# Sexual Maturity



## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

Hi People!
I read that intermittent nodes is a sign of sexual maturity... also that some people just wait till a certian age and switch their plants over to 12/12. My WW is only 35 days old but I notice her recent leaf growth has 9 fans or spikes (?) on her leafs (still no intermittent nodes) . Do the number of fans or spikes have anything at all to do with maturity? Is 9 about the max? Thanks! 
OHC


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## 2Dog (Nov 20, 2009)

Hmm I just go by when they show sex..as sexualy mature. once I see balls or lady parts I call it. some people do put them into 12/12 to get them to flower and show sex.I have never done it...good morning BTW lol... i dont really pay attention to that other stuff.


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

2dog good morning. I dont understand the answer you gave. So you just do nothing? No light schedule change? No certain amount of days? hmmmm thanks but I was really thinking I'd take a more proactive approach hehehe. Hope that doesn't sound sarky hun. xox

So once again, my question is do the number of spikes or points on a leaf have anything to do with sexual maturity and readieness to go 12/12 for sexing? Anyone ?


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## legalize_freedom (Nov 20, 2009)

Number of leaves doesn't mean anything.  somewhere after the 4th node you should start seeing pre-flowers, either a little nub if it's a male, or 2 little hairs if it's a female.  At 35 days you should be really close to haveing pre-flowers if you have not already.  But I've never grown white widow.  look at your nodes closest to the top of your plant, where the leaf and branch meet the main stem, you should have 2 hooks, or spurs, or spikes, whatever you want to call them.  Inbetween the branch/leaf, and the ,main stalk you should see either a couple hairs coming froma small calyx, or a small nub or what looks like a male pollen sack.  I saw some good pics on here somewhere of pre-flowers, I think 4U2 had a link to them.  I hope I didn't confuse you!  I like the new avatar....I love brown eyes...like deep puddles of muddy water on a sunshiney day!  I hope I helped!


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

thanks LF. Obviously I am confused on sexing.... so if I spoke out of turn to 2dog please forgive me, it was out of ignorance. I confess I have really really bad vision so I need to go find those pics and might just have to wait it out till evidence of male or female is much more noticable. What I am seeing does have two two lil "hairs" but earlier on I've seen this and the hairs have always turned into two leaves so I can't get to exicited. Def no nubbs at this time.... 
thanks for the avatar comment. I've said before I just love your hot dog. He could do with a dab of mustard . 

And thanks for the info on the leaves. 

Charging the camera batteries now in case I need to post for outside opinions. 

OHC


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## Kupunakane (Nov 20, 2009)

Yo Ho there OldHippieChick,

    I think that you are going at everything ok. I can certainly understand the question you have too. In my case, I grew my W/W until she was the size I was happy with, of coarse she was a clone, but that same idea still goes. I don't care for auto's since I wish to grow to a size that I like. Sometimes I do get a couple of males in there, always a bummer, unless I want beans.

  Should you feel that your baby is grown enough that your interested in flipping the lights, then do it. remember also that your lady will tend to grow a full third of it's current size, so you can add that to your calculating the space you have, and it obviously does speak pretty loudly when your near ready to flip. Your going to start wondering how to deal with a plant that is getting too big for it's britches if you catch my meaning.

 NO, the leaves, and their points mean nothing unless you have something of a genetic goof like I did. My clone of the W/W grew up as a 180* degree phyllotaxi . She turned out perfect all the same.

 Good luck, can't wait to see those pics. feel free to take a look at my grow posts. Remember that W/W is sensitive to nutes during the flowering stage, so careful, and easy does it.

 Here is some *GREEN  MOJO*
for you, and yours...

th_GreenMoJo 1.jpg


smoke in peace
KingKahuuna


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## ozzydiodude (Nov 20, 2009)

I has been my experence that most plant start showing sexual maturity at 6 to 8 weeks when started from seeds.


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## 4u2sm0ke (Nov 20, 2009)

legalize_freedom said:
			
		

> Number of leaves doesn't mean anything. somewhere after the 4th node you should start seeing pre-flowers, either a little nub if it's a male, or 2 little hairs if it's a female. At 35 days you should be really close to haveing pre-flowers if you have not already. But I've never grown white widow. look at your nodes closest to the top of your plant, where the leaf and branch meet the main stem, you should have 2 hooks, or spurs, or spikes, whatever you want to call them. Inbetween the branch/leaf, and the ,main stalk you should see either a couple hairs coming froma small calyx, or a small nub or what looks like a male pollen sack. I saw some good pics on here somewhere of pre-flowers, I think 4U2 had a link to them. I hope I didn't confuse you! I like the new avatar....I love brown eyes...like deep puddles of muddy water on a sunshiney day! I hope I helped!


 

:yeahthat:



Thanks Brother:48:    Heres  the  the  one I  use  now...OHC..Give  a  shout  Girl ....as  ya  can  see  we  are  all  here  to  help..http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?p=488099#post488099


Hope  this  elps   Take  are and  be safe:bolt::bong:


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## Kupunakane (Nov 20, 2009)

I thought that this one might give you a added bit more.

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16565


smoke in peace
KingKahuuna


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

thanks for the prompt and informative responses people!
thanks for the MOJO KK.
these are both excellent links! I'd seen the one you linked to KK but I'd not noticed the newer one 4u2 - thanks!
Soooo while the batteries continue to charge (yawn).... I have been skitzing like a skitzer :hubba: on my poor plant. If it is a female she is def feeling violated this evening.... if it's a guy he owes me dinner and a few drinks . 
Well I DO have intermittent nodes (gee whiz these glasses rock when I can find them!).
I'm leaning toward what Ozzie said..... I need 1-3 more weeks. Be back with pics at least by tomorrow. Have a great Friday night my friends. xox
OHC


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## 2Dog (Nov 20, 2009)

OldHippieChick said:
			
		

> 2dog good morning. I dont understand the answer you gave. So you just do nothing? No light schedule change? No certain amount of days? hmmmm thanks but I was really thinking I'd take a more proactive approach hehehe. Hope that doesn't sound sarky hun. xox
> 
> So once again, my question is do the number of spikes or points on a leaf have anything to do with sexual maturity and readieness to go 12/12 for sexing? Anyone ?


 
i do nothing but veg and feed em for 6-8 weeks when they show sex I throw em out (males) or clone it and throw it into flower if female..I dont rush things because I like big plants. If I really was in a hurry though i could throw it under 12/12 at 4 weeks...some people do from clone I have heard...flowering the plants forces it to show its sex early either with buds or balls...when you see the two hairs and a slight hair above it thats a female.. once u see it u know. I have have a moby **** planted 9-17 that still hasnt shown sex..I havent put it into flower simply because I dont want to have to reveg the clone...I hope that makes sense.. People who are not owrried about sex flower whenever the plant is the size they want and keep an eye out for balls. wow I am stoned and tired and supossed to be going to friends tonight...yowzers.


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

2dog My tent is 5 feet tall and I'm subtracting a foot for light, fan and filter clearance..... another foot for pot height and that just leaves three feet between plant base and toching the light.... I'd think I need to flip no later than 18" tall if what KK says is true about the 1/3 additional growth and just to be sure I'd probably need to top it and clone those cuttings before flipping......


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## ozzydiodude (Nov 20, 2009)

What about distance from the light to keep the tops from burning? Plant can easily grow 1/3 to to 1/2 their height when flowering first starts.


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## DonJones (Nov 20, 2009)

OLDHIPPYCHICK<

If your white widow is an autoflowering variety it will do better with no change in light cycles from what I have read.  Also if it is an autoflowering variety it will switch itself when it is ready regardless of what you do to it and not before.

I thought WW was always an autoflowering but now I'm seeing a lot about it being normal rather than auto.

Will somebody help out here? Is WW available as both a normal and autoflowering variety or just one type and if so which type?

Good smoking


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## legalize_freedom (Nov 20, 2009)

At first it was available as regular seed, and femenized, then sometime later they came out with the auto. 

 I like to let mine veg for awhile to if I have room, so haveing pre-flowers allows me to see sex earlier, so I can get rid of males before I switch to 12/12, that then gives me more room to let just the girls spread out a little bit more in veg, take clones etc, and then I can switch to flowering.  Mine are just over 4 weeks old and the males are showing pre-flowers, the females have not shown yet.  So now I pick the male I like the best to get pollen, and chuck the other 3, that frees up alot of space! 

 I read tonight (can't remember where) that not all strains will show pre-flowers.

 Get them pics hippy chick, let us be your eyes!


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> What about distance from the light to keep the tops from burning? Plant can easily grow 1/3 to to 1/2 their height when flowering first starts.


 
It'll be tight when they top out Ozzy. I can remove the light yoyos and that would mean the light would be 7" from top of tent.... I am under the impression after reading GJs that the mature plants can comfortably be as close as 10" to the light... It's a cool tube with fan so I think I'll be safe with a max height of 33"plants. As I said, I'm thinking I might ought to top off before flipping.


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

legalize_freedom said:
			
		

> Get them pics hippy chick, let us be your eyes!


 
Promise to make it high :ccc: priority tomorrow LF.
OHC


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## Locked (Nov 20, 2009)

OldHippieChick said:
			
		

> It'll be tight when they top out Ozzy. I can remove the light yoyos and that would mean the light would be 7" from top of tent.... I am under the impression after reading GJs that the mature plants can comfortably be as close as 10" to the light... It's a cool tube with fan so I think I'll be safe with a max height of 33"plants. As I said, I'm thinking I might ought to top off before flipping.



Hve you thought about training them? Lst is not hard at all...I just drilled holes every 2 inches around my pot and use pipe cleaners to bend them over... I bend them a lil more once a week....it will help you with your height issues...


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 20, 2009)

Yes Hamster. I'm open to whatever and cloning and LST seems the best route - short and wide .... You know how I've struggled with germination and autos. Of the 4 short stuff and 5 more WWs I germinated and put in rapid rooters 3 1/2 days ago, only 2 WWs have popped up. LMAO I have like a 20% propagation rate. That must be the worst on record here. It's like the universe is trying to tell me to go with the white widows and get over it.


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## Locked (Nov 21, 2009)

OldHippieChick said:
			
		

> Yes Hamster. I'm open to whatever and cloning and LST seems the best route - short and wide .... You know how I've struggled with germination and autos. Of the 4 short stuff and 5 more WWs I germinated and put in rapid rooters 3 1/2 days ago, only 2 WWs have popped up. LMAO I have like a 20% propagation rate. That must be the worst on record here. It's like the universe is trying to tell me to go with the white widows and get over it.




Don't beat your self up...to be honest I hate those rapid rooters for seed starting... I am lucky if i hve a 15% success rate. They work great for clones but not so well for starting seeds..you might want to germ them in the paper towel and then go right into moist soil.. the straight to soil method has worked a lot better for me...


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## ozzydiodude (Nov 21, 2009)

:yeahthat: go with one of the pro-mix seeding starter they work better for me but I clone in just Pro-mix to. Take a look at Super simple cloning http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42786


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## DonJones (Nov 21, 2009)

I'm still not sure if WW is available from seeds as both a normal and flowering variety or just as autos now.  Which is it?

Thank you.

Good smoking


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## ozzydiodude (Nov 21, 2009)

Hey Don the WW listed on Nirvana is NOT a auto in its description


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 21, 2009)

Don,
Mine are not autos. Sorry I didn't answer directly earlier. I got mine at marijuana-seeds.nl. Mine are not fem. I got them as part of a three pack.


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## Locked (Nov 21, 2009)

DonJones said:
			
		

> I'm still not sure if WW is available from seeds as both a normal and flowering variety or just as autos now.  Which is it?
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Good smoking



As far as I know there is no actual WW Auto...There is the White Dwarf which as far as I know is not the WW...


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## Strawberry Cough (Nov 21, 2009)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> I has been my experence that most plant start showing sexual maturity at 6 to 8 weeks when started from seeds.



I agree:  preflowers start at about 6-8 weeks.


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## Strawberry Cough (Nov 21, 2009)

OldHippieChick said:
			
		

> Don,
> Mine are not autos. Sorry I didn't answer directly earlier. I got mine at marijuana-seeds.nl. Mine are not fem. I got them as part of a three pack.



Did you risk your seeds coming in a package marked "The Netherlands" over the stamp?  It would seem to me that this is risky because any package from the Netherlands would raise suspicion of customs officials.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Nov 21, 2009)

OldHippieChick said:
			
		

> 2dog My tent is 5 feet tall and I'm subtracting a foot for light, fan and filter clearance..... another foot for pot height and that just leaves three feet between plant base and toching the light.... I'd think I need to flip no later than 18" tall if what KK says is true about the 1/3 additional growth and just to be sure I'd probably need to top it and clone those cuttings before flipping......



I would really be for flipping them before they got 18"--I really think they will outgrow the space.  Start them shorter this first time and see how much they stretch--sorry, KK, but I have never had a strain that only increased by 33%, most strains I grow double or triple in height.  I cannot tell you how much you are going to hate it if they grow into the light and you have no additional height.

You should be able to see alternating nodes without glasses.  I have had some strains that produce preflowers before they get alternating nodes.  The hairs and balls are the hard part.  Although new growth does look somewhat like hairs, I believe that after you have seen a few females, you will be able to tell the difference. (this will take glasses, however)


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## Hick (Nov 21, 2009)

DonJones said:
			
		

> OLDHIPPYCHICK<
> 
> If your white widow is an autoflowering variety it will do better with no change in light cycles from what I have read.  Also if it is an autoflowering variety it will switch itself when it is ready regardless of what you do to it and not before.
> 
> ...



the widow was "never" an auto, untill recent crosses with ruderallis, therefore making it not White widow at all IMO. But a WWxrudy cross. 


> I would really be for flipping them before they got 18"--I really think they will outgrow the space. Start them shorter this first time and see how much they stretch--sorry, KK, but I have never had a strain that only increased by 33%, most strains I grow double or triple in height. I cannot tell you how much you are going to hate it if they grow into the light and you have no additional height.


I agree with this too. most strains, plants tend to _at least_ double in size once flowering is initiated. 
LST.....


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## legalize_freedom (Nov 21, 2009)

Strawberry Cough said:
			
		

> I agree: preflowers start at about 6-8 weeks.


 
I have pre-flowers right now, at 4 weeks, at the 5th node.


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## Strawberry Cough (Nov 21, 2009)

legalize_freedom said:
			
		

> I have pre-flowers right now, at 4 weeks, at the 5th node.



Cool!  What strain?


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 21, 2009)

I slept in till mid afternoon so off to a slow start. Camera battery charger didn't work so found another and havn't given up on getting *pics today*.
I *DO* have alternating nodes. Blimey!  
This is day 36 so I'm baredly at the six week mark and I'm 90% sure I spotted evidence of a *female* last night after staring at and shining a spotlight on every single cm of the main stem till my eyes crossed - so got a smirky grin on my face but will refrain from calling it for the time being. In the weee hrs I read on another forum that the placement of the lil pistols is never directly on the main stem like the male is. This coincides with what I've identified on my plant. 

I measured and at the moment the total height including the pot is 19.5" and a width of 18". She's short and wide so if this IS a female I'm gona take some clones and flip her any moment. I'm with you Hemp Goddess - I need to test this tent and would rather flower early for less yeild than have a problem in a month. Pics before the days end - promise. 
Respect to Hick and Goddess and all my favorite friends for the feedback! I feel so blessed that you're watching my back. 

more later.
OHC


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## legalize_freedom (Nov 21, 2009)

Strawberry Cough said:
			
		

> Cool! What strain?


 
AK47xCinderella99

I'd flip the lights to, I usually do between 12-18" just this strain I'm growin now is in slow motion, I want to take clones first, and the longest branches are maybe 4" and still pretty flimsy stems, and only have about 3 sets of tiny leaves.


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## DonJones (Nov 21, 2009)

Legalize freedom,

You can flip them and still take clones.  It just takes longer for the clone to root.

For the qualifications you list, I think you probably will be totally able to clone for about 2 to 3 weeks after you flip them.

Good smoking.


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 21, 2009)

So tell me whatcha think? I'm pretty sure this is what all the fuss is about.


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## monkeybusiness (Nov 21, 2009)

I see hairs. It's a girl. 
Congratulations!


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 21, 2009)

Thanks monkeybusiness. Man it's been a month of learning - it's so exciting and I have no one in my world to share my excitement with except here - so I'm feelin' all warm and fuzzy for MP tonight. 
Here's another from the top. Ain't she pretty!?!
xox
OHC


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## monkeybusiness (Nov 21, 2009)

Well you've earned it! She's quite pretty indeed. 
     We like that warm and fuzzy feeling.:hubba:


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## ozzydiodude (Nov 21, 2009)

OldHippieChick said:
			
		

> So tell me whatcha think? I'm pretty sure this is what all the fuss is about.


 
That little baby doll could make the Playboy cover :laugh:
The bunny is already in the picture.

:aok: GROW GREEN Mojo :watchplant:


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## Locked (Nov 22, 2009)

100% female...congrats


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## legalize_freedom (Nov 22, 2009)

DonJones said:
			
		

> Legalize freedom,
> 
> You can flip them and still take clones. It just takes longer for the clone to root.
> 
> ...


 
Yeah thanks I know that I "could" but a few more weeks of Veg will be better, I got rid of a bunch of Afghani #1 that has hermi'd on me the last 3 grows, so now I only have 6 plants to go into flower, and lots of space, so I may as well take advantage of the space, and let these girls get big and bushy, also allowing me to take plenty of clones, that will be a little more stable, and mature/healthy.  These shoots right now are very small and inmature.

CONGRATS HIPPY CHICK!.....it's always nice to see them lil hairs!


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## OldHippieChick (Nov 22, 2009)

ozzydiodude said:
			
		

> That little baby doll could make the Playboy cover :laugh:
> The bunny is already in the picture.


:rofl: 
Thanks for the mojo Ozzy
Thanks for all the congrats guys!  
Time to read up on cloning.


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