# Super soil? Soil questions.



## EsC420PoT (Feb 15, 2015)

So I am starting my outdoor grow here soon. Now I've grown 6 outdoor grows and have always use just basics, never really putting much effort into the soil due to my main focus being hydro. Literally would buy FoxFarm ocean forest, and then feed via nutrient water from the FF nutrient line when needed. Other than that, nothing to the soil... Now I see all these people making their "super soil" or adding dolomite lime, and this or that. Which I understand the benefits of this. But is it really necessary? I mean is it really going to make a difference in potency and yield over just using FF soil and feeding with whatever nutrient? I mean of course it will vary depending on what line of nutes, but I'm getting more into outdoor, and was curious of the benefits of making your own organic soil as opposed to doing what I stated? Also, as of now with my FF mix and nute line, what would anyone recommend me mixing in the soil for added benefits? Any help or constructive criticism is greatly appreciated, thanks.


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## Rosebud (Feb 15, 2015)

I will give you my 2 cents worth. I had my outdoor (native) soil tested. I found out what it needed and added it. The roots go down a long way and the FFOF doesn't go that far if your in the ground as opposed to pots.

I would never add lime to my native soil as it is so very alkaline. But the soil tests are not expensive and it is worth a lot to know what you have that is  good and or depleted minerals..

Do you work the FFOF into your own dirt now?


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 17, 2015)

I think that it depends on whether you want to grow organic or not and the condition of your native soil.  The super soils most use are organic, so the soil feeds the plants.  When you feed with synthetic nutrients, the nutrients feed the soil.  Most of my soil is so clayey that I cannot grow much of anything outdoors without amending my soil huge amounts.  I mostly grow in raised beds and containers.      

Rosebud, I'm confused by your comment about not using lime.  Alkaline soil (above 7.0)would probably benefit from lime as it tends to be more acidic and cannabis is a plant that likes a soil on the acidic side (below 7.0).  Can you explain this so that I can see if I can get my head around it as I am not understanding?


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## Rosebud (Feb 17, 2015)

When I had my outdoor dirt tested it was way alkaline. The master gardeners and the soil testers both recommended to not use lime here in this soil as it alkalizes (is that a word?) the dirt even more. It is like planting next to concrete, it oozes lime... trees die.


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## pcduck (Feb 17, 2015)

What did they recommend?


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## EsC420PoT (Feb 18, 2015)

Rosebud said:


> I will give you my 2 cents worth. I had my outdoor (native) soil tested. I found out what it needed and added it. The roots go down a long way and the FFOF doesn't go that far if your in the ground as opposed to pots.
> 
> I would never add lime to my native soil as it is so very alkaline. But the soil tests are not expensive and it is worth a lot to know what you have that is good and or depleted minerals..
> 
> Do you work the FFOF into your own dirt now?



From what I've read, Lime doesn't add or lower the PH at all, it neutralizes it at 7.0. So if it's higher or lower than 7.0, the lime instantly balances to 7.0 (at least according to what I've read)
Yes that's exactly what I'm doing. I dig up about maybe 4 gallons of my actual dirt, (I sift it threw a screen to get out as much plant matter and rock as possible, then mix in about 10 gallons of FF. The soil up here is full of fertilizers as I'mm up in the woods. So I feel it'd be a great combo, but we'll see as this mixing might cause some random variables.. So per every 15 gallons of dirt I use, it will be mixed with about 4-5 gallons of natural dirt. Also, I am planting them in 20 Gallon Grow bags. I'm not growing straight into the ground.



The Hemp Goddess said:


> I think that it depends on whether you want to grow organic or not and the condition of your native soil. The super soils most use are organic, so the soil feeds the plants. When you feed with synthetic nutrients, the nutrients feed the soil. Most of my soil is so clayey that I cannot grow much of anything outdoors without amending my soil huge amounts. I mostly grow in raised beds and containers.
> 
> Rosebud, I'm confused by your comment about not using lime. Alkaline soil (above 7.0)would probably benefit from lime as it tends to be more acidic and cannabis is a plant that likes a soil on the acidic side (below 7.0). Can you explain this so that I can see if I can get my head around it as I am not understanding?


  Yes I to am growing everything in raised pots or beds. I add as much FF soil as I can ontop of the ground ( I used a rototiller for a good 2-4 ft down ward, then build a bed on top (not for my weed plants but just saying in general) for my Babies They will always be separate in Grow bags or pots. And as you stated, I do want to do 100% organic, but this time around I don't mind as apparently my "organic nutes" aren't really organic after all... So I guess in time I want to do 100% organic, but for now, I guess I just want to know what I can add to this mix while stil using my FF liquid nutes and FF soil?



pcduck said:


> What did they recommend?



Hey PC duck! Long time no see brother!


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## Rosebud (Feb 19, 2015)

pcduck said:


> What did they recommend?



That has been so long ago, i would have to find the sheet from the soil experts. What i remember I think is gypsem, sand, manure, epsom salts...alfalfa.... that is all i can recall.


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## EsC420PoT (Feb 21, 2015)

SO would it not be worth adding anymore to this FF mix if I plan on using liquid nutes? The soil mixture is only if I plan on not using nutes, but more so feeding constantly from the soil? SO thus, am fine with my current method?


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## Rosebud (Feb 22, 2015)

Ffof is a complete balanced food. No nutes are necessary for  5 weeks or so..


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## Droopy Dog (Feb 22, 2015)

EsC420PoT said:


> SO would it not be worth adding anymore to this FF mix if I plan on using liquid nutes? The soil mixture is only if I plan on not using nutes, but more so feeding constantly from the soil? SO thus, am fine with my current method?



Yes, current method is fine.

DD


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## EsC420PoT (Feb 22, 2015)

FOR SURE!!! thanks guys, I just wanted to make sure I was feeding enough. So when it comes to the soil, you only add such nutrients in the soil for it to last the duration of the plants life. If I use liquid nutes, then no need to add all these other ingredients into the soil? Thanks. Im well aware that after said amount of time, I need to stat adding nutes via watering, but what I was asking is if I should add anything to the soil if I still plan on using liquid nutes. apparently not. Thanks yall!


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## IQof420 (Feb 22, 2015)

fox farm is good but owned by monsanto,give just right xtra a try, even better without, corp.support:aok:


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## EsC420PoT (Feb 23, 2015)

IQof420 said:


> fox farm is good but owned by monsanto,give just right xtra a try, even better without, corp.support:aok:


IM just curious, how is it you joined this forum in 2008 and this is only your 14th post?? No offense, Ill research what you suggested as I am always open minded towards growing advice, but, will take what you said with the smallest grain of salt...


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## IQof420 (Feb 23, 2015)

First off no offense taken,2nd take it how you want look it up,how do you have 319 post since 2010?cmon dude!This site is not about me!


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## Rosebud (Feb 23, 2015)

IQof420 said:


> fox farm is good but owned by monsanto,give just right xtra a try, even better without, corp.support:aok:




Please in all that is holy tell me this isn't true.


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## pcduck (Feb 23, 2015)

From Fox Farm web site.



> Fertilizer Company
> 
> FoxFarm is a family business dedicated to producing the finest quality garden products available anywhere. We are proud of our reputation for uncompromising quality and supreme customer service.


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## Rosebud (Feb 23, 2015)

THANK YOU DUCK....that freaked me out a bit.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 23, 2015)

FOX FARM IS NOT OWNED BY MONSANTO!

I hate to shout, but I want to make sure everyone heard me.  As duck stated, it is a family owned business.  http://foxfarmfertilizer.com/index.php/frontpage/about-us.html


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 23, 2015)

EsC--While you do not necessarily need to add things to feed the plants, you may need to add things to the soil to maintain the right density and draining capabilities.  Most soils can benefit by having things like perlite, gypsum, peat moss, manures, etc added to the native soil.  My soil is so bad that I bring in soil for everything.  However all soils are different.  It would probably be a good idea to get yours tested like Rosebud did and get your soil tested.


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## IQof420 (Feb 23, 2015)

SORRY, if I fed the rumor mill,but I thought for sure I heard/read(in high times i thought) they were bought by scotts,same time the products started showing up at home depot.But I'm glad to be wrong!


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## Rosebud (Feb 23, 2015)

IQ, don't ever scare me like that again. ha... I really really really really hate monsanto, so I am very relieved.


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## IQof420 (Feb 23, 2015)

Sorry again,lol,I hate them too,I heard the scotts rumor a few years ago and never used their stuff again,but was it was good and easy.


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## umbra (Feb 23, 2015)

420... adding gypsum( a form of lime) is not as much about changing the ph as it about aeration of the soil. When soil is compacted, it is about the electrical charge of the dirt molecule. Without the electrical charge of gypsum, the molecules stick to other with no space between the molecules for air or water. By affecting the electrical charge the molecules repel from each other enough for aeration. Similarly adding perlite is for the same reason. It is more about the cation ion exchange rate that you are affecting. Humic acid will also change the electrical charge of the soil molecule to allow air and water all around it.


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## EsC420PoT (Feb 25, 2015)

IQof420 said:


> First off no offense taken,2nd take it how you want look it up,how do you have 319 post since 2010?cmon dude!This site is not about me!


Lol! Um... WHat?!?! First off, there was a time I was not online for a few years... what does that have to do with anything? I have been on this forum and reading since 2010... Which should show you that I don't post unless it's WORTH POSTING! AS opposed to what you do,  blurt out the first random knowledge you heard or read of some UN-authenticated info some where... The number of posts has nothing to do with how much info this site has to offer you.. What you think 300 isn't a lot of posts so you therefor think this site isn't for you? Lol! Eh, it's your funeral bro. DUde... like from every response I've seen you respond with, just shows you don't know the first thing about ANYTHING you preach about.... Just do use all a favor, or at least me, and go flex your stunted, naive knowledge somewhere else. Or at the least FAR FROM MY THREADS!!!! Now if you want to take a step back, and start learning, feel free to read!! Good luck...


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