# Anyone ever use shade cloth?



## 420benny (May 22, 2009)

I am thinking of getting some for my big area outside. I live right in the flight path to an airport and having 12 BIG plants next to me is a little scary, legal or not. I just don't know what percentage will work both for stealth and allows enough light to have a decent grow. I just did a quick look at ebay and the only thing close to what I need is 50%. Maybe a military camo netting would work,too? Siz needs to be 20'x15', roughly


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## voxito (May 23, 2009)

I'm interested in this and some material that would keep the rain off and let plenty of light through while being the least noticable.  Some of my plants got beaten to the ground when a strong storm came through last week and they got  muddy and a few leaves chewed on, so what does everyone suggest?  

I hope I don't hijack your thread benny, I need the same info and after I asked that question another popped in my head.  My thoughts are such a long string right now and I didn't want to lose my place...

Please help us


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## purplephazes (May 23, 2009)

hi there benny i would try to avoid this as i know you would prefer to do the same ...BUT i think if you give the airport a call and inquire about re routing the flight path this should not be to much trouble. yet if that is not a possibility and they wish to be difficult i would recommend investing in this type of mesh only ..hxxp://www.shadecloth.biz/HTML/shade-aluminet.html   good luck ! take care ! 70% available light resources !


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## cubby (May 23, 2009)

I use shade cloth for my house plants when I put them outside for the summer. I've never grown weed under it but I'm sure it would work just fine. I built a 10x20 deck in my yard with a pergola over it and started out with50% shade cloth but I felt too much sunlight was getting to my plants (just your average tropical house plants) so I put another 50% on top of the first and that did the trick, the plants love it. You would think 50% ontop of 50% would make it totaly dark but it dose'nt. I also have the south, east, and west sides covered and there's still plenty of light. I actualy have to put my shade cloth up this weekend sometime so I can start moving my plants outside for the season. Maybe I'll trow some beans in a large planter and see what happens, considdering the amount of house plants I put out there you'd never be able to differentiate the folliage (untill fall)
As far as the Aluuminet shade cloth goes I had it and tossed it. Flimsy, easily ripped, attracted a million birds, and no difference in lite diffusion. They advertise that it's supposed to give protection from the harshest sun while providing optimul light, thats just a come-on. I've tried 6-8 different kinds and in my experience your standard black is the best, it will hide you plants from overhead viewing without raising any suspicion what so ever. It also lets rain trough to your plants, even with 50% doubled up my plants get the bennifit of rain. Although it lets rain through it will dissapate heavy downpours. If it rains really hard your plants won't get beaten half to death because the mesh of the shade cloth disrupts it.
I got mine from a company in wisconsin called ENVIROCEPT, they have shade cloth from30% all the way up to 100% (100% is not gonna make it dark or keep out rain and wind).  They also have many diferent sizes, you can even have custom shapes made. Give em' a look, certainly better odds than getting the airlines to change their flight path.
Hope this helped you. 
good luck


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## smokingjoe (May 23, 2009)

cubby said:
			
		

> You would think 50% ontop of 50% would make it totaly dark but it dose'nt.


 
50% of 50% is 25% no?  :yay:


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## cubby (May 23, 2009)

smokingjoe said:
			
		

> 50% of 50% is 25% no? :yay:


 


    Yes half of 50% is 25%, but what I said was 50% ontop of 50%, that eqauls 100% no? I see, you go no school.
    Are you smokingjoe or fried?


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## 420benny (May 23, 2009)

Thanks guys! The airport said they were sending someone over to discuss why I want the flights changed. Should I be worried?:shocked:


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## leafminer (May 23, 2009)

smokingjoe is correct. The 50% of light that gets through the first layer is cut by another 50% by the second layer. Result = 50%


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## fishcabo (May 25, 2009)

You should have thought about that before you planted.  It may not be too late but I would plant some row crops, tomatoes, etc and make the area look like a real vegie garden.  Put some green bark chips (paint regular ones) under your plants and this will break up the typical leaf of pot from the sky.  Finally, get some red christmas balls and hang them from you plants to look like tomatoes.  Tie your plants down as low to the ground as you can so they don't get that christmas tree shape.  Hope this helps, late.


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## cubby (May 25, 2009)

leafminer said:
			
		

> smokingjoe is correct. The 50% of light that gets through the first layer is cut by another 50% by the second layer. Result = 50%


 


    Apperently you did'nt go to the same school that he did'nt go to.
    In the known universe 50 + 50 = 100, 2 layers of 50% = 100%.
    Please share what you're smoking (but not with my accountant)


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## voxito (May 25, 2009)

cubby said:
			
		

> Apperently you did'nt go to the same school that he did'nt go to.
> In the known universe 50 + 50 = 100, 2 layers of 50% = 100%.
> Please share what you're smoking (but not with my accountant)


 
Well if a 100% of light comes through with no shade cloth, you put one layer of 50% to cut the light in half.  Then another layer of 50% would cut the remaining light in half again, letting only 25% of the sun's light through.  Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe so.

I looked around and didn't see if any of the brands mentioned had shade cloth in camo.  Any body know another brand I should check out?

I want the most light to come through to my plants so they can grow better, but I think my plants would benefit more if they weren't rained on like they are.  It has rained everyday for over a week so I didn't want to water them, to give the dirt a chance to dry so my roots could get some air.  Is it a bad idea for me to put a layer of visquine, thin plastic fabric, like painting drop cloth over my plants?  I have a fence close around them that I was planning on hanging the shadecloth on and it would be just as easy for me to put this under so they wouldn't be rained on as much and I could have a chance to fertilize them without worrying about root rot.  Because of this rain I'm really worried about the humidity causing root rot and mold and since they are all a month old I want to start feeding them something besides water.

Would this be a good idea or not in terms of overall health of roots and maximum growth?


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## cubby (May 25, 2009)

voxito said:
			
		

> Well if a 100% of light comes through with no shade cloth, you put one layer of 50% to cut the light in half. Then another layer of 50% would cut the remaining light in half again, letting only 25% of the sun's light through. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe so.


 


    I will try to explain this ONE MORE TIME. The shade cloth blocks 50% of light because the material that makes up the shade cloth is a woven nylon mesh. If you put another 50% shade cloth on top it should block the remaining 50% of the total area over wich it is suspended. 
    The second shade cloth dose'nt cut 50% of remaining light that passes through, it covers the remaining space left from the first shade cloth, thereby establishing a supposedly 100% shaded area, now your tiny little brains are going to start to smoke. Even with two layers of 50% cloth you don't get 100% .Why? Because the mesh obviously dose'nt line up in a way that would block out all sunlight.There's still about 20% light filtration.
    As far as root rot, mold, and fungal diseases, you need to supply your plants with proper drainage and air circulation. You can find this information in the outdoor grow section. 
   Good luck with your grow.


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## 420benny (May 25, 2009)

Well, this thread sure got interesting. I hope everybody are still friends. I can believe cubby's last post. 20% light coming through sounds reasonable. The search continues for the right cloth. I will share what I find. TTFN


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## smokingjoe (May 26, 2009)

cubby said:
			
		

> I will try to explain this ONE MORE TIME. The shade cloth blocks 50% of light because the material that makes up the shade cloth is a woven nylon mesh. If you put another 50% shade cloth on top it should block the remaining 50% of the total area over wich it is suspended.
> The second shade cloth dose'nt cut 50% of remaining light that passes through, it covers the remaining space left from the first shade cloth, thereby establishing a supposedly 100% shaded area, now your tiny little brains are going to start to smoke. Even with two layers of 50% cloth you don't get 100% .Why? Because the mesh obviously dose'nt line up in a way that would block out all sunlight.There's still about 20% light filtration.
> As far as root rot, mold, and fungal diseases, you need to supply your plants with proper drainage and air circulation. You can find this information in the outdoor grow section.
> Good luck with your grow.


 
May I suggest you don't take up a career in photography.  I notice you conceed there is about 20% light filtration(sic).  About 25% penetration perhaps.  It would matter not if your Filter were made of semi solid concrete, if it's designed to block approximately 50% of the light penetrating it putting the same block of concrete beneath it would result in a net penetration to the shaded area of 25%.  The school I went to encouraged studies in elementary physics and maths; clearly yours didn't value manners.


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## cubby (May 26, 2009)

You don't know what you're talking about. The second cloth on top dose'nt block 50% of the light thats penetrating ,50% refers to the amount of woven material to open space. A area of 20x20 would have 10x10 of mesh material and the same in open space (the voids in the mesh) If you lay one ontop of the other it dose'nt mean you cutting the remaining filtered light by an additional 50% it you are doubling the solid material of the screen. The reason some light gets through is because the voids and knots of the second cloth do not line up exactly over one another. Additionaly when I say on top thats what I mean, not over ,as in with an unknown space between them. When you put one ONTOP of the other some of the voids from the first are blocked by the knots of the second, not all voids are blocked given that it is a machine woven fabric and there are flaws and stresses from the hanging. 
I've edited this post because I get a bit testy when people think cutting remarks and illogical asertions are eqaul to knowledge and experience.
Even if you wish to discount my experience with shade cloth, thats fine.
Let's take your assertions out to their logical and innevitable conclusion.
By your educated formula, you say the first 50% shade cloth cuts the light to 50%, so far true, but this is where you go wacko.
Adding a second 50% shade cloth would then reduce the light penetration to 25%. WRONG!
A third 50% shade cloth would reduce it to 12.5%. MORE WRONG.
A fourth would reduce it to 6.25%. Are we seeing a pattern yet?
A fifth would reduce it to 3.125%. Your claims of being educated in "MATHS" (plural?)  are being severly tested, and you've shown to be severly lacking, but I digress..
A sixth 50% shade cloth would then obviously (by your calculations ) leave you with 1.5625% light penetration, correct? WRONG! Why? Becase by this time the wieght of 6 shade cloths would most assuradley brought the whole thing down on your plants!
Sorry to burst your bubble, but your not nearly a bright as you claim or obviously believe.


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## smokingjoe (May 27, 2009)

In Australian vernacular, MathematicS is abbreviated to Maths, in the USA it is commonly referred to as Math; that we'll have to deal with.

I've actually learnt something today.  I've always believed the shade cloth % rating, a myth you perpetuate on numerous occasions in your posts by referring to blocking of light, was exactly that; when in fact it's a measure of it's UV light blocking capabilities and not the entire spectrum.  

My calculations would naturally assume the structure supporting your filter example could sustain the weight of the number of layers of the cloth in your example, but mathematically speaking, a 50% filter overlaying another 50% filter would exactly result as you describe.

I find it difficult to believe it would even be possible to overlay layers of machine woven cloth such that each fibre exactly lined up with that directly above it, which is of course the only way that subsequent filters couldn&#8217;t deplete total penetration by the percentage which they are designed to filter.

Now unless the fibres miraculously absorbed the UV, which we know not to be the case, since the aperture/size of the hole determines the filtrations (which is of course determined by the density of the weave), it is practical to assume that layering two 50% filters (despite their construction) will result in a 75% total reduction in whatever medium passes through it.  

In your own example you mention a resultant total penetration of approximately 20%; I'm prepared to concede you are approximately correct if the two filters are approximately 50%.  

Edit away sunshine or let her rip, either way your manners are appalling and your people skills sadly lacking and frankly you suck at MathS.


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## purplephazes (May 27, 2009)

Aussie, Aussie, Aussie, Oi,Oi,Oi ,sorry benny for the intrution ! Do either of you two know if they tested the 50% shade cloth on a cloudy day or wheather they they tested it in Australia or America i figure that if it were tested in Australia where the UV index is higher it won't be 50% shade cloth (in america )at all ..yet if it was tested in China (where it is permanantly cloudy ) it won't be 50% either ! (if its off shore )Yet at which UV level is considered to be 100% ..i just thought this should get thrown in as well ..oh benny be sure to buy a local shade cloth that was tested on a sunny day to insure that you are buying something close to 50%.. or go with the idea i posted earlier for arguments sake ! Peace and Take care !


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## 420benny (May 27, 2009)

pp, I just looked at the link you posted. That stuff looks great, but is the exact opposite of stealth. It's like having a million mirrors above my grow, inviting eyes to look even closer. I am afraid to use it, but I like the write-up about it. Thank you! I find the chart interesting. The numbers add up to 100%, but the diffuse light part confuses me. I tried to copy the chart, but it wouldn't include the box and lines. Oh well.

 Properties
Shade Level 	
30%

40%

50%

60%

70%
Energy Savings* 	
N.A.

15%

20%

40%

45%
Direct LIght Transmission 	
70%

55%

50%

40%

30%
Burst Strength
(kg/cm2) 	
3.9

3.6

3.7

4.3

4.7
Weight
(oz./sq.ft. 	
1.97

1.86

2.01

2.53

2.57
Diffuse Light Transmission 	
72%

75%

65%

55%

45%


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## voxito (May 27, 2009)

Now I understand.  Sorry cubby if I raised your blood pressure, you are definitely closer to right than smokingjoe and I.  

I would be willing to bet two 50% on top of each other would block over 80% of the light, letting probably about 15 or so percent of the sun's rays.  I agree it would surely be impossible to line the two 50% to block all the light, and even if you lined them up like smokingjoe and I thought about the fibers would make the holes smaller and it would be no where near 25% light admittance.  Thanks for shining the light buddy.

Yes benny I too think it would draw attention to your plot.  Has anyone tried the military cloth like was mentioned earlier?


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## purplephazes (May 31, 2009)

hi there benny ! Sunrays and Diffuse Transmission:as you know what sunrays are, but what is diffuse transmission. Diffuse transmission allows light to pass through certain objects and materials. imagine standing under a palm tree and looking up at the fronds with direct sun behind it and the  light is shining through the actual palm fronds causing them to glow. This also means that shadows which are cast onto one side of the palm frond,and show through on the other side. If you go outside and put a leaf between your eyes and the sun, you'll notice the leaf glow as some of the light from the sun passes through it. It's kind of like how sun glasses reduce the intensity of light or clouds with a silver lining show this effect as well ! peace ! and take care !


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## 420benny (May 31, 2009)

Thanks pp. Check my gj. New news


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