# Recurring problem



## Bowl Destroyer (Dec 29, 2009)

Hi MP, 

I have had a recurring problem with my grows. I have been trying to elminate all "factors" leading to this problem, but am still having trouble finding and ultimately solving it.

heres info:

Closet grow
Under a 400w HPS with MH conversion
Warmer to hotter temperature
Poorer Air Circulation,
About to enter week 5 flowering
(problem always occurs midway into plants life, not dependent on how long flowering has been going on)
PH is "fine," close to 7 (i use a analog meter)


I am using a heavy soil. This particular grow, I'm using those tiny 1 gallon pots. I have used 5 gallons and they seem to make little difference.

I am sure I have hard water problems. When I take a shower, my soap does not lather.

I have several juice jugs filled with water, and they sit out for days before I use them (so Chlorine will evaporate)


I water "as needed." I try to everyday. I give a dose of Miracle Grow 24 8 16 ONCE per week. Generally this is 1/4 to 1/2 teaspoon per gallon, so not all too much but enough.
***As a side note, as an experiment, I added a good dose of MgSO4-7H2O (epsom salt) to 1 plant, and added nothing but the regular nutes to the other. The plant that I added the epsom salt is having MORE problems than the other!

Soon, in fact probably today, I will start supplementing some 15-30-15 into the Miracle Gro solution






SO with all that said....obviously I am dealing with less than desireable conditions but I manage to get nice quantities and quality of bud. However I keep running into this massive problem where the leaves die from the middle of hte leaf, spreading  to the tip where the tip ends up dying and curling up

it is NOT nute burn. My guess to the problem: Lack of CO2, or heat related stress with a lack of Ca

Tips? Advice? Notice in the picture where the leaves start to die from the INSIDE OUT, turning from a green, to grey, to brown, then spreading to the tip of the leaf finally killing the latter half of the leaf and it curls upward

Thanks a lot gentlemen (and ladies!)
destroyer


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## pcduck (Dec 29, 2009)

Dude I would have to type a book for all your answers so this is just easier for me. click here


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## Tater (Dec 29, 2009)

Like duck said, just about everything you are doing is your problem.  You shouldn't water your plants everyday they need to go through a wet dry cycle.  If you are using salt based ferts like miracle grow you need to water it well and achieve a 10 percent runoff to stop the accumulation of salts in the media.  The only way to test your soils pH effectively is to get a digital meter and test the run off when you water.  You need better ventilation, man I don't even know what else to tell you other than pretty much everything you are doing is wrong but it can all be easily corrected with some reading and investing some time and work into what you are doing.

Best of luck.

And if I had to guess what the problem was I would say your pH is so far out of wack its caused a lockout due to the build up of salts in your soil.


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## Bowl Destroyer (Dec 29, 2009)

Lol guys, I appreciate your words, but I dont need a pointer to a "grow guide" I own several books and have grown for years.

As another note, 1 of 2 plants is green and healthy and thriving. However they are [again] about to hit the same problem that has plagued me for years.

I always tend to have this very SPECIFIC problem where the older fan leaves start to brown from the middle out, ultimately the end of the fan leaf will brown and curl up.

Of course I wanna give my babies the best environment possible, but with a cramped closet, it gets difficult.


Tater: yes I am aware of wet/dry cycle. I lift up the pot real quick to gauge how heavy it is,,,how much water is in there. water "as needed" lol

I will definitely take to mind "salt buildup" and will try to flush them out better. I am using a soil grow, and the old water doesn't really go anywhere except sit in the base of the pot. of course i wont drown them in their own waste...but I need a system to effectively remove the old waste water....hmmm


PH level tests  to be......wow exactly 6.5
PH level was tested in very wet SOIL, not the runoff unfortunately. My meter warns to not directly put the probe into water

One day I'll get a digital meter, but we're talking over a hundred dollars more invested


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## Bowl Destroyer (Dec 29, 2009)

here are better pictures of my bebies 

we'll be happy smoking soon
destroyer


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## jmansweed (Dec 29, 2009)

You don't have an Mg def made clear by the plant getting worse and your admittance of hard water - most likely created from Mg and Ca. It looks like your pH is high and Bloom nutes are seriously lacking - specifically potassium. Lighten your soil next grow and please, please try something other than miracle grow. It sounds also like you should water more at one time and allow things to dry for 4 or 5 days in between. Your pots need to drain - excessive water will stop air getting to your roots. Best of luck.....


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## Bowl Destroyer (Dec 31, 2009)

Jmansweed: Thanks for advice!

I have flushed both plants with maybe a gallon of clean water each, as shown


i'm going to wait several several days to water again. I'm going to start feeding them every watering, maybe every 3-4 days

I'll be using a low dosage of 15-30-15, salt based fert
I'll add 1/4 teaspoon to a gallon, every time I water, as directed



Hopefully I will see some improvement! Or they wont get any worse!


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## pcduck (Dec 31, 2009)

Bowl Destroyer said:
			
		

> Lol guys, I appreciate your words, but I dont need a pointer to a "grow guide" I own several books and have grown for years.
> 
> As another note, 1 of 2 plants is green and healthy and thriving. However they are [again] about to hit the same problem that has plagued me for years.
> 
> ...




Well with all those books and years of growing....why are you growing in such poor conditions?


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## Bowl Destroyer (Jan 4, 2010)

pcduck said:
			
		

> Well with all those books and years of growing....why are you growing in such poor conditions?




:'(   *cry

The grow was displaced (downsized, too) to my closet when we put a washer and dryer in the laundry room.


My brother gave me a GREAT fan to use today!!! I'm so happy about it, it's a window fan and will work well to circulate the air in/out the closet, and not just blow air around inside the closet.


pcduck, tater, jman: i have been watching your grows since i've been here at MP, I'm proud of em all!!
thanks for the advice guys I'll keep this thread updated in between bowls

destroyer


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## nvthis (Jan 11, 2010)

Feeding with every watering is gonna cause even more problems. Less is more. Every other watering ~or~ once every two weeks, should be plenty. Too much feed will make your grow look just like it does now. Chances are, this far into flowering, you will not be able to change the way things look. The best you can hope for is to keep it from advancing. A different nute line would also help.

*When you look at feeding schedules offered by nute companies you gotta remember one thing: Rinse and repeat! Just like shampoo baby! These folks make their money when you go through your nutes quicker than necessary. They are salesmen after all. Feeding every watering really isn't necessary, unless you like making other folks rich...


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## Bowl Destroyer (Jan 28, 2010)

Update: Day 59

Switched nutes last minute to Alaska Fish ferts
5-1-1 and 0-10-10

Fed them only once at 1/3 strength,  pinch of MgSO4 too.
watering them <1 liter every third day

Also, added small handful Garden Gypsum to each pot maybe 10 days ago. I'm diagnosing that heavy soil has built up salts making it too alkaline.

plants have shown traces of purple on their leaves in past week, interesting.
The "farther" plant has lost 80% of her green, we're going down captain 

Buds are 50% clear, 50% cloudy. sample buds give a good smoke :bong1: 

will post pic of yield,,,,expecting to crop soon. looking for slightly amber ohhhhh so good


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## dragracer (Jan 28, 2010)

Buds are looking nice!!


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## jmansweed (Jan 28, 2010)

Man things have really turned around. Nice buds.


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## ta2dguy (Jan 29, 2010)

it aint hard to see the recovery in those girls, almost like a line drawn on them when they started getting better. i am glad that you have things turned around and headed in the right direction. nice looking buds. happy growing.


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