To RO or not RO

[Socrapy]

I tried to explain it in my previous posts as best as possible without getting too deep into chemistry----- snipped

99% of growers don't need to worry about this. It only applies to someone attempting pretreatment using pH manipulation. Never expose fertilizers to pH extremes. Always do your final pH adjustment prior to feeding your plants.

Much appreciated, my eyes glazed over here and there but a great read.
I think it's worth the effort, sitting doesn't work anymore, I don't want to replace chemicals with chemicals and the filtres aren't cheap.

Out of the tap 8.4 after RO 6.5 and drops to 5.5 after awhile (which I have read by absorbing CO2 from the air but it keeps right on going down to 4.2 4.1
but settles around there, is that like a saturation point for 40 litres ?


seedlings are up but look so frail and vulnerable... I have had a world of trouble with seeds over last few years, multiple sources, must be me
I just let them down, I'll start a thread, maybe somebody will catch something.

 

[Socrapy]

You'd be technically bringing it up to 6, but don't be afraid of the final adjustment, that's the easy one since fertilizers are usually buffered and it won't take much. I keep my pH down/up in diner ketchup dispensers or other small orifice containers so I can just add a little squirt, mix, check, squirt, repeat until you get where you want to be. Also I ran my hydroton ebb n flow at 6.5 as the target. Don't be afraid of pH adjusting. It's an art, and the more you do it, the easier it gets!

great, another question... I have a tray on top of a reservoir, pump below fills tray above to just lick the bottom of the rapid rooter sitting in hydroton in the pot. Bottom two layers are in the flow , above that drains back down to rez. As long as the pump runs, it is circulating. When the pump stops, it takes 30 minutes to drain empty. (It takes 10 minutes to fill)

I was thinking of running the pump for 30 minutes every 2 hours.
roots will be hanging below pots in air for half the day approximately... too much?

 

[stinkyattic]

Nope not at all. I only ran mine every 4 hours for 30 mins. If you think about it, the hydroton releases moisture and creates a nice humid zone for a long time after the water recedes. One way to set your cycles is flood, drain, set a timer, and check every hour to see where they start to droop, then set your cycles to flood an hour before you saw the droop set in. Air is great for roots!

 

[Socrapy]

oh I like that droop tip, thank you
(I'm only back a couple days and a gem already)

The root zone is not full of the pellets, I'm not sure why I'm not doing that, pics in another thread coming up. Too damn heavy come cleaning time methinks.

 

[stinkyattic]

Oh okay yeah in that case try the droop tip (watch it like a hawk so you don't unnecessarily stress your plants- FIRST SIGN OF DROOP) your results are going to be really dependent on the overall environment in the room.

 

[Keef]

Hey Pappy !-- How U been ? - Stinkyattic nice to meet U -- Welcome to MP -- I'm in transition right now helping my nephew set up a grow -- I'm a water pharmer in my heart--
I ran aero under LEDs -- I'm no scientist -- I would fill up a 35 gallon plastic tote full of R/O water and let it sit for 24 hours before use - came out the RO hose with a PH of around 4 - --24 hours later It's at a pH of about 6-- it needs to stabilize
RO water got no cal/mag in it !- I add nutes to a new aero box then let it run 24 hours before using it - I use an air pump and stone -- U can end up chasing your tail on PH
U got to let it stabilize then PH - My nute formula follows:

Measurement --per gallon
5 mils- Cal /mag
5 mils - EM 1
3 mils - nute concentrate ( I use botanacare )
One scoop -- Mycos - ( I run a live res vs chemical res.)
5 mils - Voodoo juice or beneficial bacteria tea
--
PH 24 as desired 24 hours later !-- I only changes the res. Once a month !- PH will wander some so I PH once a week !
Hope this helps ?-- However U use it RO water got to have Cal/mag added to it !

 

[stinkyattic]

With regards to your question about pH after RO, usually the carbonic acid does drop it into the low 5ish range over time, but this isn't a huge deal since the ionic strength is SO low most pH meters sold for home use won't be particularly accurate anyway. When you add the ph up it will give you back a little ionic strength and your meter will be more accurate. Be sure to use a mineral pretreatment to return the good stuff that RO removes: calmag to 100ppm to give moderate hardness, then whatever your nutes are.
Sounds like you're doing a hybrid aeroponic setup. My expertise in managing one falls short and I don't want to give advice on a technique I'm not personally comfortable using. I hope other growers will weigh in with their experience!
Edit: when I reloaded the page I saw the great advice from Keef... this is what you need right about now

 

[CasualGrower]

I have not used RO....My water here is really heavy in Cal And Mag.... I just bubbled it for a day or 2 to remove the Chlorines . Before adding to my system.
Kinda like setting up a freshwater aquarium in this area....Never had to ad cal mag...

 

[Socrapy]

Hey Pappy !-- How U been ? - Stinkyattic nice to meet U -- Welcome to MP -- I'm in transition right now helping my nephew set up a grow -- I'm a water pharmer in my heart--

>>> Hey Keef, I totally threw up my hands and almost bulldozed the whole room haha, the thripps won. Then I was doing some Rockstar one day and started in on the room again.

I ran aero under LEDs -- I'm no scientist -- I would fill up a 35 gallon plastic tote full of R/O water and let it sit for 24 hours before use - came out the RO hose with a PH of around 4 - --24 hours later It's at a pH of about 6-- it needs to stabilize

>>> sitting won't clear any chloramine until you are below 4.0 then let it sit
>>> 24 hours later, it was 6.0 from 4.0 I'm glad you posted that, I see the 4 too but I drop it a tad more to 3.7 overnight
I don't think mine rises that fast (10 us gal), I don't check pH again before adding nutes (next time)

RO water got no cal/mag in it !- I add nutes to a new aero box then let it run 24 hours before using it - I use an air pump and stone -- U can end up chasing your tail on PH
U got to let it stabilize then PH - My nute formula follows:

>>> I think the trick with pH is to rinse the probe every damn time and to wait longer for the reading. Can't say why exactly but I don't like air stones, make sure your feed is high in the room,
the co2 is all near the floor, you don't want co2 in your root zone.

Measurement --per gallon
5 mils- Cal /mag
5 mils - EM 1
3 mils - nute concentrate ( I use botanacare )
One scoop -- Mycos - ( I run a live res vs chemical res.)

>>> I tried organic and soil. I screwed that up too, I always wanted waterfront, hydro is they closet I'll ever get.
all my living soil is in my backyard, one section totally kicking ass, twice as fast growing, vibrant green
SEE? I can grow grass!

5 mils - Voodoo juice or beneficial bacteria tea
--
PH 24 as desired 24 hours later !-- I only changes the res. Once a month !- PH will wander some so I PH once a week !
Hope this helps ?-- However U use it RO water got to have Cal/mag added to it !

>>>Don't the chemicals kill all your myco microbe team? I used it plenty with organic attempt but hydro, only on the seeds
>>> I picked up a tip on rez changes... keep track of your "top-ups", when you reach your rez volume, reset.

 

[Socrapy]

With regards to your question about pH after RO, usually the carbonic acid does drop it into the low 5ish range over time,

>>> Keef and I have seen as low as 4, I was thrilled, added .5 ph down to 40 L and left at 3.7 overnight

but this isn't a huge deal since the ionic strength is SO low most pH meters sold for home use won't be particularly accurate anyway. When you add the ph up it will give you back a little ionic strength and your meter will be more accurate. Be sure to use a mineral pretreatment to return the good stuff that RO removes: calmag to 100ppm to give moderate hardness, then whatever your nutes are.

>>> cal mag right off the bat? haha, interesting, so the RO almost leaves me enough room for the cal mag, my city water is 50-60
If my target is 400 ppm, do I add 300ppm nute mix to the 100ppm cal mag water?

Sounds like you're doing a hybrid aeroponic setup. My expertise in managing one falls short and I don't want to give advice on a technique I'm not personally comfortable using. I hope other growers will weigh in with their experience!

>>> I don't think I'm using the trays right but the price was right. I liked the low profile and footprint. Not so much aeroponic as recirculating but I'd love to mist that root zone.
I have no way keeping the upper tray full and only net pots have pellets, not the whole tray so I recirculate as well as flood and drain.

Edit: when I reloaded the page I saw the great advice from Keef... this is what you need right about now

>>> yep, that's why I'm here, tough love. Things get fixed
>>> ha! just don't call it advice, opinions are pretty safe, tons of strangeness, now I'm reading clorine and chloramine are fine for plants, my some has a veritable amazon rain forest in hos backyard and he doesn't treat his water sheesh, he come here and chuckles at my struggling seedlings, his are 3 nodes overnight

 

[Socrapy]

oh, that's not working, sorry about that, me fix when time.. anxious to check on the girls
ha, this Rockstar... you just click on the dulled part

 

[Ganjagrandaddy]

I have not used RO....My water here is really heavy in Cal And Mag.... I just bubbled it for a day or 2 to remove the Chlorines . Before adding to my system.
Kinda like setting up a freshwater aquarium in this area....Never had to ad cal mag...

I just put a few drops of " tap safe" for fish to sort the chloramine and chlorine out. works a treat. ironically , a company now doing the same product but renamed for plants water. cheeky sods.lol
if using L.e.d , even with hard water i get deficiencies of calmag.

 

[Socrapy]

[QUOTE="Keef, post: -------- I would fill up a 35 gallon plastic tote full of R/O water and let it sit for 24 hours before use - came out the RO hose with a PH of around 4 - --24 hours later It's at a pH of about 6-- it needs to stabilize
[/QUOTE]

I wonder what's going on in here. Only thing different is I pH downed to 3.7 but 3 days later it's still there ???
40L (10gal) tank, bubbled once a day for awhile, longer if I forget, mostly covered
2 tanks both doing the same thing and metre checks out.

Update 13 sep.... still 3.7 ???
poltergeist

 

[Socrapy]

what the heck do I do with these three, I gave up on them but the supersoil seems to have kicked in.
what now? I'm going in to flower, should I just keep going with molasses, teas, water or totally throw in the towel and start with the flower chem nutes?
the one below the yellow card is off, had that herringbone thing for awhile now
the one with the stick recovered nice from the bendy thing (supercrop?)

update 13 sep
molasses and ro water, flipping to flower, debating whether to kill all those microbes with flower nutes

 

[stinkyattic]

debating whether to kill all those microbes with flower nutes[/QUOTE]

Not necessarily the case, soil bacteria are fine with many common fertilizers. The canna terra bio organic line is great and expensive and the botanicare pure blend pro line is great and cheap.
Late to the party again lol... but stopped by and happy to see your plants are looking fine to make it through flower intact if you keep looking after them as well as you've been.