# Elvens first fogponics trial setup



## Elven

Hello everyone this is a small basic tutorial on my fogponics vegetative/flowering device. First of all a little about me, I have no idea what I am doing. I have not grown pot nor tended to anything that could not fend for itself on some level since I used to water my Dad's hidden pot plants when he was "away" read county lockup when I was five or so. I am posting this tutorial for one of two reasons.

1. IT FAILS :holysheep:  and while I have sacrificed the required number of bulls you never know it that might not be enough by todays standards. If this doesn't work then do exactly what I didn't do and it should work fine.

2. IT WORKS   Then I will know that sometimes blind luck will outdo over reading, over analyzing, and overkilling every once in a while :hubba:. If this insane experiment works then do as I did and you will  

Materials needed (or not depending on the outcome)
2x Tough Box 27 gallon containers
1x Mist Maker DK3-24 ultrasonic atomizer and bouy 
1x tube 100% Silicon 
6x 3.5" netpots

Tools needed
A cutting tool for netpot holes and cable hole (I used Dremel tool with cutting disk and 80 grit sand paper cylinder)
something to spread silicon (((I used cardboard)is that even a tool? I guess in a basic kinda look that monkey uses a stick to get termites kinda way)can you tell I code sometimes  ) 

I know you must be thinking MY GODS thats not much of a parts or tools list, you don't know the half of it. For those of you that are smarter than an average bear you could prob build it without any further instructions (see why I think it might fail). For the rest of us and lets all be honest we COULD be rocket scientists if we didn't smoke so much , here is a step by step with pics.




I really like these tough boxes, for this purpose. If you take both lids off, you can place the open ends together and (like we are doing) and they lock together securely. 



OK,if you have to do this in the quickest way possible like I did (clones were sitting on a table in rockwool). Then this is the best possible order that I could think of. Cut a small bit of the rim to make way for the cable of the atomizer.



OK, take your "tool" and spread a layer of silicon around the rim of the bottom tough box (the one you just cut) and once you have a decent seal set aside and let dry.

Ok, now for the only part of this that could actually be considered "difficult" at least while stoned. 



Cutting the holes, not rocket science but took longer than I wanted it to. Those ridges don't make it easy, but the blocked area of the netpots keep it from being a problem.  I just used a cutting disk with my dremel to get the rough shape, then used the sanding tubes to clean them up.
**STONER NOTE** make sure you dont cut the hole to big for your netpot   I almost did.  



See Mom I can finish what I start. 



OK, the hard part is over (Thank the Gods). Now just take your Atomizer



Put it in your buoy 



And it should look something like this.



Place it in your now dry silicon layered bottom along with 10 gallons or so of water and nutes. Plug in and LET THERE BE FOG!



Now, just place the other tub on top add your netpots, plants, and media and you are ready to go.

Again, I am not sure this is going to work. I will start a grow journal (look for link in signature). Even if you don't want to post please take the poll so I can start setting the Vegas odds.


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## Elven

One more thing, for fogponics I am using Humboldt County Master A&B nute line to prevent salt buildup on the sonic disks. Just a small thing.


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## Tater

Cool beans man.  I see no reason why it wouldn't work.  One thing to think about possibly is water circulation.  Will the nutrients "settle" so to say?  I don't know for sure just something that popped into my head.  Good luck I'll be watching this one.


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## Elven

Tater said:
			
		

> Cool beans man.  I see no reason why it wouldn't work.  One thing to think about possibly is water circulation.  Will the nutrients "settle" so to say?  I don't know for sure just something that popped into my head.  Good luck I'll be watching this one.



I have no idea I will look into that. Thanks for stopping by and I cant wait to post some updates.


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## papabeach1

add some air stones, and air pumps from wal mart

but do you believe this ultrasonic/atomizer does creates co2/oxygen itself? 

I have some roma, beefsteak, 4 of tops of mother, 8 baby mothers, babies of cherry tomatoes  in my DWC/aerobubbleponic  it look like this but your is fancier... this what I have is all mothers, I will build other dwc/aerobubbleponic for mainly clones and go in bloom soon after cutting the mothers out...  these plants I have in DWC/aerobubbleponic is doing so great... don't forget aqua temperature, like tater said  it will be golden!


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## The Hemp Goddess

I think that if you can keep the nutes from fouling the disc, this is going to be a great system.  I live in an arid climate and have had one of the decorative mist things in my home for about 4 years.  It can use 2 qts of water a day when the RH is really low.  Although the addition of an airstone may benefit your plants, the water is not stagnant--it kind of bubbles around the disc.

Keep us all up to date.


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## Elven

papabeach1 said:
			
		

> add some air stones, and air pumps from wal mart
> 
> but do you believe this ultrasonic/atomizer does creates co2/oxygen itself?
> 
> I have some roma, beefsteak, 4 of tops of mother, 8 baby mothers, babies of cherry tomatoes  in my DWC/aerobubbleponic  it look like this but your is fancier... this what I have is all mothers, I will build other dwc/aerobubbleponic for mainly clones and go in bloom soon after cutting the mothers out...  these plants I have in DWC/aerobubbleponic is doing so great... don't forget aqua temperature, like tater said  it will be golden!



Thanks Papa  I actually have 2" airstones and a good airpump. I was waiting to see what happens before I add them. Dont want to change to much to fast .


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## Elven

Well unfortunately one of my babies died  from lack of water apparently when you use rockwool it requires a bit more direct water. :holysheep: so on monday morning I woke up to a dead plant (see grow journal) Sorry i didnt photo journal much. I was in a huge hurry. I made a T of 3/4 PVC pipe with blocks on the top part. then added a threaded end that screws into my water pump. Once the glue was dry I drilled three holes and screwed in aero sprayers. Here are a few pics. hope they help explain what I did. 



One view



another one

The one HUGE issue is now that there is more direct water the silicon seal isnt working anymore. I have had to add tons of silicon to prevent an all out flood. I think I have figured out how to fix it. I am going to add a plastic skirt to the inside to overlap the gap. I will update again when I can.


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## Tater

/me heads to his closet to grab some towels and put on his rubber boots.

/hands towels to Elven

Hope you don't need these.


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## Elven

OK so my idea for a skirt worked! :holysheep: Here is the addition for anyone who wants to follow my steps. I leave it in picture form just in case the second Dark Age has left the internet working and reading is not yet relearned . 



Roughed up the area around the bottom rim of the top tote (the one that holds the plants) 



Add tons of pure silicon on the scratches and add the rubber skirt (I cut about 5 or so inches) and put more silicon to fill in the gaps and make give a nice taper effect that wont hold much water. 



Let dry and be dry!



Skirt in action 

Well until I update my system again (prob next weekend) See Ya. 

EDIT: I also added my 2" airstone to the nute and it really helped the RH in the grow area. I am getting close to 40%.


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## Elven

Tater said:
			
		

> /me heads to his closet to grab some towels and put on his rubber boots.
> 
> /hands towels to Elven
> 
> Hope you don't need these.



Never got that bad Tater but thanks man.   I am glad that it my fix worked.


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## Tater

Me to.  I'm still waiting and watching lets see you grow something in there.


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## Elven

Tater said:
			
		

> Me to.  I'm still waiting and watching lets see you grow something in there.



I was trying (see signature) but I think I have killed them all. My fault over nute, but I will be picking up a few more clones this weekend if I did indeed kill them.


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## ozman

Hey Elven,so you are using a misting along with the fogging ??? not tottaly fog then??
And how many heads is your fogger,1,3,5, or more ?I have a single head  fogger I want to play with also but it doesnt put out enough fog for the tote I want to use so i'm looking for at least a triple head,found a 5 head on uhg: ebay.
Good Luck and Happy Mojo   Thanks in advance
ozman


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## Elven

ozman said:
			
		

> Hey Elven,so you are using a misting along with the fogging ??? not tottaly fog then??
> And how many heads is your fogger,1,3,5, or more ?I have a single head  fogger I want to play with also but it doesnt put out enough fog for the tote I want to use so i'm looking for at least a triple head,found a 5 head on uhg: ebay.
> Good Luck and Happy Mojo   Thanks in advance
> ozman




Thanks for stopping by Ozman, At this moment it is not 100% fog I found that the rockwool is not penetrated by the fog well. I do not plan on using rockwool once I get my own mother going but until then not much choice. At that point I am hoping that the fog will be sufficient but if not then the sprayers are there in case  But I am using a three head ultrasonic fog generator. I might move to five next time cuz overkill is AWESOME.


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## andy52

I Would Use The Rapid Rooters Instead Of The Rockwool.jmo


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## Elven

andy52 said:
			
		

> I Would Use The Rapid Rooters Instead Of The Rockwool.jmo



Actually I am not going to use any medium for my clones so that when I put them into the hydrotron or whatever its just the roots and the fog. that way there isnt any medium that will change my PH  one less thing to worry about.


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## andy52

i personally have better success when i use the root riot cubes rather than without.don't know why,but if it works for you,keep at it.i am kinda experimenting with this idea anyway.i will know for sure in several more weeks.the dude at the hydro store tole me to be careful on the nute level and not get it too high as the cubes sometimes will get moldy.good luck my friend.


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## ozman

I have done some research on fogging,most all reports state that around 500 ppm works best,I don't plan on using any medium,I plan on letting my roots just hang and absorb the fog as they see fit.this is pretty new territory.My theory is to grow bigger and better thats the plan anyways,also I like the idea of using less electricity compared to e&f or anything that would use a pump.
I will be keeping a eye on your progress this is how theory becomes fact or fallacy.
Best of Luck 
ozman


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## Elven

ozman said:
			
		

> I have done some research on fogging,most all reports state that around 500 ppm works best,I don't plan on using any medium,I plan on letting my roots just hang and absorb the fog as they see fit.this is pretty new territory.My theory is to grow bigger and better thats the plan anyways,also I like the idea of using less electricity compared to e&f or anything that would use a pump.
> I will be keeping a eye on your progress this is how theory becomes fact or fallacy.
> Best of Luck
> ozman



I have been talking to the guy who builds the cloners at http://www.fogponics.com/ I am going to use the neoprene collars for my cloner, then move them to the expanded clay pellets, we will see. I will be putting a how 2 on my cloner when I actually use it .


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## trillions of atoms

hydroton id say....and set the clones in the netcups with some roots hanging then  fill gently with the hydroton.


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## Elven

trillions of atoms said:
			
		

> hydroton id say....and set the clones in the netcups with some roots hanging then  fill gently with the hydroton.



Exactly my thought.   Now all I need is more plants


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## trillions of atoms

just make sure the level of the fog comes up to the rootzone- or else those roots will dry up quick.


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## papabeach1

hey man...  I have tried that fogponic with my ultrasonic..even I uses the scoreboard (for bricking wall) to float and hold the ultrasonic..  IMO.. it does help roots to grow.. but SLOW!!!! growth.. then when my roots starts to grow bigger..and it did got in the way for ultrasonic to float around.. then the little disc in ultrasonic has burned the roots.. yes  slow burn.. I have watched it carefully  and tested it..   and it did killed one of my plant.. (3 days after root burn)..  so I removed the fogger.. and filled up the water to the top, managed all my plant stems to stick the green part out to where the air  is.. I use foams to hold these plants in the tubes.. it doing alot better and better results over fogponic  so I'm stick with DWC (deep water culture) only needs nutes and air pumps/airstones..  simple... the advance of it.. its already feeded.. though oxygen/water/bubbles  I have seen it roots sucks the bubbles!!  it works very well   and don't forget to control your water temp..  check the mass prod s link.. you will see what I meant.. I'm growing with no mediums!!


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## trillions of atoms

well if your growing in water- water is the medium...is it not?


eleven just keep it up man....goodluck.


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## Elven

trillions of atoms said:
			
		

> just make sure the level of the fog comes up to the rootzone- or else those roots will dry up quick.



With the airstones in the fog comes all the way to the top, before I used Chernobyl level nutes I actually had a ton of growth. I think thats why I got Cocky , 

Hey Pappa my unit has about 2 feet or so of "hanging room" before they even touch the water or ultrasonic agitator. This is just a test and since I have already spent all the money I figure might as well get some good solid data (GODS I LOVE SCIENCE). Thanks for your info it will totally help me with some thoughts I was having but unsure if they would be an issue. 

And Trillions I think Pappa meant that he was not using rockwool or rapidrooter. I totally understood, but thanks for helping out


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## andy52

hey Elven whats up?lookin good so far.i also use hydroton.i recently bought the root riot cubes.i love them.you can use with soil or hydro.i even start my seeds in them now.and as soon as there are roots sticking out of the cube i gently put the cube into a 5.5in net pot with hydroton.the easiest way i've found so far.heres wishing you the best on your grow my friend.be well and safe


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## Elven

andy52 said:
			
		

> hey Elven whats up?lookin good so far.i also use hydroton.i recently bought the root riot cubes.i love them.you can use with soil or hydro.i even start my seeds in them now.and as soon as there are roots sticking out of the cube i gently put the cube into a 5.5in net pot with hydroton.the easiest way i've found so far.heres wishing you the best on your grow my friend.be well and safe




Thats cool my cloner hangs the roots directly into the fog so i cant use any solid medium like that at all. I cant wait to try it out. Cloning is the main thing that fog is currently used for, from what I have read. I will be picking up next weekend (I HOPE) so look for me to kill more plants then :holysheep:


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## trillions of atoms

dont have that attitude bro- it IS trial and error....but the more more you grow, the more you know.

youll have some killer buds soon bro- NO WORRIES!


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## Elven

trillions of atoms said:
			
		

> dont have that attitude bro- it IS trial and error....but the more more you grow, the more you know.
> 
> youll have some killer buds soon bro- NO WORRIES!



Totally agree man! I was just making sure, I have read alot of thread and issues seem to spring up from pretty tame posts. I cant wait to smoke my kids.


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## papabeach1

sweet... see for yourself.. I tried and I see the truth.. I think roots is happy under the water..  and will never dry out.. 

I has to use half inch tubes, and package foams (cutted) to hold the stems which is kinda of my medium..   and to me  its a future way to grow.. I even grow it with my tomatoes.. they are doing good.. just that weather  is getting cold (growls)  let me grow some please!! go away cold air..


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## Elven

papabeach1 said:
			
		

> sweet... see for yourself.. I tried and I see the truth.. I think roots is happy under the water..  and will never dry out..
> 
> I has to use half inch tubes, and package foams (cutted) to hold the stems which is kinda of my medium..   and to me  its a future way to grow.. I even grow it with my tomatoes.. they are doing good.. just that weather  is getting cold (growls)  let me grow some please!! go away cold air..



Well its still about 90 or so here plenty hot. Actually 2 Damn hot!


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## smokingjoe

Elven I did this a few years back as an experiment for clones and it works really well.

I ran into problems with salt buildup on the discs though; it cracked a couple of times.  Just worked out to wipe the disc clean regularly and all was well.

Never contemplated a complete veg in this environment.

Only difference to your setup was I used a 45L Grated Crate with a dome overhead and a 45 litre Crate underneath.


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## Fadeux

Elven, look at it with a scientific mind, even if you do fail, you still succeed in pioneering. People tryin new stuff is how we got to hydro in the first place. "A plant without soil? Thats just crazy talk!"


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## Fadeux

And for cutting the netpot holes, a much easier method is to find a Hole Saw that is the 1/8" less than the size of a netpot. So if you use a 3" net pot, find a 2 7/8" Hole saw. They sell them at your local hardware store in the drillbit section. Just thought I'd throw this piece of advice in for anyone who needs to cut plant holes in something.


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## smokingjoe

Fadeux said:
			
		

> And for cutting the netpot holes, a much easier method is to find a Hole Saw that is the 1/8" less than the size of a netpot. So if you use a 3" net pot, find a 2 7/8" Hole saw. They sell them at your local hardware store in the drillbit section. Just thought I'd throw this piece of advice in for anyone who needs to cut plant holes in something.



I often wondered why people cut holes any other way.


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## Fadeux

smokingjoe said:
			
		

> I often wondered why people cut holes any other way.



If you had asked me about hole saws a year ago, I would've looked at you like you had two heads. I'm really not familiar with any tool my father didn't own. He never had a hole saw. I swear, I was like a kid in a candy store the first time I went into Lowe's Hardware section with building a grow op on my mind.


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## smokingjoe

My dad built an aeroplane under our house; we had every kind of tool imaginable and some you would never have even dreamed of.


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## Fadeux

smokingjoe said:
			
		

> My dad built an aeroplane under our house; we had every kind of tool imaginable and some you would never have even dreamed of.



Screw your dad's Aeroplane, some of us are trying to get high by another means...


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## Elven

Well Thanks alot for the advice guys, I found out why everything was dying. The nutes I was using had a bad print of the feeding schedule so it ended up that I was Nitrogen poisoning my babies. That explains alot, I thought I was loosing my mind. As for the salt buildup the nutes that I am using dont use salts like alot of the others, they uses Amino Acid so there isnt buildup. I will be pickup up MORE babies to try again this weekend, so make sure you guys are ready to see this work. I wont fail again, I hope . The hole saw is a great idea the only reason I didnt get one is that the store in my area only sells the big ones in a kit and the kit was 200 bucks. SCREW THAT! 

I guess my only question left is "Aeroplane under the house?" how exactly does that work?


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## smokingjoe

Elven said:
			
		

> I guess my only question left is "Aeroplane under the house?" how exactly does that work?



In Queensland Australia many of the older homes are single story pole homes aka Queenslanders or Colonials.







Dad had enclosed the lower level and turned it into a massive workshop where he built a Bushby Mustang II; when it was done the front of the workshop opened sufficiently to wheel her out.


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## Elven

smokingjoe said:
			
		

> In Queensland Australia many of the older homes are single story pole homes aka Queenslanders or Colonials.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dad had enclosed the lower level and turned it into a massive workshop where he built a Bushby Mustang II; when it was done the front of the workshop opened sufficiently to wheel her out.




For some reason I was thinking of a underground bunker with flickering generator lights, and your Dad all "it will fly" but stilt house in Australia works 2 .


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## papabeach1

hey man...   next time  start with no nutes..  when did you start use the nutes..??

I believe  the nutes is suppose to work with water.. not fogponic...  think about it..  most nutes works with soils and water, not the air..   get it?  maybe it has nute burn or something.. but I checked for any nute burns on leaves I don't think I see any?  see ?    

when I tried that.. I realized it didn't work that way.. so I filled up the water to the top.. now I saved the plants.. and I'm glad they didn't died lately..


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## Elven

papabeach1 said:
			
		

> hey man...   next time  start with no nutes..  when did you start use the nutes..??
> 
> I believe  the nutes is suppose to work with water.. not fogponic...  think about it..  most nutes works with soils and water, not the air..   get it?  maybe it has nute burn or something.. but I checked for any nute burns on leaves I don't think I see any?  see ?
> 
> when I tried that.. I realized it didn't work that way.. so I filled up the water to the top.. now I saved the plants.. and I'm glad they didn't died lately..



Thanks Pappa, the problem actually was the Nutes. The line that I am using because it wont salt up the fogger disks is Humboldt Nutrients Master AB line. The feeding schedule that I was using actually showed to use a product called Verde (Spanish for green, for anyone who doesnt know. I had to ask my wife  ) only for the veg growth instead of a mixture of Master A Master B and Verde. The problem they found AFTER they sent out the feeding schedule is that the Verde has WAY to much Nitrogen for non high nitrogen feeding plants and it kills them if used only. The website now shows the proper feeding schedule and they said that it shouldnt be a problem any more. The problems I was having were due to this issue. I am going to try one more time because I sure that it will work.


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## Elven

ITS WORKING:banana: :banana: :banana: Check my Grow Journal I have root growth out of the bottom of my net cups. For the First time.


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## Elven

Well I found that since the whole thing is black, when my HPS was on the nute temp went up to 101 F!:holysheep:  I got some IR block that will keep the res cooler while reflecting the light back up. I will see how much cooler when I start using the HPS. I also made some covers for over the net pots as well. Keeps extra light from the roots.


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## Super Silver Haze

If you are looking for something to repair Silicone try Aqua Seal.  this can be found @ a Scuba shop, used to repair dive mask's.

SSH


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