# What do you say is up MP?



## 000StankDank000 (Jan 25, 2015)

This looks like a K deficiency to me. Hush puppy caught it in an older update said it was M def. I have to feed tonight so I wanna correct it. What do you think?View attachment ImageUploadedByTapatalk1422228360.201070.jpg

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These girls are under my new T5 light. I am still weary about how far from the plants I'm used to MH.


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## TangieDank (Jan 25, 2015)

too much nute


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## BenfukD (Jan 25, 2015)

TangieDank said:


> too much nute




:yeahthat:


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## next (Jan 25, 2015)

looks like K def to me


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 26, 2015)

Got worse after I tryed to correct as a N Def still think it's K
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Does my light look to close?
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I had the light higher and the girls were stretching like crazy so I lowers it.
Calling hush puppy 
Got you better pics thanks


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## Rosebud (Jan 26, 2015)

Looks like nute burn to me and no your lights are not too close.


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 26, 2015)

Why would some be affected and not others? I have much smaller plants fed the same no wilt or burn?
Some are sensitive while others are not? I'm not trying to fight just wanna know .
Seems odd I'm not hammering them with nutes. They are almost 4 weeks and I'm feeding as if it's 2 weeks.


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## Hushpuppy (Jan 26, 2015)

You can have T5 very close as it isn't as intense as other light sources. As long as the plants don't ever touch the bulbs, you can literally keep the lights within 1"-2" of the highest tops. The one caveat to this is that it is wise to have a small fan to blow across the bottom of the lights and top of the plants. This keeps hot air spots from building up in the canopy. It doesn't need to be a lot, a small fan to blow between the plants and the lights just to move the air will work fine.

On the Necrosis: What I had seen on the older pic was a light green margin around the leaves, and many leaves curling up like a taco shell. Those 2 symptoms are very classic magnesium deficiency symptoms. However, the necrotic spots along the margins looks like a potassium deficiency. These 2 can be confused when the magnesium deficiency gets worse. I am also seeing in the latest pics, leaf tip necrosis (or tip burn). This is often a sign of overnute (or Nuteburn). However, Nuteburn is often accompanied by leaves getting darker green, and the tips of the fronds curling under like a ram's horn. Also, in the pics, while I see some leaves with tip burn, I see many leaves without the tip burn. Most often, Nuteburn will show on nearly all of the leaves pretty quick.

Now you said above that it got worse after you tried to correct it as a nitrogen deficiency, but in the pm to me you said it got worse after adding calmag. Did you add calmag? what kind? did you add something with high nitrogen? When did you do this? Have you ever checked the pH of your soil?


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## P Jammers (Jan 26, 2015)

The issue is magnesium. Add 1Gram or 1ML of pure epsom salt to one gallon of your water and the issue should be completely solved in about 10 to 15 days.

If your PH is a bit too low to begin with there is no need to add the epsom, as it is taken up over 6 in hydro and 7 in soil.


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## Dman1234 (Jan 26, 2015)

Its not causing your issue obviously but if thats a T5 it should be closer. Imo


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 26, 2015)

I added Calcium nitrate last night to try to fix the N Def. I was thinking that if it was nute burn why not all plants and why not all the leafs. ( good tip to look out for) . I was under the impression my calcium nitrate hard salts was basically liquid cal-mag noob mistake. 
My other plants had like 40% worm castings mixed with the promix. These plants don't have any. 
I'm confused need to do some bong rips
Thanks hush puppy your da breast tittle we got.

7 in soil? I PH to 6-6.5 . Pj your talking run off?


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## Hushpuppy (Jan 26, 2015)

This is what you need to use with your stuff in my opinion: [ame]http://www.amazon.com/Botanicare-Plant-Nutrient-Supplement-1-Quart/dp/B004JKBMRW/ref=sr_1_1?s=lawn-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1422301457&sr=1-1&keywords=cal+mag[/ame]
It is derived organically so it should be available to the plants as soon as it hits the medium.
In the mean time I would do a runoff pH test if you have a pH meter. The trick is to use distilled water for the runoff test. I would get 1-2gallons off distilled water and pour one into the plant in question until there is a good 2 cups of runoff water. The distilled water has nothing in it to react to the materials in the soil so it will give you a more true pH reading. I suspect though that the pH is going to be within the acceptable range, probably around 6.7 if you have been watering with 6.5  however, if you find that it is below 6.0 then you will need to get some dolomite lime and add to the soil to both bring up the pH and supply needed magnesium.


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 26, 2015)

I was under the impression that I didn't need cal mag when growing in soil. 
Should cal mag be added to my nutes? I use that nute maker Botanicare the KIND 3 part. 

That is a good tip on the distilled water for run off. I am to poor to get a digital meter I have been using drip test to test my mix. The digital PH pen is the next big purchase but I needed a light first.


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## Hushpuppy (Jan 26, 2015)

Many people think that if they grow in soil that they don't need the calmag. The truth is that the plants need certain amounts of both calcium and magnesium, regardless of the medium that they are in. Typically, most "soil" growers or organic growers will get soil that has certain elements in it already, or they add amendments to the soil to make it work better and longer. Most of the time, organic growers will make up their own soil and use several amendments that have enough trace elements to give the plants what they need. Often they will add dolomite lime or other raw materials that have magnesium and calcium.

If you are using basic organic medium, or soilless medium, many times there is too little of different trace minerals to supply the plants' needs. That is when you must add either amendments to the soil initially, or supplement with additives.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Jan 27, 2015)

I like Rosebud believe that it looks like nute burn.  If the remedies have not worked, I would lay off the nutes or lighten them up a bit.  Not all strains like the same amount of nutes.  If I fed my Satori like I feed some of my Kushes she would curl up and fry.

The light is not too close.  Pretty much if the leaves are not touching the bulbs, you are okay.  I keep mine like 2" away.


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 30, 2015)

Just keeps getting worse. I have flushed them and the girls are still going down hill. The only 3 things that have changed are MH to T5 the soil has no WC in it and the temp is like 10 F lower.
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What do you say MP peeps?

Any input?


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## oldfogey8 (Jan 31, 2015)

i think i saw in another thread that the temps are getting to around 56 f. i would geuss that is the problem. i read somewhere that nitrogen is locked out when temps drop into the low 60's which is why a lot of purple happens late in flowering when the temps are more fall like. can you get a heater going in the room? i am vegging right now with t5's and have the lights going 24/7 just to keep my tent temp in the mid 70's. it is frickin' cold around here!


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## Dr. Green Fang (Jan 31, 2015)

^ Nailed it.

I spoke of this in your other thread :aok:


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 31, 2015)

Low temps caused by T5 if input a heater in there I might as well run my MH and saved $200 from buying the T5 fixture The only reason I went T5 was to save on power now I need a heater. Can't win.


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## Dr. Green Fang (Jan 31, 2015)

I'm confused... your MH doesn't run much warmer than your T5's. At least mine do not. Also, aren't you worried about your lights off temps? If so, why would the lights change that? Sorry for my confusion, just trying to help you out


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 31, 2015)

1000watt MH runs hotter then a 54 watt T5 fixture no doubts about it. I'm vegging lights don't go off and bloom room is sealed and has a 1000watt HPS with lights off gets to 66F in bloom room.

It's veg that's hurting. The ones under T5


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## Dr. Green Fang (Jan 31, 2015)

Whoops whoops... I was thinking of my 400w MH vs my T5


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## Dr. Green Fang (Jan 31, 2015)

I'm a meat head. Yes, put your MH's back in when it's cold then. AND maybe even a heater! lol  

Point is, get the temps up. So if MH's help, then use em. But use the T5's in the summer. :aok:


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## Dr. Green Fang (Jan 31, 2015)

Root zone should never go below 65° if you can help it (something I'm just realizing the hard way...but did know before) 

60° low would be pushing it...I'm at 58° run off and that is with "warmer" water so, I'm probably around 55° with lights off root zone (digi thermometer reads 55° as my lowest low this winter so far)
I'm having yellowing from mid section down (lock out of Nitrogen from temps, it seems) and they are curling in a little and all "meh" looking.


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 31, 2015)

I'm having crazy thoughts of using a propane heater get heat and CO lol. I just can't chooch anymore power I'm already paying a mint. This is why I went T5 over MH in first place fang


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## oldfogey8 (Jan 31, 2015)

propane will give you carbon monoxide. do not do that. carbon monoxide will kill you and the plants. plants use carbon dioxide...


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## Rosebud (Jan 31, 2015)

Stank, i love your enthusiasm for our fabulous plant. BUT, you need to chill and watch it grow.. You can love your plants to death. Don't do that.  Soon very soon, you will be smoking your own dank.


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## Dr. Green Fang (Jan 31, 2015)

I also agree with Rose there. You can indeed love them to death. 

But with a root zone of 56° it seems you may freeze them to death first, lol. Sorry, possibly a bad joke.  

Yeah, the electric bill certainly rises with this hobby. But, if you can not pay to sustain it then... it may not work out for you during the winter months at least. Winter is so rough, especially when you live in the northern climate. Maybe you can wrap the pots with some type of insulation? Total shot in the dark theory, just still trying to help sort this with you. :aok:


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## Rosebud (Jan 31, 2015)

I use a space heater in the shed in the winter..


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## oldfogey8 (Jan 31, 2015)

heating pads are cheap, can be water proof and will warm the root zone for you...


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## yooper420 (Jan 31, 2015)

Have an electric wall heater in my grow room. Used it for the last 2 crops. Gonna remove it and put the propane one back in. Believe the girls liked the propane heater better. Hope I remember this right. Electric heaters remove moisture from the air and propane heaters don`t, something like that. 
Calling our resident HVAC peep.....STANK, WHERE YOU AT ?


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 31, 2015)

Yooper I'm with you. It's just like a GAS  CO2 generator. I'm from NFLD we would spend hours in a shed smoking drinking with no fresh air no ill effects. 2 propane heaters going.

Old fogey explain how a propane heater is diffrent then a gas powerd co generator?

Gas generators put moisture into the air


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## oldfogey8 (Jan 31, 2015)

not sure i can explain the difference between a propane heater and a gas powered co generator but i do know that people die every year from co poisoning due to faulty ventilation form their heaters. co is different from co2. we exhale co2. combustion engines exhaust co. co2 in high densities will kill you too. if you have been inhaling co for years, i cannot argue with you experience. i just would not.


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## 000StankDank000 (Jan 31, 2015)

Yea No doubt it's bad for us old fogey. 
I just don't see how it's gonna kill my plants when people use propane and NG CO generators with great results.


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## oldfogey8 (Jan 31, 2015)

I am maybe thinking of something different. Whatever works for you, dank.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 1, 2015)

000StankDank000 said:


> Yooper I'm with you. It's just like a GAS CO2 generator. I'm from NFLD we would spend hours in a shed smoking drinking with no fresh air no ill effects. 2 propane heaters going.
> 
> Old fogey explain how a propane heater is diffrent then a gas powerd co generator?
> 
> Gas generators put moisture into the air


 
Yeah we were all young and did stupid things when we were.  But it is an incredibly bad idea to put propane heaters in a space without proper ventilation and not worry about gassing yourself and your family during the night.  It is simply to risky (and sorry, but stupid).  Please do not do this.    

When using CO2 generators (most are propane or natural gas operated, don't know if I have ever seen a gas CO2 generator), you need to have a sealed room to insure that CO2 fumes are not seeping out into living spaces.  It is also monitored and regulated to between 1200 and 1500 ppm.  Something you cannot do with a simple heater.  They are entirely different devices and should not even be compared.  I would never put a gas powered generator in a living space either though.  

Like Rosebud, I think that you need to sit back, take a breath, and relax.  This is supposed to be fun and relaxing.


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## yooper420 (Feb 1, 2015)

My propane heaters, the wall one, all my portable ones, are over 99% efficient, with low oxygen shutoff. Never had one shut down in over 20 years usage. And of course have fresh O2 supply. Having been a firefighter all my life, and in charge of hundreds of structure fires,  I do understand a little about ventilation. Also, one night, while deer hunting and staying in my camper, luckily I woke up with a splitting headache and  the air stunk. What had happened was, some scale had broke loose and plugged the exhaust outlet. So all of the BAD stuff came inside. Lucky as hell the morning commotion from outside woke me up.


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## 000StankDank000 (Feb 1, 2015)

I have seen a CO2 generator THG . It can either be standing pilot or have a Honeywell ignition system on it. Very similar to a furnace . In Toronto it is code to have a CO alarm installed in your house. I have 2 . If my heater levels leak the alarms will sound when levels get high.

Like yooper says the heaters of today are very EFF and have safety's built into it for safe operation. Still like the heater idea


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## Hushpuppy (Feb 5, 2015)

For a medium size grow, a "Minigen" would be good for adding heat and co2, but they really need to be run with a temp/co2 monitor to get the proper levels off everything. Otherwise you will be chasing the optimum settings continuously as the outside weather changes. I believe in many cases with the co2 generators, you also have to use a dehumidifier. If you are in the great white north and outer humidity stays extremely low then you may be able to get away without the dehumidifier, but not the gen controller.


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## The Hemp Goddess (Feb 5, 2015)

Also, enhanced lumens.  If you want to run CO2 enhancement, be sure to add more light and they will probably need more food.


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## sopappy (Feb 14, 2015)

"But it is an incredibly bad idea to put propane heaters in a space without proper ventilation"

What successful grow room does NOT have proper ventilation?
I can't believe you said that out loud.


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## Hushpuppy (Feb 14, 2015)

Yeah proper ventilation and very careful planning should be first and foremost in setting up any grow room. And even more so when trying to enhance it with CO2.


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