr sq ft thats intense lol


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## Waspfire (May 6, 2009)

Callawave said:
			
		

> Sorry. I'll be using four square feet of growspace


 
great choice on lights but in a space that big ur going ot need lots of ventilation IMO for the 600hps(90,000) 4sq ft= 22,500 lumens per sq ft
if u can keep the temps where they need to be u will have plenty of light


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Lol great minds think alike mate 
Good point on ventilation man, be needing some good cooling for that, i'd invest in a cool hood and BIG fan for sure


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## Callawave (May 6, 2009)

Newbud said:
			
		

> Whats confusing you pal maybe i could help or point you in right direction


Thanks Newbud. Frankly, to much reading I think.
Ive got a friend who says keep it simple. lol as grows progress youll learn to increase your yields. Thats what its all about.
Be nice to start with maximum yield possible though :hubba:


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## Callawave (May 6, 2009)

Waspfire said:
			
		

> great choice on lights but in a space that big ur going ot need lots of ventilation IMO for the 600hps(90,000) 4sq ft= 22,500 lumens per sq ft
> if u can keep the temps where they need to be u will have plenty of light



My extractor is a Prima Klima 125mm: 2 Speed
Speed1- 230mtr3 per hr
Speed2 - 360mtr3 per hr 
Hope that will do it?
When I said four square feet, that's not quite right. I have six and a half feet of headroom.


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Callawave said:
			
		

> When I said four square feet, that's not quite right. I have six and a half feet of headroom.


 
I might be way off, i'm smashed lol, but you might be confusing area with volume as i first did.

If you talking Lumens per area then really you just need the width and length of your area not the height to calculate the Lumens per sq ft *BUT *if your factoring in light dissipation over a certain distance from your canopy then all well and good.

I'm going lol too stoned for this level of conversation lol


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## Callawave (May 6, 2009)

Newbud said:
			
		

> I might be way off, i'm smashed lol, but you might be confusing area with volume as i first did.


Sorry Newbud, I meant regarding extraction. Four square feet would heat up more than 4'x4'x6'6". If you get my drift. Hoping my extractor's man enough now  
I should have started my own thread instead of taking over yours


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## Newbud (May 6, 2009)

Its all good mate i welcome any input.
Anything that gets put here may be helpful to someone reading it which is more important to me 

That is a small space but believe it or not i dont need to much to control temps in my veg room which is about 3.5x4ft with a open 600.
I have no fan but i am able to leave the front open all time lights on and a breeze gets in of a large floor fan i have cooling the larger room that my grows are in 
I take it you not got air cooled hoods then?
Cool air from outside would be best to vent into your room if poss or air con i guess.
As for extraction i think ideally you want a fan powerful enough to exchange air couple of times a minute.


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## umbra (May 6, 2009)

Your perspective on indoor vs outdoor light is interesting. There are some issues you did not mention. Like uv and ir spectrums. But mostly about the inverse square law. Light will decrease its intensity based on distance. As the distance increase by 2, the intensity decreases by the 2 squared (4). How does this apply to your discussion. Well if you take a plant and move your light 4 ft away, the intensity will decrease by 16. (4 squared). But the distance light travels from the sun, an additional 4 ft is such a small amount of distance, compared to the total distance that the light has traveled from the sun, that there is little difference in intensity from the top of the plant and the bottom of the plant. This is not true with indoor lights.

Moreover, the intensity of the sun changes by latitude and time of year, so to say that the sun equals 10,000 lumens/ft is not at all correct. It may be 10,000 at some place at some time, but that is all.


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## Callawave (May 6, 2009)

Newbud said:
			
		

> As for extraction i think ideally you want a fan powerful enough to exchange air couple of times a minute.


Twice a minute? :holysheep:  Think I need a lot more extraction.
How do you calculate that? JESUS! Twice a minute  That'll suck the walls in :rofl:


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## umbra (May 6, 2009)

Oh and I forgot, the output of the bulb that the manufacturer states is the initial start up output. It drops to 90% to 80% within the first 5 minutes. Within 2 years output intensity is 60% or less.


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## Newbud (May 7, 2009)

> Moreover, the intensity of the sun changes by latitude and time of year, so to say that the sun equals 10,000 lumens/ft is not at all correct. It may be 10,000 at some place at some time, but that is all.



This has actually being mentioned but cheers 



> There are some issues you did not mention. Like uv and ir spectrums.



Different spectrums and there effects were kind of the whole reason for this post so any info you got regarding em is more than welcome if you wanna share.



> As the distance increase by 2, the intensity decreases by the 2 squared (4). How does this apply to your discussion. Well if you take a plant and move your light 4 ft away, the intensity will decrease by 16. (4 squared). But the distance light travels from the sun, an additional 4 ft is such a small amount of distance, compared to the total distance that the light has traveled from the sun, that there is little difference in intensity from the top of the plant and the bottom of the plant.



Glad you brought that up, i thought we'd mentioned it but it i was talking about it in pm's with Waspfire lol


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## Waspfire (May 7, 2009)

umbra said:
			
		

> Your perspective on indoor vs outdoor light is interesting. There are some issues you did not mention. Like uv and ir spectrums. But mostly about the inverse square law. Light will decrease its intensity based on distance. As the distance increase by 2, the intensity decreases by the 2 squared (4). How does this apply to your discussion. Well if you take a plant and move your light 4 ft away, the intensity will decrease by 16. (4 squared). But the distance light travels from the sun, an additional 4 ft is such a small amount of distance, compared to the total distance that the light has traveled from the sun, that there is little difference in intensity from the top of the plant and the bottom of the plant. This is not true with indoor lights.
> 
> Moreover, the intensity of the sun changes by latitude and time of year, so to say that the sun equals 10,000 lumens/ft is not at all correct. It may be 10,000 at some place at some time, but that is all.


 
:goodposting:  

yep same thing i was trying to say but umbra put it better then i could have


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