# drying to curing??



## newbiegrower58 (Feb 14, 2009)

i just have a quick question for everyone, my buds have been drying for 7 days now and my temp has been in bw 68-73 and humidity 47-52 my buds look dry but the stems are not snapping yet they are still bending a little bit but i have read in a few different places that your buds are ready to be cured after the stem is dry and snaps but some other places it says that after about a week of drying if your stems are still bending a little bit then that is when curing should start just trying to get everyones input and see which is better..i have also attached a few pics of my buds...thanks everyone


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## HippyInEngland (Feb 14, 2009)

Hello 

Your Humidity is very high, this is stopping your buds from drying.

It is extremely important to get it lower.

Your going to get mouldy buds, so act quickly.

Are you sure your reading your RH correctly?

What part of the globe are you living in?

No specifics needed, just a general area.

eace:


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## leafminer (Feb 14, 2009)

Newbiegrower, don't worry about Hippy, he's a bit damp that's all. Your humidity is not that bad. Don't expect bud to be dry to the point of breaking in one week. It usually takes longer, about 2 - 3 weeks depending on humidity. With me it takes 3-4 weeks bc I like a slower dry, I believe it gives the 'off' odours and suchlike a chance to ferment out. Just be patient and have the clean jars ready. Even after it is dry it is still changing - the bud will probably be much more potent after a few more weeks.


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## BBFan (Feb 15, 2009)

Sorry, but no.  No disrespect.  Potency is what it is and will not change no matter what you do.  If it is changing it is only because the thc is degrading because you're doing something wrong- not improving.  What will improve is the burn and the taste.  And humidity does affect the drying process.
I usually hang for about 7 days.  I have jarred bud that felt dry but that the stems did not "crack".  If you use this method, you must be deligent in checking the bud- I check in the morning and evening- when it starts to feel soft I spread it out on paper to let it air dry for an hour or two, then put it back in the jar.  After about a week, you won't need to air dry as often- just burp them for an hour.
Buds look good- enjoy the smoke!


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## Hick (Feb 15, 2009)

BBFan said:
			
		

> Sorry, but no.  No disrespect.  Potency is what it is and will not change no matter what you do.  If it is changing it is only because the thc is degrading because you're doing something wrong- not improving.  What will improve is the burn and the taste.  And humidity does affect the drying process.
> I usually hang for about 7 days.  I have jarred bud that felt dry but that the stems did not "crack".  If you use this method, you must be deligent in checking the bud- I check in the morning and evening- when it starts to feel soft I spread it out on paper to let it air dry for an hour or two, then put it back in the jar.  After about a week, you won't need to air dry as often- just burp them for an hour.
> Buds look good- enjoy the smoke!


..and a returned "no disrespect intended".. but you are the one wrong this time BB'. 
during the _curing_ process, there ARE non-psychoactive cannabinoids that are transformed into psychoactive. rendering an increase in potency..


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## BBFan (Feb 15, 2009)

Hick said:
			
		

> ..and a returned "no disrespect intended".. but you are the one wrong this time BB'.
> during the _curing_ process, there ARE non-psychoactive cannabinoids that are transformed into psychoactive. rendering an increase in potency..


 
Hick- you know I love you man-
but I'm going to disagree with you on this.  Decarboxylation (heating-smoking) renders THC-A and some other cannabinoids into an active form of THC, but curing can actually degrade THC into CBN through oxidation.  CBN is only weakly psychoactive.  Curing improves flavor and burn.

I'm paraphrasing DJ Short and Ed Rosenthal on this-  this information does not come from my personal chemical analysis but what I have read from those resources.  Even the "curing your meds" sticky on this forum talk about improving taste but do not discuss improving potency. 

I'd love to read more and if I'm wrong, accept my apologies in advance.  Educate me my friend.


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## imager777 (Feb 15, 2009)

Are there any online resources that give a definitive answer to this, with research to back it up?  By "this", I mean wether curing increases potency or not and what curing actually does to the bud chemically.  I can say from experience that I get higher off of dried or slightly cured bud, as opposed to fresh, just off the plant bud.  The high doesn't really seem to change after that point for me.  The flavor and texture does, over time though.  My observations are nowhere near scientific though.  I'd like to actually know the answer and have references to back it up.


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## cadlakmike1 (Feb 15, 2009)

Here's some interesting science for you. 

Curing takes place after cannabis has been harvested, manicured and partially dried. Most cannabis will retain a significant quantity of moisture within its stems and inner buds even when the outside feels dry. This is especially true for very dense buds, more care must be taken in drying loose airy buds because sometimes they can dry too fast.

Naturally, as the metabolic processes continue during curing, the conversion of cannabergerol to tetrahydrocannabinol will continue and the potency of the pot will increase. This is because cannabergerol (CBG) is the non-psychoactive precursor for tetrahydrocannabinol (THC). Of course, the exact change in THC content will necessarily be dependant upon the concentration of CBG in the fresh material at harvest. Of course any remaining precursors necessary to form additional cannabidiol (CBD) and other cannabinoids will also be consumed and converted.

Some decarboxylization will take place during curing as well. This happens when the carboxyl group (COOH) located at C-2, C-4, or the end of the hydrocarbon chain at C-3 is destroyed leaving a hydrogen attached and liberating CO2.

Decarboxylization is necessary to convert cannabinoids to usable psychoactive forms; the plants (and your body) carboxylize cannabinoids to make them more soluble in water (for metabolic reactions and excretion).

Research indicates that this effect is fairly minimal during the curing process though. Decarboxylization will take place naturally very rapidly at temperatures of over 100C. So smoking and most any cooking will decarboxylize the cannabinoids. As decarboxylization occurs, the loss of CO2 will liberate a small amount of inert material making the pot more potent via concentration of the cannabinoids.

Terpenoids are the highly volatile compounds that give marijuana much of its&#8217; characteristic odors, and therefore tastes.

The most current research also suggests terpenoids lend to the high, sometimes very significantly. Cannabinoids are phenolated terepenes so it&#8217;s not surprising that many hundreds of different terpenoids are synthesized as well.

As pot ages, some of the terpenoids go through polycyclic aromatization in the process of decomposition. This agglomeration of terpenoids will change the flavor; hence the ability of cured pot to show flavors that didn&#8217;t seem present in the original fresh material. Much of the very volatile terpenoids will also evaporate and or decompose, especially with prolonged curing or storage. This action will remove some matter from the pot increasing the cannabinoid concentration and therefore potency.


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## cadlakmike1 (Feb 15, 2009)

I posted the article I found in it's entirety here.

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38073


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## WeedHopper (Feb 15, 2009)

> Decarboxylization will take place naturally very rapidly at temperatures of over 100C. So smoking and most any cooking will decarboxylize the cannabinoids. As decarboxylization occurs, the loss of CO2 will liberate a small amount of inert material making the pot more potent via concentration of the cannabinoids.


 
So does that mean if you quick dry a Bud at 170 in the oven,(wont burn it)it increases the potency because it is reaching a rapid temp over 100? Just curious,,I quick dry that way(takes about an hour) to try my buds and always get purtty high. Wasnt sure if it was hurting the potency or not. If so I couldnt tell,,I was to high.


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## cadlakmike1 (Feb 15, 2009)

My understanding would be yes, it is more potent after a quick dry then it is while it is still wet and fresh off the plant. Obviously you are sacrificing taste and harshness by this, and you are also sacrificing potency as compared to a longer cure that would allow the plant to naturally decompose and metabolize sugars and chlorophyll.


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## Hick (Feb 16, 2009)

> As floral clusters dry, and even after they are sealed and packaged, they continue to cure. Curing removes the unpleasant green taste and allows the resins and cannabinoids to finish ripening. Drying is merely the removal of water from the floral clusters so they will be dry enough to burn. Curing takes this process one step farther to produce tasty and psychoactive marijuana. If drying occurs too rapidly, the green taste will be sealed into the tissues and may remain there indefinitely. A floral cluster is not dead after harvest any more than an apple is. Certain metabolic activities take place for some time, much like the ripening and eventual spoiling of an apple after it is picked. During this period, cannabinoid acids decarboxylate into the psychoactive cannabinoids and terpenes isomerize to create new polyterpenes with tastes and aromas different from fresh floral clusters. It is suspected that cannabinoid biosynthesis may also continue for a short time after harvest. Taste and aroma also improve as chlorophylls and other pigments begin to break down. When floral clusters are dried slowly they are kept at a humidity very near that of the inside of the stomata. Alternatively, sealing and opening bags or jars or clusters is a procedure that keeps the humidity high within the container and allows the periodic venting of gases given off during curing. It also exposes the clusters to fresh air needed for proper curing.


from MJ Botany by Clark. 



> Proper curing can exponentially increase the quality and desirability of your harvest. The key word to remember is "slow".


from DJ short....



> Cannabinoid Conversion
> 
> Naturally, as the metabolic processes continue during curing, the conversion of cannabergerol to tetrahydrocannabinol will continue and the potency of the pot will increase. This is because cannabergerol (CBG) is the non-psychoactive precursor for tetrahydrocannabinol (THC). Of course, the exact change in THC content will necessarily be dependant upon the concentration of CBG in the fresh material at harvest. Of course any remaining precursors necessary to form additional cannabidiol (CBD) and other cannabinoids will also be consumed and converted.
> 
> Be aware though if curing is excessively prolonged (most connoisseurs would agree after 6 months no more benefit could be had from curing), the conversion of THC to non-psychoactive cannabinol (CBN) will occur. The exact rate of decomposition can vary widely depending on handling and storage conditions, but can be less than 10% to greater than 40% decomposition per year.


from the old OG FAQ "I believe"...

  Lets face it BB, I don't have any lab equiptment or spectro-soni-hyper-glycto-graph to measure the actually potency....  "I" believe from my own past experiences, that _"properly handled and cured"_ bud is better/more potent six months down the road, than it was at harvest..


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## cadlakmike1 (Feb 16, 2009)

> from the old OG FAQ "I believe"



That's not where I found it but I don't doubt that it came from there originally, that was a great resource. I really enjoy finding things like this, the science behind things has always interested me. Any time I'm interested in a subject I enjoy learning as much as I can about it.


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## WeedHopper (Feb 16, 2009)

cadlakmike1 said:
			
		

> My understanding would be yes, it is more potent after a quick dry then it is while it is still wet and fresh off the plant. Obviously you are sacrificing taste and harshness by this, and you are also sacrificing potency as compared to a longer cure that would allow the plant to naturally decompose and metabolize sugars and chlorophyll.


Thanks,,I just do a couple buds that way. The rest goes into my Drybox and from there into jars. I was also woundering what the paper sack part of the cure is all about? Dont get the difference,, between it drying in the paper bag or the box before it goes into Jars. Why both? I skip the paper bag,,so am I missing out on something by doen that?


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## WeedHopper (Feb 16, 2009)

Reddy Kilowatt said:
			
		

> Cowboy, I think you are getting C and F's mixed up.
> 
> Please explain potency.
> 
> Is a couchlock type of high (where my legs go numb and I don't want to do anything) more potent than a head high (when I can't resist the urge to do something constructive). Its from the same plant. I can process weed in different ways. There is an obvious change, but does it mean its more potent if it affects you differently?


 
Bro,,dont be messen wit my high so early in the morning. I dont care which high I get,,as long as I get one,, or both of those highs,,,in relation to my question.:hubba:


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## Hick (Feb 16, 2009)

.."brown bagging" it, is simply a method of slowing the drying process, and kick starting the cure... "IMHO"..


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## WeedHopper (Feb 16, 2009)

Hick said:
			
		

> .."brown bagging" it, is simply a method of slowing the drying process, and kick starting the cure... "IMHO"..


 
Right,,but I dont get the drying difference in the sack verses the box. And I aint saying ther isnt a difference,,I just dont get what it is. Is it kinda like a sweating thing cause all the weed is now being compressed more tightly?


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## Hick (Feb 16, 2009)

I couldn't/wouldn't say that there is a difference, other than one is more pliable/maleable than the other..:confused2:


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## WeedHopper (Feb 16, 2009)

Hick said:
			
		

> I couldn't/wouldn't say that there is a difference, other than one is more pliable/maleable than the other..:confused2:


 
Thanks Bro,,OK I will stick from (Drybox to Jar) cure.


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## BBFan (Feb 16, 2009)

Reddy Kilowatt said:
			
		

> Cowboy, I think you are getting C and F's mixed up.
> 
> Please explain potency.
> 
> Is a couchlock type of high (where my legs go numb and I don't want to do anything) more potent than a head high (when I can't resist the urge to do something constructive). Its from the same plant. I can process weed in different ways. There is an obvious change, but does it mean its more potent if it affects you differently?


 
Reddy- I think that is exactly my point. Thank you.  THC by itself is actually psychoactive and produces a euphoric and "giddy" high, potentially even hallucinogenic. In the harvesting based on trichome color: clear-cloudy-amber-black, there is a bigger difference in the high- up high from cloudy trichs to couchlock high from amber trichs. Personally I prefer the euphoric/up high achieved from purer THC content. Degradation of THC through drying and curing produces a different high. If I take a bud off a plant and quick dry some and cure some- I notice a more up high from the quick dry (unfortunately impossible to do a side by side comparison) then after it has been fully cured. I guess potency is relative to the individual tastes on whether you prefer more THC to a THC / CBN combination and what the resulting high means to you.


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## POTUS (Feb 16, 2009)

cadlakmike1 said:
			
		

> My understanding would be yes, it is more potent after a quick dry then it is while it is still wet and fresh off the plant. Obviously you are sacrificing taste and harshness by this, and you are also sacrificing potency as compared to a longer cure that would allow the plant to naturally decompose and metabolize sugars and chlorophyll.


Man, you can say that again!



			
				cadlakmike1 said:
			
		

> My understanding would be yes, it is more potent after a quick dry then it is while it is still wet and fresh off the plant. Obviously you are sacrificing taste and harshness by this, and you are also sacrificing potency as compared to a longer cure that would allow the plant to naturally decompose and metabolize sugars and chlorophyll.


hehe, hey, it's an expression!

Simply put, two things are true:

1. Because the baggie will have less mass due to water leaving, less weed will get you as high as more weed did before the water left.

2. A slow cure makes it a smoother smoke.

The fractions and decimals can be compared until the cows come home, but the part that a human can tell by smoking the weed is in those two statements.

The KIS principle. "Keep it simple"


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## POTUS (Feb 16, 2009)

Reddy Kilowatt said:
			
		

> Is a couchlock type of high (where my legs go numb and I don't want to do anything) more potent than a head high (when I can't resist the urge to do something constructive). Its from the same plant. I can process weed in different ways. There is an obvious change, but does it mean its more potent if it affects you differently?


That's kind of like what the Chinese say when an old expression is mentioned:

When you see a duck swimming, is the ducks body pushing on the water or is the water pushing against the duck?

Even that statement can be picked apart in it's fractions and decimals, but the meaning remains the same. Some see some things from a different perspective than others.

The rest of the statement in Chinese is:

When eating the duck, it no longer really matters.

hehe, those Chinese people have always been so smart!


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## BBFan (Feb 16, 2009)

> The fractions and decimals can be compared until the cows come home, but the part that a human can tell by smoking the weed is in those two statements.



Not sure I understand what you're trying to say other than DUH!

Which statements are you referring to?


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## POTUS (Feb 16, 2009)

BBFan said:
			
		

> Not sure I understand what you're trying to say other than DUH!
> 
> Which statements are you referring to?


The ones listed as "1" and "2" just above where I said that.

and I've never said "DUH" in my entire life!

hehe


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## WeedHopper (Feb 16, 2009)

> and I've never said "DUH" in my entire life


 
Ya just did. Well maybe ya didnt SAY it,,but you wrote it,,and that counts.
New rule I just made up.:ignore:


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## LEFTHAND (Jun 9, 2009)

imager777 said:
			
		

> Are there any online resources that give a definitive answer to this, with research to back it up? By "this", I mean wether curing increases potency or not and what curing actually does to the bud chemically. I can say from experience that I get higher off of dried or slightly cured bud, as opposed to fresh, just off the plant bud. The high doesn't really seem to change after that point for me. The flavor and texture does, over time though. My observations are nowhere near scientific though. I'd like to actually know the answer and have references to back it up.


 
I dont know why im gettin into this. but wouldnt it be down the same road as mushrooms its water weight. so you smoke 1 gram joint so you think.. and really its only .5 or less, that would be why your not getting as stoned.

IMO but who am i to say...

since i have just read the whole thread. i would like to say WOW. Got kind of intense there. i did know most of that. i know now i am wrong lol..


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## LEFTHAND (Jun 9, 2009)

POTUS said:
			
		

> Man, you can say that again!
> 
> hehe, hey, it's an expression!
> 
> ...


 
its KISS " KEEP IT SIMPLE STUID." 
thats what we use to say back in the day


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## blowslow23 (Jun 30, 2009)

ive heard that u can use dry ice to speed up the drying process? anyone on here know anything about that?


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## dman1234 (Jun 30, 2009)

do ppl use fans to dry or just hang them?
i use a fan and  they dry too fast


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## hanfhead (Jun 30, 2009)

dman1234 said:
			
		

> do ppl use fans to dry or just hang them?
> i use a fan and  they dry too fast



I would not suggest using a fan.  Like you said it will dry too fast.


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## smokeytheherb (Jun 30, 2009)

If you aren't going to use a fan then you need to be really careful with mold and the humidity in your drying area, having your buds mold when your so close would be awful.


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