# Need Cal/Mag? Week 7 flower getting rough...



## bombtombadil (Mar 14, 2022)

Is this a classic calcium deficiency? Brown spots on leaves, yellowing etc.. or a lockout?

Nutrients in use: Fox Farm Trio and fox farm bloom solubles. Sensi Calmag,+4-0-0 (I really wish this was lower in N but its all I have for now.) and Molasses
PH 6.2 or so
SpiderFarmer SF-1000 10-12 inches from tops.
Humidity 35-40, Temp 72 day, 70 night.

I'm feeding lightly half strength once per week following the fox farm feeding schedule.

Edit, Not having flowers on my plant got to me and I tossed this in the garbage over night at week 6 or so. I woke up and felt bad for it and decided to let her finish. I think I might have some flowers this time, but I still don't really understand what a bud is. 3 weeks to go if she can make it.


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## Carty (Mar 15, 2022)

Maybe yes, if your not giving it any... a shot of Calmag would be loved and buds should look a little better to..  but, I wouldn't panic to much with it being older growth.  Espcially if your backing off the N it could just be stealing it from within itself being a mobile element.  Looks like some slight clawing though and leaf tip burn.

You give her a light flush yet ?   I would.  Just enough to get rid of that filmy look the water gets and get it to run clear.. then hit it with calmag and PK booster, molasses.  after that,  close to water only and more flushing at wk 9.

your on track for a nice harvest.  I ran a SF1000 for years and still have it in my 2x2x4 tent..  just with the dimmer switch was more easily accessed huh?   

luck


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## bombtombadil (Mar 15, 2022)

Yep, the SF-1000, its perfect for my needs. Pretty amazing for under 100 watts of power. (less than a light bulb) Yes, mine has a dimmer but I'm on 100% the whole time, waisted on me. 

I flushed a few weeks ago but think your right, a mini-flush might be perfect. I'm not watering to run-off and Its very possible I have some salt build up. 

My pictures here aren't great and the yellowing and browning is advancing very fast. I'll post back in a day or two.


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## OGKushman (Mar 15, 2022)

You have a micro nutrient deficiency like Molybdenum, Zinc, or Boron; or a combination of a few. Buy a quart of GH micro and feed it ~4ml/gal with some of your bottled water. 
They should really appreciate it.

But, for how far they have come it really isn’t that bad.


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## OGKushman (Mar 15, 2022)

these spots here circled in light green are an indication of what’s to come later circled in orange and that looks like micro nutes, not an NPK problem. A lot of micro nutes, most actually, give similar looking issues when deficient.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 15, 2022)

OGKushman said:


> these spots here circled in light green are an indication of what’s to come later circled in orange and that looks like micro nutes, not an NPK problem. A lot of micro nutes, most actually, give similar looking issues when deficient.



So, I'm, pretty disappointed that the Fox Farm feeding schedule leaves you with deficiencies. Thanks much for your advice, I have been meaning to buy a micro nutrient solution and will grab one fast. I really appreciate it!


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## OGKushman (Mar 15, 2022)

bombtombadil said:


> So, I'm, pretty disappointed that the Fox Farm feeding schedule leaves you with deficiencies. Thanks much for your advice, I have been meaning to buy a micro nutrient solution and will grab one fast. I really appreciate it!


Different strains require more or less of everything in the spectrum. That’s why there’s so many types and flavors.


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## Growdude (Mar 16, 2022)

bombtombadil said:


> I'm not watering to run-off and Its very possible I have some salt build up.
> 
> My pictures here aren't great and the yellowing and browning is advancing very fast. I'll post back in a day or two.



My vote is lock out due to salt build up. This looks like what I was telling another member here about not watering until runoff.
It shows up later in flower with burning edges and gets worst fast.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 16, 2022)

Growdude said:


> My vote is lock out due to salt build up. This looks like what I was telling another member here about not watering until runoff.
> It shows up later in flower with burning edges and gets worst fast.



Yes, but understand that the only reason I don't water to run off is that the plant gets very unhappy if I do. This is with Fox Farm Happy Frog and a very healthy dose of perlite added. Watering till run-off isn't an option, I wish it was.

I did flush her a few weeks ago, I'll have to try one more time. Its getting real bad real fast.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 16, 2022)

I came out with scissors last night and mangled her at week 7.5 flower. Not good ! I cut away half the buds and leaves. Hopefully this will keep the nutrient demands down. 

Thanks for the help all, but I think I can chalk up my number two grow to failure once again. It was doing so good too !


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## pute (Mar 16, 2022)

Not a failure....a learning experience.  All beginners experience some problems until dialed in...I think you can nurse them all the way home.  Don't give up.  I cut out N, cal/mag  and some suppliements 30 day from harvest and some strains fade faster than others...gotta learn to relax and be durable....


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## bombtombadil (Mar 16, 2022)

I'm going take a long growing break after this one, four months is too long to go only to have failure in the last two weeks !

I'm good, I'll get some leaves to smoke for a while, no flowers-- but someday.

Next grow I'm moving to 5 gallons soil and a shorter Veg. I'm thinking my plant was taking more than the soil could provide.


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## choxie (Mar 17, 2022)

Wait why did you cut the buds off?  I guess maybe save those and let your plant continue maturing the rest of the buds.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 17, 2022)

choxie said:


> Wait why did you cut the buds off?  I guess maybe save those and let your plant continue maturing the rest of the buds.



My last grow, I chopped off a lot of leaves due to some soil issues. This is my second grow and for learning purposes, I wanted to see what would happen if I let the plant grow on its own with minimal HST (chopping). It was a bad idea. I wound up with a huge thick pile of leaves and popcorn buds at the bottom of my plant that (according to my newbie theory) are using up resources my main colas can use.

So, I chopped half of all the small buds that were lower than 50% the height of my top buds. I also removed a lot of leaves, mainly leaves that were blocking light and dying. I know it's not good cutting this late into flower, but it's do or die at this point. Whatever deficiency I have is moving way too fast, and I don't want brown leaves on my flowers !

I'll try adding Dynagrow bloom (need to purchase) tomorrow as it contains micro nutrients my plant may be needing. I doubt it will work fast enough to save my plant, but we'll see.

Side note: This plant was trained with its main stem bent horizontal. (to keep her low in my small space) I also topped this plant twice during Veg.

Pic: here is my popcorn taken early so that my plant can focus on the bigger buds. (day 3 drying--yes I use cigar boxes, I love them for drying.) Who knows, this stuff might even get me high...the trics are clear and cloudy.


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## choxie (Mar 17, 2022)

Ohh I see what you mean. I thought you harvested the top colas and we're banking on the smaller popcorn ones to grow. 
I'm only leaving 6-8 colas and I'm chopping the extra leaves and branches and I think this should work well.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 17, 2022)

choxie said:


> Ohh I see what you mean. I thought you harvested the top colas and we're banking on the smaller popcorn ones to grow.
> I'm only leaving 6-8 colas and I'm chopping the extra leaves and branches and I think this should work well.



Nice, sounds like you have a plan. I think I may be learning that soil is key, when you run out of soil, nutrients can keep you going, but they are tricky. In short, I think if I had used 5 gallons of soil instead of 2.5, this wouldn't be happening so soon. I'll go 5-7 gallons next grow with one plant!

6-8 colas is probably just right, I got greedy ! (had around 20, have 14 tops now).


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## choxie (Mar 17, 2022)

Well I use around 3 gallons of soil (only half filled my octopot) but it has a large 6 gallon water resivoir that I filled up with nutrients similar to hydroponics so the roots are all down there.

I was just reading that with people with plants of my size 2 feet so far during 2nd week of flower that 6-8 would be appropriate in my 18 inch by 18 inch growing area (total is 18x36 and I have 2 plants).

The smaller branches, at least what I've seen, grow useless popcorn buds and use up too much nutrients or resources that detract from producing large main colas.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 17, 2022)

choxie said:


> Well I use around 3 gallons of soil (only half filled my octopot) but it has a large 6 gallon water resivoir that I filled up with nutrients similar to hydroponics so the roots are all down there.
> 
> I was just reading that with people with plants of my size 2 feet so far during 2nd week of flower that 6-8 would be appropriate in my 18 inch by 18 inch growing area (total is 18x36 and I have 2 plants).
> 
> The smaller branches, at least what I've seen, grow useless popcorn buds and use up too much nutrients or resources that detract from producing large main colas.



Yep, I should have removed the lower growth early, lesson learned!

Your in the same size space as me, 18x18. Its not perfect, but its teaching me to keep my plant low and to keep all of the tops at the same height. This really takes advantage of your light. (In my case less than 100 watts) I'm not sure how folks with tall plants get good indoor light down to the lower branches. It seems to me you want all your flowers right at the top getting the best light they can. A few inches light movement makes a HUGE difference in the amount of light a plant is taking in. Tall plants and high powered lights seem to be a waist of electricity to me, but maybe I'm just jealous that I have such a small space.

1-2 ounces with a power draw of less than 100 watts is pretty cool. I turn the light off in the kitchen at night and break even with electric costs !


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## choxie (Mar 17, 2022)

So I'm very similar!! Mine draw around 105-110 watts ish ( I have two of them) and I try to save on my electricity bill. I don't even run a fan inside my tent as it would consume around 30 watts. I have my 6 inch outlet fan running at 50% power which draws 25 watts total and is able to move enough air that the plants move a little. 

If memory serves me correct, you're growing northern lights yes? Our indica strains (mine being purple punch) doesnt really grow that tall as long as your lights are somewhat close (I'm always at 12 inches no matter) and my plants have done ok ish with lst and top cropping. 

If I may suggest, veg + bloom and cal mag is all you really should need. If you look at studies, supplement with sucrose (sugar of any kind), organic and whatnot doesn't make a difference as long as the relative ratio and concentration of the nutrients are there. Organic components just break down to the constituent nutrients anyways and also I don't want to lug around a large container of bat guano or work castings or make some organic tea.

Also you don't need to flush and you can just do regular pH'd water the last 2 weeks according to all the research I've done and it'll come out the same. 

Also this whole notion of nutrients and chlorophyll degredation is just a load of **. I'm a biochemist and my father was a botanist. Chlorophyll has a short half life and degrades with time relative to temperature.

I'm just going to give heavy nutrients during early mid flower then just give water as to not waste excess nutrients.

Lastly, I've noticed in my octopot that the pH tends to shift upwards and upon contacting the makers of octopot, they say that's normal as when plants uptake nutrients the pH tends to go up. So if you're growing in soil only, you may need to water at a bit lower. I never checked the pH of my runoff when I was in soil but when I went to the octopot and checked the reservoir the pH would jump from 5.9 to 6.9 in 1-2 days after the plant uptook the nutrients.

These pictures are now on 1.5 weeks of flower. It'll be interesting to see what we both get as a yield since I've messed up a lot so far. My plants almost died 3 times, then over watered, underwatered, didn't pH my water, then forgot to add perlite, etc.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 17, 2022)

choxie said:


> So I'm very similar!! Mine draw around 105-110 watts ish ( I have two of them) and I try to save on my electricity bill. I don't even run a fan inside my tent as it would consume around 30 watts. I have my 6 inch outlet fan running at 50% power which draws 25 watts total and is able to move enough air that the plants move a little.
> 
> If memory serves me correct, you're growing northern lights yes? Our indica strains (mine being purple punch) doesnt really grow that tall as long as your lights are somewhat close (I'm always at 12 inches no matter) and my plants have done ok ish with lst and top cropping.
> 
> ...




Any chance you tied your own trellis net? I did, my space is so small I figured how hard can it be to make a net? It wasn't that easy, but a little twine and a few tries  and I'm good to go.

Are you talking about Dynagrow Veg and Bloom? I understand these nutrients are very simple to use and I'm tired of "wondering" what's in the fox farm snake oil. How can I troubleshoot or fix a deficiency when I have no clue what's in half the bottles? As far as I understand, Dynagrow has your micro nutrients taken care of for you. (Micro/ Macro? Not sure, have the same problem with camera lenses....)

Your setup looks amazing, that's a lot more space than I'm using. Have you considered bending the main stalk horizontally during early veg? It seems to help keep everything level and takes many inches off the height.


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## choxie (Mar 17, 2022)

So I didn't tied my own trellis net it's just the usual 6 inch ones by vivosun and attached with some zip ties. 

I don't know what the parent company is called but if you Google veg + bloom it's the first one up there and it'll take your plants all the way through. You just have to adjust the concentration and it contains all the micronutrients.  

I believe that the fox farms is good to start your plants in due to it being pH'd correctly and contains some nutrients for early veg, then after that you have to add your own. 

My space is 18 x 36 x 60 inches so it's really not big at all. Luckily I'm patient as I found some retail bud for $8 for bottom bag buds for 1/8 oz. Bottom bag stuff is good enough until mine replace it!!!


Btw I loved your first post "I dont know what bud is". It gave me a great laugh that I haven't done in years!!!!  It really brightened my day!


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## bombtombadil (Mar 18, 2022)

choxie said:


> So I didn't tied my own trellis net it's just the usual 6 inch ones by vivosun and attached with some zip ties.
> 
> I don't know what the parent company is called but if you Google veg + bloom it's the first one up there and it'll take your plants all the way through. You just have to adjust the concentration and it contains all the micronutrients.
> 
> ...





Glad you enjoyed that post, and I'm still unsure exactly what a bud is.. Harvest coming in a few weeks, hopefully I'll figure it out !

I grabbed some Dynagrow Bloom to take care of my macro nutrient needs, I'll be watering with it tonight.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 20, 2022)

OGKushman said:


> these spots here circled in light green are an indication of what’s to come later circled in orange and that looks like micro nutes, not an NPK problem. A lot of micro nutes, most actually, give similar looking issues when deficient.




Thanks! There are a lot of possibilities as to what's going wrong here but I appreciate your advice on Micro-nutes. I'm using a Dyna-grow product (Bloom and Mag Pro) and just watered with Bloom tonight. I know it's a bit late but I'm hoping the plant get what it needs. It's worth a shot I guess.

I'm 8 weeks in, leaves are yellowing and moving up the plant fast. If it progresses into my flowers, I'll chop early.


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## spunom (Mar 20, 2022)

Man... My first few grows yellowed the same way. I never knew why. I ran them the whole way to ripeness anyway (~30% amber trichs) and got some good smoke out of them. Don't get discouraged. I can't see your trichs, but your overall plants look close to the finish line to me. I'd finish them out to ripeness if they were mine yellow leaves it not. Just my two pennies.


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## OGKushman (Mar 20, 2022)

dyna grow 1 part grow formula didnt fix micro deficiency. Of all the products out there I tried this before doubling my micro GH3 part.
Yellow nug is free of chlorophyll, so that’s one positive


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## bombtombadil (Mar 20, 2022)

spunom said:


> Man... My first few grows yellowed the same way. I never knew why. I ran them the whole way to ripeness anyway (~30% amber trichs) and got some good smoke out of them. Don't get discouraged. I can't see your trichs, but your overall plants look close to the finish line to me. I'd finish them out to ripeness if they were mine yellow leaves it not. Just my two pennies.



Trics are mainly cloudy now with a few clear, no amber. I grew the same strain last grow and went 70 days of flower, I still had very few amber trics. Nothern Lights is supposed to be a fast flowering strain, going 7-9 weeks in flower. I plan to try for 75 days this grow, watching for amber trics. Hopefully she can make it another three weeks!

Side note: raising my lights 2 inches has really slowed down the yellowing. (12 inches from flower tops, I was at 10)

I'm also watering a 3 gallon pot with 1 gallon of water. (I was using 1/3 to 1/2 gallon water). I'd like to think these "mini" flushes help clear any salt buildup if there is a problem there. My runnoff water is yellow with a PH of 6.2


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## bombtombadil (Mar 20, 2022)

OGKushman said:


> dyna grow 1 part grow formula didnt fix micro deficiency. Of all the products out there I tried this before doubling my micro GH3 part.
> Yellow nug is free of chlorophyll, so that’s one positive



You used dyna grow Grow and still had deficiencies? not good news for me ! I'm outta tricks at this point.


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## bombtombadil (Mar 20, 2022)

spunom said:


> Man... My first few grows yellowed the same way. I never knew why. I ran them the whole way to ripeness anyway (~30% amber trichs) and got some good smoke out of them. Don't get discouraged. I can't see your trichs, but your overall plants look close to the finish line to me. I'd finish them out to ripeness if they were mine yellow leaves it not. Just my two pennies.



Chopping early stinks and I want to avoid it. It seems to me that the last few weeks are very important as far as bud weight goes, I really want these to plump up! So far all flowers look very healthy and I'd like to think the plant is eating its fan leaves to make her flowers bigger (wishful thinking). My last grow, the brown leaves crept into my flowers making very ugly buds. I want pretty buds this time !


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## spunom (Mar 20, 2022)

bombtombadil said:


> Chopping early stinks and I want to avoid it. It seems to me that the last few weeks are very important as far as bud weight goes, I really want these to plump up! So far all flowers look very healthy and I'd like to think the plant is eating its fan leaves to make her flowers bigger (wishful thinking). My last grow, the brown leaves crept into my flowers making very ugly buds. I want pretty buds this time !


You'll get there homie. Just don't sacrifice all the time you got invested in this. You'll regret it I've had uglier plants than that give me decent buds


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## bombtombadil (Mar 20, 2022)

spunom said:


> You'll get there homie. Just don't sacrifice all the time you got invested in this. You'll regret it I've had uglier plants than that give me decent buds



It's all good, I'm learning but the more I learn, the more I learn that I have a lot more to learn. I'm not only on weed forums but am all over the place learning how plants and gardening works. I may be a newbie, but I'm not a blind follower and do question many of the things many growers do. Example? The nutrient flush the last two weeks of flower --I'm not buying that. I'm not saying its wrong, I'm just saying I question things and think about them...I want to understand exactly what's going on, not just follow some snake oil sellers feed schedule.

And I'm still not exactly sure what a bud is. Is there anyway to go live here with some folks during trim time? I'll show you why I'm confused as to what a bud/flower/cola/ is...

Out of curiosity, on a scale of 1-10 how bad is this grow looking? ) (1 bad 10 good)


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## bombtombadll (Mar 29, 2022)

This is Bombtombadil, I was silly and changed my email so folks couldn't see it. Not a good move if you reset your password wrong. Anyway, I have some updates coming. My harvest is in a week, she is still a bit rough but the flowers are getting heavy and look great.


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## SubmarineGirl (Mar 29, 2022)

The yellowing looks ok imo this close to harvest I would ride it out
dont chop early you will have wasted all your time on this pretty plant wait till the trichomes are right


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## Bugus_Monkey (Mar 29, 2022)

As you get closer to the very end sometimes the buds will suck out many of the remaining goodies and nutrients stored up in the leaves while they are finishing. I have had that happen several times. Usually it is just bigger fan leaves though and not the sugar leaves coming out of the actual buds.


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## bombtombadll (Mar 29, 2022)

SubmarineGirl said:


> The yellowing looks ok imo this close to harvest I would ride it out



So, I looked at some pictures that Nirvana had for its Northern Lights buds. Guess what, the plants look just like mine! The leaves are yellowing, flowers getting big and plump.

This is my second grow of the same strain, and it did this last time too. (Around week 7) I'm starting to think this might be normal or at least I'd like to think so.

I'll probably harvest when trics turn cloudy and forget about amber. I've been all over the internet on this, and I'm not alone waiting for amber trics that never come. The buds I trimmed a few weeks ago look amazing ! A nice light green with red hairs, I love it. I also sampled the early buds and the high is so different than late harvesting. My buds from last harvest (10 weeks) make me head for the couch. My Early buds (week 7) have me up jamming on my guitar. So, I'm thinking 9 weeks total this time is good middle ground.


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## bombtombadll (Mar 29, 2022)

Bugus_Monkey said:


> As you get closer to the very end sometimes the buds will suck out many of the remaining goodies and nutrients stored up in the leaves while they are finishing. I have had that happen several times. Usually it is just bigger fan leaves though and not the sugar leaves coming out of the actual buds.



My last grow was like that until the end of week 10, buds looked great, almost all fans leaves were in bad shape. It did start to creep into my sugar leaves towards the end. Its a real hassle getting all of those brown sugar leaves off the bud especially if you dry trim, I'll wet trim this plant.


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## bombtombadll (Mar 29, 2022)

Frosty ! Smells so sweet, like honey and the smell of a dollar bill. (if that makes sense).. I swear I could roll in these buds instead of wearing cologne.


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## bombtombadll (Mar 30, 2022)

Dad, are we there yet?

Temp hanging in at 72, humidity 37%. I'm thinking 1-2 weeks max. They say if you're not sure, add a week.

Newbie Whining:

I've researched Northern Lights probably more than any human alive. I've tallied almost 100 NL grows, and the average harvest time was 56 days after 12/12---Its supposed to be a fast flowering plant and almost all breeders say 7-9 weeks, (Many warn to start checking at week 6 and some finish that early) It took me 2.5 weeks from 12/12 to flower, I'm almost in week 10. So the question, is it 7-9 weeks or 7-9 weeks + 2.5 weeks? It really pisses me off that half of the breeders recommend flower time from 12/12 and half from flower start. Whining complete.

90% of my pistols are dark now. Pictures below were taken today with a Nikon DLSR and a old manual focus 55 mm Macro Lense. (I'll make them look better next shot to show trichomes better.)

The Dyna Grow helped, great stuff. I'm using Bloom and Mag Pro. (Fox farm trio in the trash can)


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## bombtombadll (Mar 30, 2022)

If anyone remembers my "I don't know what a bud is, " thread, this may explain why I'm confused as to what a bud is. If you look at the cloth pot picture above, take a look at the big cola all the way to the left. The very top is obviously a flower. (I get it) What I don't get is the massive pile of leaves piling up in the middle and lower end of the cola. Is that flower or just leaves? Now, I'm off to research lollipop-Ing plants. I have a feeling I'm missing an important step if it is all leaves at the bottom.


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## WeedHopper (Mar 30, 2022)

lockedout said:


> This is Bombtombadil, I was silly and changed my email so folks couldn't see it. Not a good move if you reset your password wrong. Anyway, I have some updates coming. My harvest is in a week, she is still a bit rough but the flowers are getting heavy and look great.


Yep you had us Mods trying to figure out why the hell you were trying to log in under a different name.
Fking stoner


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## bombtombadll (Mar 30, 2022)

WeedHopper said:


> Yep you had us Mods trying to figure out why the **** you were trying to log in under a different name.
> Fking stoner



Feels good to be back, there are really good people here. I tried another forum and it's a constant argument there. (people arguing with each other). No fun.


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## bombtombadll (Apr 3, 2022)

Harvest---Day 67 Flower. Cola's weighing over an ounce each wet weight after trimming. Not bad for a newb with 97 watts of light and a 1.5x1.5 grow area?

I just thought I'd update this thread if anyone's been watching. Smell is delicious, like Honeysuckle and sugar. Now that I think of it, this smells exactly like honeysuckle.


















1.7 Ounce from this medium cola, trimmed. (wet)


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## CrashMagnet (Apr 3, 2022)

Pretty amazing harvest for one plant. You should patent your secure growing setup.


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## bombtombadll (Apr 3, 2022)

CrashMagnet said:


> Pretty amazing harvest for one plant. You should patent your secure growing setup.



Nah, I'll share if anyone is interested. What I love is seeing is folks that get less weed with lights that cost 10 times the cost of my Spiderfarmer SF-1000. I see too many people growing Xmas tree style plants with big lights, but the tops don't get the light they need. With a trellis net, training and topping, I can easily out do those huge expensive lights. (Although I'll concede that those good lights done right will kick my butt)

1 plant, 97 watts or less light, and 1.5x1.5x 5 space =3 ounces? Dry weight to come, wet I'm around 18 Oz trimmed. We'll see how far the little spiderfarmer can take you. (drying now, I'll weigh again at end). It uses less power than a lightbulb !

I see your in Va, DC area? I'm ten minutes out of DC.


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## CrashMagnet (Apr 3, 2022)

I'm in Hampton roads a couple hours from DC. There seems to be a lot of us in this area.


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