# Ebb / Flow - How long, and often, should I flood and drain my tray?



## tobyferter (Jun 8, 2007)

Hello, I am pretty new to hydroponics and I am just now starting my first grow.  I am in the middle of setting up all of my equipment but have run into a problem.  I was wondering what the ideal conditions were for flooding and draining my system?  I am growing Lowryder #2's using big rockwool cubes (6 inches I think) in ebb and flow trays.  I am using plenty of light and will start CO2 soon.  The question is:  How long should the tray be flooded?  Should I flood and drain as quickly as possible or should i make sure that the tray is flooded for a minimum amount of time?  The next question is:  How often should it be flooded?  Thank you guys/girls for all your help.  I will keep everybody updated!  Peace!


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## Viracocha711 (Jun 8, 2007)

How deep is your tray and are you using clay pebbles(hydroton) or hygromite along with your rockwool cube? 

...on an hour off two? You can start there and watch to see how your girlies react. If they like it stay the course, if not adjust the times until you think they are happy.

BTW-If you send "Stoney Bud" a PM he can help you. He is the Hydro Master!


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## MJ20 (Jun 8, 2007)

^^x2


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## Stoney Bud (Jun 8, 2007)

Your cubes have to be covered with media of some sort. What are you covering them with?

Light can't be allowed to hit the cubes.

I set my pump to a one hour on, two hours off, cycle.


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## tobyferter (Jun 9, 2007)

Thanks guys for the input.  I don't think that I would be able to cover the cubes with any sort of media because the tops of the cubes are about two inches over the top of the tray that the gardener at the hydro store said to use.  If it is just to prevent mold from forming in the cubes maybe I can use some mylar or something on the top of the cubes?  I could just cut it to size to cover the top of the cube and put a hole in it to go around the stem.  As far as the time goes I believe I have a unique situation.  I am using a pump that floods the tray extremely quick but I drain the tray slowly (about 20 minutes).  I thought that the idea was to get them the nutrient that are needed and let it drain out of the cube so that it sucks in air into the cube to give the roots the air that they need.  I was never aware that I should also be using any other sort of media.  I am anxious to hear some of your ideas about this.  ~peace~


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## Stoney Bud (Jun 9, 2007)

A pic of your system would help tremendously. Anything light hits that has water/nutrients will form algae which in turn will ruin your grow.

Where are your roots going to grow once they get long enough to show outside your grow cubes?

Please, pictures....


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## tobyferter (Jun 10, 2007)

Thank you S.B. for your help.  I will have to get a picture up really soon to help with my inquires.  I think that I am going to get some hydroton for the bottom of the tray for the roots to play in after they start reaching outside the cubes.  What to do for the top of the cube I am undecided though.  I will not be able to have the hydroton on top of the cube because the top of the cubes are above the top of the tray they are in.  I will most likely be doing quite a bit of work on my system on Monday.  I only have one tray set up and I will be eventually using three.  I am still in the process of working out all of the kinks.  Talk to you later.  ~peace~


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## Stoney Bud (Jun 10, 2007)

tobyferter said:
			
		

> I think that I am going to get some hydroton for the bottom of the tray for the roots to play in after they start reaching outside the cubes.


 
That's a very good idea tobyf. Pile that Hydroton as high as you can in your tray and around the cubes to block the light. After a few weeks of growth, you'll see the roots all through it.

Good luck to you man.


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## tobyferter (Jun 12, 2007)

So, I am reading that I should have the tray flooded for at least a half an hour to an hour?  I am getting so many opinions on this.  I have a really fast pump to fill my tray but I let it drain slowly.  It floods in about 45 to 50 seconds and drains in about 20-23 minutes.  What should I watch for in my plants to know if they are getting enough or too much?  I also have another question if anybody knows anything about the "auto-flowering" (no veg cycle supposedly) plant called Lowryder 2.  I wonder if I should be using a veg cycle nute mix or should I go with a flower cycle mixture?  These specific nutes say not to mix together on the bottle.  I don't know if that is because it will do harm?  I would like to just use the flower cycle mix the entire time but would like to hear from people what they think.  Thanks for everything guys!  ~peace~


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## HazeMan101 (Jun 12, 2007)

I am also new to the whole hydro scene. The guy at the hydro store said I should have the pump on for a 1/2 hour, 4 times daily. Is this completely wrong because my plant seemed to be doing fairly well (it was a male so I had to toss it, but it was huge.).


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## kasgrow (Jun 12, 2007)

If your tray drains that slow just add more overflow drains. I have two in my system and it works well but every system is different. By moving more water through your system you will rinse plenty of fresh nutes past your plants roots while rinsing away any salts that may have accumulated. I use hygromite and water 1 hour on and 2 hours off and my plants are happy.


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## Stoney Bud (Jun 13, 2007)

An ebb and flow system can be set to what works best for your setup.

Experience is the true teacher.

I set mine for one hour on, two off. It works for me.

The maximum delivery of nutrients, water and oxygen is what you're after. Sure, you can trim it down. You can eat much less food and live also. You'll be skinny and not have as much energy, but it will work.

You should feed your plants, provide water and nutrients in as large of amount as the plants will take. That's the advantage to hydroponics over dirt. You can provide 100% of all the water, nutrients and oxygen as the plant is capable of using. If you provide less, then sure it will work. Just not as well.

I've been growing hydroponic weed for more than 25 years. The schedule I use works best for the plants that I grow in my system.

You guys will have to use what you think works best for you. As I said, experience will define that.

Good luck to you.


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## Object505 (Jun 13, 2007)

I am also haveing a watering issue. Only my systm I built myself. Basicly Its a drip system and Im using about 3 cups of hydrotron for each bay where a plant goes. The water drains fairly quickly from the plants pot. But it seems to stay pretty wet for at least an hour after the pump shuts off. I am trying to switch to a digital timer but it only has six on and off slots per 24 hours. So If i use the digital timer im going to have to set it up so its on 3 times during the day and 3 times at night. How long should each watering session be?

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/Gallery/showgallery.php/ppuser/6050/cat/500

you can see a picture of my home made system on that link

Any help would be appriciated. 

Paul


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## Stoney Bud (Jun 13, 2007)

Object505, just buy a better timer instead of trying to make your plants like the one you have.

Space it around the clock as often as you can until you can buy the proper timer.

Mine has unlimited on off's and it cost about 30 bucks at home depot.

I could tell you why a one on, two off cycle is the best thing you can do for your plants, but it takes a lot of typing....

With a drip system, you can keep it on at the same interval once your plants are rooted well.

Max nutrients, max oxygen. That's what hydroponics is all about.

No light hitting your fluids!!!!


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## tobyferter (Jun 13, 2007)

Hello, Thanks for the input Stoney Bud.  You said in your reply that you could explain why one on two off is the best but it would take alot of typing.  Do you know a good place for me to read about it so that I can understand it more.  It is just that I am trying to figure out how to maximize my system but I am having troubles understanding what is best for the plants.  What should I try to achieve for optimum growing conditions.  I don't want to have them too wet and I need to make sure that they have time to **** up nutes.  The problem is... I don't know what TOO WET is and I don't know how much time they do need to drink.  I look forward to your reply.  You have been helpful. ~peace~


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## Stoney Bud (Jun 14, 2007)

tobyferter said:
			
		

> Do you know a good place for me to read about it so that I can understand it more.


 
Absolutely! The best book on Hydroponics I've ever read in my life is:

*Hydroponic Food Production: A Definitive Guidebook of Soilless Food-Growing Methods, 6th Ed.*

Howard M. Resh This link also has many other hydroponic books, but I would suggest you read Dr. Resh's book first.

I haven't read the most recent couple of versions, and he added a lot of new information about the latest growing techniques in them, from what I hear.

I read the first two versions, (I'm an old guy...), and I think edition 4 or 5.

This book is considered the "Bible of Hydroponics" by many, including myself. The history, and many hundreds of examples are discussed and examined. The exact methods and why they're used.

If you buy no other books about Hydroponics, you HAVE to at least read this one. Any library can get it for you on loan as well. Just ask them about their "Intra-Library loan system" and give them the ISBN for this version, (9780880072229).

After you've read it from cover to cover, you'll have a wealth of information about Hydroponics that you never knew existed. When you have finished it, come back and ask me about what parts are different for growing a very fast growing plant such as Marijuana. It's requirements are unique when using indoors hydro. Everything is on "Fast Forward", (that's why my one hour on two off pump cycle).

I've been growing Marijuana for more than 40 years. I've been doing so using Hydroponics for more than 25 years. I wish I had the talent for writing a book and could transpose all I've learned into an instructional guide, but alas, I'm way too busy having a life.

Good luck man!


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