# Can I flush with tap water at 6.3-6.5?



## stunzeed (Dec 22, 2009)

I am having MAJOR issues. Used floramite an mixed too strong. Then I drowned my plants. Bye bye mites AND plants. Now I washed my bucket systems and rinsed my clay pellets. I thought everything would be fine to go back and start over but now my clones are yellowing. I have a connected DWC system similar to a waterfarm. Now here is why I'm REALLY trippin. I have 2 plants in dirt just to raise some mothers and they are yellowing as well. WTH? I use gen hydro 3 part system and usually mix only 3/4 strength. Humidity is fine, heat and cold are not issues. Airstones are working. So my ONLY other idea is can my nutes somehow went bad? BUT in my bloom room I'm using same nutes and there are no issues. I am baffled. Any ideas? Thx


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## stunzeed (Dec 22, 2009)

Forgot to mention that my PH is fluctuating downward rapidly. I try to keep it at 5.8ish and in 2-3 days it gets down to around 4.9-5.3

thx guys


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## stunzeed (Dec 22, 2009)

Also sorry mods. I guess I shoulda posted this in the sick plants area.


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## 4u2sm0ke (Dec 22, 2009)

First  thing  is  your  useing  Hydro  nutes  for  a  soil  grow..not  right....next  your  ph  for  flushing  soil  is  ok  but  I  would  change  to  a soil  nute  should  salve the  soil  isue  and  the  PH  there  should  be  6.5-7.0..hydro 5.5-5.8   Get  yourself some  PH  up  and  down..Good  luck..


Merry  Christmas


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## stunzeed (Dec 22, 2009)

Sorry for confusion. I have both. Mostly DWC but 2 In dirt. I flushed my 2 Soil plants. I was wondering if I could also flush my net pots with 6.5-6.8 Ph. I have both ph up and down. Thank you though. If now that you have updated info it changes your advice thanks.


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## stunzeed (Dec 22, 2009)

Oh and your right I will change to a soil nute for the 2.


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## 4u2sm0ke (Dec 22, 2009)

well  not  much anyway...How  do  you  flush  the  nets   with  pressure  hose?   why  not  just  addjust  PH  to  be  corect  and  keep  it  there..It  will  fix  itself..and  as  for the  Male if  shown..trim  nough  away  so  as  to  keep  roots   healthy  and  sacs  from  forming...thanks  for the  update  it  will  help  others  that  chime  in  to help...:48:


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## stunzeed (Dec 23, 2009)

Well I'm hoping that if the clay pellets are still contaminated I will be able to flush it out. And I flush them in the bathtub.


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## 4u2sm0ke (Dec 23, 2009)

oh  i  see  now....I  wouldnt  see why  not...But  I  only  have  one  DWC...ill  fallow along...any  pics  you  wanna share?


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## stunzeed (Dec 23, 2009)

I'll post pics in about half an hour.


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## stunzeed (Dec 23, 2009)

Here are some pics

These are the dirt flics


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## stunzeed (Dec 23, 2009)

Heres some DWC ones. Some healthy most not. They are connected together so im STUMPED. I think I need some help from some Mods or some REALLY experienced hydro grower. Thanks guys.


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## HippyInEngland (Dec 23, 2009)

Hello Stunz 


Magnesium (Mg) - Micronutrient and Mobile Element


Magnesium helps supports healthy veins while keeping a healthy leaf production and its structure. Magnesium is significant for chlorophyll-production and enzyme break downs. Magnesium which must be present in relatively large quantities for the plant to survive, but yet not to much to where it will cause the plant to show a toxicity.


Magnesium is one of the easiest deficiencies to tell the green veins along with the yellowness of the entire surrounding leave is a dead giveaway, but sometimes thats not always the case. In case you have one of those where it doesnt show the green veins, sometimes leaf tips and edges may discolor and curl upward. The growing tips can turn lime green when the deficiency progresses to the top of the plant. The edges will feel like dry and crispy and usually affects the lower leaves in younger plants, then will affect the middle to upper half when it gets older, but It can also happen on older leaves as well. The deficiency will start at the tip then will take over the entire outer left and right sides of the leaves. The inner part will be yellow and or brownish in color, followed by leaves falling without withering. The tips can also twist and turn as well as curving upwards as if you curl your tongues.


Excessive levels of magnesium in your plants will exhibit a buildup of toxic salts that will kill the leaves and lock out other nutrients like Calcium (Ca). Mg can get locked out by having too much Calcium, Chlorine or ammonium in your soil/water. 
One of the worst problems a person can have is a magnesium def caused by a ph lockout. By giving it more magnesium to cure the problem when you are thinking you are doing good, but actually you are doing more harm then good. When the plants cant take in a nutrient because of the ph being off for that element, the plant will not absorb it but it will be in the soil therefore causing a buildup. A buildup will be noticed by the outer parts of the plant becoming whitish and or a yellowish color. The tips and part way in on the inner leaves will die and feel like glass. Parts affected by Magnesium deficiency are: space between the veins (Interveinal) of older leaves; may begin around interior perimeter of leaf.




Problems with Magnesium being locked out by PH troubles 

Light Acid Soils, soils with excessive potassium, calcium and or phosphorus


Soil

Magnesium gets locked out of soil growing at ph levels of 2.0-6.4
Magnesium is absorbed best in soil at a ph level of 6.5-9.1 . (Wouldnt recommend having a ph of over 7.0 in soil) anything out of the ranges listed will contribute to a Magnesium deficiency.



Hydro and Soil less Mediums 

Magnesium gets locked out of Hydro and Soil less Mediums at ph levels of 2.0-5.7
Magnesium is absorbed best in Hydro and Soil less Mediums at ph levels of 5.8-9.1
(Wouldnt recommend having a ph over 6.5 in hydro and soil less mediums.) Best range for hydro and soil less mediums is 5.0 to 6.0. Anything out of the ranges listed will contribute to a Magnesium deficiency.

How are you checking your PH?
What are you using to check it?

eace:


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## stunzeed (Dec 23, 2009)

Hippie: I am. I have a nice Ph meter. My Ph falls every couple of days to 4.9-5.4 I stay on top of it though. That picture does look alot like one of the soil plants but would you take another look at the hydro and see if you think they look like the same prob? Thanks For your help all!

Stunzeed..


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## stunzeed (Dec 23, 2009)

The dirt one is green changing to yellow around edges, the others seem to go yellow in center green on edges. Is that still a MG deficiency? Thanks again.


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## Growdude (Dec 23, 2009)

stunzeed said:
			
		

> The dirt one is green changing to yellow around edges, the others seem to go yellow in center green on edges. Is that still a MG deficiency? Thanks again.



I dont believe so,
 this is a quote from HIE post "The deficiency will start at the tip then will take over the entire outer left and right sides of the leaves. The inner part will be yellow and or brownish in color, followed by leaves falling without withering. The tips can also twist and turn as well as curving upwards as if you curl your tongues."


I believe its iron deficiency

*Iron (Fe) * Micro Nutrient and an Immobile element


 Iron is an important component of the plants enzyme and is also important for the transportation of electrons while photosynthesis is happening...


 Iron reacts with many of the components of nutrient solutions, which will cause a nutrient lockup to occur, If you add to much Iron without adding enough Phosphorus, you can contribute to a phosphorus deficiency , so watch out how much iron and phosphorus your nutrients have. The Leaves on the plant can turn a pale yellow along the growing shoots, while the veins remain dark green. When you have pH imbalance, it can make iron insoluble. The tissue between the veins becomes pale or white, kind of mimics the magnesium deficiency, but not yellow, iron has the white where the yellow would be on the magnesium deficiency. The deficiency starts with the lower and middle leaves, while the new leaves become completely lacking in chlorophyll, but with little or no necrotic spots. The chlorotic mottling on new leaves starts first near the bases of the leaflets, so the middle of the leaf appears to have a yellow mark. Iron is difficult for plants to absorb and moves really slowly in the plant.
Harder for outdoor plants to absorb when in hot weather. Parts affected by the Iron Deficiency are: Young leaves and Petioles.

To much Iron can cause a problem that looks like a PH imbalance, Brown spotting on the top leaves, mainly fan leaves. Can affect the whole plant. Iron Toxicity is rare for Ph below 5.5.



*Problems with Iron being locked out by PH troubles *
Over watering, pests nematodes, not enough drainage, like not enough perlite. High ph, Soils with low iron, High Phosphorus, Excess Zinc, manganese or copper.



*Soil* 

        Iron gets locked out of soil growing at ph levels of 2.0-3.5
Iron is absorbed best in soil at a ph level of 4.0-6.5 (Wouldnt recommend having a soil ph of over 7.0 in soil) anything out of the ranges listed will contribute to an Iron Deficiency.



* Hydro and Soil less Mediums *

         Iron gets locked out of Hydro and Soil less Mediums at ph levels of 2.0-3.5
Iron is absorbed best in Hydro and Soil less Mediums at ph levels of 4.0- 6.0 (Wouldnt recommend having a ph over 6.5 in hydro and soil less mediums.) Best range for hydro and soil less mediums is 5.0 to 6.0. Anything out of the ranges listed will contribute to an iron deficiency.




*Solution to fixing a Iron deficiency*
 Any Chemical/Organic nutrients that have potassium in them will fix a Iron deficiency. (Only mixing at ½ strength when using chemical nutrients, or it will cause nutrient burn!) Foliar feed with chemical fertilizer containing Fe or rusty water can work well. Other supplements that have Iron in them are: Iron chelates, Ferric oxide, Ferrous oxide, Ferrous sulfate, all of these are fast absorption. Greensand, Cottonseed Meal is slow absorption, Garden Manure, which is medium absorption. Manure is most common organic iron source to use.


Now if you added to much chemical nutrients and or organics,( which is hard to burn your plants when using organics) You need to Flush the soil with plain water. You need to use 2 times as much water as the size of the pot, for example: If you have a 5 gallon pot and need to flush it, you need to use 10 gallons of water to rinse out the soil good enough to get rid of excessive nutrients.


    Notice how the yellowing starts at the base of the leaf and progresses to the tips.


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## stunzeed (Dec 23, 2009)

Growdude: Yes, that looks right! Should I use a product like clearex or Liquid Karma? What would be the best way of getting them back to normal? Thanks. 

Stunzeed..


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## stunzeed (Dec 24, 2009)

Just bought some Liquid Karma and added to my plants. Grow shop said I should go with it. I'll keep you guys posted and thanks for your help


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## stunzeed (Dec 26, 2009)

Ok here is where I'm at the liquid Karma seems to have stabalized my ph. No more dramatic drops overnight. Now my plants are starting to have darker green areas on the leaves. Is this a normal sign of recovery? It looks kinda like a blotchy dark green. Thank you for your help. If I could only explain how much I need it.


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## stunzeed (Dec 26, 2009)

Also new root growth appears to be healthy.


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## zem (Dec 26, 2009)

hey stunzeed, good news there, i think it's better to change the soil when you get soil fert since the bacteria in your dirt plants is pretty much dead cuz of all the hydro ferts, bacteria is needed with soil ferts to break down nitrogen compounds present in soil ferts, good luck


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## stunzeed (Dec 26, 2009)

Cool. So are you saying that my last post was a good sign? Thanks for everyones help!!


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## Droopy Dog (Feb 24, 2010)

stunzeed said:
			
		

> Cool. So are you saying that my last post was a good sign? Thanks for everyones help!!



What was the outcome, how did they do?

DD


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