# Why do my plants end up being so damn tall and skinny?



## Getmelifted (Feb 11, 2010)

I veg for 4 weeks and flower for 6-10 weeks (Im always running different strains)
No matter what strain I run the plant always ends up 4ft tall and always wants to fall over.

The most Ive gotten out of one plant is just over 1 ounce

I think I may be able to achieve more weight if I can keep the plant at 3ft and get it alittle bushier that way the light hits all of the plant and not just the first 2ft

Im running a 400w HPS for 6 plants.

So how do I go about keeping it short and just make it bushy?

OH, and it seems my dad has been reusing the soil. I just found this out.  Im guessing he should NOT be re-using the soil after we harvest a plant and then putting a new clone in it correct?


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 11, 2010)

Getmelifted said:
			
		

> I veg for 4 weeks and flower for 6-10 weeks (Im always running different strains)
> No matter what strain I run the plant always ends up 4ft tall and always wants to fall over.
> 
> The most Ive gotten out of one plant is just over 1 ounce
> ...



Tall skinny plants with long internodal spaces are generally caused by inadequate lighting.  When figuring lighting, the number of plants is immaterial--lighting needs are figure by square footage.  You want 3000 lumens per sq ft for vegging and 5000 lumens per sq ft for flowering.  So a 400W HPS is good for around 9-10 sq or a space about 3 x 3.  How large is your grow space?  What is your ventilation set-up?   

There are techniques that help keep plants shorter (topping, supercropping, LST), but if you have inadequate light, you are still going to end up with sparse plants and low yield.


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## Getmelifted (Feb 11, 2010)

PuffinNugs said:
			
		

> dont re use the soil, crap just builds up in it. have you tried using a MH conversion bulb for veg or maybe soemthing you can get closer. idk.
> 
> how far you keep the light from the plants, how many times has the bulb been used (cycles)? all varibles
> 
> a 400watt is pushing the limit on 6 plants unless you keep them very small


 
Sorry for flowering we use the 400w HPS.  

For vegging we use 2 T8 bulbs?  Something you would see hanging up in a garage.  4ft long 2 of them side by side and I got the one with the lumnes meant for plants.  Cant member the exact kelvin number but it seems to work just fine.

For flowering the light is about 2ft above the plant and it always grows right up into it.  But its hard to lower the plant because we are constantly cycling in new plants.

Harvest 2 one week and put 2 new ones in, and then 2 weeks later harvest another 2 and put 2 new ones in.  That way every 2 weeks we have about 2oz worth.

Im reading alot of people getting 1.5-2.5oz per plant and Id atleast like to get 1.5 instead of barely breaking 1.0oz

I think keeping it short and fat will help it produce more since the light can probably hit more of the plant that way

Dont people crop them somewhere to keep them short?


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## ozzydiodude (Feb 11, 2010)

Are you growing in a inclosed area? if so how big? 

A 400 watt light is good for about 9 square feet. 

try keeping the lights as close as possible without burning your plants 8 to 10 inches no more than 18 inches.

You should keep the flouros 1 to 2 inches from the light at all times this will help keep the plants from streaching


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## zem (Feb 11, 2010)

you can grow 6 plants and more under 400w if you keep em small. how far your light from plants is more important, i think your keeping light far away. i keep my 400 at 8"-12" away depending on heat


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## Getmelifted (Feb 11, 2010)

The Hemp Goddess said:
			
		

> Tall skinny plants with long internodal spaces are generally caused by inadequate lighting. When figuring lighting, the number of plants is immaterial--lighting needs are figure by square footage. You want 3000 lumens per sq ft for vegging and 5000 lumens per sq ft for flowering. So a 400W HPS is good for around 9-10 sq or a space about 3 x 3. How large is your grow space? What is your ventilation set-up?
> 
> There are techniques that help keep plants shorter (topping, supercropping, LST), but if you have inadequate light, you are still going to end up with sparse plants and low yield.


 
Id like to change out the vegging lighting.  What would you recommend on a budget and something that wont strain the electric bill TOO much.  I can deal with another 15-20 a month.

I plan on totally revamping the flowering room.  right now the light is in the closet and alot of light hits the wall.  I want to hang it from the ceiling so the light will travel in all directions.
Put my plants in 2 lines of 3 and then wrap the area in some reflective material.  Then hook up a CPU fan to blow the hot air from the bulb out the window.

Temps are about 67-75degrees most of the day, but its been kinda dry lately so I opened up the window to let in some nice fresh air.


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## Getmelifted (Feb 11, 2010)

zem said:
			
		

> you can grow 6 plants and more under 400w if you keep em small. how far your light from plants is more important, i think your keeping light far away. i keep my 400 at 8"-12" away depending on heat


 
That could be part of the problem.  I guess that could be the problem of cycling in plants.  Im not able to lower light to their level since I already have other plants in there that are already at 4ft tall.
The new plants that are just starting their flowering stage are about 2-2 1/2'


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## ozzydiodude (Feb 11, 2010)

Your plants need fresh air at all times in more areas a 400watter won't add but about $25 a month.

 The smaller better contained a area is the better the lights will work as long as you get the heat out of the area.


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## nouvellechef (Feb 11, 2010)

You need to re-tool your set up. answer the above about how many sq ft and get some pics up.


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## thestandard (Feb 11, 2010)

veg with the hps, keep it as close as u can without burning the plants and u'll be fine...

new soil every time too.


....if u cant LOWER the lights because of tall plants.. stand the plants on something to raise the plants TO the light!


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## dman1234 (Feb 11, 2010)

set the light as close as possible to the larger plants and it is important imo to have a fan blowing across the canopy, the area between the top of your plants and the light bulb needs to have good air flow, then you can get em close. find the spot under the light where you can hold the back of your hand without burning it for 20 seconds thats where your canopy should be. the smaller plants can be raised up so you have an even canopy. 
also what size pots do you have? you should be able to get them way closer than 2 ft. good luck

Got any pics?


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 11, 2010)

I also run my grow so that I am cycling plants in every 10 days to 2 weeks, so I too have plants of all sizes.  The solution to this is to raise the smaller plants with buckets, milk crates, etc, so that you have an even canopy.  My lights stay in the same place.  I recommend air cooled hoods so that you can keep your light closer.  You never did tell us how large your space is?  And IMO, you need more than CPU fans for ventilation.  I like to exchange the air in my space 3-4 times a minute.

This is what I use for vegging:  hXXp://www.htgsupply.com/viewproduct.asp?productID=49346
I find that it gives me close internodal spacing and dense bushy growth.  I have 2 400W MH that I do not use to veg any more because I like the T5s so much.


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## nouvellechef (Feb 11, 2010)

I have a feeling hes not to sure how much this growing thing can cost to have it dialed.


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## PUFF MONKEY (Feb 11, 2010)

2 T8's is not enough to veg under..not even close... i use 16 T8's over a 3x3 tray.


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## Getmelifted (Feb 11, 2010)

I think for vegging I will switch to a 400w MH or HPS depending on what I can pick up for a better price.  I had great success with a MH for vegging when I grew years ago.
I wish I could be at the house everyday but I cant so I rely on my dad who is failing me cause hes lazy.  But I will not give up we just need to change things up a bit.

The grow space is in a closet and the plants are bunched together.  Approx 2 1/2' x 5-6'


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## pcduck (Feb 11, 2010)

t-5's work great for veg and use the hps for flower.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 11, 2010)

pcduck said:
			
		

> t-5's work great for veg and use the hps for flower.



:yeahthat:


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## Jericho (Feb 11, 2010)

How much does each 54w t8 give off in lumens?


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## Growdude (Feb 12, 2010)

Ive beeen vegging with the HPS, works great.


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## nouvellechef (Feb 12, 2010)

I think I might switch it up a bit. Either run all HPS all the way thru, more lumens is more lumens. Or mix the light, 3-1, HPS-MH.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 12, 2010)

Jericho said:
			
		

> How much does each 54w t8 give off in lumens?



I know nothing about the T8s (do they come in 54W?), but the 54W T5 puts out 5000 lumens.  They are slightly more effective (lumen per watt) than a 400W MH, although they do not have the penetrating power of a MH, they also do not have the heat.


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## leafminer (Feb 12, 2010)

*right now the light is in the closet and alot of light hits the wall.*

- Nobody else noticed this? Looks like one of the problems right there.


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## Jericho (Feb 12, 2010)

The Hemp Goddess said:
			
		

> I know nothing about the T8s (do they come in 54W?), but the 54W T5 puts out 5000 lumens. They are slightly more effective (lumen per watt) than a 400W MH, although they do not have the penetrating power of a MH, they also do not have the heat.



 Thanks THG

Your right i dont think they do. so one 54w t5 gives out 5000 lumens, thats not bad so for a space of  9 sqft 6  bulbs should work fine for vegging.


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## BOSTON BAKED BEAN (Feb 12, 2010)

I  use cfls  and  my plants  are  smaller and  very very,, bush,,,    like  everyone said  more lummens mabie  they  are not hitting the plants or  what  leafminer said could be it right their ,,,,,


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