# Round two, damnit!



## Tonto (Nov 21, 2006)

Some of you guys know how the last grow ended.... yeah, not so great. I believe there will never be an issue like that again. 

We got some Snow White(Nirvana) beans germinating as I type now. We got the 400 HPS, and have been working on and have finally completed a mother/clone growing area. Pictures to follow of the new grow area, the 'old' grow area with new lighting, and of course, the growth process when the little girls get planted. We're going to get it right the first time, this time, and grow out to nuggets in my pipe. We're stoked up and ready to go. Thanks to all who come with us.

Seeds germinating: 3

Pot: 5 gallon bucket, 16 .25" holes drilled in the edge of the bottom, 4 in  a square shape on the bottom, and one in the center of the bottom. 

Soil: Miracle Grow 

Veg: 3 weeks, or until sex is shown. We will take clones from the female(s) at this point. We're obviously hoping for 3 females. We'll take 5 clones, and hope that 4 make it. We would like to have a 4 plant cycle.

Flower: flowering should take right around 8 weeks for this strain. 

Clones: once the clones take root well, they will veg for 2-3 weeks, depending on how fast they root, and then they will be put into flower. The total time from cutting to 12/12 is 4 weeks. This would mean that the clones would start to flower exactly 4 weeks after their mothers started flowering. Repeating this process should give us 4 flowering plants that we harvest every 4 weeks. That should be plenty of bud for the family. 


Any comments?


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## Elephant Man (Nov 21, 2006)

Cheers to you guys for working it out, I wish you the best of luck and will be watching.


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## THE BROTHER'S GRUNT (Nov 22, 2006)

*Sounds like you got a great plan Fluid1 now lets execute it.   You might wanna drop Stoney Bud a PM as he has grow Snow White in the past with great results. Here is some GREEN MOJO. *


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## Tonto (Nov 23, 2006)

Now that's some crazy green mojo!!! Thanks, TBG! Also, thanks to you Elephant Man. I'm going to shoot Stony Bud a PM to see if he's got any tips for this particular strain. The seeds have all 3 successfully germinated and I planted them in the MG soil in small peat pots. I have three 8 gallon containers for them to go into, as opposed to the 5 gallon buckets. They are plastic trash can like items, and I figured larger is better. I may find the best female and use her as a full time mother as opposed to my original plan of budding everything out and taking clones the day before 12/12. I figure that if all three are females (which I hope) then I can flower two of them, and use the best one as a momma.


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## Tonto (Nov 24, 2006)

Okay, it's picture time. The first picture is of two of my 120mm computer fans, of which I have 4 of on the back of the clone/mother grow box. It is an old clothes dresser, half with drawers and half is an open side with a door. I'm using the open side..... I have 4 of the computer fans. Two are rated at 107cfm, and two are rated at 94 cfm. I cut a section out of the bottom of the rear of the box for air intake. There are six CFL bulbs that are rated at 2,400 lumens each. The size of the box is roughly 2.7 square feet. This is about 5333 lumens per square foot. The second picture is of all 4 fans. The third picture is of the inside of the top of the box, showing the holes cut for the fans and the lighting, and the flat white paint I used 33 coats of inside the box. #4 is of the front of the dresser with the door cracked a little bit. #5 is of the 400 HPS floualux light, and #6 is of the baby Snow White.


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## THE BROTHER'S GRUNT (Nov 25, 2006)

*Whats going on Fluid1. Everything is look great man. Congrats on the Snow White baby. What are your temps inside your grow cab? *


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## Tonto (Nov 25, 2006)

THE BROTHER'S GRUNT said:
			
		

> *Whats going on Fluid1. Everything is look great man. Congrats on the Snow White baby. What are your temps inside your grow cab? *


 
Temps inside the brow box stay constant at 75* and 35-40% humidity. Those 4 computer fans really do the trick. Inside the closet with the 400 HPS, the temps are at 77* and similar humidity.


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## THE BROTHER'S GRUNT (Nov 25, 2006)

Fluid1 said:
			
		

> Temps inside the brow box stay constant at 75* and 35-40% humidity. Those 4 computer fans really do the trick. Inside the closet with the 400 HPS, the temps are at 77* and similar humidity.


*That's great man. With temps like that your ladies are gonna grow fast and furious.  *


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## Tonto (Nov 25, 2006)

THE BROTHER'S GRUNT said:
			
		

> *That's great man. With temps like that your ladies are gonna grow fast and furious.  *


 
I sure hope so! The other two babies have shown themselves. In 24 hours I will be moving them closer to the CFL lights.


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## Zarnon (Nov 26, 2006)

Cool.  Good luck bro.


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## Fiction (Nov 27, 2006)

nice setup man..goodluck on this go around. i'll be following


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## Tonto (Nov 27, 2006)

Thanks guys, glad to see you all here. 

Here's a pic of the three little ladies (crossed fingers) with their multi-spectrum veg goodness shining 1.5" away from them.


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## THE BROTHER'S GRUNT (Nov 28, 2006)

*Whats going on Fluid1. I see some babies peaking between the lights and they are looking great. :aok: *


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## Tonto (Nov 28, 2006)

Thanks, TBG! The largest of the three is showing its next set of leaves now, but overall they don't look all that different at this point. Just a little taller and the serated leaves are larger. I think that pics should wait for a couple days.  I believe that I will up their light significantly by putting them in the cabinet, nice and close to the CFL's. Temperature in the box has not been over 78* in the week that I've had it running and monitoring that and the humidity. Good stuff.


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## Zarnon (Nov 28, 2006)

In honor of you not giving up and your new seedlings

C'mon you little fighter
No need to get uptighter
C'mon you little fighter
And get back up again
Oh, get back up again
Oh, feel your heart again

 

-- Supertramp


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## Tonto (Nov 28, 2006)

Good stuff!!!  :headbang: :headbang2:


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## Tonto (Nov 30, 2006)

Here's a couple pictures of the girls at day 5


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## THE BROTHER'S GRUNT (Dec 1, 2006)

*They are growing up fast. Pretty soon you will be sending them off to school.   Looking great man can't wait to see them little one's grow into some beautiful ladies.  *


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## Tonto (Dec 9, 2006)

Here's the updated pictures, the babies aren't feeling well and I have no idea why!


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## Fiction (Dec 9, 2006)

whas goin on with them?


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## Fiction (Dec 9, 2006)

sorry i didnt see the pic load before i posted up..Are they all showin yellowing? have u fed them any nutes?


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## Tonto (Dec 9, 2006)

No nutes, just MG soil like last time....


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## Tonto (Dec 16, 2006)

My babies aren't doing the best....















And they are acutally looking better then they did about 5 days ago. Today is the last day of week 3, and they have slowed growth a lot with the discoloration that I think is the fault of the MG soil, being how sensitive this strain is to nutes...


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## Comatoked (Dec 16, 2006)

The Soil Looked Very Saturated On The First Page, Perhaps You Are Over Watering. In The Pic Above The Plant Looked Good except For Its Sagging. I Think Your Roots Are Waterlogged. I am A Outdoor Grower But, I Sprout Indoors And I Have Had This Same Problem. And Like You Said The mg Soil Could Have A Big Effect On Sensitive Strains. I Hope The Best For Your Plant And Hope You FInd Te Source Of Your Problem.


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## Elephant Man (Dec 16, 2006)

Looks like they will pull through, I think it was burn, a nice hungry sativa probably wouldn't have had that problem.  Probably going to be smooth sailing with clones in that mix.


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## Tonto (Dec 16, 2006)

Elephant Man said:
			
		

> Looks like they will pull through, I think it was burn, a nice hungry sativa probably wouldn't have had that problem. Probably going to be smooth sailing with clones in that mix.


 
I think that I will convert the three babies into my newly completed hydro system this afternoon. We shall see what happens. Thanks for the comments everyone, I'll make some more pictures of the system today.


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## Tonto (Dec 16, 2006)

Well, I just finished. Here's a bunch of pictures of what I have done. 

This first picture is of the 10-gallon container that has three 6" pots. It has a dual output air pump, and we are running two splitters and 4 air stones. Running 8 gallons in the res until the roots have taken nicely to their new environment. Then somewhere around 6. 








The second picture is of a 6" pot with the lavarock in it. That's what I'm using as a medium, along with the Sunleaves brand starter plugs. 








Third picture is a picture of a pack of nutes that  picked up, they came very highly recommended to me by a friend who used Fox Farm for 5 years and switched, never coming back to FF. So I figure I'll try it out. The only thing in my res right now is some of the Super B+ as it helps reduce the shock of a transplant. 








Fourth is a pic of the DWC system in the grow box, testing out temps, pH, ect, before I do the transplant. 








Fifth is of a newly transplanted baby Snow White.







Sixth is a picture of everything in place and in action. My current pH is 6.0
Any comments are welcome!


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## Tonto (Dec 19, 2006)

New pics and everything, still no comments....


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## kbkiller9 (Dec 19, 2006)

Very nice setup mayn, I would like to do the same setup myself when I turn to hydroponics. Going to wait to get a few grows under my belt first though. Cant wait to see white crystalized buds all over those plants. Good luck with the grow. Ill be following it the the whole way through.


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## Growdude (Dec 19, 2006)

Fluid1 said:
			
		

> New pics and everything, still no comments....


 
Are you giving them any nutes now?
And how large are the roots? dont you need some root length to put them in your hydro setup?


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## Tonto (Dec 19, 2006)

kbkiller9 said:
			
		

> Very nice setup mayn, I would like to do the same setup myself when I turn to hydroponics. Going to wait to get a few grows under my belt first though. Cant wait to see white crystalized buds all over those plants. Good luck with the grow. Ill be following it the the whole way through.


 
Thanks. This is honestly so easy that I can't believe I ever messed with soil..... Thanks for the good wishes, I hope that these babies pull through. If not, I will have more on the way.


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## Tonto (Dec 19, 2006)

Growdude said:
			
		

> Are you giving them any nutes now?
> And how large are the roots? dont you need some root length to put them in your hydro setup?


 

The only 'nute' I gave them was a dose of Super B+, which is to help relieve shock and for transplanting. The roots were large enough, for sure. Thanks for coming to the thread!


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## Tonto (Dec 21, 2006)

Well, the plants show completely no growth up top. I've obviously been scared that I'll lose all three plants. Well, one of the three, the healthiest one, was not low enough down in the lava rock for my liking. The plugs on the other two plants were moist when the third was not. So, I gently took out the surrounding rock, took out the baby in the plug, and put her in there deeper. When I had her out, I saw something that made me feel very good.... new root growth with the DWC system. So, maybe there's a chance to save my baby Snow Whites. 

I have the following strains on the way right now:

Ingemar's Punch (White Widow Web)
Hash Plant (Seedsman)
White Widow (Nirvana)

I also got an 8-plant DWC cloning system, it uses 3" net pots and hydroton. I also got a new lid for my current DWC system, one with four 3" pots instead of my current three 6" pot configuration. This way, when a baby clone or seedling is ready to go into the flower room, I can just snatch her from the cloning bubbler and put her into the flowering 10-gallon bubbler. 

Now I just have to get some little babies to survive!


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## Elephant Man (Dec 21, 2006)

Please forgive my lack of knowledge on DWC, but I think I remember reading something about having the water level like 1/2 up on the medium till roots show and then 1/2 below.  I believe the water level is very critical too, perhaps a float valve res to keep it at optimal level?  Just throwing ideas at ya.


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## Tonto (Dec 21, 2006)

Elephant Man said:
			
		

> Please forgive my lack of knowledge on DWC, but I think I remember reading something about having the water level like 1/2 up on the medium till roots show and then 1/2 below. I believe the water level is very critical too, perhaps a float valve res to keep it at optimal level? Just throwing ideas at ya.


 
And I appreciate that you are! :yay:  My understanding of the DWC is that I should have the bottom inch of the pots submerged in water until the roots take well, and once the roots are dangling out of the bottom of the pots, to lower the water level to about an inch below the bottom of the pots. The dude that made the thing for me even drew lines on the inside of the tub for the two water levels. I check the water at least twice a day, usually much more, and at this point, it's not moving down much, mostly because my stunned plants are not having the best time drinking.  The lava rock is very conducive to the distribution of water, and the plugs are nice and moist. Again, thanks for checking my weak GJ out!


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## Tonto (Dec 21, 2006)

> You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Elephant Man again.


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## Elephant Man (Dec 21, 2006)

No problem buddy...that sounds like a plan.  Hunted around and found this pic of a simple gravity fed res feed system.  Just throwin' more stuff at ya


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## Tonto (Dec 21, 2006)

Cool, where did you find that? Perhaps therein lies the answer to... vacuum? How often does the water need to be changed? how much backflow can there be?   Maybe another thread has some info on here, I have done a lot of thread reading on this forum, but not many others. I do love to continually be learning. I believe if I were to have a remote res system it would have to be ebb and flow.


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## Elephant Man (Dec 22, 2006)

The pic was a little brainstorm creation between 2 guys discussing going on vacation.  It doesn't change anything about the DWC setup, except that it maintains water level for you.  Think of it as being like one of those 'auto-watering' pet feeders.  I have done something similar with a swamp cooler.

I can pretty easily describe how it works for you...not much info in the thread where I found the pic.  For one, the 'fill res' does not need to be that big, one gallon or so would be plenty.  The fill res needs to be strong, like you can't use a plastic jug.  Should be something non-collapseable like pvc, glass etc.  Reason why...the fill res will rely on the vacuum at the top to keep the water from flooding the main res, so if it collapses, water will escape without air entering it.  Basically, once the water level drops below your fill hose, air will enter the fill res, allowing water to escape until proper height of main res is reached and air supply to fill res is once again blocked.

Make sense?  Sometimes I am not the best at describing things.

'Nother point...you need to have a valve to open and close on the fill hose, so the main res can be removed and refilled.  This is an added bonus, great place to premix nutes.  My thinking is, when your girls get pretty big, you might find yourself 'topping off' your main res several times a day, to maintain optimal water height.  This could be a pain, not to mention increase the chance for shock from slight variances in water temp or ph.

Let me know if you need more info, I'm sure I could locate a thread with a better description if necessary.  Or perhaps one of the big hydro guys like Kade or Stoney will pop in  to help.

Good Luck brother


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## Tonto (Dec 22, 2006)

I see what you are saying. This is actually an excellent idea, I guess that picture threw me off. So if my 10 gallon bubbler, holding 8 gallons of water, has about a gallon every inch of the tub, I could set up a system with a small, gallon sized remote res, and make it so the water is added at a certain height of the 10 gallon tub's water level. 

The only hitch is the fact that I'll be using two different water levels, one for the young plants, and one for when they have large root systems. (I love roots too. Sucks we can't see them more often,  )


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## Tonto (Dec 27, 2006)

They are dead. All three are dead. I quit.


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## newgreenthumb (Jan 18, 2007)

I am sorry to hear about you grow but don't give up stay with us, and give it another try.  The mistakes we make at first only make our next grows better. Trust me on this I have been through trial and error but these guys have helped me tremendously on this site.


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