# Vertizontal Reflector



## IllinoisDiesel08 (May 3, 2009)

Anyone using vertizontal reflectors? How would you rate them against the other types?


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (May 7, 2009)

I have tried a few different reflectors and then I realized two things.  First, reflectors are typically a waste of money.  By some mylar, put it on a sheet of cardboard, and hang it over your light.  Congrats you saved $60.
Secondly, reflectors are not necessary and waste light.  Buy cool tubes and a few Topsy Turvy tomato planters, remove all reflectors from the cooltubes, and hang plants over your lights.  Reflecting light is a waste of light.  It is much more productive to figure out how to get more light directly onto the plants.  Reflection just decreases light power and increases distance the light must travel therefore further decreasing light power.  If I could I would build a giant ball of plants around my light without any light reflection at all.


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## The Hemp Goddess (May 7, 2009)

Do not make a reflector out of cardboard--this is an incredible fire hazard.  It is also unwise to hang your plants over your lights.  I see all kinds of problems there.

Reflectors are not a waste of money and really about the best way we have now of maximizing the light.


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## pcduck (May 7, 2009)

:yeahthat: :goodposting: 



> By some mylar, put it on a sheet of cardboard, and hang it over your light.



This is one of the most *dangerous* posts I have ever read.



> Secondly, reflectors are not necessary and waste light



That must be why 99% of the indoor growers use them.



> Buy cool tubes and a few Topsy Turvy tomato planters, remove all reflectors from the cooltubes, and hang plants over your lights.



This is also one of the most *dangerous* posts I have ever read.



> Reflecting light is a waste of light.



After reading this I would take whatever he mentions about growing with a grain of salt.

Sorry dude but you are passing along some dangerous and bad information.
But the ball of plants is a cool grow style, they make a system like that all ready


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## Sir_Tokie (May 7, 2009)

:yeahthat:  Is this guy for real?


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## Mikey09 (May 7, 2009)

So let me get this right... If a reflector only reflects, lets say, 60% of light. It is still better to use the direct light not the direct light plus what it reflects? Doesnt seem to add up, ha


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## BuddyLuv (May 7, 2009)

Most good reflectors have dimpled aluminum for light disbursement. My reflectors are very effecient and are fairly large. If you pay 30-60 for a reflector you are probably not getting a good one.


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (May 7, 2009)

Reflectors are a waste of money, and Topsy Turvy Tomato Planters are not in any way dangerous.  
Look at it from this point of view...Say your 600 watt HID gives off 95,000 lumens.  One square foot of space one foot from the light source will receive roughly 7500 lumens.  So if you have plants sitting under your light and you are reflecting all light down, how many plants can you fit one foot from your light?  The reason I ask is because a plant two feet from this same light will only receive 1875 lumens, not enough....

Picture a point of light with a ball exactly one foot in radius extending around the point of light.  This ball 1 foot from the light in all directions actually has a surface area of roughly 12.5 square feet.  This means that you have 12.5 square feet of space one foot from your light source to use if you utilize the light traveling in all directions.  How many square feet of plants can you put one foot from yor light if all your light is being reflected down in one direction?  3...4 square feet tops?  

Let me show you what I mean.  Look here, we took two 600 watt cooltubes and removed all of the built in reflectors that reflect the light down so that light can leave the cool tube in all directions.  Remember, how close you can get your plants to the lights has a HUGE impact, and to only utilize one flat surface beneath a light is EXTREMELY inefficient.  Light traveling up and hitting a reflector and then back down onto a plant that is already close enough to the light to get enough lumens is a waste, not to mention the power the light loses by traveling the extra distance to and from the reflector as well as the process of reflection.  Light decreases by a factor of 4 as distance doubles, so getting as much plant surface as close to your light source as possible is much more important than gathering all the light from that source and then trying to throw it in one direction.  When the plants go in, each Topsy Turvey planter gets a SCROG screen set in place below it, and every tote below done with hydro is done SCROG and each screen is dished towards to light source.  Would you believe me if I told you we did 60 plants in a in a closet that is only 23.5 sqaure feet?  Here are the pics how to do it.  By the time everything was done we ended up with a giant oval surrounding the lights with an opening on either end to blow air through.  

But hey, what do I know about reflectors.....other than by not using them (other than mylar) we can produce .94 GRAMS PER WATT.     

I will admit that my point about using cardboard was stupid though, probably want to use a metal surface or something that will be heat resistant.  But mylar will reflect just as much light as a reflector.  

Give me a few minutes I will get a pic for ya....



Reflectors ARE a waste of money.  Why would I buy a reflector that reflects 98% of light when I can buy a roll of mylar that reflects the SAME AMOUNT of light????  Besides, as I just explained, I don't want any reflective surfaces around my lights, I want as much plant surface area as possible.


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (May 7, 2009)

Kind of funny, but I guess I could have just described this setup as a "Coliseum turned on it's side".


Still can't believe I said to use cardboard, that WAS stupid, sorry all, brain fart.

Hopefully this explanation above makes me eligible for the "Dumbest post that eventually made sense award".


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## Lemmongrass (May 7, 2009)

pics with producing hanging plants? i refuse to jump on that wagon yet.


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (May 8, 2009)

I have two pics with the plants in there but you can't see anything, it just looks like you are looking into a rainforest.  Trust me it works.  Typically the planters are raised higher when the plants are in them and you can't see them at all.  I will try to take some shots next time a new crop goes in so that the planters and totes, and SCROG screens, and everything can be seen.


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## ShecallshimThor (May 8, 2009)

nyc i think you need to start a journal on this please ive seen a thread on the topsy but dont recall your input so please start a journal for everyone to see and then have an opinion on your idea


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## NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer (May 8, 2009)

Sure....tell you what I will do you one better.  I am curious in comparing the yield of a plant grown upside down versus rightside up since everything done at ground level in this room is hydro.  How about I take some clones, pick two that are the most identical, and plant one in soil below and one in soil above the light.  I will keep everything as identical as possible such as feeding schedules and report the results.  Both will be done in a SCROG that is 1 square foot and kept the same distance from the light.  

I have a feeling lots of people will be out buying these when they see what they can do.

Some people have argued that the gravitropism in the plants causes them to reorient themselves and not grow correctly.  This is easily overcome by using clones that are already established, and by using a SCROG in the grow (also helps prevent stretch).  The one major problem we encountered at the start is with the watering.  All of the roots sit in the bottom of the Topsy Turvey under ALL of the dirt.  This means that watering needs to be a little more frequent in my experience.


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## thisjustin55 (May 8, 2009)

very interested in seeing how that turns out, keep us posted!


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## winstonwolf (May 8, 2009)

NYC_Diesel x Jack_Herer said:
			
		

> How about I take some clones, pick two that are the most identical, and plant one in soil below and one in soil above the light.  I will keep everything as identical as possible such as feeding schedules and report the results.  Both will be done in a SCROG that is 1 square foot and kept the same distance from the light.



That would be outstanding, a genuine service to the community. I can't wait to see this.


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## Rockster (May 8, 2009)

Well I've just modified my cheapo horizontal reflectors,you can just make em out in the pic.

All plants are now closer to the light but I'll be doing a further mod in my next grow as I aim to have reflectors the width of the growroom so no light is lost upwards at all.


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