# Why is...(this world of ours)



## OGKushman (Mar 29, 2011)

...Mercury found in fish? 

A: because Humans put it there. Burning Coal for energy.

Does anyone know that coal burning:
-clear cuts forests
-removes mountain tops, and topsoil 
-destroys natural resources like rivers and lakes
-creates deadly, cancerous, arsenic infested ash slurries IN what was once a lake/stream.
-sometimes the slurry dams fail
- disasters in the US are kept out of US news 

hXXp://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2009/aug/21/tva-spill-prevention-cleanup-hits-3-billion/?local

I recently graduated with an environmental science degree. I had 30+ classes in this field...I was never told about coal ash spills and the environmental hazards of the slurry ponds IN OUR BACKYARD. 

I remember the arsenic pond that spilled red deadly poison over an eastern European town...i was taught about the mercury in North American Mined Coal and how it is released into high altitudes to fall back to earth in the artic fish breeding grounds. But I wasn't told that most of it came from the good ol US...


I feel like someones been lying to me...


What about you? What's your concern today? Are you worried about some random nuclear reactor leaking Plutonium or Cesium? Or maybe your worried about Atomic war in the middle east? Gas Prices???? 


Let me hear you!


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## Dr.Autoflower (Mar 29, 2011)

about the nuke war thing. They have been shooting depleted Uranium tiped missels for a while for a while now. cancer and birth defects are sky rocketing.... Havent you heard accourding to Ann Coulter raditon is good for you and is fine for soldiers to test and use on the battle feild.


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## PencilHead (Mar 29, 2011)

I keep hearing a lot of noise and whinning but no solutions.  Anybody got one?


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## EDGY (Mar 29, 2011)

Yup, but NOBODY wants to hear it.

Take all the major problems that face the human race or, indeed, the planet today.
Polluted oceans, polluted air, global warming, deforestation, species extinction, energy and food shortages- ect.... (You get the point)
All of these problems are caused by overpopulation. Through technology, we have been able to feed many more people than the earth could otherwise support. 
We are at the top of the food chain. We have no natural predators to thin our herd. In the past, wars, plague, famine, ect. have served this function.
Think of the hundreds of millions of people that died in wars just in the last 100 years.
Now think of their children, grandchildren and great grandchildren that were never born.

So the ultimate solution has to be less people. The obvious and civilized answer has to be through birth control - globally. How about each couple has only one child. It's harsh I know, but if we don't limit the population, war, famine and plague will surely come and will certainly be less humane.
We can choose our poison, but the longer we wait the more the planet will suffer.

Earth First!!!    we'll screw up the other planets later....


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## ozzydiodude (Mar 29, 2011)

It just the price we have to pay to live in the style we all have come to know. Without coal we would still be in the dark. It's a dirty nasty thing but it has made our world what it is today.


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## kaotik (Mar 29, 2011)

PencilHead said:
			
		

> I keep hearing a lot of noise and whinning but no solutions.  Anybody got one?


find a way to cure greed.
it will solve everything (or make it terminal, either works for me )


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## Mutt (Mar 29, 2011)

We are a species of over-indulgence, not a species of moderation. We live on a finite rock. Unless the species changes it's drive, the outcome is obvious.

I won't post my thoughts....after yesterday I would probably get banned. still disgusted.


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## OGKushman (Mar 29, 2011)

What happened yesterday???? My iphone took a hammer punch to the face, and i am waiting for a replacement. I been busy!??


Ozzy, you live in the northwest? I would not mind darkness...escape from LA ending, ya feel me? I had 15 years in scouting. Me and mine will make it. 

SHUT IT ALL DOWN. THEN MP.C can meet me in the High Sierras for us to build the first successful community! 


			
				PencilHead said:
			
		

> I keep hearing a lot of noise and whinning but no solutions.  Anybody got one?


It sure will be nice... about 35,000 years from the worldwide radioactive fallout...


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## ozzydiodude (Mar 29, 2011)

I'm on the eact coast OG. The thing is that without coal to make steel our world as we know it would change completely


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## ArtVandolay (Mar 29, 2011)

Irish made contact with the Mother Ship the other day.  It's on the way and will save the day.


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## 4u2sm0ke (Mar 29, 2011)

DEEP


:stoned:


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## WeedHopper (Mar 29, 2011)

Where are my boots when I need them!
Oh,,and the sky really is falling.


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## sickbiker (Mar 29, 2011)

The toxic effects of the mercury, also known in vaccines as Thimerosal, have once again been confirmed, this time by researchers from the University of Brazil. Marking the sixth major study in recent months to condemn the use of mercury in medicine, the new study reveals that mercury causes serious brain damage, and is linked to autism and other developmental diseases in children and Alzheimer&#8217;s disease in adults.
Dr. Jose Dorea and his colleagues conducted an extensive, peer-reviewed analysis of various studies and available information in major databases that address the effects of low-dose Thimerosal, or ethylmercury, on neural tissue and behavior. They found conclusively that Thimerosal accumulates in brain tissue, negatively affects brain development, and harms brain cells.&#8220;Mercury is known to cause serious harm, especially to fetuses and children because of their smaller size,&#8221; said Lisa Sykes, president of the Coalition for Mercury-free Drugs (CoMeD), a non-profit group dedicated to removing mercury from medicine. &#8220;Why remove Thimerosal from pediatric vaccines only to inject it into pregnant women and children with recommended flu shots? They removed Thimerosal from other vaccines, so it should also be removed from flu shots.&#8221;


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## sickbiker (Mar 29, 2011)

Several other recent studies confirm the numerous dangers posed by mercury, including one recently published in the Folia Neuropathologica that links the toxin directly to autism (hxxp://www.naturalnews.com/031678_m&#8230. Mercury is also known to disrupt proper immune function, damage DNA, inhibit healthy embryonic development, and cause cancer.
The vast majority of the flu shots administered in the US still contain Thimerosal, as they come from multi-dose vials that require a preservative in order to prevent contamination. However, CoMeD says there is no reason to continue using Thimerosal since safer alternative preservatives already exist and are currently in use in many pediatric vaccines that used to contain Thimerosal.


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## WeedHopper (Mar 29, 2011)

Im a Biker,,,(Sickbiker) and I could give a crap. 
By the way,,yur nose ring is crooked.  Just jacken wit ya Bro.


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## sickbiker (Mar 29, 2011)

thats the prob there are to many people that dont give a crap


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## tcbud (Mar 29, 2011)

OGK,
Did you ask why mercury is in fish?

Around my parts, Northern California, Mercury is in fish due to Gold Mining back in day when it was used getting gold out of black sand ( the process is called Amalgamating, if I remember right) .  It got in the water, then by seeking the lowest point, down the streams into the lakes and down rivers to the ocean.  It is against the law to use it now in Gold Mining.  The Sacramento River dumped huge amounts of Mercury into the San Francisco Bay, there the fish are heavy with Mercury.  It is a case of the little critters are in the Mercury laden bottoms of streams/bay then they get eaten up by the food chain.  By the time we eat the larger fish, they have eaten lots of Mercury contained bait etc.  Clear Lake has a point in the bottom (I hear) that is covered with Mercury.  I would never eat a fish from that lake.

I cant do much about Mercury.  I dont eat over the recommended allowed amounts of Bass out of the lake I fish in regular, I try to pay attention to that.  I imagine something is gonna get you in the end, just wish I could go fishing more before it does.


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## Rosebud (Mar 29, 2011)

I think all we can do is keep our little piece of the world as clean and green as we can. I have a nuclear reactor in my back yard. But my real back yard is a clean as it can be with my neighbors using spray services.:holysheep: 

My son developed seizures after the DPT shot given 30 years ago. He was lucky. Lots of kids were profoundly   disabled for life.I was an earth mom hippy that was on the organic bandwagon before most. 
We just have to do what "we" can. And fish more! just maybe don't eat it.
I have a water filter for my whole house. I wouldn't eat the fish down river from the reactor and I don't want the dirty water.
 It is easy to get depressed with the planet's problems and all the other terrible things going on, but we can only do our best and try to have some fun in this life and be good to each other, because i think that is what we are here for. 
Sorry if i went on and on.


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## sickbiker (Mar 29, 2011)

Rosebud said:
			
		

> I think all we can do is keep our little piece of the world as clean and green as we can. I have a nuclear reactor in my back yard. But my real back yard is a clean as it can be with my neighbors using spray services.:holysheep:
> 
> My son developed seizures after the DPT shot given 30 years ago. He was lucky. Lots of kids were profoundly   disabled for life.I was an earth mom hippy that was on the organic bandwagon before most.
> We just have to do what "we" can. And fish more! just maybe don't eat it.
> ...


dont be sorry for anything


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## ishnish (Mar 29, 2011)

I'm worried about worrying too much...  seen some 2012 videos the other day...
Earth is gonna shake off some fleas I believe.  I hope she's nice to me tho..
mega-quakes, asteroids, super-volcanoes, Oh My!!
:48:  :aok:


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## SmokinMom (Mar 29, 2011)

ishnish said:
			
		

> I'm worried about worrying too much...  seen some 2012 videos the other day...
> Earth is gonna shake off some fleas I believe.  I hope she's nice to me tho..
> mega-quakes, asteroids, super-volcanoes, Oh My!!
> :48:  :aok:



Yep, I agree.

And we all gotta die sometime.

Don't we already have a longer lifespan from people 100 yrs ago anyways?


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## SensiStarFan (Mar 29, 2011)

EDGY said:
			
		

> Yup, but NOBODY wants to hear it.
> 
> Take all the major problems that face the human race or, indeed, the planet today.
> Polluted oceans, polluted air, global warming, deforestation, species extinction, energy and food shortages- ect.... (You get the point)
> ...


 
I have to agree with EDGY on this one.  It is time we stopped looking at reproduction as an unlimited right.  If I have 20 children by 20 different women and do absolutely nothing to care for those children, nothing happens to me.  I can go out and create a 21st if I can find a woman willing.  But if I take a life the law may put me to death.  The law doesn't require me to do anything for the lives I create, only the lives I destroy.  This is a contradiction because many of the lives that are created on this planet are destined for sadness and destruction simply because of the circumstances and choices made surrounding their conception.  China instituted a one-child policy at the end of the 1970's and look who is the newest superpower in the world.

-SSF-


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## Rosebud (Mar 30, 2011)

interesting thought, how ya gonna do that? You would have to tackle some pretty big religions in this country. Good luck with that.  Good point about the super power though. I am glad I don't live in china.


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## SensiStarFan (Mar 30, 2011)

Rosebud said:
			
		

> interesting thought, how ya gonna do that? You would have to tackle some pretty big religions in this country. Good luck with that. Good point about the super power though. I am glad I don't live in china.


 
That is the problem, religion.  Every large religion has in it's doctrines to "go forth and multiply".  You end up with people that have 20 kids that are all half starving and the parents are happy as heck thinking they "did God's work".

-SSF-


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> It just the price we have to pay to live in the style we all have come to know. Without coal we would still be in the dark. It's a dirty nasty thing but it has made our world what it is today.


Although this is true, we no longer have an excuse with alternate energy. Electric cars should be traded even for any gas using vehicle... And someone mentioned over population... Cancer kills 400,000 people a year in the US alone... This is why there is no cure; population control. Government allows disease to run rampur to control population growth. 400,000 a year, plus their children, and their children's children! We need to do an application program for reproduction... Only the most intelligent and physically prowess individuals should be able to breed, for at least two generations, and then we could evolve naturally instead of technologically... Everyone go to the woods with a tent and a spear and if you make it, it's because you're supposed too! JMO


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

SensiStarFan said:
			
		

> That is the problem, religion.  Every large religion has in it's doctrines to "go forth and multiply".  You end up with people that have 20 kids that are all half starving and the parents are happy as heck thinking they "did God's work".
> 
> -SSF-


Let's not start in on religion:rofl: I'll :rant: til no one is listening anymore!!! Mass hysteria is all organized religion is! No one wants to think that when you die that's it! And what better way to get one man to do what another man wants him to than to tell him that "the creator" told him to do so? Just food for thought not stepping on toes... Was raised baptist, but have recognized the propaganda for a while now!


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## Rosebud (Mar 30, 2011)

"Government allows disease to run rampur to control population growth"


How do they do that Gixx?


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

SensiStarFan said:
			
		

> I have to agree with EDGY on this one.  It is time we stopped looking at reproduction as an unlimited right.  If I have 20 children by 20 different women and do absolutely nothing to care for those children, nothing happens to me.  I can go out and create a 21st if I can find a woman willing.  But if I take a life the law may put me to death.  The law doesn't require me to do anything for the lives I create, only the lives I destroy.  This is a contradiction because many of the lives that are created on this planet are destined for sadness and destruction simply because of the circumstances and choices made surrounding their conception.  China instituted a one-child policy at the end of the 1970's and look who is the newest superpower in the world.
> 
> -SSF-


APPLICATION PROCESS FOR BREEDING, ONLY SMART, FAST, STRONG, AND BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE CAN REPRODUCE FROM NOW ON! This would advance man kind by centuries in just a few generations! Speed-evolution!


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## ozzydiodude (Mar 30, 2011)

SSF you still have to use coal to use every type of alternate energy there is. None of them will work with out Steel and you can not make steel with out Coal.


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## SensiStarFan (Mar 30, 2011)

Gixxerman420 said:
			
		

> APPLICATION PROCESS FOR BREEDING, ONLY SMART, FAST, STRONG, AND BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE CAN REPRODUCE FROM NOW ON! This would advance man kind by centuries in just a few generations! Speed-evolution!


 
I'm not talking about creating a master race.  I am talking about limiting the number of children so that parents can give their children the best possible education and attention.  Many people will say that if they have 8 kids or one, they still love their kids all the same.  Well time and math do not lie.  You can not give 8 kids as much attention, love, and education as you can 1 kid.  

-SSF-


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## SensiStarFan (Mar 30, 2011)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> SSF you still have to use coal to use every type of alternate energy there is. None of them will work with out Steel and you can not make steel with out Coal.


 
I never mentioned coal or steel...I'm confused :stoned:


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

Rosebud said:
			
		

> "Government allows disease to run rampur to control population growth"
> 
> 
> How do they do that Gixx?


There are countries that you can go to to "cure" certain types of cancers... Government runs any cure through an extensive processing with the FDA... Often times a viable cure that has side affects that are feasible, or do not carry a high enough cure ratio (according to their standards; profit based standards) will not be approved. There are medicines for aids patience that aren't available here in the states and other developed countries of the world... Simply because their impact on population growth would undoubtedly carry vast consequences.


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

SensiStarFan said:
			
		

> I'm not talking about creating a master race.  I am talking about limiting the number of children so that parents can give their children the best possible education and attention.  Many people will say that if they have 8 kids or one, they still love their kids all the same.  Well time and math do not lie.  You can not give 8 kids as much attention, love, and education as you can 1 kid.
> 
> -SSF-


I know... I was saying to selectively breed... Just relating it to the restriction of birth rate... One step further to ensure the future of the human race as a whole... Not any one color either (before anyone harps in on that bus) but the highest scientific minds of each race! Sounds a little Hitlerish, but I'm not killing anyone, just not allowing some genetics to continue soiling the gene pool! :rofl: just had an image of "the gene pool"... I have a buddy named Gene; he's one of these "ladies men" with the porno mustaches.... Hot tub and all! Funny looking bastard!


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## ozzydiodude (Mar 30, 2011)

Soory SSF I had just answered your pm. my comment should have been dirrected at Gix and OGK.

Religion was created by a few men to control the masses. That all I say on that or Hick will ban a bunch of us for ingoring  the rules


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

SensiStarFan said:
			
		

> I never mentioned coal or steel...I'm confused :stoned:


Ozzy, that was me bro! There are alloys available that can be produced at a much lower temperature than steel... And I'm not saying to eliminate our USE, just our dependency! There are warehouses of solar panels already fabricated, and wind turbines could be made from resins like fiberglass or something.. I'm sure there are other ways of doing things: the easiest way is not necessarily the best way to do things!


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> Soory SSF I had just answered your pm. my comment should have been dirrected at Gix and OGK.
> 
> Religion was created by a few men to control the masses. That all I say on that or Hick will ban a bunch of us for ingoring  the rules


Religion a no-no??? Understandable, sorry all, didn't realize! Strike my previous comment about it...


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## SensiStarFan (Mar 30, 2011)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> That all I say on that or Hick will ban a bunch of us for ingoring the rules


 

Excellent point, let's go back to :bong: and :farm: :watchplant: and making people from other forums wonder why they wasted their time before finding us here  

-SSF-


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## Rosebud (Mar 30, 2011)

Lets all smoke some pot!


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

SensiStarFan said:
			
		

> making people from other forums wonder why they wasted their time before finding us here
> 
> -SSF-


:rofl::rofl::rofl::giggle::rofl::rofl::rofl:


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 30, 2011)

Rosebud said:
			
		

> Lets all smoke some pot!


Smoke one for me rose! All I've got is black sticky [email protected]#* from my pipe... All my money has been going into this grow!


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## Rosebud (Mar 30, 2011)

I will do that.


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## WeedHopper (Mar 30, 2011)

Gixxerman420 said:
			
		

> Let's not start in on religion:rofl: I'll :rant: til no one is listening anymore!!! Mass hysteria is all organized religion is! No one wants to think that when you die that's it! And what better way to get one man to do what another man wants him to than to tell him that "the creator" told him to do so? Just food for thought not stepping on toes... Was raised baptist, but have recognized the propaganda for a while now!


 
Aint that the truth,,Im just suprised you said it. I gets in trouble when I touch this subject.


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## WeedHopper (Mar 30, 2011)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> Soory SSF I had just answered your pm. my comment should have been dirrected at Gix and OGK.
> 
> Religion was created by a few men to control the masses. That all I say on that or Hick will ban a bunch of us for ingoring the rules


 
:yeahthat:


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## Hick (Mar 30, 2011)

> 17.You will not discuss politics, religion, saints or sports.


...


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## Roddy (Mar 30, 2011)

But, that's the majority of this thread, Hick! :rofl: :rofl:


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## Hick (Mar 30, 2011)

Roddy said:
			
		

> But, that's the majority of this thread, Hick! :rofl: :rofl:



and about 1 comment from being closed..

ones choice to believe or not to believe is a 'personal' choice that need not be berated or promoted or 'expressed' here.


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## Roddy (Mar 30, 2011)

My complaint is the lack of kindness in this world! We all live so near to each other and all we can do to acknowledge one another is the single finger salute when one of us cuts the other off in traffic!

Now, get that slow moving clunker off the road if it can't do more than 50, you &*(^*&


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## PencilHead (Mar 30, 2011)

Hick said:
			
		

> ones choice to believe or not to believe is a 'personal' choice that need not be berated or promoted or 'expressed' here.


 
Can we expand this rule to apply to the entire world?


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## WeedHopper (Mar 30, 2011)

:bolt:


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## EDGY (Mar 30, 2011)

Yeah, I think this thread took a 90 degree turn... When I said population control I was NOT suggesting selective breeding. 
We are a clever species but, we have not proven to be very wise. A larger gene pool leads to a healthier population. 
I do remember China's 1 child law.
 While it DID curb population growth, it  led to forced abortions as well. Also couples were aborting fetuses that were not male...???
While I am certainly not an anti-abortionist, I DO think it is probably the WORST form of population control, when there are so many other methods of birth control available. 
Forced abortion, to me, is unthinkable... 

This does not come from any religious thinking, just human compassion.


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## PencilHead (Mar 30, 2011)

To jerk the thread back around to topic, what's wrong with natural gas?  There aren't any prissy Arab princes/dictators sitting on it.  Sure we'd take an initial hit at the pump and lose efficincy, but if we took our 10th Crusade dollars and put them into extraction subsidies and research, we could beat the oil addiction in a few years--the technology is already there.

Sure, you need coal to produce steel, but producing coke to produce steel isn't like open burning for a power source.

There are answers, but unfortunately the US is like a trust-fund heroin junky with a suitcase-full of morphine in the attic--we still want the big fix, screw the price tag.


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## kaotik (Mar 30, 2011)

you've gotta put you're greed cap on and think like them for a second to understand it better pencil..
why would i want to fund and research alternatives, when i make a killing as it is right now?  

 and you want to talk about technology being here already.. read some of Nikola Tesla's work (screw Edison, Tesla was the true genius of that era. but the elite didn't like him and preferred ol eddie.. so he's the one we all read about in our textbooks instead  )


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## SensiStarFan (Mar 30, 2011)

kaotik said:
			
		

> you've gotta put you're greed cap on and think like them for a second to understand it better pencil..
> why would i want to fund and research alternatives, when i make a killing as it is right now?
> 
> and you want to talk about technology being here already.. read some of Nikola Tesla's work (screw Edison, Tesla was the true genius of that era. but the elite didn't like him and preferred ol eddie.. so he's the one we all read about in our textbooks instead  )


 
Good point on alternative energy. Even if a company could create an alternative to gasoline or coal tomorrow that was cheaper and cleaner, it would still be a long road to making that alternative energy a reality. There are coal and oil subsidies our government gives to energy companies. Our entire infrasturcutre is based on gasoline powered vehicles, so even if we create cars that are cleaner that don't run on gas, we are talking about trillions of dollars in gas stations, service stations, car repair centers, etc. The investment in altering our infrastrucutre would be staggering. And while a company may be out there with alternative fules, that company has got to convince every major car manufacturer as well as the service station industry to start creating their cars and servicing their cars that are alternative to gas. 

China is on pace to open one coal power plant a week over the next few years in order to keep pace with their growth. And while the US still uses a LOT more energy per person in our country, China now produces and consumes more energy than the U.S.  Don't get me wrong, I would not want to live in China but their one child policy was created out of necessity.  Over 75% of their lakes, rivers and stream (all sources of clean water) have gone dry in the past 70 years due to overpopulation.  The one-child policy was a necessity due to the explosion in the population and the slow death and destruction of their natural resources.  If we keep doing what we are doing we will have no choice but to do something similar.  There is only so much Earth. 

However in my opinion the biggest reason for the number of coal power plants in the U.S. and the lack of growth in alternative energy is due to the government. For the longest time our government has completely ignored any idea of an "energy policy". We end up subsidizing oil companies, coal companies, basically everything that exists. We are so dumb, that even though we live in a world where people are starving, we are burning our food (corn) to drive our cars. If I want electricity in my home, I have no choice where i get that electricty from or how it is created. The government has allowed monopolies to be created in the energy industry. If people had a choice where they got their energy from and how it was created, I believe most people would care. If I had the option to pay more on my electric bill knowing that my energy came from natural gas instead of coal, I would pay the 5%-15% increase in cost.

-SSF-


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## Roddy (Mar 30, 2011)

SensiStarFan said:
			
		

> Good point on alternative energy. Even if a company could create an alternative to gasoline or coal tomorrow that was cheaper and cleaner, it would still be a long road to making that alternative energy a reality. There are coal and oil subsidies our government gives to energy companies. Our entire infrasturcutre is based on gasoline powered vehicles, so even if we create cars that are cleaner that don't run on gas, *we are talking about trillions of dollars in gas stations, service stations, car repair centers, etc. The investment in altering our infrastrucutre would be staggering.* And while a company may be out there with alternative fules, that company has got to convince every major car manufacturer as well as the service station industry to start creating their cars and servicing their cars that are alternative to gas.
> 
> China is on pace to open one coal power plant a week over the next few years in order to keep pace with their growth. And while the US still uses a LOT more energy per person in our country, China now produces and consumes more energy than the U.S.  Don't get me wrong, I would not want to live in China but their one child policy was created out of necessity.  Over 75% of their lakes, rivers and stream (all sources of clean water) have gone dry in the past 70 years due to overpopulation.  The one-child policy was a necessity due to the explosion in the population and the slow death and destruction of their natural resources.  If we keep doing what we are doing we will have no choice but to do something similar.  There is only so much Earth.
> 
> ...



Actually, it's a huge business opportunity, the smart are jumping in with both feet.


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## nova564t (Mar 30, 2011)

I feel that the humans dont have much time left on this hunk of rock, we are ruining it and its time for us to go!! I just hope some of the other animals can survive our wrath.


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## WeedHopper (Mar 30, 2011)

Energy never dies,,it just changes forms.:hubba:


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## Mutt (Mar 30, 2011)

Then taking that statement into account. would energy in it's purest form gain momentum...thus positive energy would be a linear increase, but on the other hand negative energy escalate as well....equaling a true balance of power?
stoned n drunk just had to toss into the debate


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## Mutt (Mar 30, 2011)

stability without chaos would not be stability, chaos without stability would not be chaos. :bong2:


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## Gixxerman420 (Mar 31, 2011)

kaotik said:
			
		

> you've gotta put you're greed cap on and think like them for a second to understand it better pencil..
> why would i want to fund and research alternatives, when i make a killing as it is right now?
> 
> and you want to talk about technology being here already.. read some of Nikola Tesla's work (screw Edison, Tesla was the true genius of that era. but the elite didn't like him and preferred ol eddie.. so he's the one we all read about in our textbooks instead  )


Tesla was a genius! His understanding of longitudinal electricity was above and beyond his time! I worry about mankind's ability to adapt to the snowball effect climate issues we're having... Cryospheres slowly melt off and reflect less and less light back into space; resulting in even faster global warming!


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## EDGY (Mar 31, 2011)

Even natural gas is a stop-gap measure. We will spend the trillions to convert from one non-renewable resource to another... Other than weeding us off foreign oil it really makes little sense. We need to sink the money into renewable, and hopefully, not extremely expensive energy.
Electric cars are NOT green so long as we are burning fossil fuels to charge them.

I think nuclear energy is looking a lot worse than it was a month ago. Although many countries operate nuclear reactors safely, the waste is an environmental nightmare.
Why do we build so many reactors on fault lines? I was blissfully ignorant of this until just recently.


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## Roddy (Mar 31, 2011)

Electricity can and is being made daily without fossil fuels, we just need to stop being slaves to the elec company and make the leap. It's a costly start-up, but I'm wagering many of us will see it pay off quickly...especially us growers!


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## OGKushman (Mar 31, 2011)

holy crap did i stir up a poo storm? i just got back online and i got a lot of reading to do. u guyz got busy fingers!



:48:


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## PencilHead (Apr 1, 2011)

Great thread, OG.  It's turned into a microcosm of the country--try to start a serious discussion about oil addiction and the conversation goes directly to impractical silliness.  First things first: get our lips off the oil tit, and let go of that chunck of coal that's got us caught in the ball trap.  We've got enough natural gas fto stage a hundred year moratorium on oil and coal.  Maybe, just maybe, we could come up with some *serious* renewable source in 100 years.

As far as the trillions that it would take, that's only for refueling stations--as I said, the technology for natural gas driven vehicles and factories has been there for years.  Let's see: Iraq=a gazzillion dollars a week; Afghanistan=a gazzillion dollars a week.  Look, there's 2 gazzillion dollars a week for our retrofit right there.  

Unfortunately, the biggest problem with natural gas is that the guys who own the gas fields wear big ol' greed hats.  Did someone say "eminent domain?"


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## ArtVandolay (Apr 2, 2011)

On the other hand, you have different fingers.


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## EDGY (Apr 6, 2011)

PencilHead said:
			
		

> Let's see: Iraq=a gazzillion dollars a week; Afghanistan=a gazzillion dollars a week.


 
Yeah, all that to swat at flies... Warfare just ain't what it used to be...
I thought Obama was gonna end these wars.
I mean, at least end one or the other, pick your favorite!!!
I don't mean this in a political way, just pure economics. 
Whether we send our money to the middle east to buy gas for our cars or for our tanks it still goes to the same place, right?


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## Rosebud (Apr 6, 2011)

ArtVandolay said:
			
		

> On the other hand, you have different fingers.



:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

Art, where have you been, I have been missing you. Are you guys all moved?


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## Roddy (Apr 6, 2011)

I dunno about Art, but I moved....

from the bed to the computer chair, to the bathroom, to the kitchen and now back to the computer chair....   

Here, hit this :48: and not me please....


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## SensiStarFan (Apr 6, 2011)

PencilHead said:
			
		

> Unfortunately, the biggest problem with natural gas is that the guys who own the gas fields wear big ol' greed hats. Did someone say "eminent domain?"


 
I remember reading something about this a couple months back. Natural gas fields are being discovered all the time and apparently a huge one was discovered in......Pennsylvania I think? Anyway, farmers are leasing the rights to collect natural gas on their farmland and RAKING in money. They get a percentage of each....I believe it was cubic foot of gas recovered. Let me see if I can dig up the article. It was an interesting read.....
hXXp://money.cnn.com/2010/10/06/news/economy/penn_community/index.htm
The problem with natural gas is that though it burns cleeaner than coal or oil, getting it out of the Earth is a very dirty process.  The company mentioned in the article I linked, Marcellus Shale, is under close investigation because of the process they use to extract natural gas.  They basically create cesspools of toxic waste wherever they extract natural gas.  Fortunately for them, they were given a free pass by Bush/Cheney that prevents Marceulls Shale from being bound by the normal EPA regulations.  

-SSF-


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## Mutt (Apr 6, 2011)

you know how deep they have to go in Pa to get oil and gas now?
few people know but the first oil rush in the US was in Pa. 
Also had a friend blown up pipelining nat. gas. in north central Pa.
Rough tough business there...and no it's freakin expensive to drill those wells on usually a "maybe" they are never sure until they hit it.


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## OGKushman (Apr 6, 2011)

I thought the oil boom started in Southern Cali by a silver miner named Daniel Plainveiw






Its good to read yalls views on touchy subjects.


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## niteshft (Apr 6, 2011)

We all have to do are part as best we can. I've got the skeleton of two 12 foot satalite dishes that I'm going to make a solar collector out of and use the ground as a heat sink that I can draw from as needed. I saw a small community that is doing that, in Canada I think. It took a long time for the initial heat up, (thinking a year), but runs smoothly thereafter. But that one was HUGE!!!


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## Mutt (Apr 6, 2011)

OGKushman said:
			
		

> I thought the oil boom started in Southern Cali by a silver miner named Daniel Plainveiw
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> While most people think of Texas when you mention oil, the modern oil  industry actually traces its roots to Titusville, Pennsylvania, north of  Pittsburgh. It was 1859 when Col. Edwin L. Drake successfully drilled  the first oil well there.



hXXp://pittsburgh.about.com/od/day_trips/a/titusville_oil.htm


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## OGKushman (Apr 6, 2011)

I was totally joking 

Daniel Plainview was a character in the award winning movie about a miner turned oil tycoon..."There Will Be Blood"... awesome flick


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## Mutt (Apr 7, 2011)

OGKushman said:
			
		

> I was totally joking
> 
> Daniel Plainview was a character in the award winning movie about a miner turned oil tycoon..."There Will Be Blood"... awesome flick



i know LOL i just thought i'd post the info up


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## maineharvest (Apr 7, 2011)

I look at the human race as a huge infestation of spider mites.  We will eat and consume and destroy everything and then move on to the next garden.  We are like a virus and planet earth is our host.


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## Mutt (Apr 7, 2011)

maineharvest said:
			
		

> I look at the human race as a huge infestation of spider mites.  We will eat and consume and destroy everything and then move on to the next garden.  We are like a virus and planet earth is our host.



We are the only species on this planet that does not live in harmony. Makes ya ponder thoughts of we're we dumped off here thousands and thousands of years ago?


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## SensiStarFan (Apr 7, 2011)

Mutt said:
			
		

> We are the only species on this planet that does not live in harmony. Makes ya ponder thoughts of we're we dumped off here thousands and thousands of years ago?


 
I think now we might be getting into a more abstract view of life itself.  We always talk about life as being beautiful but when you really look at it, it can be scary.  Other than plants and things that get their energy from the sun, life can only survive and thrive my consuming itself.  All mammals, animals, etc, everything that pretty much moves can only survive by destroying and consuming other forms of life.  Even vegetarians survive by destroying and eating plant life.  In other words with the excpetion of life forms that feed off sunlight, pretty much every other form of life is virus-like in it's survival.  It must find other life forms to dominate and consume.  What seperates us from other forms of life is the extent to which we dominate and consume other forms of life, and that we are the only species on the planet that while performing this process simultaneously destroys the environment for future forms of life.  

-SSF-


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## OGKushman (Mar 29, 2012)

Our candidates for president so evil! Why do we REALLY have no choice? Romney or Obama is the next president, it doesn't matter who we choose as a people anymore...

How did campaign contributions become the deciding factor? I don't want to live in their planet anymore.


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## King Bud (Mar 29, 2012)

Maybe it never did? Maybe when the presidents see the top secret information, they have no choice but to change their stance. 

At least they don't get to seed our first child. 

Way I see it, with the U.S. nearing that special 51% of world military power, things should get rough and ugly, and then eventually mellow out.

Doubt much will change for me, beyond maybe a draft, or some 'natural' disasters. :confused2:

So I'm going keep my eye on the prize, and focus on the things I want to get done. :icon_smile: 

After all, cavemen survived the ice age with fire, sticks, and stones; we should be alright. :fly: 

:48:


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## OGKushman (Mar 31, 2012)

Oh and you bes believe i got my sticks and stones


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