# Pests or nutritional damage.



## redpassion (Jan 17, 2017)

I think it necessary to explain how I feed my plants. 5 WHITE WIDOW AUTO by
Greenhouse Seed Co. and 4 BLUE DREAM AUTO by Humboldt Seed Org.  My tent is 1.20m x 1.20m x 2,00m. I use Hesi liquid fertilizers. In my 11 ltr. vases I have used Plagron Bat soil, added a little manure from a purchased bag from a garden center. I water daily + Hesi fertilizers using a total of 5 litres of water/Hesi. The 5 ltrs are used as ltr.2.5 in the evening (19,00 hours) represents the beginning of the 18 hr. light phase. The night phase begins (13,00) and ends at (19,00) hrs. The daily 5 litres is divided between the 9 plants. At germination I did not use any fertilizers and watered the seedlings with a 60 ml. syringe. Strangely enough, One of the Humboldt seedlings started growth with yellow leaflets, whilst the other three grew normally. The yellow leaf Humboldt continued its growth with many yellow leaves mixed with the normal coloured leaves. The fertilizer I used at 1 3rd strength for a couple of weeks slowly increasing until I am using full full strength as indicated on the Hesi bottles. Occasionaly I use just water.  The water I use I extremely hard, the area I live in has extremely hard water.  I lower the alkalinity with PH down until the mixture has a PH of 6,2.
In the tent I have installed 3 oscillating 20 cm fans. Externally an inverted aspirator feeding air into the Tent. I have  2 Co2 bags hanging  near the canopy. I use a 380 Led lighting in 8 modules. Ample temperature and humidy control in 4 areas of the tent. When necessary, I use a dehumidifier or a humidifier, which ever is needed. The tent is heated by a 1,20 mt heating tube connected to a thermostat.   I have found some Fungus Gnats on the surface of the soil in the pots. A few days ago I introduced 500 Orius predetors to get rid of them. Is my problem a lack of Potassium or Manganese. Or have I over fertilized them? Can a member help me with this problem?  Please see photographs. It seems that I am able to upload 1 photograph. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Thanks to all members who can help. PS. Feeding is done with a 5 ltr. air pumped, container with long brass tube for feeding. The tube is passed at soil level from one plant to another and not passed above the canopy! So it cannot possibly be nutrient spillage.  I use green light for looking into the tent with lights out, only if necessary. I should add that I cannot enter my tent as I am not stable on my legs. I have a lady that keeps me informed, or, removes a plant from the tent for inspection. Should I enter the tent, no room with 9 plants, I might topple the tent and all on top of me. 

View attachment IMG_0496.jpg


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## redpassion (Jan 17, 2017)

Hopefully an additional photograph. 

View attachment IMG_0498.jpg


View attachment IMG_0501.jpg


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## umbra (Jan 17, 2017)

looks like nute splash getting on the leaves


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## redpassion (Jan 17, 2017)

Hi Umbra, It certainly looks as if some nutrient has been splashed on these leaves. I can assure you that no nutrients can reach where I cut the stalks and leaves. Thanks Umbra.


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## Grower13 (Jan 17, 2017)

not pest.......... if this is the only leaves on the plant doing it then I agree with Umbra........... if it's multiple leaves on the plant doing it then you got issues.


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## daftpunk (Jan 18, 2017)

nute splash
Daftpunk


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## techrons78 (Jan 18, 2017)

It's Fungus Nat's..you said you got them..
Adults live about one week and lay up to 300 eggs in rich, moist soils. Within 4-6 days tiny larvae emerge and begin feeding on plant roots during their two week period. The pupal stage lasts 3-4 days before young adults leave the soil and begin the next generation. The entire life cycle from egg to adult may be completed in as little as 3-4 weeks depending on temperature. Because of their proclivity and relative short gestation, potted plants can host each stage &#8212; egg, larvae, pupae, adult &#8212; in multiple generations at once. Because of this remedies usually require repeated applications until there are no surviving eggs...

So if you just noticed them they have been there for a few ..
Pots need to stay dryer
Water less if possible
Use a hygrozeme to eat up dead root material so fungus larvae doesn't have much to feed on ..
 I really like AZaMax it's Omri organic anti feedeant. It's expensive but it works.
They also have a organic glass that you can top soil with that will slice them on s microscopic level.. This is a problem that will take constant monitoring. 


And BTW you leaves look like that because of the larvae are feeding on your roots..it's a common mistake to think it's nute burn or cal Mag defeceincy..they are destroying plant if it's not stopped plants yield will suffer greatly.


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## redpassion (Jan 19, 2017)

Thank you Techron for such an informative reply, I really appreciate it.


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## techrons78 (Jan 19, 2017)

redpassion said:


> Thank you Techron for such an informative reply, I really appreciate it.



Anytime my friend...good luck..


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## trillions of atoms (Jan 20, 2017)

What is your ph in the containers?   Ppm of solution you are feeding? What food?   Looks like a calmag/ micro nutrient issue.

I have never seen gnats cause leaf issues like you posted. But if you sprinkle diatomaceous earth in the containers it will solve the bug problem.

Is it on one plant?   A couple of leaves? All the plants?


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## techrons78 (Jan 20, 2017)

trillions of atoms said:


> What is your ph in the containers?   Ppm of solution you are feeding? What food?   Looks like a calmag/ micro nutrient issue.
> 
> I have never seen gnats cause leaf issues like you posted. But if you sprinkle diatomaceous earth in the containers it will solve the bug problem.
> 
> Is it on one plant?   A couple of leaves? All the plants?



What do the leaves look like then.? If he would not already have Nat's I would say diffent..I have had them and seen them in coco same exact look ..last grow ..I have seen Nat damage on 30-40% before of total plants but maybe only 2%per plant ..If the infection has just hatched they have already been harvesting on roots so it could be one or all of the plants ...or one or more leaves dealing on life cycle you are catching Nat's at.


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## trillions of atoms (Jan 22, 2017)

The plants are being over watered first and foremost. DE will fix the bug problem.   Gnats feed of rotting roots caused by dampening off. While seedlings can be damaged, healthy plants are virtually unaffected. The larvea feed off dying and decaying organic matter. The rotting roots they find and other matter in the soil is what feeds them, not healthy roots. I have never used hes and am unfamiliar with its nutrient content. Immediately I noticed he had yellowing leaves on one plant as a seedling.... could be one of a few things including low nutrient content or ph issues effecting nutrient uptake. The ph of the feed water is 6.2...but let's do some digging.

How is he testing?

Is it a quality digital ph meter? Has it been calibrated? How was calibration preformed if it was calibrated if it is a good meter?

What is the ph of the soil?  Only way to know is to test runoff.  What type of soil? Did he add lime? Is one of the main ingredients peat?  Gnats love peat. How is the arreation of the soil?  Peat is also known to cause ph and micronutrient issues if dolomite lime is not added. Also peat does not drain water well which can be the perfect environment for gnats to thrive.

There are many more questions to ask even tho his initial post was somewhat informative it is still incomplete.

Pictures other than just the leaf would help too. I have seen people freak out thinking bugs are killing their plants when it was something as simple as the containers not having drainage holes.

Before I say -  YUP! That's your problem! I try and take all factors into consideration and there is not enough info here to make that decision.


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## techrons78 (Jan 23, 2017)

trillions of atoms said:


> The plants are being over watered first and foremost. DE will fix the bug problem.   Gnats feed of rotting roots caused by dampening off. While seedlings can be damaged, healthy plants are virtually unaffected. The larvea feed off dying and decaying organic matter. The rotting roots they find and other matter in the soil is what feeds them, not healthy roots. I have never used hes and am unfamiliar with its nutrient content. Immediately I noticed he had yellowing leaves on one plant as a seedling.... could be one of a few things including low nutrient content or ph issues effecting nutrient uptake. The ph of the feed water is 6.2...but let's do some digging.
> 
> How is he testing?
> 
> ...



Yes I understand where your coming from...im not sure exactly where your info is coming from on Nat's issue  but Their larvae primarily feed on fungi and organic matter in soil, but also chew roots , hince effecting leaf structure and scarring on leaves..so healthy plants CAN get fungus Nat's and they CAN affect finally flower harvest weight..I've had healthy plants get them during flower ..and veg....fungus Nat's are a problem for all life cycle of plants if proper growing is not followed. Tech


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