# Lights!!!awww!!!



## AZshwagg (Feb 9, 2006)

I want to grow at least two plants and focus all of my attention on them. What kind of light would i need to get to be succesfull. but i want it to be low on energy use and heat. I'll use this light from seed in soil to harvesting.


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## Mutt (Feb 9, 2006)

Best case scenerio (6) 40w tube florous or a Metal Halide for veg. HPS for flower.

Cheapest way: (2) cool white compact florous 42 watt and (2) warm white 42watt compacts from wal-mart. Make a small box and line with mylar or those emergency space blankets, no aluminum foil.
Note: HPS/MH is more effecient with energy usage than florous, but with florous less heat.
Hope this helps.


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## skunk (Feb 9, 2006)

hey mutt why the warm tubes if you have the cool tubes if you dont need the heat ? just curious i just went the other day and bought a 42w 150 cf the other day did you see that 42w 200 reading light too put out the same lumens as the 42 w150 . just curious whether the reading and the warm is going to be of dif spectrum or not .ps they also had the 135 cf mister twisty i think but it was of a natural spec. but only put out i think 1475 lumens verses the cool w which was like 2 thousand some lumens .


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## Mutt (Feb 9, 2006)

Hey skunk, 

I read that you get the more reddish spectrum from the soft (or warm never can remember the box name) whites which the MJ plant uses during flower. The cool whites are more on the blue spectrum for veg. Figured cheap way it would cover the spectrum needed to carry him through a full grow. little less lumens, but in a small box enough for two plants he could get by, not great but will work with lots of trainng and keeping those florous close. IMO

I always looked at the actual wattage not the incadescent equivilent wattage as that really never meant shit except for the old lady buying a bulb for her porch light or something. (never understood why the even put it on the box)

whats that 135 watt mister twisty at wal-mart?? Largest I seen was 42watt unless you get over to the halogen floods which unfortunatly don't work for a grow. I am interested in that thing.

If you want a really cheap HPS or MH you can get them at the link below.
150watt HPS for 40 bucks with bulb. (just found this place yesterday)
http://www.e-conolight.com/Product/EFamily.asp


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## skunk (Feb 11, 2006)

hick  told me once about the cool put out the blues but not for sure on the warm unless it was for help heat in winter . the mister twisty at walmart is just a 27 cf  showing comparible 135 with an incandecent except with a natural spectrum . mister twisty is just the name they have it in walmarts name brand 2 it is just a little bit more compact dont stick out as far .ps i have my 400 hps in my flowering room just looking for a little bit more help on 1 side of the bush to make more of an even canopy.


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## AZshwagg (Feb 12, 2006)

I went to walmart and looked at the lights, and there was alot to choose from  and they ranged in watts and lumens. whats the exact amount of watt and lumens i need to start off with. Should i get the ones with high output of lumens?


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## skunk (Feb 13, 2006)

yes you need 6000 lumens per sqft or 50 watts per sq ft.


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## mountain rambler (Feb 13, 2006)

Hey AZshwagg

So, because of energy limitations at my house, I have tried straight CFL (compact flouoro) grows, and here's what I've found. First, all the names on the boxes are confusing. Warm and soft are the same thing, and you'll need those for optimal flowering. Cool or bright are also the same thing, and you'll need those for veg. 

If you're limited, try scrogging or sogging--- that'll be the best way to do this cheap with less lights. Your MINIMUM lumens per square foot is 1000, bust with CFLs you can easily reach the optimal lumens/sq foot-- which is 5-7,000. When working with CFL's, totally ignore the wattage. Just go by lumens. 

I should add that, while some people say that CFL's are far inferior to other lighting options, I have had very sucessful grows using straight CFLs in the past. You just have to know how to do it, IMHO.

So in veg stage you need to maximize blue light spectrum, which means cool/bright white lights. If you're only going for 2 plants, then go for the bigger bulbs, but if you are planning to grow more than 2, go for more smaller bulbs to space out the light since CFLs really don't spread light that far.

In flowering stage, you want to introduce more warm/soft white--- I found it to be best to go 1/2 and half warm and soft, but everyone differs on this. Just know that during flowering they need more light from the red, or warm/soft spectrum.

To rig these lights up you have a number of options. Light bars (otherwise known as vanity lights) for bathrooms work well, but you have to know how to wire them. Otherwise, you can pick up cords and light socket sets at Wal-Mart or any hardware store for just a coupla' bucks, and these are a cheap & easy way to customize your lights. 

You need a lot of compact fluoros, which makes it kind of  a pain, but they are a lot cheaper (in the short term) than other kinds... and they're cooler, which is good for small places. Just remember that you have to keep the lights quite close if you use CFL's-- I personally kept them within an inch, but most people advise 2 inches or so. I wouldn't advise keeping them as close as I did, as most people report burning their plants this way.

So... uh... got a lil' carried away, but I've had a lot of experience with CFL's, so if you need any help with them, just let me know & I'll be happy to offer what I can. We all have our own opinions, and you'll figure out your own in short order. Good luck!!


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## zouse1234 (Feb 13, 2006)

Can i scew a M/H 400w into a HPS socket and use that ballast


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## El Diablo Verde (Feb 13, 2006)

No, you need an 400w MH conversion bulb if you want to use the same ballast.


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## El Diablo Verde (Feb 13, 2006)

hey rambler, what do you think of these? think of getting one.
http://www.1000bulbs.com/product.php?product=11689


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## sicnarf (Feb 14, 2006)

mountain rambler, what was your hiegest yeild ever from using cfl's per plant?


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## mountain rambler (Feb 14, 2006)

hey sicnarf... In the end my yields were fairly consistant, and depending on the strain anywhere from 1-2 oz's per sq ft for scrog. I do, however, remember my very first CFL grow was a kinda' disappointing sog (and that was with a fair amount of experience)... I mighta' got a half ounce per sq ft or something... 

I know a lot of people think CFL's are real inferior, and while I don't use 'em anymore either, I have to disagree with the general view that they're totally useless.


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## mountain rambler (Feb 14, 2006)

Hey Diablo... Missed your post there somehow sorry. 13,000 lumens, eh? Dang. Dang.

Can't say as though I've ever used one, but everything looks great. Good k rating (spectrum) for veg growing, dang lotta' lumens... 

I always just stuck to a lot a little lights myself (pain in the but with all the wiring) but it spread the light out well. Put a coupla' those babies in there with just a coupla' plants and a refelctor, should be good to go! Thanks for the link to that site, btw, I've been thinking about experimenting with lights again (shoulda' been a scientist), so I'm going to cheeck that site out.


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## zouse1234 (Feb 15, 2006)

cheers El Diablo Verde, looked at the other light might get one or two of them


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## Stoney Bud (Feb 15, 2006)

Hey, for clarification, lumens are a measure of the amount of light that strikes a one foot diameter globe at one foot from the source of light.

As a measure of what is good for MJ, remember that depending on what type of light you use, the bulb must be a certain distance from the tops of the plant.

If a bulb is rated at 3 thousand lumens, than that is at one foot from the bulb. No exceptions.

If you move the plant 2 feet from the source of light, it's now only delivering 1,500 lumens to the plant. That is for the area directly beneath the bulb. If you measure diagonally from the bulb to the furthest plant top and it's 4 feet from the bulb, then that plant top is only receiving 325 lumens of light.

For MJ, look at the rated lumens and divide by 2. That will work for the plants directly below the light. A light at 3,000 lumens will deliver 1,500 lumens to the plant at 24 inches from the bulb.

What you want is 3,000 lumens on every plant you have, if you want to optimize your light. That means, If you're using a light rated at 3,000 lumens, you need to put two over each square foot of your grow just to get 3,000 lumens to your plants. That is as much light as any MJ plant would need to grow real good. Some Indicas can use as much as 7 thousand lumens at the surface of the plant tops.

Now, you can see the exact method of light measurement you need to use to maximize your grow.

The light I like the most is a Hortilux LU 430S/HTL/EN. It's rated at 58,500 lumens. I'm using two in a 19 square foot area. That's giving me pretty near 3,000 lumens per/sq foot, which is perfect for the sativa hybrid I'm growing.

That's 117,000 lumens of rated light needed to deliver 3,000 lumens at the top of the plants that are 24 inches from the bulbs in an area that's only 3.5 feet by 5.5 feet. You can see what it would take to deliver 7,000 lumens of light to each square foot of pure indica.

Mother Nature delivers that much without even breathing hard, but if you're going to try it with electric light, it's going to cost a bundle. That's why the Hybrids that only require lower light intensity's are nice.

I hope I cleared this up just a little for all of you. The science behind lighting and plants is precise and exact. The figures I've given you here are the way it is.

A lot of people out there have differing points of view, but the science is the proof, and that's what I've just given you.

Have fun, don't stress and get high as often as possible.

That's the secret to getting old. I've proven that.


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## sicnarf (Feb 16, 2006)

I did the math stony and your getting 3078.9 lumens per plant, and now I going to guess that you could grow 19.5 plants in that 19sq ft area. Very interesting post, clears up the whole issue once and for all for me...very insightful


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## gqone333 (Mar 5, 2006)

i say a 400 watt,if you want more bud,the more light the better yeild.but mutt is right if your using a grow box you need floresensence.a 400 or 1000  is suitable for grow rooms only or a grow closet .


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