# Stoney im calling for you!!! Need help..



## can of ownage (Nov 27, 2006)

Hey there guys and ...err Stoney.. but i really kinda need your help here REAL soon..im about to get a go ahead and go hydro from here on out but this isnt my area of expertise AT ALL and need your help putting up a decent setup but need help with EVERYTHING. i walked out to my lighting store today and found that the lights there are 16 a pop for just a bulb and its 100 for a ballast kit (not including fixtures or anything) and just wanted to u to tell me exactly what it is that would be best . i dont really know the space ill be dealing with just yet but ill let u know exactly what that is when i find out..like i said i cant find any local hps at 600 watts and so far the only thing i really know for sure is that this is going to kill my $$$ but its alright. i kinda have to take this slow so dont worry about things being done quik. so far all i really want is just to setup just 2 plants..ive seen your 25 gallon setup but think thats a bit much for me right now.all i was really thinking of was getting some decent sized buckets and turning them into an ebb and flow with some piping but for now all i kinda really want to know is how much lights im going to need and the basic principle behind pumps....what output in going to probably be using and your calculations on lumens so yep...ill be checking up on this everday so ill check in tomorrow sometime and hopefully tell u the deminsions im going to be working with ( a closet is all i knwo now)...anyhow thanx for any info stoney and ill loik to filling the info gaps in so i can get this running and going....


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## CheebaCheeba (Nov 27, 2006)

Damn!!!! Callin you out Stoney. Maybe a PM would be better.
My 2 cents about cost on HPS.... Look on Ebay or other internet wholesale stores... Works fo me...
BTW these forums are full of all the info that you asked.
There is no specific "best" thing to do in growing MJ. Its subject to the individual grower.
Good luck


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## Elephant Man (Nov 27, 2006)

Ummm, we would all like to help you but without even knowing your room size yet, not sure what to say.


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## can of ownage (Nov 28, 2006)

well i just got the demensions today and the truth is the room is bigger than what i need it for...its about 5' by 6' and about 7 to 8 feet tall... all i really wanted to do is grow some for my personal use and mayb have a little bit extra to sell to a good freind or just stash away for hard times. Like i said i thought about getting 2 or 3 black decent sized buckets and using pvc piping and setting up an ebb and flow out of that... u know what im saying? so in the event of anything i just to set up a table and drill and make the right holes and proper fixtures and close the section off with some black and white poly which would keep in light.the table wouldnt be big but just enuff to cover the area i need... so the rest of stuff i need some guidance on. i dont know what pump im going to need to keep 2 or 3 buckets going and all that or what the proper lumens i would need or anything so if any1 could actually explain to me how that works in the process of telling me what i would need so i can learn as i go would be great.Ive never worked a timer in my life....not even the little circle cooking one...i dont know if a single 400 watt light is going to do for 2 or 3 plants ( i KNOW it wont ) or if i need a fixture or what...the guys at the light store gave me a HARD time about what i needed an hps for...told me i should get a flood light if i was going to light a backyard or get metal halides rather than hps and all the while im telling them i need an hps not a mh so if they could just help me out and sell me what i need and not preach to me what they think i need i would appreciate it.....things r going VERY smoothly.... 

for right now im more focused on the more expensive things which would be the lights and nutes.... i have a local hydro store just need to go find the damn place....its out in the middle of nowhere so idk ill have to look it up some time...as for a pump, if i get more output than i need will the pump be like a gyser?like water on the ceiling lol?....idk i think im just overly paranoid...im the type of person that more focuses on the plant rather than the growing medium so in hydro i know the basics of how all systems work but dont know much of anything on the specifics...

so a couple of questions at the end of a LONG story :

1.what should i look for in a hps other than quantity (other than how much i need to make sure the plants will get enuff lights)
2. what pump would work for me ( im talking about getting black buckets that hold mayb a gallon or 2 of water, making an ebb and flow outa them, growing in rockwool then xfer the rockwool to hydroton...any suggestions here r open
3.what can i do for ventalation since i cant modify walls (want to minimize smell and just wana make sure theres air flow)
4. when it come to lights what do i need? i know i need bulb(duh) a ballast(yep)a fixture?(not sure). 

im just idk i guess overly paranoid like i said. ive always grown outside and just cared for the things but now that isnt an option since cops r seriously starting to get suspicous of us here in this city period and r cracking down. theres inspections here every couple months and i just wanna keep everything down on a minimum in the case of suspicion.I know stoney wont be able to help me with all of this but hell be able to give me the basic hydro setup info ill need and as for ventalation i think imma need some1 else to help.... 

well guys thanx for listening to my whining and bitching...ill be checking this every morning and every night so provide as much info as u can be asking questions since i need to make that money lol...night shift sucks...

ill be check out stoney's DIY but id like some personal chatting to get a more specific to me type of setup...thanx guys!


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## KADE (Nov 28, 2006)

I'll let stoney give u the real counselling about the ebb and flow..

If that guy is giving u trouble over the hps... tell him ''Well I can always go to another place to buy it" he'll come around very quickly. MH is normally used outside for big floodlights... that is what is in all the stadiums... gives a ''realistic'' lighting. Everytime I watch nascar I drool at all the wattage.

IMO a 400watt would be just right but normally for another $15 u can get a 1000w ballast... thas the only reason i bought what i did.


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## can of ownage (Nov 28, 2006)

well in truth i think that a 1000 watt would be way way wayyyy too high  unless u can use over the wattage but i think a 1000 would burn a hole in my wall... u know? i think that a 600 would of been good but not 1 was in sight so i think a 400 is the next best thing but then again i dont know how much a 1000 would be and truthfully i dont think id be able to use it so idk just waiting for stoney really... anything else u can throw out there kade?


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## Ravishing_68 (Nov 28, 2006)

400watt (MH for veg, HPS for flowering, but can use HPS for all) should be fine for 2-3 plants, the room size will need to be widdled down, you could just put up a "wall" of white plastic for now if need be, until you can regroup your funds because I totally understand the initial expense and you cannot skimp on the lighting, nutes and ventilation.

I am rotated to graveyard shift myself... who needs sleep?!?!?!?!? eace:


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## KADE (Nov 28, 2006)

1000watts isn't too bad... but depends on the size of room of course...
I'm just thinking ahead of the game... one u start u want more...


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## Stoney Bud (Nov 30, 2006)

Well, COO, it's really not that difficult to understand how an ebb and flow system works.

You have grow tubs and a reservoir. The reservoir has nothing but a pump in it. The grow tubs have nothing but hydroton/rocks mix in them.

The pump is on an electric timer.

You have either HPS or Halide light above the grow in the amount of a minimum of 3,000 lumens per/sq ft of growing area and 5,000 lumens per/sq ft if you want the best results.

The tubs should be 10 to 12 inches deep and about 12 to 14 inches wide and 16 to 18 inches long.

Fill one tub with hydroton/rock 50-50 mix up to two inches from the top.

Use a measuring container to measure the water it takes to fill the tub to the top of the media.

Multiply that amount of water times the number of tubs you are going to use.

Multiply the total by two. That's the amount your reservoir should hold. No more, no less.

Empty the tub and dry it out. You'll have to do some plumbing on all of your tubs while they're empty.

Don't buy anything else until we've talked about what you're buying. You don't want to use 1000 watt lights in that size room.
We'll get to the lights after we've done some other stuff.

You're looking at about 3 to 4 weeks of setup time and buying of equipment. It can't be rushed. It's better to do it right then fast.

Make another post when you've gotten that far and we'll continue.

Good luck.


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## can of ownage (Nov 30, 2006)

thanx for the help stoney!! i understand the principles of the ebb and flow to a very simplistic scale. i read the one post u had a while ago on the ebb and flow that u made but i cant find it anymoer and the only thing i remember about it was the reservoir minimum u mentioned here. what i really want to do is to buy the parts i need slowly and set it up all at once.like i said i dont have too much money in right now just about 500 but im slowly going to up that so yea lol i think slow is good right now i cant find my hydro store ( its in the phone book but a part of town i dont really know) and the stuff in trying to get out of the way right now is all the hydro stuff im going to need. rock wool, hydroton,nutes,a pump and some reading pens.i would just like to understand the water pump so when i go to buy it i wont get something i dont want rigth now u know? something about how the water pumping will decrease the more hieght it goes up and blah blah.. with the setup ur giving here whats the minimum and maximum pump out i need? as for the hps like i said be4 is there something else i should look for in it? i dont really understand how to tell the spectrum of it ( warm blue and cool red and such like that idk...) and i know this is going to sound REALLY noobish but u cant run more than 1 hps blub on 1 ballast right? 1 ballast for 1 blub? thanx btw and as soon as i get the pump info its a trip to the hydro store and to get the stuff u mentioned.was thinking of mayb getting 2 bulbs to mayb possibly 3 if i needed them. btw hows that lumen rule work?effecitiveness drops to a 1/4th for every distance doubled?Thanx stoney!


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## Stoney Bud (Nov 30, 2006)

My ebb and flow system is in the DIY area.
Click Here

There is a link at the top of it for the questions involved with that system.

I use a pump I bought at Home Depot called a "Beckett" Medium Fountain Pump. 185 gallons at a 1 foot lift. It works great.

For your HPS, any HPS will do. Some are better than others, but they also cost more. I use the Cadillac of HPS bulbs "Hortilux 430, LU 430/HTL/EN Super HPS EN.

You can run only one light per/ballast and the ballast has to match the bulb. Ballasts are rated for what bulb they will run.

I use half river rock from Home Depot and half Hydroton.

Lumens are a measure of the amount of light that strikes a globe 1 foot from the bulb. The further you move the light from the lighted surface, the less lumens will strike the surface.

A 430 watt bulb is generally kept at about 18 inches from the plant tops. Further from young plants.

Have you decided how many grow tubs you want to use?


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