# new grower seeking guidance



## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 8, 2012)

Hey, I am a new grower I am learning through trial and error but am starting to hit the point where I'm trying to eliminate the error. I have a whole group of Jack Herrer and Blackjack that I started from seed. They are looking good. Started on Nov 10th. I have had some struggling with yellowing, drooping and now some strange bending of the leaves. I pH my water before each feed with liquid drop indicator so my guess is a slight pH variance between 5.2 and 6. I am approaching 30 days and just bumped my feed up from 1/4 tsp to a full tsp per gallon. GH 3 stage nutes and rock wool is what my food and medium are. Haven't tested run off in a while but rock wool is pretty stable. Average height of seedlings are about 4.5 inches and about 5 nodes. I want to sex them and revert them back to veg but I am wondering if I'd be best to let them go another 2 to 3 weeks before I sex them and just let them continue to flower and pull all my males. Just trying to avoid stepping up to bigger blocks. Roots are already coming out of 4x4 cube.... where should I go from here?:icon_smile:


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## pcduck (Dec 8, 2012)

:ciao::welcome: To the Only Place :ciao::bolt::bong:



> I pH my water before each feed with liquid drop indicator so my guess is a slight pH variance between 5.2 and 6.



That is a bit more then a slight variance, which might be one cause for the yellowing.

Really need to get a pH meter for a more accurate pH reading. And a ppm/ec meter to know what strength the nutes are to do hydro more easily.

If the roots are exploding out of the 4x4 cubes either need bigger blocks or bury them in hydroton.


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## OregonGrownBud (Dec 8, 2012)

:welcome: 


			
				10GBgrowMI05 said:
			
		

> ...I have had some struggling with yellowing, drooping and now some strange bending of the leaves...


All three of those sound like nutrient problems to me. When my leaves start to bend awkwardly, i know the nutes are a little too strong for the plant.

-Leaf deficiency chart


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 8, 2012)

I don't think that you are feeding your plants enough.  They are over 4 weeks old.  I would be giving them 3 tsp of grow, 2 tsp of micro, and 1 tsp of bloom every feeding.

Like pcduck mentioned, your pH spread is too much.  You are going to want to keep it between about 5.3 and 5.8 for hydro.  How exactly are you growing?  Will you be putting the cubes in dirt as they get larger or are you planning on some kind of hydro?  Soil grows need a higher pH than hydro.

Tell us more about your grow--lights, ventilation, size of space, etc.  With only 5 nodes, I don't think I would force these to flower.


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 9, 2012)

Lights are 400w mh 
Ventilation is a 8 inch inline fan pulling air out. As well as an 8 inch oscilating fan in the room.
Room size is 4x6x6
I would like to just keep them in rock wool and upgrade to the bigger blocks. Any recommendations for more accurate pH testing?


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## pcduck (Dec 9, 2012)

10GBgrowMI05 said:
			
		

> Any recommendations for more accurate pH testing?



Many of our members use and have good results with this place.

www.eseasongear.com/


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## 4u2sm0ke (Dec 9, 2012)

:ciao:

welcome to the passion...

:48:


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## Locked (Dec 9, 2012)

pcduck said:
			
		

> Many of our members use and have good results with this place.
> 
> www.eseasongear.com/




:yeahthat:

I buy all my meters from eseasongear.com. Great prices great service.

Welcome to MP...a ph meter is a must. If you are going the hydro route you will want a ppm meter as well.


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 9, 2012)

Thank you all for the direction! I upped my feeding to 3 2 1 and already they are starting to get the deeper green I was looking for! I have also been keeping a much closer eye on my pH and its really making the difference, my leaves are looking much happier! I am anxious to see how many of these I will be able to use in the flowering process! Hope I haven't stressed these little buggers out too much. The seeds were bag seeds luckily I know the breeder and he did a nice job propagating the seeds. They were very mature and are now showing me the potential I was after! Once I figure out how to post pics I will post on this thread! 

Thanks again!


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 9, 2012)

Hopefully this works!


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## Locked (Dec 9, 2012)

Those don't look bad at all bro....


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 9, 2012)

Like I said, I was having some troubles and these are pics from today. I think they are starting to turn around for me!


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## pcduck (Dec 10, 2012)

Yeah it does not long in hydro to see the difference. 

Looking good to me too. Maybe a little stretch but not bad:aok:


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 10, 2012)

10GBgrowMI05 said:
			
		

> Lights are 400w mh
> Ventilation is a 8 inch inline fan pulling air out. As well as an 8 inch oscilating fan in the room.
> Room size is 4x6x6
> I would like to just keep them in rock wool and upgrade to the bigger blocks. Any recommendations for more accurate pH testing?



You are quite underlit.  A 400W light is only good for about 9-10 sq ft, you have 24.  You are either going to need substantially more light or a significantly smaller space.  

Is your fan a duct booster fan or a centrifuge type fan.

I'm a little confused--were they bagseed or were they seeds someone made from males and females for seed stock?


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 10, 2012)

That's what I was worried about! I don't have a lot of money right now but would possibly adding 2 90w LED's to the mix help my cause? I am skeptical but my friend has them and said I can use them if I want... I eventually want to get 1000w mph/ hps. The LED's worked well for him in veg.


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 10, 2012)

Just looked at the 150w hps thread and am thinking about doing that soon...


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 10, 2012)

Just moved them into their new home! Hopefully by tomorrow I get new lights in the room. I really want to put out some quality stuff... don't need much just want it to be really good! Also, I see a lot of different types of pH meters. Which one is going to best suit my needs? I am testing water so I am not sure which one will benefit me the most...


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## The Hemp Goddess (Dec 11, 2012)

10GBgrowMI05 said:
			
		

> That's what I was worried about! I don't have a lot of money right now but would possibly adding 2 90w LED's to the mix help my cause? I am skeptical but my friend has them and said I can use them if I want... I eventually want to get 1000w mph/ hps. The LED's worked well for him in veg.



Make your space smaller.  You do not need that much room and you are wasting quite a bit of light.  Construct some temporary walls to put around the plants.


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 11, 2012)

Just moved them into their new home! Hopefully by tomorrow I get new lights in the room. I really want to put out some quality stuff... don't need much just want it to be really good! Also, I see a lot of different types of pH meters. Which one is going to best suit my needs? I am testing water so I am not sure which one will benefit me the most...


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## pcduck (Dec 11, 2012)

> Which one is going to best suit my needs? I am testing water so I am not sure which one will benefit me the most...



The one that you can most afford that tests water. I use a pen type for hydro.


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 12, 2012)

Hemp Goddess, I found another 400w HPS and added that to my room. I can still construct a mylar wall between the two lights but is that still important?

Pcduck, thanks!


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## ShOrTbUs (Dec 12, 2012)

these are your minimums:

3000 lumens per sq ft in veg
5000 lumens per sq ft in flower

if you have 24 sq ft then you need 72,000 lumens minimum for veg, and 120,000 lumens for flowering

so 2 400 watt mh bulbs will net you around 70k total lumens
and 2 400 watt hps bulbs will get you around 100k total lumens

you seem to be just below your threshold. what i'd suggest is section off the space to 4X4 or 4X5 at the most.

as for your grow itself. at 4 weeks your plants should be larger then they are. the fact that you have been under feeding them is probably the biggest reason they are as small as they are at the moment. also you need to find a larger medium to plant them in immediately. you can put the rockwool in a large tote full of soil. or place them in a net pot and do a dwc hydro setup. when properly fed for a few weeks those roots will be bursting out of those blocks.

if you plan on using rockwool in the future make sure you soak the rockwool in properly ph'd water before putting them to use.

and get a ph pen & ppm meter asap


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 28, 2012)

I have read and understand what you are all saying which is why I am biting the bullet and getting a 1000 watt hps. I am also getting an air cooled hood and I am purchasing another inline fine to cool my hood. And remove air from room. Plants have really turned around... here is a little peek at what's coming up!


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Dec 28, 2012)

And I thank you all for sharing this information with me. I really look forward to seeing the final result!


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## Locked (Dec 28, 2012)

Somebody is a proud pappa to a girl.....congrats. Just be warned...this get's addicting as hell.


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Jan 5, 2013)

I'm a proud papa of 10!!!  my first ever! This is addicting! A great hobby as well! My little jack herer and blackjacks will be done in 2 months! With all the help I have received I am definitely on my way to growing a nice 1st crop and will make improvement after improvement to treat them the best I can


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## 10GBgrowMI05 (Jan 18, 2013)

Here's just another update!!!  can't wait! Almost done!


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## skullcandy (Jan 18, 2013)

i use the blu lab ph meter works great and its water proof @ moster gardens online site .


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