# Seed Qualities! The rise of a phenomenon....



## Nova (Oct 7, 2007)

Is it just me or have there been an outstanding number of people of who are gettin really bad germ rates? 

I looked at vitocorleone's topic and the Nirvana Seeds topic, and it just seems that alot of people are having issues, even people who have grown for awhile with almost 100% success rate are having problems.

Seems that there very well could be ALOT of bad stock floating around the banks lately from the breeders. Of course, the breeders or the banks will never admit to this, but what else could explain this phenomenal rise in people gettin 0% germ rates from seeds?

Anyone else have an idea about this, something they would like to add, an opinion, or feel the same way as i do?

:holysheep:


----------



## 85cannabliss (Oct 7, 2007)

yeah ive had problems with some early misty seeds. ok, they were bought in may and 4 germed of 5. but i put 3 into germ, then nothing. probs just a few crap seeds, but just thought id add to this


----------



## LLCoolBud (Oct 7, 2007)

The quality of a seed I beleive is directly linked to the breeders skills and over all goals. Many breeders work purly for profit so I beleive thier stock will suffer but in reality the only real thing that could cause seed qualitys to be lower then others is lenght of time the breeder alows the seeded plants to mature. For some of you who don't know a seeded plant takes quite a bit longer then a unseeded plant to finish and those extra days really do help the seeds have more vigor and chance of survival if finished properly. 

With that being said also know what your getting. Many breeders are providing f2s and various forms of knockoffs of strains some are ok some are not so good and are gross misrepresentations of the original strain. As long as you know whats going into a strain or where it comes from thats the best way to tell if the seeds will be quality.

:holysheep:Thats alot of typing haha.


----------



## g-13 (Oct 7, 2007)

you guys took the next topic right out of my brain. ive always ordered from the doc his service is garbage now and the nirvana seeds are junk also. does anyone know of a place with good quality seeds/genetics as well as service. i think we all put alot on the line with growing to be getting all this garbage service.


----------



## upinarms (Oct 7, 2007)

Well quit germinating them, put them in soil and water the soil. Let God do the handy work!!!


----------



## Nova (Oct 7, 2007)

upinarms said:
			
		

> Well quit germinating them, put them in soil and water the soil. Let God do the handy work!!!



Well, for example....

I order a set of Nirvana White Widow and Northern Light beans. I planted all 20 beans that i got in soil, every precaution was taken, i use a sterile soil, under a 175w MH Hydrofarm bulb, in an enclosed greenhouse with more than adequate ventilation, using a germination chamber. I got a 0% germ rate, thats right, 0 out of 20 seeds sprouted, its been about 3-4 weeks, and i have still been doing the upkeep on the soil, providing water and such, and still no sprout. 

So sometimes the nature way is not necessarily the most successful way. However Doc, after a little bit of a hassle, did send me another batch of northern lights, although i would have preferred White widow. I just germ'd those in paper towels, and only 2 out of the 5 seeds put in the towel have developed a taproot, thats not even 50% germ so far!

So alot needs to be said to the breeders or the banks, one of the two. I have never had such disaster with seeds, i have germed the same way, using soil, for 2 almost 3 years now, using bag seed. I have learned alot from this site and what to expect, the precautions that need to be taken, and i have not only forked out alot of cash to grow an actual strain instead of bagseed. In fact, i have 2 HPS 400w still in the box waiting for these strains to grow big enough so i can use them, its like having $500 just sitting there and doing nothing. Not to mention the money spent on strains, i got the nirvana strains cuz people had good success with growing them, they are relatively easy to grow, and put out a decent smoke. I had really planned on buying some awesome strains like DJ Shorts F13, Blueberry, Flo! However, with the way the breeders and banks have been lately, im losing faith in them and their quality. I bought from a bank because i was under the impression i was buying quality seeds, not gettin some bag seed. If i wanted bag seed i would have kept my stash and not thrown it out. 

I know im not the only grower who feels this way! 

To the breeders and banks, if you provide quality they will come! Seriously...


Now thats alot of typing and griping!


----------



## Stoney Bud (Oct 7, 2007)

I've got to speak up for Nirvana. I've had nothing but great results with their seeds. 80 seeds, 80 sprouts, 80 females.

That's with 6 seperate orders over a couple of years.

Nova, step by step, exactly what did you do when you used the paper towel method. How long was it before you opened the towels and looked? How many times did you look?

Were the seeds in slightly moist towels in a sealed baggie? Were they in constant darkness? Room temps?


----------



## MarPassion (Oct 7, 2007)

I have had a lot of seeds from Nirvana too and I experienced also 100% germination rates. It's been a few years I did this so don't know what the case is now, but i'm prepared to take a new test and see how they will do now.

I find it strange though.

Let me know what to order and I will order them myself and test it out. 

And please tell me not to buy the most expensive seeds lol

Marp


----------



## bombbudpuffa (Oct 7, 2007)

I've ordered quite a few Nirvana strains. All germed but 2 lil runt seeds out of a mixed pack. Theres a lot of things that could make germ rates low and its not always the breeder and most definitely not a bank that resells. Take into account how many times a day the doc probably gets resend requests.


----------



## Stoney Bud (Oct 7, 2007)

MarPassion said:
			
		

> Let me know what to order and I will order them myself and test it out.
> 
> And please tell me not to buy the most expensive seeds lol
> 
> Marp


 
Ok, lets see....

1. Bright Blueberry Orange Mowie Afghani Widow  $2,000 per/seed

hehe

Nova says she had her problems with Nirvana White Widow and Northern Light.

I've got some Nivana WW I'll be growing soon for a Mother plant. It'll be a few weeks before I can start them tho.


----------



## bombbudpuffa (Oct 7, 2007)

Yummy...White Widow.


----------



## Nova (Oct 7, 2007)

I waited exactly 48 hours, no peeking, and room temps were anywhere from 70-72! Complete darkness, i put a couple pairs of pants on top of them so even if the drawer was opened, there shouldnt have been any light hitting them. 

I pulled the two that germed out and planted in soil, just like you said stoney. I used a pair of surgical tongs to handle them so there was no risk of me even touching the tap root. The tongs were sterilzed using a solution of hydrogen peroxide, rinsed, and thoroughly wiped clean with a new paper towel. I dug a very-very small hole, i would call it a divit, whatever. I put the seed in the soil, tap root down, and covered it and gently gave it some gentle taps to firm it up like you said. I went and got some bottled water and put some in my hand, and let it drizzle a bit on top of the soil, carefule not to get it too wet, but also enough to keep the surrounding soil moist to the touch. Now they are sitting in my germ dome, waiting to sprout, so we will see. I have followed all directions given to me for using the paper towel method, so lets see what happens!

Keep in mind, im not bashing anyone, the breeders, the banks, or the growers. Im just saying its been a bit odd lately that people have been having a hard time with germ rates, and i find it a bit odd. Especially since some of the growers arent n00** to growing, like myself. I dont want anyone to feel i am attacking them under any cicumstances, im just trying to bring something to the surface, and by us all working together on it, im sure we can find the problem! Even if this grow doesnt workout, i still plan on buying soem F13 from Doc and i am going to try ordering from a couple of other banks as well, just to be sure. 

I have been trying to grow some nirvana white widow and northern light. My first batch of seeds were green in color, and all my bag seed ive ever grown the seed has all been a little tannish or dark brownish. They were also a bit more oblong compared to the batch i recently i got, so maybe the seeds were harvested early, a possibility, but still no facts to support it other than my word. Im solid in my word, but even i need more convincing than that! One last thing, the reason i went with Nirvana is because ive heard nothing but good things about them from all of you! I wont just go buy from a breeder unless they are a reputable breeder. Im thoroughly convinced nirvana is a good breeder, until facts prove otherwise! Im still convinced Doc is a good bank, until facts prove otherwise! Just wanted to throw that in!

The dilemma continues!

p.s.

Stoney, im going to check on those other 3 seeds now.... :hubba:


----------



## bombbudpuffa (Oct 7, 2007)

> i am going to try ordering from a couple of other banks


Sorry about your seeds man, thats terrible. Good luck with the next batch. I hope they all sprout and are ladies for you.


----------



## Nova (Oct 7, 2007)

UPDATE!

I put 5 seeds in a paper towel, and i got 5 tap roots, which is 100% gemr rate. I now have 5 germs sittin in soil waiting to sprout. This is good...

Still doesnt explain the previous 20 seeds not germing at all....as the only thing i am doing different reall is using this paper towel method instead of natures own way. 

Could maybe just that specific batch of seeds been bad, like i said my recent batch looks almost entirely different! 

Also, it seems the more bulbous the seeds are the stronger they are, as one seed that i got was almost perfectly spherical and its tap root is twice the size of the seed in a matter of hours! Not that i have just noticed that, but its definately something i have observed with these seeds!


----------



## bombbudpuffa (Oct 7, 2007)

> I put 5 seeds in a paper towel, and i got 5 tap roots, which is 100% gemr rate.


...Good luck man.


----------



## Stoney Bud (Oct 7, 2007)

Nova said:
			
		

> UPDATE!
> 
> I put 5 seeds in a paper towel, and i got 5 tap roots, which is 100% gemr rate. I now have 5 germs sittin in soil waiting to sprout. This is good...
> 
> Still doesnt explain the previous 20 seeds not germing at all....as the only thing i am doing different reall is using this paper towel method instead of natures own way.


 
There are too many variables with the soil method to determine what caused your problems. There is a real reason why a Marijuana plant grows thousands of seeds. The odds of a successful germination was thousands to one.

That's the natural method. Thousands of seeds to one plant.

By performing the exact, perfect method to germinate, the success rate will be much, much better.

I'm one of those people who can stick a broom in the ground and grow a tree. It's one of the few things I'm good at.

Good luck to you Nova.


----------



## MarPassion (Oct 8, 2007)

> My first batch of seeds were green in color, and all my bag seed ive ever grown the seed has all been a little tannish or dark brownish. They were also a bit more oblong compared to the batch i recently i got, so maybe the seeds were harvested early, a possibility, but still no facts to support it other than my word.



This is certainly not a good sign. White Widow or Northern Light seeds should be brownish and with tigerish stripes. Purple Power seeds are different, they're much smaller and some how the shell comes of and you have them look pale green, but germ rates were always good for all of them.

Maybe there was just a bunch of bad seeds from the breeder, but they never should have sold these in the first place, that's certainly not a good thing to do.



> Ok, lets see....
> 
> 1. Bright Blueberry Orange Mowie Afghani Widow $2,000 per/seed
> 
> hehe



Haha Stoney, could you lent me some money for this, I know you're a rich man ;-)

I will order some White Widows then. I will report how it goes here.

I will order


----------



## ktownlegend (Oct 8, 2007)

honestly for germ i do it exactly as nature does it. every year after the winter when spring hits the ground thaws out and plant life starts to grow. 

so for my germ method i take all beans choosen for the grow and toss them in the freezer for at least 24 hours. then i place them in small cardboard plant starter cups and set them in a small dish of water until the cup is completely saturated along with soaking the soil. 

set the babies in the window ledge. 

a couple days later i got sprouts in a 100% germ ratio.   freeze and plant 20 seeds----have 20 sprouts. its when i have more sprouts than seeds is what gets me.


----------



## Stoney Bud (Oct 8, 2007)

ktownlegend said:
			
		

> honestly for germ i do it exactly as nature does it. every year after the winter when spring hits the ground thaws out and plant life starts to grow.
> 
> so for my germ method i take all beans choosen for the grow and toss them in the freezer for at least 24 hours. then i place them in small cardboard plant starter cups and set them in a small dish of water until the cup is completely saturated along with soaking the soil.
> 
> ...


 
Nature drops the seed on top of the ground directly from the plant. That's it. Nothing else.

You're using cupboards, freezers and cups and window ledges. How is that "exactly as Nature does it"?

The germination rate for a wild plant is one out of a thousand seeds. The method you use is totally man made and works because of it. There's nothing "natural" about how you're germinating your seeds. That's my point.


----------

